Australian Politics Forum - Why isn't the media talking about manufacturing ?

Sir lastnail

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Re: Why isn't the media talking about manufacturing ?
Reply #30 - Sep 12^th, 2010 at 9:45pm

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 6:17pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:25pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:21pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:12pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:08pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:58pm:

perceptions_now wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:39pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:17pm:

The major component of manufacturing is labor costs. our labor rates are severl times that of our asian neighbours and 10-20 times that of china. That pretty much precludes much of the manufacturing base. not all, but a lot of it. And you cant just huff and puff and complain and pretend it isnt true. The only viable alternative is to halve the minimum wage. you up fot that?

Try looking forward a few years LW!

What was that supposed to mean? do you expect anything to change in the wage disparity arena?

Yes but you would be the first to expect someone on low wages to pay over inflated prices for a house in a property bubble. You can't have it both ways.

But nails, even you must realise that eventually the housing 'bubble' will burst and house prices WILL drop back into line with wages.....

The credit companies are, currently, holding housing prices artifically high....so they can demand higher interest rates...

This cannot and will NOT continue...

that is nonsense. anyone who has ever read about - never mind studied - eceonomics knows all bout the value of goods and that this 'value' is given by the CONSUMER/CUSTOMER, not by some other regulatory or third party buyer. House prices are what they are simply because that is what people are willing to pay. Now you might say that it is a bubble. maybe you are right maybe you are wrong but it is a price generated by DEMAND. The most likely result wil be a small correction of perhaps 10% sometime soon followed by flat-lining prices for a few years while inflation and wages catches up. The class example of how this principle operates is that 30 years ago houses only required a single income to be bought, however at that time dual income families were quite rare. The houseing prices matched the market-places expectations and ability to pay. when dual income families became the norm house prices became much higher because - shock horror - people had more money to pay and so did exactly that.. pay more. It is no more complex than that. A recession causes houe prices to fall because... people have less money. a boom casues prices to rise because people have MORE money. and just liek in stocks, if house prices get out of kilter with their actual intrinsice worth there comes a correction. Usually in the 5-15% range. The US example is not the same as the housing market collapsed over there for very very different reasons. Primarily because of the structural condition of their economy. House prices merely led the way for the rest of their hosue of cards to collapse. Australias economy is vastly different and essential stable.

Rubbish. The housing market as been distorted for years by Government intervention with tax payers money and taxation policies that favor speculation. As a result the bubble has been overinflated when the rest of the world has been deflating or bursting.

And what is our fame to claim ? Virtually zero manufacturing and just a pile of minerals in the ground. No more or less than other countries that have gone into recession.

We didnt go into recession you moron and currently have the best economy in the world and one that is booming.

Idiot.

We barely manufacture and export anything except raw materials. How can we have such a great economy without the false economy caused by over borrowing to buy yet more imported goods ?

And you can thank Kevin Dudd for doling out the money to delay the inevitable part of the free market system but now the tax payers money has stopped and so has the party so we shall see how bad the downturn in Australia gets from here on.

A few interest rate rises and deflation of the property bubble will show us what would have happened without the Government handouts because there is no more freebies to handout to the scammers.

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« Last Edit: Sep 12^th, 2010 at 9:52pm by Sir lastnail »

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Sir lastnail

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Re: Why isn't the media talking about manufacturing ?
Reply #31 - Sep 12^th, 2010 at 9:51pm

freediver wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 5:36pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:21am:

Just like Bob Katter reminded us about the lack of manufacturing in this country, why isn't the talk of the town about the future of manufacturing here ?

What future do we have if we don't add value to things and try and export them ? Do we honestly think we can survive on over priced service industries and lawyer word smiths ?

I'm not talking about your nickel and dime stuff made in Chinese sweatshops. I'm talking about high value added and high tech goods of which we are a net importer. Renewable energy technology comes to mind but where is it ?

I listened to the insiders on the ABC this morning and all they could waffle on about is the same old drab and dreary old politicians being recycled into different portfolios. What garbage media this is !!

Why we funneling billions of dollars into BER so that we can supposedly educate our children better ? Educate them to do what Ms Gillard and Mr Abort ? What on earth are we doing about it ?

I remember the media used to huff and puff about it, but then the economists got involved and started asking questions like why do you want Australians to compete against an unskilled Chinese factory workers getting paid 50c a day. Is it really value adding when you get paid so little? Of course, before manufacturing they were all up in arms about why were aren't growing more food and competing against Africans getting paid 10c a day. Anyway, for some reason the media these days focuses on competitiveness and Australia's participation in the genuinely high value bits. But why would you trust a high faluting economist and the gullible media when we could all be growing potatoes, stitching shirts together and fitting steering columns in new cars all day?

