Australian Politics Forum - Re: Climate Science

astro_surf

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #450 - Apr 20^th, 2011 at 9:21pm

It's the feed-back from hell. Methane is 25 times more powerful a greenhouse gas than CO2. And there are already patches of ocean where you can actually light up the bubbles of methane coming up. Once it starts it would be impossible to stop, we'd be on a roller-coaster of nightmare proportions. A real evolutionary bottle neck for the species.

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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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Foolosophy

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #451 - Apr 20^th, 2011 at 10:13pm

astro_surf wrote on Apr 20^th, 2011 at 9:21pm:

It's the feed-back from hell. Methane is 25 times more powerful a greenhouse gas than CO2. And there are already patches of ocean where you can actually light up the bubbles of methane coming up. Once it starts it would be impossible to stop, we'd be on a roller-coaster of nightmare proportions. A real evolutionary bottle neck for the species.

true, but methane also breaks down in the earths atmosphere and environment far quicker than CO2.

Also note that when methane breaks down part of it converts into CO2

One big happy family

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perceptions_now

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #452 - Apr 20^th, 2011 at 10:26pm

astro_surf wrote on Apr 20^th, 2011 at 9:21pm:

It's the feed-back from hell. Methane is 25 times more powerful a greenhouse gas than CO2. And there are already patches of ocean where you can actually light up the bubbles of methane coming up. Once it starts it would be impossible to stop, we'd be on a roller-coaster of nightmare proportions. A real evolutionary bottle neck for the species.

Its one that we will face at some point in time, but I would think it preferable to put it off for a while, until we have hopefully progressed a little further along the evolutionary trail?

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muso

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #453 - Apr 21^st, 2011 at 8:10am

Foolosophy wrote on Apr 20^th, 2011 at 10:13pm:

astro_surf wrote on Apr 20^th, 2011 at 9:21pm:

It's the feed-back from hell. Methane is 25 times more powerful a greenhouse gas than CO2. And there are already patches of ocean where you can actually light up the bubbles of methane coming up. Once it starts it would be impossible to stop, we'd be on a roller-coaster of nightmare proportions. A real evolutionary bottle neck for the species.

true, but methane also breaks down in the earths atmosphere and environment far quicker than CO2.

Also note that when methane breaks down part of it converts into CO2

One big happy family

The Global Warming potential for methane is 25 (25 times that of CO2) for a 100 year horizon. Its atmospheric lifetime is 12 years. It decomposes to CO2, but the overall contribution to atmospheric CO2 from methane is negligible, since the atmospheric concentration of methane is about 500 times lower than that of CO2. Methane contributes approximately 6% of the total greenhouse effect (including water vapour)

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muso

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #454 - Apr 21^st, 2011 at 8:16am

astro_surf wrote on Apr 20^th, 2011 at 9:21pm:

It's the feed-back from hell. Methane is 25 times more powerful a greenhouse gas than CO2. And there are already patches of ocean where you can actually light up the bubbles of methane coming up. Once it starts it would be impossible to stop, we'd be on a roller-coaster of nightmare proportions. A real evolutionary bottle neck for the species.

Some of those are near Spitzbergen.

http://eprints.soton.ac.uk/64607/1/2009gl039191%2Baux.pdf

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Climate Science Reply #455 - Apr 24^th, 2011 at 10:37am Off-Topic replies have been moved to this Topic.
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perceptions_now

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #456 - Apr 24^th, 2011 at 5:39pm

Longtime Minnesota TV reporter digs into global climate change

After spending 32 years in front of the camera as an anchorman and investigative reporter for WCCO-TV in Minneapolis, Don Shelby wanted to apologize to people about climate change.

“For those of you who are confused on this issue,” he said, “you’re forgiven. It’s my fault.”

Shelby was speaking at the University of Minnesota Duluth on Tuesday on what he called “The most important story since journalism began — global climate change.” His speech served as the kick-off for a two-day sustainability fair sponsored by UMD’s Office of Sustainability.

The TV newsman’s mea culpa about having misreported climate change came after of years of treating the story the same as he would any other, requiring the views of two opposing parties, Shelby told the packed lecture hall of the chemistry building.

But, he said, climate change is not a pro or con issue; it’s a scientific fact. And journalists who work to “balance” a story present an inaccurate picture when they give equal weight to sources promulgating inaccurate facts.

“If I report a story on abuse of children, I don’t go out and interview an abuser on the up-side of child abuse,” he said as an example of how an effort to balance can go too far.

“I’ve put the same technique of investigative reporting to the climate change. I had to learn science. This is really difficult stuff, so I had to go back to school.”

Shelby took courses at Metropolitan State University in St. Paul, including statistics, chemistry and physics. Retired from WCCO television and radio work, he now reports online for Minnpost.com.

Shelby said that when he first began to report on climate change, much of the science was unsettled. Most of the “other side” coverage was really about those who disagreed over details of theory.

“When the science began to grow conclusively, the PR machines of the (right-wing and libertarian) think tanks … began to hire and sponsor scientists with pretty good credentials. Those scientists ‘cherry-picked’ information from massive studies and found fault with them. Rather than taking the intellectually honest approach and saying that the body and conclusions of the study were strong, they wished to show that the entire science was flawed.”

Shelby said he used the skills of any good investigative reporter and followed the money. “Once I began to trace back the source and the politics of that approach to science, it began to be clear that many of the same scientists were also on record as saying that acid rain was not a problem, that PVC and HVC did not damage the ozone layer, and, most ugly, was the cigarette smoke was not a carcinogen, and many of these scientists had been employed by the tobacco lobby. Things began to smell. I then started pointing out those facts.”

