Australian Politics Forum - Bono & Climate Change

Miss Anne Dryst

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Bono & Climate Change
Nov 29^th, 2010 at 12:17pm

Bono and U2 have arrived in Australia.
Bono is a global warmist.

"U2'S 360 Degrees tour, the most expensive rock spectacle ever, is here.

The tour, with a daily running cost of $850,000, arrived on six 747 jets to be assembled by a crew of 130.

"You compare a tour by the number of trucks they use," production manager Jake Berry said. "The Rolling Stones ran 46 trucks. We are running 55. This is the biggest."

The tour kind of destroys the global warmist's ideology doesn't it.

So no global warmist would really want to be seeing any U2 concert, unless they are a hypocrite of course.
Would there be any global warmist hypocrites ?

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skippy.

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #1 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 12:51pm

Miss Anne Dryst wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 12:17pm:

Bono and U2 have arrived in Australia.
Bono is a global warmist.

"U2'S 360 Degrees tour, the most expensive rock spectacle ever, is here.

The tour, with a daily running cost of $850,000, arrived on six 747 jets to be assembled by a crew of 130.

"You compare a tour by the number of trucks they use," production manager Jake Berry said. "The Rolling Stones ran 46 trucks. We are running 55. This is the biggest."

The tour kind of destroys the global warmist's ideology doesn't it.

So no global warmist would really want to be seeing any U2 concert, unless they are a hypocrite of course.
Would there be any global warmist hypocrites ?

This is not a topic for the politics board "miss" try the environment thread .Maybe muso can explain to you your climate confusionalism. Sorry muso, you can have her ther. Grin

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... Gold Member Offline Posts: 23673 WA Gender:	Re: Bono & Climate Change Reply #2 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 1:03pm Jusdt think how many starving africans could be saved if Bono donated his annual sunglasses bill alone to them. I also seem to recall him having his hat flown to him in a charter plane...that can't do much for his carbon footprint can it? Bono ranks a 10.0 on the hypocritometer.
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muso

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #3 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 3:49pm

Miss Anne Dryst wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 12:17pm:

Bono and U2 have arrived in Australia.
Bono is a global warmist.

"U2'S 360 Degrees tour, the most expensive rock spectacle ever, is here.

The tour, with a daily running cost of $850,000, arrived on six 747 jets to be assembled by a crew of 130.

"You compare a tour by the number of trucks they use," production manager Jake Berry said. "The Rolling Stones ran 46 trucks. We are running 55. This is the biggest."

The tour kind of destroys the global warmist's ideology doesn't it.

So no global warmist would really want to be seeing any U2 concert, unless they are a hypocrite of course.
Would there be any global warmist hypocrites ?

There was an interview on ABC National recently with the CEO of a major company. (The following is paraphrased.) The reporter made the observation "So you subscribe to global warming". (I laughed when I heard that question.) Australian journos still insist on balance and give air time to the likes of Christopher Monkton. A BBC commentator recently was surprised at the ABC's take. He said "but he's a loonie" They don't give him the time of day because they know he's a homegrown loonie.

Anyway, back to the article - The CEO replied "Oh yeah we sorted that out back in 2001. We have a commitment to reduce our carbon footprint" (or words to that effect. )

I doubt if there is a major industry around in Australia that has not made plans. The only businesses still living in cloud cuckoo land are the small businesses, and it's no wonder - I've seen some of the crap articles they have in their industry journals. Most small businesses have been infiltrated big-time, and they don't have the resources to realise that they are being fed nonsense. Small business operators are not always the smartest operators. Some of them do well. Most are amateurs and they are doing it tough at the moment as a result.

As far as global warming itself, it's Atmospheric Physics 101. Refer to the sticky thread. If you have any questions, feel free to ask. Don't ask me about Al Gore or politics. I don't waste my time on that. I'll tell you about the science only.

As far as U2 is concerned, have you considered that they might be able to afford to offset? I even offset all my flights. It costs something like $1.50 tops for a typical domestic flight.