Try and tell that to Intel, AMD, Microsoft, Analog devices etc and any other US company that profits from its intellectual property rather than by brute force slave labor.

You sound like an apologist for low achievers who can't think outside the square Sad

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"All of the arab states have said we will have peace with Israel when there is a state of Palestine as a UN member state and properly constituted." - Jeffrey Sachs.

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perceptions_now

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Re: Why isn't the media talking about manufacturing ?
Reply #32 - Sep 12^th, 2010 at 10:07pm

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:58pm:

perceptions_now wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:39pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:17pm:

The major component of manufacturing is labor costs. our labor rates are severl times that of our asian neighbours and 10-20 times that of china. That pretty much precludes much of the manufacturing base. not all, but a lot of it. And you cant just huff and puff and complain and pretend it isnt true. The only viable alternative is to halve the minimum wage. you up fot that?

Try looking forward a few years LW!

What was that supposed to mean? do you expect anything to change in the wage disparity arena?

What happens, when Energy costs go thru the roof, say $400-$500 a barrel of oil and comparable for other fossil fuels?

What happens when the cost of transporting, now highly inflated costly goods, becomes non economical, but we have already done away with our manufacturing infrastructure & experienced workforce?

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perceptions_now

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Re: Why isn't the media talking about manufacturing ?
Reply #33 - Sep 12^th, 2010 at 10:12pm

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:21pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:12pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:08pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:58pm:

perceptions_now wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:39pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:17pm:

The major component of manufacturing is labor costs. our labor rates are severl times that of our asian neighbours and 10-20 times that of china. That pretty much precludes much of the manufacturing base. not all, but a lot of it. And you cant just huff and puff and complain and pretend it isnt true. The only viable alternative is to halve the minimum wage. you up fot that?

Try looking forward a few years LW!

What was that supposed to mean? do you expect anything to change in the wage disparity arena?

Yes but you would be the first to expect someone on low wages to pay over inflated prices for a house in a property bubble. You can't have it both ways.

But nails, even you must realise that eventually the housing 'bubble' will burst and house prices WILL drop back into line with wages.....

The credit companies are, currently, holding housing prices artifically high....so they can demand higher interest rates...

This cannot and will NOT continue...

that is nonsense. anyone who has ever read about - never mind studied - eceonomics knows all bout the value of goods and that this 'value' is given by the CONSUMER/CUSTOMER, not by some other regulatory or third party buyer. House prices are what they are simply because that is what people are willing to pay. Now you might say that it is a bubble. maybe you are right maybe you are wrong but it is a price generated by DEMAND. The most likely result wil be a small correction of perhaps 10% sometime soon followed by flat-lining prices for a few years while inflation and wages catches up. The class example of how this principle operates is that 30 years ago houses only required a single income to be bought, however at that time dual income families were quite rare. The houseing prices matched the market-places expectations and ability to pay. when dual income families became the norm house prices became much higher because - shock horror - people had more money to pay and so did exactly that.. pay more. It is no more complex than that. A recession causes houe prices to fall because... people have less money. a boom casues prices to rise because people have MORE money. and just liek in stocks, if house prices get out of kilter with their actual intrinsice worth there comes a correction. Usually in the 5-15% range. The US example is not the same as the housing market collapsed over there for very very different reasons. Primarily because of the structural condition of their economy. House prices merely led the way for the rest of their hosue of cards to collapse. Australias economy is vastly different and essential stable.

Rubbish!

The Australian economy, will follow the USA & Europe, which is inherently unstable and about to go down the toilet!

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perceptions_now

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Re: Why isn't the media talking about manufacturing ?
Reply #34 - Sep 12^th, 2010 at 10:16pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:34pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:21pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:12pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:08pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:58pm:

perceptions_now wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:39pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:17pm:

The major component of manufacturing is labor costs. our labor rates are severl times that of our asian neighbours and 10-20 times that of china. That pretty much precludes much of the manufacturing base. not all, but a lot of it. And you cant just huff and puff and complain and pretend it isnt true. The only viable alternative is to halve the minimum wage. you up fot that?

Try looking forward a few years LW!

What was that supposed to mean? do you expect anything to change in the wage disparity arena?

Yes but you would be the first to expect someone on low wages to pay over inflated prices for a house in a property bubble. You can't have it both ways.

But nails, even you must realise that eventually the housing 'bubble' will burst and house prices WILL drop back into line with wages.....

The credit companies are, currently, holding housing prices artifically high....so they can demand higher interest rates...

