Lies come easy to them.  We constantly see examples here, of delusion, denial, deflection, and dishonesty.  They readily accept "convenient" disinformation.

You must be joking mate.....if anyone has ever played the race card it is Howard and his protégé Abbott.....the Liberal faithful have nothing to be proud of with their comments about minorities and immigration......Australia has shown it is insecure and self serving in every respect.....I think it is time the Coalition stopped playing to the lowest element in society!!!

Most intelligent people realize a few thousand people coming by boat a year will have no affect on their lifestyle what so ever.....Australia would be doing it's bit to alleviate the refugee problems facing our neighbors and show some compassion.....However when their are votes to be won in domestic politics the major parties use refugees as an election issue to attack their opponent demonizing the innocent.....Australia deserves to be labeled racist....it is a fact!!!

Well That is a BEEEEEEAAAUUUUUTTTTYYYY>
That post is going straight on the mantlepiece in the poolroom.

Let me paraphrase if I may, the position that aussiefree3ride is seemingly making,

IF these poor people had better boats, we would LOVE them to come, but we are too worried for their safety to let them risk their lives in unseaworthy craft.

Perhaps you are right, and if there is an iota of honesty in your post, I suppose we can expect to see Tone send a flotilla of seaworthy craft to guarantee the safe passage of these guests that Lib supporters welcome so openly, and whose safety is so paramount to them.

aussiefree2ride wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 9:44am:

Australians hostility towards asylum seekers arriving on boats is not motivated towards stopping them due to any fear or concern for their seaworthiness, it is motivated by an hysterical and irrational fear of invasion by cultural foreigners, atavistic of the Yellow Peril hysteria, for which the only solutions our politicians can offer is incarceration in deserts or transportation to remote islands, both themselves atavistic of another 19th century practise with which Australia has a unique experience.

aussiefree2ride wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 9:44am:


Abbott has talked about firing warning shots at them, the way they do with the illegal fishermen.

How is firing shots at terrified families in leaking boats going to help them? Not all of them are politically savvy and won't have a clue about this new policy of turning them back.

There will be even more drownings under this cruelty.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 11:42am:


There is no possibly of a sensible debate or discussion with this kind of irrelevant, neurotic rambling.  Emotive, exagerative hysteria can make good comedy, but it`s a pointless WOFTAM most of the time.

I'm just sick of non-white immigrants and immigrants in general. I've been toying with the idea of an ethnic status quo that mandates that we are allowed to take in non-white immigrants as long as the proportions in which they arrive cannot change the current ethnic balance of the country. I don't know what should be done about the boat people; it's a tricky situation, but I really don't like the idea of keeping them locked up. Allowing them provisional asylum until it is safe for them and their families to return home seems like the best answer for them, but even that is a problematic solution. The boat people aren't really a big blip on my radar screen though.

Certain groups should just not be allowed to arrive here, period, even if their arrival would not upset the ethnic status quo. Africans in particular fall under this category.

I don't trust our current government at all on this issue. Free debate is essentially banished on discussing these matters, and I've gpt a feeling that our officials are covering up or deliberately providing us with misleading statistics on the crime rates of certain groups.

aikmann4 wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 12:55pm:



Ausralia is by population, a very small country, without the potential to support a big population. We can only make a token gesture for assylum seekers, the number of people Australia can support is too insignificant.  I believe you to be right re the misleading statistics.

aikmann4 wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 12:55pm:

Representative, I'm sure, of Australian anti-boaters.

aikmann4 wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 1:17pm:

We have a cultural responsibility not to evoke the image of a dark chapter in Australian history - Incarceration of the destitute in desert and remote island prisons.

Quote:


???

Do Australian "anti-boaters" actually have views similiar to mine, in that they would prefer them not to be locked up or sent back home unless it was safe to do so?

Fair enough, I'm not disputing that. I don't really "hate" anybody though.

I just like to think that my opinions on this, obviously highly controversial and incendiary theme, are a little more nuanced than those of Macca and Dave's down at the BP Garage outside of Wollongong (despite the fact that they are ultimately similiar in their objectives ).

aikmann4 wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 1:17pm:


I agree 100%, we should only be taking in limited numbers, and ONLY people from compatible backgrounds.  I don`t care tf they`re black, brown, green, or yellow, providing they don`t pose a future threat to stability and internal peace.

I don't want anybody to "disappear". Merely immigration to be brought near to a grinding halt. The totterring, ricketty edifice we've put together over the past thirty or forty years, that tower of guilt-mongering, endless special pleading and tedious, petty, identity politics, simply needs to be deconstructed and put to death. Ordinary Australians are sick to death of it.