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« Last Edit: Nov 29^th, 2010 at 4:01pm by muso »

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #4 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 4:33pm

Quote:

As far as U2 is concerned, have you considered that they might be able to afford to offset? I even offset all my flights. It costs something like $1.50 tops for a typical domestic flight.

You know what's even better than 'offsetting'?

Not doing the unnecessary, frivolous things that add to your carbon footprint in the first place.

I mean seriously, is it EVER OK to have a private plane make a trip of several thousand kmn's for the sole purpose of bringing you your bloody hat?

The notion that 'it's OK for me to whatever the hell I want, so long as I pay some bloke to plant a tree for me' is just so ridiculous, it baffles me how anyone can take it seriously. Sad that that is the concept that underpins the whole push for a price on carbon.

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JC Denton Gold Member Offline Posts: 5520 Gender:	Re: Bono & Climate Change Reply #5 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 4:38pm Exactly, Wesley. If anything to really help the planet you could avoid doing unnecessary and extravagant things while putting money towards curtailing greenhouse emissions at the same time. You would even save money that way.
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gizmo_2655

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #6 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 4:38pm

... wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 4:33pm:

Quote:

As far as U2 is concerned, have you considered that they might be able to afford to offset? I even offset all my flights. It costs something like $1.50 tops for a typical domestic flight.

You know what's even better than 'offsetting'?

Not doing the unnecessary, frivolous things that add to your carbon footprint in the first place.

I mean seriously, is it EVER OK to have a private plane make a trip of several thousand kmn's for the sole purpose of bringing you your bloody hat?

The notion that 'it's OK for me to whatever the hell I want, so long as I pay some bloke to plant a tree for me' is just so ridiculous, it baffles me how anyone can take it seriously. Sad that that is the concept that underpins the whole push for a price on carbon.

Why not just cut out the middle man and plant the damn trees themselves????

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JC Denton Gold Member Offline Posts: 5520 Gender:	Re: Bono & Climate Change Reply #7 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 4:41pm Bono would plant the Joshua tree.
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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #8 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 4:58pm

This sort of hypocrisy is endemic throughout the 'environmental' movement.

Aparrently, support for 'green intiatives' is strongest among highly educated and paid people....the same types who drive the Giant 4WD monster trucks to pick up little timmy from school.

The same types who take foreign holidays at least once a year.

the same types who buy the 'premium' imported products over the local equivalents....I went to a restaurant recently whose whole selling point was that they were 'ethically and environmentally aware'....that image was shot to pieces when they tried to charge me $8.50 for an 800ml bottle of water FROM BLOODY NORWAY. Something wrong with australian water?

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In the fullness of time...

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JC Denton Gold Member Offline Posts: 5520 Gender:	Re: Bono & Climate Change Reply #9 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:00pm That's because some of the most strident and visible members of the 'environmental' movement are just status signalers. It's exactly the same situation as the multiculturalists who preach about the virtues of diversity but live in lilly-white neighbourhoods.
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gizmo_2655 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 16010 South West NSW Gender:	Re: Bono & Climate Change Reply #10 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:03pm Actually, on THOSE multiculturalists, I'll even agree with you Imp....
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JC Denton Gold Member Offline Posts: 5520 Gender:	Re: Bono & Climate Change Reply #11 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:06pm It's just a status thing. I am assuming the carbon footprints of individuals who accept anthropogenic global warming are much greater than those who don't.
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gizmo_2655 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 16010 South West NSW Gender:	Re: Bono & Climate Change Reply #12 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:09pm Strangely, in the case of all the 'public figureheads' yes that is the case...
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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #13 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:11pm

JC Denton wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:00pm:

That's because some of the most strident and visible members of the 'environmental' movement are just status signalers.

It's exactly the same situation as the multiculturalists who preach about the virtues of diversity but live in lilly-white neighbourhoods.

Yeah, and that's why I usually disagree with the proposed masures to 'save the planet' - not beacsue I disagree with the stated goal, but becasue it's being run by hypocrites who do more harm than those who they browbeat for not being 'environmentally and/or ethically conscious' enough. Measures thats only function is to make them feel good about the destruction they wreak.

