Australian Politics Forum - Australian Greens' And The Federal Election

skippy.

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #120 - Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 8:28am

Quote:

As it is your debating skills consists of huge swathes of boring, negative articles you've copied, but you seem to believe by adding a vulgar personal comment at the end - you're making a good argument against the Greens.

How true, what annoys me the most about mel,besides her constant whine, is that she never provides proof of her fairy tales, just a whole bunch of crap.
But be carefull mantra, mozz doesn't like mel being told she doesn't tell the truth,at least freediver has worked her out.

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mellie

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #121 - Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 8:32am

mellie wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 8:25am:

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2010/s2958392.htm

It's all in the transcript.....

LEIGH SALES: But the rules that you're talking about only affect Upper House and Senate preferences, don't they? So why have you had to do a deal for Lower House preferences if you don't actually agree with it?

BOB BROWN: Well exactly. There shouldn't be preference negotiations for either, but there always are, because if you don't get involved in preference negotiations you get cut out and your voters do and your candidates do. It's a perverse system, it should be abolished, but it's there, the Greens take part in it the same as every other political party and there'll be how-to-vote cards as a result of that in, I'm told, 50 or so seats.

LEIGH SALES: But you just pointed out that, as you say, it's the preference deal is required for the Senate, but the Greens have also done a deal for preferences in the Lower House. If you're so opposed to it in principle, why didn't you as the party leader simply say, "Well actually I'm just not going along with this"?

BOB BROWN: Because, ah, the - I'm not - the party determines preferences and I've stayed out of it. And ...

LEIGH SALES: But you're the leader.

I think this speaks for itself, don't you? Roll Eyes

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All together now Labor voters.......&&&&lap-tops, pink-bats refugees and Clunker-cars&&&&insurance.AES256

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skippy. Gold Member Offline Posts: 20882 Gender:	Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election Reply #122 - Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 8:42am A question for the dummys- Why would the GREENS preference a climate confusionalist party that doesn't even beleive in climate change?
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Cyberman Senior Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 391	Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election Reply #123 - Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 9:23am Why would they preference anyone at all, according to Bob? If Bob wants to play dumb and dumber with the Australian public, he will likely get hurt
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longweekend58

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #124 - Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 9:46am

mellie wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 8:25am:

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2010/s2958392.htm

It's all in the transcript.....

LEIGH SALES: But the rules that you're talking about only affect Upper House and Senate preferences, don't they? So why have you had to do a deal for Lower House preferences if you don't actually agree with it?

BOB BROWN: Well exactly. There shouldn't be preference negotiations for either, but there always are, because if you don't get involved in preference negotiations you get cut out and your voters do and your candidates do. It's a perverse system, it should be abolished, but it's there, the Greens take part in it the same as every other political party and there'll be how-to-vote cards as a result of that in, I'm told, 50 or so seats.

LEIGH SALES: But you just pointed out that, as you say, it's the preference deal is required for the Senate, but the Greens have also done a deal for preferences in the Lower House. If you're so opposed to it in principle, why didn't you as the party leader simply say, "Well actually I'm just not going along with this"?

BOB BROWN: Because, ah, the - I'm not - the party determines preferences and I've stayed out of it. And ...

LEIGH SALES: But you're the leader.

Sounds like the Democrats where the leader had little say in anything. kind of makes you wonder why they have a leader at all if the job comes with zero authority and power.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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muso

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #125 - Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 10:21am

____ wrote on Jul 18^th, 2010 at 8:37pm:

muso sad

"The difference is that the Greens want to stop prosecution for personal use. It will open the floodgates.

_/_/_/

got a link to this and to which floodgates (Thames River, London maybe?)

To the policy? Yes. The Greens' Website.
http://greens.org.au/policies/care-for-people/drugs-substance-abuse-and-addictio...

Quote:

5: the regulation of personal use of currently illegal drugs is best addressed primarily within a health and social framework, with legal support.
6: imprisonment for personal use of illicit drugs, when not associated with other crimes, is not an appropriate solution to drug dependence.

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Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election Reply #126 - Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 10:32am longweekend58 wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 9:46am: LEIGH SALES: But you're the leader. Jim Hacker: It is the people’s will. I am their leader. I must… follow them
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longweekend58

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #127 - Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 10:59am

The Greens dont seem to have any point to their preference deals. if they had an ounce of integrity (year right!) they would preference those that could help their agenda. clearly that isnt the ALP. perhaps they should preference another minor party or just stop pretending they are anything other than Labor-lite.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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freediver

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #128 - Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 8:36pm

mellie wrote on Jul 21^st, 2010 at 9:00pm:

Do you need a link to the transcript Freediver?

I mean, by all means, don't take my word for it...

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2010/s2958392.htm

Thanks Mellie. I always have trouble finding a transcript.

longweekend:

Quote:

Im sure you believe there is logic there, but trust me there isnt. second preferences are notoriously invalid

So you are right because of some kind of notoriety that no-one else is aware of? Do you have any actual evidence, or have you just invented this to suit your agenda?

