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EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM? (Read 48480 times)
Grendel
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #285 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 1:52pm
 
I keep hearing it was bit of a "whitewash" Mozz and the terms of reference made it so.

of course you could google more diverse opinion if you were fair dinkum...

like I did...

Climategate Investigation A Monumental Whitewash
One down, two to go: First “investigation” into data fixing scandal clears scientists, says warming is real
Steve Watson

A Parliamentary investigation into the climategate scandal has cleared the scientists involved of any data fixing and subversion of the peer review process, and notes that the scandal provides no evidence to challenge the notion that human activity is causing catastrophic global warming.

The House of Commons’ Science and Technology Committee Report (PDF), the first of three investigations into climategate, produced its report after only a single day of oral testimony.

The report concludes that UN IPCC affiliated scientists at the University of East Anglia’s Climatic Research Unit, led by director Phil Jones (pictured at the hearing), did not tamper with data in an effort to exaggerate the threat of global warming.

The Report states that “The scientific reputation of Professor Jones and CRU remains intact”.

The committee added that it found nothing sinister in Jones’ use of the words “hide the decline” and “trick” with regards to data on temperature changes.

The committee contends that when Jones stated “hide the decline” in an email to his colleagues, he was referring to discarding erroneous data, rather than deliberately concealing it.

The report also states that Jones’ use of the word ‘trick’ “appears to be a colloquialism for a ‘neat’ method of handling data.”

The Committee pulled this explanation from testimony by the CRU itself, which stated:

    …as for the (now notorious) word 'trick', so deeply appealing to the media, this has been richly misinterpreted and quoted out of context. It was used in an informal email, discussing the difficulties of statistical presentation. It does not mean a 'ruse' or method of deception. In context it is obvious that it is used in the informal sense of 'the best way of doing something'. In this case it was 'the trick or knack' of constructing a statistical illustration which would combine the most reliable proxy and instrumental evidence of temperature trends.

Scientist Steve McIntyre, who is mentioned over 100 times in the hacked emails has consistently explained how this explanation is insufficient and falls flat on its face.

On his blog, Climate Audit, McIntyre rebuts the Parliamentary Committee’s conclusion, noting:

“Contrary to [the University of East Anglia's] claims, there is no valid statistical procedure supporting the substitution of tree ring proxy,”

“This is absurd.” McIntyre added, “The trick was not a "neat" way of handling data, nor a recognized form of statistical analysis. The trick was a clever way of tricking the readers of the IPCC 2001 graphic into receiving a false rhetorical impression of the coherency of proxies -- a point understood at the beginning by Jon Stewart of the Daily Show, but now misunderstood due to continued disinformation.”

McIntyre points out that at no time did even the CRU itself contend that any of its data was “erroneous”, so to conclude that it had to dispose of such data is ludicrous:

    In addition, their suggestion that Jones and others were doing nothing more than "discarding data known to be erroneous" is simply absurd. There was no testimony to the Committee (nor has it ever been suggested) that the tree ring data was measured incorrectly or that the data was "erroneous" -- the data is what it is. The tree ring data goes down instead of up -- but that doesn't make it "erroneous". It only means that the data is a bad proxy -- something that was concealed from IPCC readers.

McIntyre submitted notes to the Science and Technology Committee on this very detail of the matter, however, it seems his detailed description has been completely disregarded.

The idea that the “trick” was not to conceal data that was out of step with the scientists warming thesis also falls down when you consider that the code within the CRU’s climate models prove that temperature numbers were "artificially adjusted" to hide the decline in global warming since the 1960's.

This information was leaked along with the inflammatory emails referring to it and provides the real smoking gun. However, predictably, there is no mention of the coding in the STC report.

With reference to charges of subverting the peer review process by Jones and the CRU, the report states “the evidence we have seen does not suggest that Jones was trying to subvert the peer review process”, adding that academics should not be criticised for “informal comments” on papers.

So when Phil Jones wrote the following to climate scientist Michael Mann of Penn State University: We “will keep them out somehow — even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!” that was not a declaration of intent, according to the STC investigation.

The committee essentially believes it is A-OK for the CRU scientists to routinely refer to any research offering alternate viewpoints as “disinformation“,”misinformation” or “crap” that needs to be kept out of the public domain. The committee sees no problem with the fact that those same scientists have the power to do just that.

pt 1
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« Last Edit: Apr 15th, 2010 at 1:59pm by Grendel »  
 
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Grendel
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #286 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:01pm
 
pt 2.

It is backwards and upside down to constantly refer to a “scientific consensus” in order to back up claims of human induced warming and then to essentially state that it doesn’t matter whether or not the scientists at the head of that same consensus have operated within a culture of stonewalling dissenting evidence, theories, data and viewpoints.

After one afternoon of interviews, the STC report concludes “We have found no reason in this unfortunate episode to challenge the scientific consensus.”

“There was no evidence to challenge the ’scientific consensus’ that global warming is induced by human activities.” the report states elsewhere.

