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Solar Panels (Read 6628 times)
muso
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Solar Panels
Sep 29th, 2010 at 10:21am
 
Has anybody else installed a Solar PV home system? I'd be interested in experiences. I just purchased a 2kW system, so I'll keep you posted of how it goes.

We decided to install based largely on the projected price of electricity. The return on investment should be around 2-3 years based on that, allowing for REC's.  If we're away for a month or two, which we're planning to do, the unused electricity will be fed back into the grid, so theoretically we should get a credit for that period.
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #1 - Sep 29th, 2010 at 1:38pm
 
muso wrote on Sep 29th, 2010 at 10:21am:
Has anybody else installed a Solar PV home system? I'd be interested in experiences. I just purchased a 2kW system, so I'll keep you posted of how it goes.

We decided to install based largely on the projected price of electricity. The return on investment should be around 2-3 years based on that, allowing for REC's.  If we're away for a month or two, which we're planning to do, the unused electricity will be fed back into the grid, so theoretically we should get a credit for that period.



It's a pity, really, that Australia only has hard PV arrays available...
I think something loike this might be a better choice for this country...

http://www.shadeplex.com/default.html
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muso
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #2 - Sep 29th, 2010 at 1:53pm
 
Yeah, I've heard about that kind of material. The downside is that although it looks good, if you have any in the shade, or not at the optimum angle to the sun, you stand to lose a great deal of efficiency.

I was looking at steered concentrator technology, but the waiting time was too long. They are only interested in major developments.

I think heat pumps and direct solar airconditioning will eventually come to the fore in Australia as it has in Europe. Solar airconditioning systems, such as the Astech design show a lot of promise. It's very inefficient to convert solar energy to electricity then use that electricity to power air conditioners.

http://www.buildup.eu/cases/9552
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #3 - Sep 29th, 2010 at 2:48pm
 
muso wrote on Sep 29th, 2010 at 1:53pm:
Yeah, I've heard about that kind of material. The downside is that although it looks good, if you have any in the shade, or not at the optimum angle to the sun, you stand to lose a great deal of efficiency.

I was looking at steered concentrator technology, but the waiting time was too long. They are only interested in major developments.

I think heat pumps and direct solar airconditioning will eventually come to the fore in Australia as it has in Europe. Solar airconditioning systems, such as the Astech design show a lot of promise. It's very inefficient to convert solar energy to electricity then use that electricity to power air conditioners.

http://www.buildup.eu/cases/9552


True, but the same really applies to solid PV arrays though...
From what I remember from the science show I saw about, it has a higher conversion rate than normal solar arrays, and can be 'fitted' to odd shapes.....and it's cheaper...

I'm sure a 100% coverage of your roof and patio would give a far higher return than having 2 or 3 3x2metre solid glass and metal panels, converting 35% of available sunlight to electricity....
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muso
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #4 - Sep 30th, 2010 at 8:21am
 
gizmo_2655 wrote on Sep 29th, 2010 at 2:48pm:
True, but the same really applies to solid PV arrays though...
From what I remember from the science show I saw about, it has a higher conversion rate than normal solar arrays, and can be 'fitted' to odd shapes.....and it's cheaper...

I'm sure a 100% coverage of your roof and patio would give a far higher return than having 2 or 3 3x2metre solid glass and metal panels, converting 35% of available sunlight to electricity....


I don't doubt that it's a good idea, but as with anything else, introduce it to Australia and you'll be paying roughly 2.5 times the price that they are in the US. At work, I've started buying a lot of things direct from the States, and it saves a fortune.

As a side note - you'd never achieve 35% with standard Solar panels. You can barely achieve 35% with triple junction cells and concentrators (lenses that focus the sun's light on to the cells).

Solar PV/thermal hybrids, such as the ones made by a company in Israel claim 75% efficiency (PV and Thermal combined).

   
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muso
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #5 - Sep 30th, 2010 at 3:42pm
 
Incidentally for the system we're installing, the Solar cost per kWh generated (Based on installation cost, generated output and life span) was 4.5 cents.

Cost savings with feed-in tariff was $2500 per year based on the current price per unit.

With the current rebates, it's a no-brainer. By the way, I'm not in the Solar Power industry.
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hawil
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #6 - Sep 30th, 2010 at 6:09pm
 
Cost savings with feed-in tariff was $2500 per year based on the current price per unit.

If you can get a cost saving of $2,500 on a 2kwh system, you are doing very well.
I have had a 1.5kwh system installed one year ago and it has produced some 1120kw which equals to about $600.00 saving.
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muso
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #7 - Sep 30th, 2010 at 8:59pm
 
hawil wrote on Sep 30th, 2010 at 6:09pm:
Cost savings with feed-in tariff was $2500 per year based on the current price per unit.

