Australian Politics Forum - The Climate Change Levy

Equitist

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Australian Politics

Posts: 9632
NSW

Re: The Climate Change Levy
Reply #30 - Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:52pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:20pm:

Quote:

A real climate policy would see Australia target emissions reductions of at least 25 per cent by 2020 - our fair share of the effort needed to give us all a 2-in-3 chance of keeping warming below 2 degrees, as world leaders agreed at Copenhagen

.

So we should reduce OUR emissions of 25% of 1.5%????

And 'reduce' our economy by 25% and our emissions by 0.375%???
That'll make a HUGE difference to the world emissions total....won't it??

Whatever happened to the concepts of personal responsibility and mutual respect!?

Let us not continue to kid ourselves, that we (in the First World) personally don't consume on average between 20 and 40 times our fair share of the world's precious natural resources - nor that we're not thereby disproportionately responsible for facilitating the mass-destruction and exploitation that is being perpetrated around the globe by us and/or on our behalf...

Those of us in the world, who are in a relatively prosperous position, can and should begin to make the necessary socio-economic and environmental changes that we have the greatest skills and technological and economic capacity to do...

Those in this world, who are in a much poorer position (i.e. the vast majority of the human race), need to be supported, educated and trained and allowed to make the transition, to fairly share in some the obscene benefits of the superior technology and prosperity that the small minority of global citizens currently enjoy at the expense of the rest of the world's people and their/our global environment...

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Lamenting the shift in the Australian psyche, away from the egalitarian ideal of the fair-go - and the rise of short-sighted pollies, who worship the 'Growth Fairy' and seek to divide and conquer!

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____ Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 33410 Australia Gender:	Re: The Climate Change Levy Reply #31 - Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:00pm Yes, the world can follow Australia. Like I said before, playing to win and that means leading. Are the Hard Right and Labor scared of leading?
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gizmo_2655

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South West NSW
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Re: The Climate Change Levy
Reply #32 - Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:02pm

Equitist wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:52pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:20pm:

Quote:

A real climate policy would see Australia target emissions reductions of at least 25 per cent by 2020 - our fair share of the effort needed to give us all a 2-in-3 chance of keeping warming below 2 degrees, as world leaders agreed at Copenhagen

.

So we should reduce OUR emissions of 25% of 1.5%????

And 'reduce' our economy by 25% and our emissions by 0.375%???
That'll make a HUGE difference to the world emissions total....won't it??

Whatever happened to the concepts of personal responsibility and mutual respect!?

Let us not continue to kid ourselves, that we (in the First World) personally don't consume on average between 20 and 40 times our fair share of the world's precious natural resources - nor that we don't thereby contribute disproportionately to the mass-destruction and exploitation that is being perpetrated around the globe by us and/or on our behalf...

Those of us in the world, who are in a relatively prosperous position, can and should begin to make the necessary socio-economic and environmental changes that we have the greatest skills and technological and economic capacity to do...

Those in this world, who are in a much poorer position (i.e. the vast majority of the human race), need to be supported, educated and trained and allowed to make the transition, to fairly share in some the obscene benefits of the superior technology and prosperity that the small minority of global citizens currently enjoy at the expense of the rest of the world's people and their environment...

"Let us not continue to kid ourselves, that we (in the First World) personally don't consume on average between 20 and 40 times our fair share of the world's precious natural resources "

Do we actually consume (and produce) 20 to 40 times 'our fair share'??? IF so, why do we only produce 1.5% of the total 'emissions' in the world???
Would you care to explain HOW we can 'consume' almost HALF of the 'polluting' materials....but still only produce 1.5% of the 'polluting' emissions????...Where does the 'other' 1,998.5% of the emissions go???

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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____ Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 33410 Australia Gender:	Re: The Climate Change Levy Reply #33 - Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:05pm gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:43pm: ____ wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:38pm: My preference is 40% I am not willing to accept failure and 25% invites potential failure. If you are going to do something, do it properly. So you think that less than 0.75% of the current emissions will help the planet??? Yes.
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Equitist

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Australian Politics

Posts: 9632
NSW

Re: The Climate Change Levy
Reply #34 - Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:05pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:02pm:

Equitist wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:52pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:20pm:

Quote:

A real climate policy would see Australia target emissions reductions of at least 25 per cent by 2020 - our fair share of the effort needed to give us all a 2-in-3 chance of keeping warming below 2 degrees, as world leaders agreed at Copenhagen

.

So we should reduce OUR emissions of 25% of 1.5%????

And 'reduce' our economy by 25% and our emissions by 0.375%???
That'll make a HUGE difference to the world emissions total....won't it??

Whatever happened to the concepts of personal responsibility and mutual respect!?

Let us not continue to kid ourselves, that we (in the First World) personally don't consume on average between 20 and 40 times our fair share of the world's precious natural resources - nor that we don't thereby contribute disproportionately to the mass-destruction and exploitation that is being perpetrated around the globe by us and/or on our behalf...