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JC Denton

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #14 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:14pm

Well if you think about it, it is very likely an across the board thing. Global warming, whether one believes it warrants such status, is essentially a political issue that is stratified greatly along political lines, with those with liberal opinions far more likely to accept it. Since liberal opinions are associated with higher social class (see the GSS survey) and more education, and thus higher socioeconomic status, it is not an unwarranted inference to make. Larger houses, more vacations, more expensive and energy intensive electronic equipment, etc.

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #15 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:25pm

... wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:11pm:

JC Denton wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:00pm:

That's because some of the most strident and visible members of the 'environmental' movement are just status signalers.

It's exactly the same situation as the multiculturalists who preach about the virtues of diversity but live in lilly-white neighbourhoods.

Yeah, and that's why I usually disagree with the proposed masures to 'save the planet' - not beacsue I disagree with the stated goal, but becasue it's being run by hypocrites who do more harm than those who they browbeat for not being 'environmentally and/or ethically conscious' enough. Measures thats only function is to make them feel good about the destruction they wreak.

Yes true Wesley.

Back in the 80's I used to see those bumper stickers the 'environmentalists' all had on their cars...."Burn fat not oil, ride a bike" (if you remember them)......AND they were almost always on a battered sh!tbox car, with stuffed piston rings and black smoke boiling out of the exhaust pipe.....

talk about LAUGH....

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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codswal

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #16 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 9:54pm

JC Denton wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:00pm:

That's because some of the most strident and visible members of the 'environmental' movement are just status signalers.

It's exactly the same situation as the multiculturalists who preach about the virtues of diversity but live in lilly-white neighbourhoods.

---------------

dont forget those who scream abuse if you dare raise your voice against the boat people..

yet if you ask them .. so "What do you do personally for these people". they are gone in a flash..

its all paper sympathy.. or in this case. forum sympathy but it makes them feel so good about themselves they actually think words do something to make these peoples lives better, at the end of the day its all about making THEM feel better..very pious!

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Itanimulli

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #17 - Nov 29^th, 2010 at 10:37pm

... wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 4:33pm:

I mean seriously, is it EVER OK to have a private plane make a trip of several thousand kmn's for the sole purpose of bringing you your bloody hat?

No - and in the case of U2, it probably is just posturing because it's good for business. Meanwhile there is a real issue out there, that will probably go to the dogs as a result of their hypocrisy.

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muso

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #18 - Nov 30^th, 2010 at 8:02am

JC Denton wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:00pm:

That's because some of the most strident and visible members of the 'environmental' movement are just status signalers.

That's partly true. I doubt if anyone would claim that the CSIRO or the BoM are status signallers; however a few Hollywood stars think it's fashionable to buy a Prius to improve their public image. I bought a Prius because it benefitted me personally to the tune of about $20,000 overall because I average more than 100,000km each year.

At the same time, there is so much garbage out there on the media that the profile needs to be lifted.

World governments with very few exceptions are dragging their feet. China is far more advanced in renewable energy than Australia is.

Whatever perspective you look at it from, if we don't invest in renewable energy it will cost society in the long run. There are more reasons to do that than global warming and ocean acidification, but they are pretty good reasons in themselves.

I agree that the deep greens are probably misguided in a lot of ways. The last thing I want is for the world to return to poverty. My motivation is the survival of a technologically advanced society.

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #19 - Nov 30^th, 2010 at 12:24pm

muso wrote on Nov 30^th, 2010 at 8:02am:

JC Denton wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 5:00pm:

That's because some of the most strident and visible members of the 'environmental' movement are just status signalers.

That's partly true. I doubt if anyone would claim that the CSIRO or the BoM are status signallers; however a few Hollywood stars think it's fashionable to buy a Prius to improve their public image. I bought a Prius because it benefitted me personally to the tune of about $20,000 overall because I average more than 100,000km each year.