Of course, the committee did not spend any time looking at the science, and it was never the intention of the investigation to vindicate the scientific theory behind anthropogenic global warming, however, those two juicy quotes will serve to do so in the eyes of the media and the public at large.

The STC investigation into climategate is farcical on its face. The Committee itself admits that it’s report is insufficient and does not cover all the issues. Phil Willis, the committee’s chairman, noted that it had to produce something quickly before the British general election, and a possible change of government, in May.

“Clearly we would have liked to spend more time on this,” Willis said, adding “We had to get something out before we were sent packing.”

Though the Committee condemned the CRU for withholding information requested by outsiders under Britain’s freedom of information laws, it failed to determine whether Professor Jones had actively deleted information to prevent requests to publish it, as indicated by requests made by Jones in emails to his colleagues.

“The culture of non-disclosure at CRU and instances where information may have been deleted to avoid disclosure, particularly to climate change sceptics, we felt was reprehensible,” Willis told a news conference.

However, the report does not indict Jones on these charges, perhaps because, as revealed by one of the MP on the committee in comments to The Times of London, all members had agreed not to question Professor Jones too closely because of his “fragile condition” – now that’s what I call getting to the bottom of the matter.

Phil Willis also said that the further two pending inquiries into the e-mail scandal would provide a more in depth review. However, as we have previously reported, we can hardly expect the so called “independent” investigation led by Sir Muir Russell to be in any form impartial, given that Russell himself vehemently supports the notion of anthropogenic global warming and has constructed a panel of “experts” that share the same views.

Those views clearly contradict the founding principle of the inquiry – to appoint experts who do not have a "predetermined view on climate change and climate science".

Thus, any notion that this investigation might shake the foundations of the perceived “consensus” on climate science, by being anything other than favourable to Phil Jones and the CRU, is highly unlikely.

Once again it will be left to the alternative media and the blogs to expose these whitewash reports for what they are, given that the vast majority of the corporate mainstream media will undoubtedly run with headlines such as “Investigation Clears Climate Scientists” and “Warming Science Vindicated”, headlines that will be repeated ad infinitum by warmists, carbon trading scam artists and eco-fascists everywhere.

Update: Yep, the media is running with those afore mentioned headlines.

http://www.informationliberation.com/?id=29769
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muso
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #287 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:38pm
 
Grendel wrote on Apr 15th, 2010 at 1:52pm:
Scientist Steve McIntyre, who is mentioned over 100 times in the hacked emails has consistently explained how this explanation is insufficient and falls flat on its face.


You mean Steve McIntyre as in

"I've spent most of my life in business, mostly on the stock market side of mining exploration deals," (Steve McIntyre, 2009)

Do Stock Market pundits and ex Gold Mining Executives automatically qualify as Scientists, and in Climate Science in particular?

- Or is he qualified by virtue of his two published articles in "Energy and Environment" a publication that is not carried in the ISI listing of peer-reviewed journals?

Grendel - Have you tried to publish in Energy and Environment?  You should. They are not very picky who they publish, and you could make a name for yourself.
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Grendel
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #288 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:46pm
 
Good grief...  i wouldn't know you from a bar of soap muso...  so i trust you less than people in the public eye.

Once more all we get from you is cherry picking and shooting messengers.

Well bugger off.  The ARTICLE addresses Mozz's point.  As do many other articles on the Net.  Roll Eyes

ps...  there are at least 2 more enquiries to go.
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skippy.
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #289 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:47pm
 
Quote:
Grendel - Have you tried to publish in Energy and Environment?  You should. They are not very picky who they publish, and you could make a name for yourself.

I'm sure he'd have a following, a rather small deluded following, but a following all the same. Grin
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Grendel
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #290 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:48pm
 
Good to see your fair moderation policy at work...  oh and BTW who is going to censor your flames  Cheesy
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pjb05
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #291 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:54pm
 
muso wrote on Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:38pm:
Grendel wrote on Apr 15th, 2010 at 1:52pm:
Scientist Steve McIntyre, who is mentioned over 100 times in the hacked emails has consistently explained how this explanation is insufficient and falls flat on its face.


You mean Steve McIntyre as in

"I've spent most of my life in business, mostly on the stock market side of mining exploration deals," (Steve McIntyre, 2009)

Do Stock Market pundits and ex Gold Mining Executives automatically qualify as Scientists, and in Climate Science in particular?

- Or is he qualified by virtue of his two published articles in "Energy and Environment" a publication that is not carried in the ISI listing of peer-reviewed journals?

Grendel - Have you tried to publish in Energy and Environment?  You should. They are not very picky who they publish, and you could make a name for yourself.



I think you will find he is an expert in statistics, and his criticisms of the AGW theory were based in this field.
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muso
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #292 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 3:01pm
 
pjb05 wrote on Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:54pm:
muso wrote on Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:38pm:
Grendel wrote on Apr 15th, 2010 at 1:52pm:
Scientist Steve McIntyre, who is mentioned over 100 times in the hacked emails has consistently explained how this explanation is insufficient and falls flat on its face.


