Australian Politics Forum - Quentin Bryce is seeking advice

shampain socialist Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1004	Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice Reply #30 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 8:02pm the military in this country is apolitical. It is simply a disciplined organisation that is task-orientated to protect the country and see to operational functionality. That is all. That is what is needed. It is not about politics.
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longweekend58

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #31 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:32pm

shampain socialist wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 7:18pm:

don't panic! We are not Fiji, we have an excellent, competent, professional and very humanitarian military in all services. AND, we are lucky enough to have a Monarch who has the right to protect us by allowing an interim government.
I would very much welcome that development right now. It would send an extremely good counterbalance view to the world that we are mature enough and have quality military personnel to entrust our Commonwealth to their care until the civil politicians sort it out.
This has happened before, in 1940 (not that I was around, if that makes you feel any better!), right before the second world war. Then, our military protected us.

you are a moron. military leadership is ONLY the provicne of dictators.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #32 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:34pm

shampain socialist wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 8:02pm:

the military in this country is apolitical. It is simply a disciplined organisation that is task-orientated to protect the country and see to operational functionality. That is all. That is what is needed.
It is not about politics.

You seem to forget that we didnt vote for them. we DID however vote for the labor party at the 2007 election (well not me but the majority did!). until the new election results are sorted out it is only fair and fitting and SAFE for that govt to remain in control. you idea is probably one of the stupidest things Ive ever read on here - and that is one helll of a challenge!

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #33 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:35pm

shampain socialist wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 7:09pm:

Tell Quentin Bryce, she's the one seeking advice.

There is no guarantee that any outcome here will be stable, and no guarantee that another election or another one after that will show any different result or one that is acceptable to everyone.

It is not a matter of panic at all, it is simply a matter of considering what the options are.

Democracy is an experiment, the people need to see that it succeeds. Prior to democracies, there was monarchical government. What is so outlandish about that? It is historical fact; monarchical governments used the military and a bureaucracy, instead of a parliament.
Very simple.

you [insert any and all expletives] moron.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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shampain socialist

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #34 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:35pm

only in dictatorships. Australia is not a dictatorship, it is a parliamentary democracy with a constitutional monarchy. The relationship is quite clear.
If a government cannot be formed in the democratic process, the monarch may appoint one, as in a Commonwealth Administration, under the leadership of whoever, as an interim measure.
No problem.
Now start panicking!

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shampain socialist

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #35 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:39pm

you don't vote for an Administrator appointed by the Crown. It happens at local councils all the time when they become dysfunctional.
At the national level, that Administration could be whoever the Crown deems fit to keep order and national security.
You don't vote for the Monarch either, so you wear what is given. That is the law.
If you, as a democratic voter cannot ensure a cogent national government (possibly because a lot of people flippantly vote for stupid little parties that are there just to stir), then the Crown is there to step in and protect the country.
It's not a game, mate. Learn.

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longweekend58

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #36 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:40pm

shampain socialist wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:35pm:

only in dictatorships. Australia is not a dictatorship, it is a parliamentary democracy with a constitutional monarchy. The relationship is quite clear.
If a government cannot be formed in the democratic process, the monarch may appoint one, as in a Commonwealth Administration, under the leadership of whoever, as an interim measure.
No problem.
Now start panicking!

try reading your constitution you idiot. the GG CANNOT just appoint anyone she wants. the only choice of PM has to come from the lower house and anyone cho can form a majority. in practical terms that is only two people - Gillard or Abbott.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #37 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:41pm

shampain socialist wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:39pm:

you don't vote for an Administrator appointed by the Crown. It happens at local councils all the time when they become dysfunctional.
At the national level, that Administration could be whoever the Crown deems fit to keep order and national security.
You don't vote for the Monarch either, so you wear what is given. That is the law.
If you, as a democratic voter cannot ensure a cogent national government (possibly because a lot of people flippantly vote for stupid little parties that are there just to stir), then the Crown is there to step in and protect the country.
It's not a game, mate. Learn.

You just got EVERYTHING wrong. congratulations. It is a real skill to get every single point in a post totally wrong.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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shampain socialist

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #38 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:47pm

You still don't have a government no matter how angry you get.
You do have a monarch, and if you fail to make the democratic process work, don't overlook the power and influence of the Crown to step in in emergency situations.
They have great lawyers.
You can be absolutely certain that the powers that be at that level are considering this situation right now. Definitely.
Would you like to join the Army, Navy or Airforce?

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #39 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:52pm

shampain socialist wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:47pm:

You still don't have a government no matter how angry you get.
You do have a monarch, and if you fail to make the democratic process work, don't overlook the power and influence of the Crown to step in in emergency situations.
They have great lawyers.
You can be absolutely certain that the powers that be at that level are considering this situation right now. Definitely.
Would you like to join the Army, Navy or Airforce?

We still DO have a Government.....Which has all the same powers as any 'interim' government or 'Administrator' would have...

Until the finalisation of the vote count....the last government continues with routine functions...

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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longweekend58

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #40 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:53pm

shampain socialist wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:47pm:

You still don't have a government no matter how angry you get.
You do have a monarch, and if you fail to make the democratic process work, don't overlook the power and influence of the Crown to step in in emergency situations.
They have great lawyers.
You can be absolutely certain that the powers that be at that level are considering this situation right now. Definitely.
Would you like to join the Army, Navy or Airforce?

if you had even a moderate understandong of our constitutional democracy you woudl realise that we DO have a government. the government was not dissolved - just parliament and can exist constitutuionally without parliament until November. this govt has no legisltaive powers due to no parliament but it has full executive powers. Convention (ie not law) dictates that no major policies are enacted in this period without the support of the opposition. So just to make it clear...

WE HAVE A GOVERNMENT STILL.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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shampain socialist Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1004	Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice Reply #41 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:57pm you better go tell Quentin Bryce...she's seeking legal advice. You better check the historical emergency powers of the Crown when parliament or government cannot be formed. If it cannot be resolved now or with repeated elections, an appointed Administration will be necessary.
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longweekend58

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #42 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:57pm

Its actually not dissimilar to the USA which holds it presidential election in november but the govt doesnt change until 10 weeks later. In the meantime the existing president has full executive power but is expected to consult the incoming administration on major matters.

just to clarify the situation further, this situation is not unique. it does in fact happen EVERY TIME and election is called. the govt goes into caretaker mode until some time after the election and the numbers are counted. The opposition leader doesnt take the reigns of office the moment the other leader concedes defeat. the PM remains PM until he/she resigns.

I cant believe people dont get this? it happens EVERY TIME. the only difference this time is that it will take a few more days or a week to do the counting.

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longweekend58

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Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice
Reply #43 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:59pm

shampain socialist wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:57pm:

you better go tell Quentin Bryce...she's seeking legal advice.
You better check the historical emergency powers of the Crown when parliament or government cannot be formed.
If it cannot be resolved now or with repeated elections, an appointed Administration will be necessary.

Good greif. She is gettinglegal advice to make sure she does the right thing you idiot. 'legal advice' doesnt mean she doesnt know what to do.

But since you seem to think you are such an expert please refer me to these 'emergency powers' you seem to think exist or at least refer me to an expert who agrees with you.

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shampain socialist Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1004	Re: Quentin Bryce is seeking advice Reply #44 - Aug 23^rd, 2010 at 9:59pm a president is not a monarch. It remains to be seen whether a functioning parliament OR government can be formed. If an emergency situation arises... bring in a military administration. I think it might be you who thinks you are the expert. In that case, keep researching.
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