Mindy Granley, UMD’s sustainability coordinator, said Shelby was chosen to speak because he would be a draw as a respected reporter talking about climate change.

“Judging from the amount of people who showed up, (we were) right,” she said. “We want students to be informed and to be able to think critically about what they see in the media, so they don’t just believe … and ask the right questions.”

Granley said Shelby hit the mark.

“The goal of journalism is to be objective using the three-legged stool of fairness, accuracy and balance,” Shelby said. “I’ve put the same technique of investigative reporting to climate change,” he said.

Link -
http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/event/article/id/197145/group/homepage/
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perceptions_now

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #457 - Apr 24^th, 2011 at 5:50pm

Climate change threatening China’s water resources

Climate change is having an adverse impact on China’s water resources, said the country’s water resources minister.

Chen Lei’s comments came during a meeting on climate change where he pointed out that global warming has become an important environmental issue, with water being one of the sectors most directly affected.

"China faces an imbalance between the supply and demand of water to support its rapid social and economic development, while protecting the natural environment and ecosystems," the China Daily quoted Lei, as saying.

"Global climate change could further exacerbate existing problems over water security, water supply and farming irrigation," Lei said.

Lei also said China experiences a water shortage of 40 billion cubic meters a year, with two-thirds of cities facing increasing scarcity of water.

Khalid Mohtadullah, a senior adviser of Global Water Partnership, said one of the worst issues that China is facing today is water pollution.

He said China has become the world''''s second largest economy with rapid economic growth, and many industries have not found a proper way to manage waste water.

"China is vulnerable to the impacts of uncontrollable climate change as its water infrastructure is weak or unprepared for such changes," he said.

However, Chen said government is stepping up the efforts in water resources management by enhancing the water supply capacity for urban and rural areas, flood prevention systems and the construction of farming infrastructure.

The Chinese government is set to invest 4 trillion Yuan in water conservancy projects over the next 10 years.

It has also established strict water resource management measures to limit the scale of water exploitation, improve the efficiency of water usage, and curb water pollution.

Link -
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/climate-change-threatening-chinas-water-resour...
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There ain't no free lunches!

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perceptions_now

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #458 - Apr 27^th, 2011 at 3:51pm

As I have previously posted, Perth and the South West of WA have been experiencing a long term trend of reduced inflows into dams, which is confirmed by the above chart.

The last of what could be termed "old time/usual rainfall" occurred around the time of the last great La Nina event, in the early to mid 1970's, coinciding with cyclone Tracy in Darwin.

Since then, there has been a clear break from the past, with discernably lower inflows into Dams between 1975-2000 and significant further reductions thru to 2009.

The year 2010 was abysmal and following a 3 month rainfree zone in Perth over this summer, it seems 2011 will be another similar year.

In fact, if this winter follows the winter trend of 2010, then Perth could be in for a very difficult period, particularly given that the Gnangara mound/acquifier, which is now Perth's major water source, is starting to rapidly deplete!

PS - Thanks to Vegi for highlighting an ASPO report, which was the original source of the first chart.

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Foolosophy Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1171 Australia Gender:	Re: Climate Science Reply #459 - Apr 27^th, 2011 at 5:53pm Clathratic Methane Releases - The Elephant in the room
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gizmo_2655 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 16010 South West NSW Gender:	Re: Climate Science Reply #460 - Apr 27^th, 2011 at 7:14pm Foolosophy wrote on Apr 27^th, 2011 at 5:53pm: Clathratic Methane Releases - The Elephant in the room Yes, but YOU are an idiot..."Clathratic"??? Maybe you should actually learn to spell???
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Foolosophy

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #461 - Apr 27^th, 2011 at 7:33pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Apr 27^th, 2011 at 7:14pm:

Foolosophy wrote on Apr 27^th, 2011 at 5:53pm:

Clathratic Methane Releases - The Elephant in the room

Yes, but YOU are an idiot..."Clathratic"??? Maybe you should actually learn to spell???

gizmo doesn't understand what the term "Clathratic" means

A clathrate, clathrate compound or cage compound is a chemical substance consisting of a lattice of one type of molecule trapping and containing a second

Methane clathrate, also called methane hydrate, hydromethane, methane

So when I say Clathratic Methane I mean Methane that exists in a cage - a Clathrate

Gizmo is SUPREMELY INTELLIGENT LADIES AND GENTLEMEN-WHO IS THE IDIOT NOW GIZMO

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Lisa Jones Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 39047 Sydney Gender:	Re: Climate Science Reply #462 - Apr 27^th, 2011 at 7:57pm sighs ...
Back to top	If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free. HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415) IP Logged

Foolosophy Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1171 Australia Gender:	Re: Climate Science Reply #463 - Apr 27^th, 2011 at 8:17pm someone has to liven this place up a lttle bit OZPOLITICS is ranked 3rd most boring and riskless political chat forum in the Southern Hemisphere ...not long now before it totally decays into oblivion
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Lisa Jones

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Re: Climate Science
Reply #464 - Apr 27^th, 2011 at 9:37pm

Foolosophy wrote on Apr 27^th, 2011 at 8:17pm:

someone has to liven this place up a lttle bit

OZPOLITICS is ranked 3rd most boring and riskless political chat forum in the Southern Hemisphere

...not long now before it totally decays into oblivion

I don't know what's gotten into you lately but every post that you've made and that I've clicked onto this evening is depressive and morbid.

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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