At the same time, there is so much garbage out there on the media that the profile needs to be lifted.

World governments with very few exceptions are dragging their feet. China is far more advanced in renewable energy than Australia is.

Whatever perspective you look at it from, if we don't invest in renewable energy it will cost society in the long run. There are more reasons to do that than global warming and ocean acidification, but they are pretty good reasons in themselves.

I agree that the deep greens are probably misguided in a lot of ways. The last thing I want is for the world to return to poverty. My motivation is the survival of a technologically advanced society.

That's fair enough muso...AND I agree with you on most of your points..

I've got no problem with changing to renewable energy and alternative fuel vehicle (EV, hydrogen or what ever)....my only real objection is to the TAX, which, in reality, would do nothing to 'help' the environment and very little (as it stands) to implement renewable energy...

I also do object to the methods being used (AGW) to try to 'force' a change.....although that might be more of a 'deep green' agenda...

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muso

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #20 - Nov 30^th, 2010 at 4:26pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Nov 30^th, 2010 at 12:24pm:

I also do object to the methods being used (AGW) to try to 'force' a change.....although that might be more of a 'deep green' agenda...

Well it's a valid argument, and as I've said before, I'm happy to explain the science. I have a feeling that you basically understand the science behind it, but you object to the "posturing" (thanks Itanmulli) and political crap that's going on. Well so do I - especially the Robin Hood school of global carbon trading that was threatened at Copenhagen. I'd also rather see things happen faster than they already are.

My opinion is that if we can find a way to pay for the renewable energy projects, and preferably keep our inept government well away from their direct management (should I mention pink batts?), then that is more likely to happen. I suggested elsewhere that a tax on coal exports would be a good start, firstly because the likes of Canada are doing exactly that already and secondly because we're throwing away our natural resources without getting any significant financial benefit from it.

If we tax coal exports, it doesn't impact so much on ordinary people (who vote), and we can use some of the proceeds towards renewable energy infrastructure, in the same way that carbon offsets do. (It doesn't go towards planting trees by the way.)

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #21 - Nov 30^th, 2010 at 4:32pm

muso wrote on Nov 30^th, 2010 at 4:26pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Nov 30^th, 2010 at 12:24pm:

I also do object to the methods being used (AGW) to try to 'force' a change.....although that might be more of a 'deep green' agenda...

Well it's a valid argument, and as I've said before, I'm happy to explain the science. I have a feeling that you basically understand the science behind it, but you object to the "posturing" (thanks Itanmulli) and political crap that's going on. Well so do I - especially the Robin Hood school of global carbon trading that was threatened at Copenhagen. I'd also rather see things happen faster than they already are.

My opinion is that if we can find a way to pay for the renewable energy projects, and preferably keep our inept government well away from their direct management (should I mention pink batts?), then that is more likely to happen. I suggested elsewhere that a tax on coal exports would be a good start, firstly because the likes of Canada are doing exactly that already and secondly because we're throwing away our natural resources without getting any significant financial benefit from it.

If we tax coal exports, it doesn't impact so much on ordinary people (who vote), and we can use some of the proceeds towards renewable energy infrastructure, in the same way that carbon offsets do. (It doesn't go towards planting trees by the way.)

NO , not the science...the alarmism and panic mode...

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muso

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #22 - Dec 1^st, 2010 at 11:11am

gizmo_2655 wrote on Nov 30^th, 2010 at 4:32pm:

NO , not the science...the alarmism and panic mode...

In industry we normally work with risks associated with specific processes which typically run around 1 fatality in 10 million years. (1e-07) A typical manufacturing plant might have a total risk of around 50E-06 (50 fatalities in a million years)

If any industrial plant in Australia had risks that approached absolute certainty, they would have to shut them down. Here we're talking about risks that will almost certainly (close to 100%) kill large numbers of people and cause severe economic disruption within a 100 year timeframe.

A previous poster posted the range of risks associated with a 2 degree temperature rise. That is a compromise that in itself will involve mass fatalities and economic disruptions, just not as severe as business as usual.