Those of us in the world, who are in a relatively prosperous position, can and should begin to make the necessary socio-economic and environmental changes that we have the greatest skills and technological and economic capacity to do...

Those in this world, who are in a much poorer position (i.e. the vast majority of the human race), need to be supported, educated and trained and allowed to make the transition, to fairly share in some the obscene benefits of the superior technology and prosperity that the small minority of global citizens currently enjoy at the expense of the rest of the world's people and their environment...

"Let us not continue to kid ourselves, that we (in the First World) personally don't consume on average between 20 and 40 times our fair share of the world's precious natural resources "

Do we actually consume (and produce) 20 to 40 times 'our fair share'??? IF so, why do we only produce 1.5% of the total 'emissions' in the world???
Would you care to explain HOW we can 'consume' almost HALF of the 'polluting' materials....but still only produce 1.5% of the 'polluting' emissions????...Where does the 'other' 1,998.5% of the emissions go???

Do you need anyone to spell the broader impacts of exponential specialisation, globalisation and polarisation out for you!?

If so, then you obviously wouldn't appreciate the answer...

Either way, I'm prepared to give you one more hint: global ecological/environmental footprint.

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Lamenting the shift in the Australian psyche, away from the egalitarian ideal of the fair-go - and the rise of short-sighted pollies, who worship the 'Growth Fairy' and seek to divide and conquer!

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gizmo_2655

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Australian Politics

Posts: 16010
South West NSW
Gender: male

Re: The Climate Change Levy
Reply #35 - Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:28pm

Equitist wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:05pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:02pm:

Equitist wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:52pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 3:20pm:

Quote:

A real climate policy would see Australia target emissions reductions of at least 25 per cent by 2020 - our fair share of the effort needed to give us all a 2-in-3 chance of keeping warming below 2 degrees, as world leaders agreed at Copenhagen

.

So we should reduce OUR emissions of 25% of 1.5%????

And 'reduce' our economy by 25% and our emissions by 0.375%???
That'll make a HUGE difference to the world emissions total....won't it??

Whatever happened to the concepts of personal responsibility and mutual respect!?

Let us not continue to kid ourselves, that we (in the First World) personally don't consume on average between 20 and 40 times our fair share of the world's precious natural resources - nor that we don't thereby contribute disproportionately to the mass-destruction and exploitation that is being perpetrated around the globe by us and/or on our behalf...

Those of us in the world, who are in a relatively prosperous position, can and should begin to make the necessary socio-economic and environmental changes that we have the greatest skills and technological and economic capacity to do...

Those in this world, who are in a much poorer position (i.e. the vast majority of the human race), need to be supported, educated and trained and allowed to make the transition, to fairly share in some the obscene benefits of the superior technology and prosperity that the small minority of global citizens currently enjoy at the expense of the rest of the world's people and their environment...

"Let us not continue to kid ourselves, that we (in the First World) personally don't consume on average between 20 and 40 times our fair share of the world's precious natural resources "

Do we actually consume (and produce) 20 to 40 times 'our fair share'??? IF so, why do we only produce 1.5% of the total 'emissions' in the world???
Would you care to explain HOW we can 'consume' almost HALF of the 'polluting' materials....but still only produce 1.5% of the 'polluting' emissions????...Where does the 'other' 1,998.5% of the emissions go???

Do you need anyone to spell the broader impacts of exponential specialisation, globalisation and polarisation out for you!?

If so, then you obviously wouldn't appreciate the answer...

Either way, I'm prepared to give you one more hint: global ecological/environmental footprint.

OHHHH all those 'magic words'....Which STILL don't beat the idea that Australia's TOTAL contribution to the WORLD WIDE 'Co2' levels is still less than 1.2%.....No matter what idiotic statements you care to make about "per capita' or anything else....our contribution is STILL only 1.2% of the total.....so 1/4 of 1.2% is STILL stuff all...Even 40% of 1.2% is less than half of SFA....

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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Equitist

Gold Member

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Australian Politics

Posts: 9632
NSW

Re: The Climate Change Levy
Reply #36 - Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:43pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 4:28pm:

OHHHH all those 'magic words'....Which STILL don't beat the idea that Australia's TOTAL contribution to the WORLD WIDE 'Co2' levels is still less than 1.2%.....No matter what idiotic statements you care to make about "per capita' or anything else....our contribution is STILL only 1.2% of the total.....so 1/4 of 1.2% is STILL stuff all...Even 40% of 1.2% is less than half of SFA....

LOL...sorry Giz, but that mindset reminds me of what goes on in pre-school and primary school yards on a daily basis, e.g.: -

"It wasn't me, Miss - it was them!

"Na, na, nah nahnaahnnaah - don't have to if they won't!"

"I'm having the biggest piece!"

"No, it's ALL MINE!"

"You're not the boss of me - can if I want to!"

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Lamenting the shift in the Australian psyche, away from the egalitarian ideal of the fair-go - and the rise of short-sighted pollies, who worship the 'Growth Fairy' and seek to divide and conquer!

IP Logged