You mean Steve McIntyre as in

"I've spent most of my life in business, mostly on the stock market side of mining exploration deals," (Steve McIntyre, 2009)

Do Stock Market pundits and ex Gold Mining Executives automatically qualify as Scientists, and in Climate Science in particular?

- Or is he qualified by virtue of his two published articles in "Energy and Environment" a publication that is not carried in the ISI listing of peer-reviewed journals?

Grendel - Have you tried to publish in Energy and Environment?  You should. They are not very picky who they publish, and you could make a name for yourself.



I think you will find he is an expert in statistics, and his criticisms of the AGW theory were based in this field.


So we can discount his comments on the validity of tree ring data? The issue is a technical one - the fact that the correlation of tree ring size and temperature hasn't held for the most recent period of history - probably due to pollution/ increased UV radiation or some other factor.  

The whole issue is irrelevant anyway, because for this period of history, we can measure temperatures directly.  A Tree-ring expert has stated that the data is not valid, and that it should be discounted.

On the other hand Steve McIntyre an ex Stock market pundit (and not a dendro expert) says that the technical data is valid and that the expert was wrong.

So what this is about is that instead of using calibrated thermometers and remote sensing, we should be cutting bits out of trees and analysing them.

The tree ring data shows that the global temperatures have been decreasing.  Shocked

Actually (now let's get serious), this is backed up by another study which shows that Himalayan Yaks scratch their arses more often when the temperature is higher.

I believe that the author  of that study stated that this data should not be used as a temperature proxy because it's too unreliable.

The temperature trend has been downwards. Of course, the author is an expert on Yak's arses, but perhaps we should ask Steve McIntyre before we dismiss  this important study in its entirety?
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« Last Edit: Apr 15th, 2010 at 3:15pm by muso »  

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muso
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #293 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 3:04pm
 
Grendel wrote on Apr 15th, 2010 at 2:46pm:
Good grief...  i wouldn't know you from a bar of soap muso...  


No - and you're not going to.  Wink

- but it's not my qualifications that are being called into question here.

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mozzaok
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #294 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 4:04pm
 
Google more diverse opinions?

Seriously Grendel, I am really finding it a bit of a stretch to take you seriously.
Your "opinion" piece was from Steve McIntyre's Denialist website, which I would be pretty confident you, of all people, wouldn't need to google, ...but wait..... I have another moment of prescience coming on, and I see "Bookmarks", many bookmarks, many denialist sites.
The great mozza know all, Wink see all Wink
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OOPS!!! My Karma, ran over your Dogma!
 
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Paella
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #295 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 8:17pm
 
Paella wrote on Apr 14th, 2010 at 9:00pm:
Soren wrote on Apr 14th, 2010 at 6:58pm:
Paella wrote on Apr 14th, 2010 at 3:40pm:
Lindzen says that it (AGW) does.



Where, in that article from the Washington Post, did he say that?



How about "To be sure, man’s emissions of carbon dioxide must have some impact. The question of importance, however, is how much."

Did you even read it?

Cat got your tongue?
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Soren
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #296 - Apr 15th, 2010 at 9:39pm
 
Paella wrote on Apr 15th, 2010 at 8:17pm:
Paella wrote on Apr 14th, 2010 at 9:00pm:
Soren wrote on Apr 14th, 2010 at 6:58pm:
Paella wrote on Apr 14th, 2010 at 3:40pm:
Lindzen says that it (AGW) does.



Where, in that article from the Washington Post, did he say that?



How about "To be sure, man’s emissions of carbon dioxide must have some impact. The question of importance, however, is how much."

Did you even read it?

Cat got your tongue?



Yes, I saw that. The guy is musing. So?

Is that all you are on about?



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Paella
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #297 - Apr 16th, 2010 at 12:33am
 
Musing? Musing?! No, he's plainly stating that human activity contributes to warming. Lindzen is a genuine skeptic, as in not a denier. His position is that, yes, increased greenhouse gases will cause radiative forcing, as fairly basic laws of physics suggest they must. But the climate modelling has overstated the effect of positive feedbacks, most significantly those relating to water vapour, and understated some negative feedbacks, and completely failed to recognise other negative feedbacks (on this last point I think his research really has some merit. At least I hope it does).

Point is: he accepts anthropogenic global warming. Either Lindzen is wrong, or soren lorenson is wrong. I'm calling on you to either renounce Lindzen, or renounce AGW. You can't cling to both, one has to go.

Your call.
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Grendel
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #298 - Apr 16th, 2010 at 2:17am
 
ROTFLMAO

Told you...  black and white...  common sense or context doesn't enter into it.
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Paella
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Re: EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM?
Reply #299 - Apr 16th, 2010 at 9:08am
 
Grendel wrote on Apr 16th, 2010 at 1:59am:
"Grow up"   you mean like by not replying to something not addressed to me?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


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