It doesn't look like we'll meet that 2 degrees the way things are going.

You say that you disapprove of the alarmist rhetoric. Maybe so. - but if you were aware that a building was on fire, would you bother to sound the fire alarm, or would you worry that you might wake somebody up or piss them off in some way?

After all, sounding the fire alarm is alarmist, isn't it?

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #23 - Dec 1^st, 2010 at 12:30pm

muso wrote on Dec 1^st, 2010 at 11:11am:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Nov 30^th, 2010 at 4:32pm:

NO , not the science...the alarmism and panic mode...

In industry we normally work with risks associated with specific processes which typically run around 1 fatality in 10 million years. (1e-07) A typical manufacturing plant might have a total risk of around 50E-06 (50 fatalities in a million years)

If any industrial plant in Australia had risks that approached absolute certainty, they would have to shut them down. Here we're talking about risks that will almost certainly (close to 100%) kill large numbers of people and cause severe economic disruption within a 100 year timeframe.

A previous poster posted the range of risks associated with a 2 degree temperature rise. That is a compromise that in itself will involve mass fatalities and economic disruptions, just not as severe as business as usual.

It doesn't look like we'll meet that 2 degrees the way things are going.

You say that you disapprove of the alarmist rhetoric. Maybe so. - but if you were aware that a building was on fire, would you bother to sound the fire alarm, or would you worry that you might wake somebody up or piss them off in some way?

After all, sounding the fire alarm is alarmist, isn't it?

I'm talking more about overstated 'fear-inducing' pronouncements....like Al Gore and his "ALL the Polar bears are drowning" and the IPCC's 'typo' of the Himalaya glaciers will be gone by 2035 (when the scientist who actually wrote the piece said 2350), and the IPPC's use of a world wildlife opinion piece as 'factual' data....

Much the same sort of overstating is used in regard to nuclear power....

just check out http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1291150760

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muso

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #24 - Dec 1^st, 2010 at 1:23pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Dec 1^st, 2010 at 12:30pm:

I'm talking more about overstated 'fear-inducing' pronouncements....like Al Gore and his "ALL the Polar bears are drowning" and the IPCC's 'typo' of the Himalaya glaciers will be gone by 2035 (when the scientist who actually wrote the piece said 2350), and the IPPC's use of a world wildlife opinion piece as 'factual' data....

Much the same sort of overstating is used in regard to nuclear power....

just check out http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1291150760

Ok. Somebody should drown Al Gore. As far as the Working Group I report is concerned, investigating the effects of different emission scenarios, that is sound science. If anything it's biased on the conservative side. By the way none of the scientific authors actually work for the IPCC. They work for national bodies such as the CSIRO in Australia.

As far as things that various people have said to the media and the general public, I can't vouch for them. In some cases they are taken out of context.

I already said that I wouldn't talk about Al Gore.

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #25 - Dec 1^st, 2010 at 1:43pm

muso wrote on Dec 1^st, 2010 at 1:23pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Dec 1^st, 2010 at 12:30pm:

I'm talking more about overstated 'fear-inducing' pronouncements....like Al Gore and his "ALL the Polar bears are drowning" and the IPCC's 'typo' of the Himalaya glaciers will be gone by 2035 (when the scientist who actually wrote the piece said 2350), and the IPPC's use of a world wildlife opinion piece as 'factual' data....

Much the same sort of overstating is used in regard to nuclear power....

just check out http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1291150760

Ok. Somebody should drown Al Gore. As far as the Working Group I report is concerned, investigating the effects of different emission scenarios, that is sound science. If anything it's biased on the conservative side. By the way none of the scientific authors actually work for the IPCC. They work for national bodies such as the CSIRO in Australia.

As far as things that various people have said to the media and the general public, I can't vouch for them. In some cases they are taken out of context.

I already said that I wouldn't talk about Al Gore.