This cannot and will NOT continue...

that is nonsense. anyone who has ever read about - never mind studied - eceonomics knows all bout the value of goods and that this 'value' is given by the CONSUMER/CUSTOMER, not by some other regulatory or third party buyer. House prices are what they are simply because that is what people are willing to pay. Now you might say that it is a bubble. maybe you are right maybe you are wrong but it is a price generated by DEMAND. The most likely result wil be a small correction of perhaps 10% sometime soon followed by flat-lining prices for a few years while inflation and wages catches up. The class example of how this principle operates is that 30 years ago houses only required a single income to be bought, however at that time dual income families were quite rare. The houseing prices matched the market-places expectations and ability to pay. when dual income families became the norm house prices became much higher because - shock horror - people had more money to pay and so did exactly that.. pay more. It is no more complex than that. A recession causes houe prices to fall because... people have less money. a boom casues prices to rise because people have MORE money. and just liek in stocks, if house prices get out of kilter with their actual intrinsice worth there comes a correction. Usually in the 5-15% range. The US example is not the same as the housing market collapsed over there for very very different reasons. Primarily because of the structural condition of their economy. House prices merely led the way for the rest of their hosue of cards to collapse. Australias economy is vastly different and essential stable.

No it's not longy....the 'bubble' has burst every other time the house prices have been too high....

It happened in the 50's, the 60's, the 70's, the 80's and the 90's....

I mean, hell my parents bought their first house for 2000 pounds....ok, that was 10 years worth of wages at the time.....
but the current house prices are about 30 years at the average wage.....the prices WILL drop....just as soon as people get to the point where they can't afford the prices, and stop buying houses.....then the prices will drop down to the point where home owners don't need 2 or 3 jobs, just meet the payments...

It is correct to say that housing will decline!

All one has to do is take a line thru what has already happened in Japan, the USA, Europe & what will also follow in China.

We will be no different here and I suspect 40-50% will be a minimum, the only outstanding is the final date that things start to roll!

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perceptions_now

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Re: Why isn't the media talking about manufacturing ?
Reply #35 - Sep 12^th, 2010 at 10:22pm

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 6:17pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:25pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:21pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:12pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 4:08pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:58pm:

perceptions_now wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:39pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 3:17pm:

The major component of manufacturing is labor costs. our labor rates are severl times that of our asian neighbours and 10-20 times that of china. That pretty much precludes much of the manufacturing base. not all, but a lot of it. And you cant just huff and puff and complain and pretend it isnt true. The only viable alternative is to halve the minimum wage. you up fot that?

Try looking forward a few years LW!

What was that supposed to mean? do you expect anything to change in the wage disparity arena?

Yes but you would be the first to expect someone on low wages to pay over inflated prices for a house in a property bubble. You can't have it both ways.

But nails, even you must realise that eventually the housing 'bubble' will burst and house prices WILL drop back into line with wages.....

The credit companies are, currently, holding housing prices artifically high....so they can demand higher interest rates...

This cannot and will NOT continue...

that is nonsense. anyone who has ever read about - never mind studied - eceonomics knows all bout the value of goods and that this 'value' is given by the CONSUMER/CUSTOMER, not by some other regulatory or third party buyer. House prices are what they are simply because that is what people are willing to pay. Now you might say that it is a bubble. maybe you are right maybe you are wrong but it is a price generated by DEMAND. The most likely result wil be a small correction of perhaps 10% sometime soon followed by flat-lining prices for a few years while inflation and wages catches up. The class example of how this principle operates is that 30 years ago houses only required a single income to be bought, however at that time dual income families were quite rare. The houseing prices matched the market-places expectations and ability to pay. when dual income families became the norm house prices became much higher because - shock horror - people had more money to pay and so did exactly that.. pay more. It is no more complex than that. A recession causes houe prices to fall because... people have less money. a boom casues prices to rise because people have MORE money. and just liek in stocks, if house prices get out of kilter with their actual intrinsice worth there comes a correction. Usually in the 5-15% range. The US example is not the same as the housing market collapsed over there for very very different reasons. Primarily because of the structural condition of their economy. House prices merely led the way for the rest of their hosue of cards to collapse. Australias economy is vastly different and essential stable.

Rubbish. The housing market as been distorted for years by Government intervention with tax payers money and taxation policies that favor speculation. As a result the bubble has been overinflated when the rest of the world has been deflating or bursting.

And what is our fame to claim ? Virtually zero manufacturing and just a pile of minerals in the ground. No more or less than other countries that have gone into recession.

We didnt go into recession you moron and currently have the best economy in the world and one that is booming.

Idiot.

Obviously & solely, due to the Liberal government, who vacated power back in 2007?

Btw, is it OZ or the world that is booming?

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