If you can get a cost saving of $2,500 on a 2kwh system, you are doing very well.
I have had a 1.5kwh system installed one year ago and it has produced some 1120kw which equals to about $600.00 saving.


Interesting. Maybe the calculator I used was a bit optimistic. Of course the price of a grid kWhr has gone up, and with a higher rated system there would possibly be more feed-in tariff above the usage threshold. The cost saving without feed in tariff included was around $1200.

It's indicating an ROI of 37% accounting for feed-in tariff, which gives a payback period of 2.8 years.

I guess I'll find out after the first year. The area I'm in is rated at 6kWhr/m2/day and we average about 8.3 hours of sunshine per day. How does that compare to yours?
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« Last Edit: Sep 30th, 2010 at 9:13pm by muso »  

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Amadd
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #8 - Oct 1st, 2010 at 6:08am
 
I'm getting a 1.5KW system. The 2yr interest free deal with Origin. It should be installed by December, but I'm hoping for a bit sooner.

I also opted for the 66 cents per kw/h feed in price, which I understand is a minimum for 15 yrs. In that case, I wouldn't expect any more, but it would've paid for itself a few times over in 15yrs.
I'm hoping that I will only be paying slightly more than my usual electricity bill whilst it is being payed off, by my estimation.
Being that I'm far more confident in my own theory vs. practise estimations than anybody else's, I think that the solar deals that are around these days should be snapped up, even though there are more efficient panels on the way.

Whatever we say about wanting to do what is right for the environment, the bottom line is always price.





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muso
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #9 - Oct 1st, 2010 at 8:32am
 
Amadd wrote on Oct 1st, 2010 at 6:08am:
Whatever we say about wanting to do what is right for the environment, the bottom line is always price.



Next thing we'll have people with Solar Panels cutting down all the neighboring trees to improve the efficiency  Grin

My main motivation was the rising cost of electricity but also the ability to be self sufficient to a degree if we get to a time where grid power is frequently interrupted for whatever  reason.

The way I see it, a Solar Power supply also acts as a kind of UPS. So many Windows based computers and other electronic equipment develops problems after power cuts.
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qikvtec
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #10 - Oct 1st, 2010 at 11:41am
 
One thing to be very careful of when evaluating the ROI on a solar system is the assumption used for number of hours of daily sunlight.  I saw one recently where they used 7 hours of daily sunlight to bump up the ROI; when being realistic one should only count on ~4hrs/day to take into consideration inclement conditions and the efficiency of the panel.

The only thing that is preventing me from installing a system myself is a massive palm tree in the way of our north facing roof space; the Mrs values the palm tree more.  Now where did I put that round-up.
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muso
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #11 - Oct 1st, 2010 at 1:56pm
 
True. The BoM data on average hours of sunshine takes into account inclement conditions, but there are other factors such as local shading etc.

Palm trees are a bugger. Large copper nails  Wink or accidentally run into it after a good shower of rain.
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« Last Edit: Oct 1st, 2010 at 2:02pm by muso »  

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hawil
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #12 - Oct 1st, 2010 at 4:25pm
 
Interesting. Maybe the calculator I used was a bit optimistic. Of course the price of a grid kWhr has gone up, and with a higher rated system there would possibly be more feed-in tariff above the usage threshold. The cost saving without feed in tariff included was around $1200.

We had very little sunshine during the winter, therefore the output from solar was rather poor.
I installed 8panels and the Salesperson quoted 6Kwh average per day but so far the output was 4Kwh so to recover my investment it will probably take more like 6 years.
I have asked some technical questions but have not been able to get answers; like, is there any difference in feed-in power when power is being used, and if the line voltage raises above 240volts, is the feed-in reduced.
Apparently the best results are when the temperature is about 25degrees.
I,am surprised that Germany has so much solar power, when their sunny days are a lot fewer.
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #13 - Oct 1st, 2010 at 5:57pm
 
The shadeplex product looks faily good, even with around 16m2 for 1kw that's ok if the price per kw holds up. Is there a similar product available here in Aust for grid installs? I am looking for good green power products to promote on my site along side pv panels.
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Re: Solar Panels
Reply #14 - Dec 31st, 2010 at 5:01pm
 
A few weeks back I had 3 quotes from solar power installers, ranging in price (after all the rebates etc.) from $12000 for a 2.52 kWh system to  $4700 for 1.6 kWh.  Looking at my current power bills and the costs of these systems I estimated it would take between 2 and 5 years to recoup my expenses.

I decided not to go ahead as I think the price of these systems will only come down. I thought I detected an air of desperation to get me signed up before the rebates ended. Also, I have a large tree
in my yard which I was told would reduce the effectiveness of the system by an estimated 40%. Ironically the local councils green policy will not allow it to be removed.
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