Quote:

and there is absolutely NO WAY a candidate with 27% of primary votes beatinmg a candidate with 45% of primaries is democractic!

But I just explained how it is the very definition of democracy. Is there anything specific in my explanation you disagree with, or is this something you just take on faith?

Mellie:

Quote:

It comes down to the powers of the people being undermined, their preferences being decided upon by others, unless they are aware of how the system works, which in many cases, they are flat out knowing what box to tick.

Actually, you do not have to know how the system works. All you have to do is rank the candidates in order of preference. I think most are capable of this. Longweekend is the first person I have ever come across who actually attempts to vote strategically in preferential systems. It would be interesting to see him try to explain this. For some reason, every person I come across who promotes optional preferential voting has some odd confusion about how our system works, but they can never explain why they believe what they do. It is remarkably consistent for something lacking any substance. Maybe one of the lunatic parties is pushing the idea.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Dsmithy70

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #129 - Jul 23^rd, 2010 at 8:54am

Seems the Greens may actually have a chance at balance of power.
Today's "Daily Tele" has a full page scare campaign on what freaky things it think the Green's would do if they got the balance of power>
Big picture of Brown as Hulk.
Funny thing is in the same addition they have good old Piers crying that the ABC is bias(YAWN) yet somehow don't see themselves as a mouth piece for the Liberals.
Nothing like marshalling the brain dead bogans of western Sydney to your cause.
Green's holding the balance of power is the last thing Murdoch wants as it seems Brown cant be bought. If it does come to pass perhaps he should watch out for grassy knolls Wink

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REBELLION is not what most people think it is.
REBELLION is when you turn off the TV & start educating & thinking for yourself.
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skippy.

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #130 - Jul 23^rd, 2010 at 9:03am

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Funny thing is in the same addition they have good old Piers crying that the ABC is bias(YAWN) yet somehow don't see themselves as a mouth piece for the Liberals

Piers is a lying turd who realises that Abbott is going to get belted and the extreme right wing neo cons who run the Libs are about to lose their power.
I just hope that the moderates hold their seats, it is clear Abbott will be flogged, but what if there are only extremists left after the election? what if Turnbull loses his seat to the GREENS?

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muso

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #131 - Jul 23^rd, 2010 at 9:41am

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2010 at 10:59am:

The Greens dont seem to have any point to their preference deals. if they had an ounce of integrity (year right!) they would preference those that could help their agenda. clearly that isnt the ALP. perhaps they should preference another minor party or just stop pretending they are anything other than Labor-lite.

Maybe they genuinely want people to make their own minds up on preferences. I usually do, but I'm probably in the minority.

The latest ALP Citizen's Assembly on climate change is one major cop out. Neither the ALP nor the Libs are serious about climate change.

If the Greens hold the "balance of powderpuffs" in the Senate, which looks likely, it could be a good outcome. We might see less procrastination and some action with some luck.

The idea of Bob Brown as PM is scary, but as a lobby, they might do some good, just as long as they don't have to make any decisions.

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« Last Edit: Jul 23^rd, 2010 at 9:51am by muso »

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Equitist

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #132 - Jul 23^rd, 2010 at 2:00pm

A little while ago, the creepy Nick Minchin was on ABC24, sqawking that the Greens should have double-sided how to vote cards - presumably so that the Greens can help the electorate to vote Lib or Lab in the Lower House...

LOL...since when have the Libs had double-sided how-to-votes that help voters to choose between left and right - in either house!?

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Lamenting the shift in the Australian psyche, away from the egalitarian ideal of the fair-go - and the rise of short-sighted pollies, who worship the 'Growth Fairy' and seek to divide and conquer!

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____

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #133 - Jul 24^th, 2010 at 6:03am

Quote:

muso sad

"The difference is that the Greens want to stop prosecution for personal use. It will open the floodgates.

_/_/_/

got a link to this and to which floodgates (Thames River, London maybe?)

To the policy? Yes. The Greens' Website.
http://greens.org.au/policies/care-for-people/drugs-substance-abuse-and-addictio...

Quote:
5: the regulation of personal use of currently illegal drugs is best addressed primarily within a health and social framework, with legal support.
6: imprisonment for personal use of illicit drugs, when not associated with other crimes, is not an appropriate solution to drug dependence.

Yes I am aware of the policies ... I am asking for your link to show it will open the flood gates muso.

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mantra

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Re: Australian Greens' And The Federal Election
Reply #134 - Jul 24^th, 2010 at 6:59am

The drug policies of the Greens won't open the floodgates at all. They are very practical and considered policies, but those who like to denigrate them keep preaching the same old line - that the Greens want to legalise drugs.

It is propaganda only, but it's a good line to throw out when you need something nasty to say.

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