I know, but unfortunately, a lot of the ideas that we see in the media are based on 'talking heads' like Gore, Bono and other 'champagne' environmentalists...who 'talk' Green, while producing a 'carbon footprint' bigger than Newcastle..

Even on these boards....the only 'greenie' who seems to walk the walk, as well as talking the talk, is Skippy...

Which is fairly common...

To base a massive change to society on the opinions of hypocrites is idiotic...

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It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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muso

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #26 - Dec 1^st, 2010 at 4:15pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Dec 1^st, 2010 at 1:43pm:

I know, but unfortunately, a lot of the ideas that we see in the media are based on 'talking heads' like Gore, Bono and other 'champagne' environmentalists...who 'talk' Green, while producing a 'carbon footprint' bigger than Newcastle..

Even on these boards....the only 'greenie' who seems to walk the walk, as well as talking the talk, is Skippy...

Which is fairly common...

To base a massive change to society on the opinions of hypocrites is idiotic...

As an environmental professional who works for industry, I distance myself from tie-died greenies, but I still try to do things that are effective both at work and at home.

I just had solar panels installed at home, I offset all my flights using renewable energy offsets, and have set company policy so that everybody does the same. The cost is nominal.

The motivation for the solar panels was mainly financial. I got them while the government incentives were available.

There will be a massive change to society whether we want it or not. The causes will be dwindling resources and an international drive towards renewable energy. Ordinary people like you and me will have little say in it. Life will go on with minimal disruption.

The biggest threat will be economic disruptions. Progress will be minimal while the economy is weak.

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #27 - Dec 1^st, 2010 at 9:08pm

muso wrote on Dec 1^st, 2010 at 4:15pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Dec 1^st, 2010 at 1:43pm:

I know, but unfortunately, a lot of the ideas that we see in the media are based on 'talking heads' like Gore, Bono and other 'champagne' environmentalists...who 'talk' Green, while producing a 'carbon footprint' bigger than Newcastle..

Even on these boards....the only 'greenie' who seems to walk the walk, as well as talking the talk, is Skippy...

Which is fairly common...

To base a massive change to society on the opinions of hypocrites is idiotic...

As an environmental professional who works for industry, I distance myself from tie-died greenies, but I still try to do things that are effective both at work and at home.

I just had solar panels installed at home, I offset all my flights using renewable energy offsets, and have set company policy so that everybody does the same. The cost is nominal.

The motivation for the solar panels was mainly financial. I got them while the government incentives were available.

There will be a massive change to society whether we want it or not. The causes will be dwindling resources and an international drive towards renewable energy. Ordinary people like you and me will have little say in it. Life will go on with minimal disruption.

The biggest threat will be economic disruptions. Progress will be minimal while the economy is weak.

But do you truly believe that an ETS or Carbon Price will do anything to directly 'help' the environment??

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muso

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Gladstone, Queensland
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Re: Bono & Climate Change
Reply #28 - Dec 2^nd, 2010 at 8:26am

gizmo_2655 wrote on Dec 1^st, 2010 at 9:08pm:

But do you truly believe that an ETS or Carbon Price will do anything to directly 'help' the environment??

Put it this way, one of our plants has been waiting for an ETS to install low emission technology. There is no point in doing it before the ETS comes in. It's much better to set your baseline at current levels and get the credits.

What it does do is to make polluting technology more expensive and reduces the cost differential between that and renewable energy technology/clean production technology.

With my idea of taxing coal exports, we use the revenue partly to subsidise renewable energy projects. We can even pass on some of the tax to the general population to sweeten the pill.

There is a kind of renewable energy tax already in place for major industries. It's called the ERET Legislation and it's already paying for renewable energy projects.It works like a tax on electricity purchases. High emitters can initially claim partial exemption through the EITE Scheme (Environmental professionals usually pronounce it "ET"), with the intent of softening the blow. (and it's a total pain in the arse working with financial auditors to validate your figures.)

There is also the NGERS reporting system. The more politically correct pronounce it "engers" Grin

To answer your question, I think we'll still need to do some very expensive catch-up about 15 years down the line.

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