Bringing up the Holocaust is just cheap.

Quote:


I have a feeling he feels the same way I do. I wish more people would just be honest about this sort of thing. There's no shame in it.

aikmann4 wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 1:57pm:



Thank you Imp, I just want the best future for Australia.

aikmann4 wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 2:06pm:



That`s it.

aussiefree2ride wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 1:58pm:

No definitions then?

Of course not. They would undermine the point of dog whistling.

Quote:


I don't know how this relates to what I'm saying at all. All political views and attitudes can be abused in some way; I'm not suggesting that what I desire can't potentitally be very harmful.. but only a naive person could hold an opinion and not think that it couldn't be potentially harmful. When I attempted to distinguish myself from "Macca & Dave" I meant that my opinions are motivated by things beyond a mere visceral, emotional fear and dislike of foreigners (not that "Macca & Dave" are entirely like that either).

I could never support the ascension of a demagogue or tyrant like those of the last century; but attempting to slander every single politician who attempts to address or stand up for sentiments like those of "Macca & Dave" as potential little Hitlers goes too far and is unfair. Hitler made his views explicit from day one -- everything he was going to do in the Second World War was spelled out in capital letters in Mein Kampf. Anti-immigration, nationalist commentators like Jared Taylor, Steve Sailer, etc don't resemble Hitler in the slightest. Yet they are treated as if they do every time the media talks about them. I stopped buying into the rhetoric a long time ago.

v

Quote:


I've been meaning to write it out actually. I've been constructing a site over the past several months that explains all the nuances of my views, but it'll take a while to finish.

I'm not up to that bit yet. If somebody here has access to JSTOR or any other academic database please private message me.

Quote:


I do. That doesn't necessarily mean that I desire the same thing as Hitler did. And I don't think any Australian and "anti-boater" does either. This does not mean however that the views of said Germans were exactly founded upon anything substantial; but this does not mean that it logically follows that my, or anybody else's views of the present day, are likewise without founding.

Maybe you should think about what the people who run this country desire for us; they're not exactly benign forces either. The people who ridicule the supposed xenophobes and "white trash" (a term you love and use so contemptuously all the time) disgust me to a great extent at times.

Quote:


Should have paid more attention. The agenda of the Nazis was fairly obvious; explicit, in fact.

I try not to make inferences too distantly from what people say and make personally clear. Saying that journalists, pundits and politicians like Steve Sailer et al have sinister motives, on the magnitude of those of a certain German dictator, just from having a "really bad feeling about them", or misrepresenting or disfiguring their actual statements into grotesque travesties of themselves, appears to be nothing more to me (not specifically referring to you) than a deliberate attempt to shut down and defame anybody who disagrees with a certain political and philosophical orthodoxy. I think it's sick and I'll have no part in it, thank you.

aikmann4 wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 3:00pm:

The rhetoric of the Nazis was out there (and even that they moderated when expedient)... Few in 1920's Germany believed that a crime unprecedented in thousands of years of human history could have sprung from "good old-fashioned European anti-Semitism"

Quote:

My point is that our acts of omission and commission, born of what we fear, have undesirable consequences beyond that which we would intend or, more to the point, can control.

aikmann4 wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 3:15pm:

All the more more incumbent on us then to be sure we do not project our personal fears, lest they be misused by those among us who crave personal power before the greater good.

There's always a risk there though; in that our fears and anxieties may in fact be urgent and legitimate, and thus warranting of a seeing to. Whether you are entirely right, or I am entirely right, or we're both a little bit right or both entirely wrong, whatever route that we take is inevitably going to result in us being bombarded by a host of trifling as well as severe problems.

I'm not afraid of the boat people, no. I'm not sure "afraid" is the word I would use to describe my sentiments on non-white immigration either.

If I lived in the United States, yes, I would have a sense of fear for the potential (and, current, palpable) implications of its totally self-destructive, suicidal, immigration policy. If I lived in Europe, particularly, a country like France, yes, I would "fear" what the future of my country would look like under a Muslim majority population, or even a sizable Muslim minority. I don't think even you would disagree with the last one. Australia's situation is more complicated and I feel may require deeper investigation before I can make any (proper) moderately strong statements on it, in one way or another.

The whole boat people situation has provided a convenient niche for politicians who want to appear tough and appeal to anti-immigration sentiments, without actually opposing the bulk of immigration. It's a precarious tight-rope walk between the bogans and our corporate overlords (who always have an insatible thirst for immigrants).