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Hamas claims great victory (Read 25457 times)
tallowood
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #120 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 3:21pm
 
hamas had money and ability to get rockets but not food?
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עַם יִשְרָאֵל חַי
 
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Amadd
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #121 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 3:29pm
 
Last update - 01:08 01/07/2008    


Israel closes Gaza border crossings once again in wake of Qassam  

By Fadi Eyadat and Shahar Ilan, Haaretz Correspondents and Reuters  

The defense establishment decided late Monday to close the border crossings between Israel and Gaza after Palestinian gunmen fired a Qassam rocket into the western Negev Monday afternoon in violation of a cease fire agreement between Israel and Hamas.

Two early warning "Color Red" sirens were heard in the Sha'ar Hanegev area and a rocket struck an open field shortly after. No injuries or damage were reported.

There was no immediate claim of responsibility for what was the fourth such attack since the Egypt-brokered truce went into effect on June 19.

On Sunday, Israel reopened three of its border crossings with the Gaza Strip after cross-border rocket fire stopped.

Israel had shut the crossings on June 25 after an Islamic Jihad rocket salvo which the Palestinian faction said was in retaliation for Israel's killing of one of its leaders in the West Bank.

Other Gaza militants have also fired a rocket and two mortar bombs in two separate incidents.

The Egyptian-brokered ceasefire requires militant groups to halt rocket fire in return for Israel gradually easing its blockade of the impoverished territory.

Israel sharply cut back the supply of goods into the Gaza Strip a year ago, after the Islamic militant group Hamas took over the territory from forces loyal to President Mahmoud Abbas's more secular Fatah faction.



I'd never open the borders to those thugs, they should go ask their Arab mates.
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #122 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 3:34pm
 
Lestat wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 3:18pm:
Seriously...how do you keep a face fd?

I dunno, the same way you keep a cat, I bet. Just keep feeding it.
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freediver
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #123 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 3:39pm
 
Lestat wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 3:18pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 2:55pm:
Quote:
Palestine upheld its end of the truce, Israel did not, and continued its blockage which was starving the people of Gaza. The UN co-ordinator of Gaza has admitted this in an article I posted in this very thread.


Would you mind quoting the bit about starving people?.


Are you serious? Are you honestly saying that palestinians were not starving under the Israeli blockage.

Seriously...how do you keep a face fd?


No Lestat. If you read what I actually posted, you would see that I merely asked you to quote the passage you claimed to have already posted that supports this claim. I notice you were unable to do so. I also checked the first link you supplied as evidence. It directly contradicted you.
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #124 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 4:42pm
 
Lestat wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 2:50pm:
 

Hamas agreed to halt the rocket fire, Israel agreed to lift the blockage. Hamas stopped nearly all the rockets, Israel did absolutely nothing to lift the blockage, on the contrary, and actually increased the blockage, in addition to numerous targetted killings and the odd bomb here or their which resulted in civilian deaths.

After 6 months, Hamas realised that Israel were never going to uphold its end, therefore it decided not to renew the ccease fire agreement. Israel attacked, hamas began firing rockets.

Tell me FD? Would you have preferred that the cease fire continue, Hamas continue to uphold its end, whilst Israel did not, and that the Palestinian people slowly starve to death?

Go back and read the article I posted...I know its very unlikely, but just maybe you may learn something.




Did you mean to say stopped nearly all rockets as acting on their agreement to stop all rockets?
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freediver
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #125 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 4:49pm
 
No wonder I have to ask Lestat to back the claims he makes.
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Gaybriel
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #126 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 4:59pm
 
Amadd wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 2:39pm:
It seems like you're being a bit biased there Gaybriel.

I'm sure there's plenty of "off topic" comments that you could've picked up on, but you chose this one.

I never really care where the debate ends up going when I start a thread anyway.



Yadda has a history of randomly spamming with useless posts and topics
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #127 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 5:53pm
 
Lestat

Were you a visionary negotiator for the Palestinian people, what vision would you have for them? Do you believe there is any viability in pursuing the goal of Israel's destruction? If so, how would you propose to curb Israel's increasingly catastrophic reprisals while Hamas continues its armed harassment of the state?

Would you accept a two state solution?

Instead of a two state solution, could you imagine the possibility of a Republic of Israel-Palestine?

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Grendel
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #128 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 6:00pm
 
he can't even comment of what he thinks.
Or in point form why Hamas was victoriuos.

I wouldn't be waiting around for answers.
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Lestat
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #129 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 7:58pm
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 5:53pm:
Lestat

Were you a visionary negotiator for the Palestinian people, what vision would you have for them?


To live in peace and safety, with the ability to determine their own futures...just like the rest of us Helian.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 5:53pm:
Do you believe there is any viability in pursuing the goal of Israel's destruction?


In comparison to doing nothing, dieing and suffering in silence.
Absolutely.

Fact is helian, Israel should never have been created in the first place, especially in Palestine, a land which was already occupied by people, who had lived on the land for 1300 years.

Israel will be destroyed. It is inevitable, the Palestinian population growth will ensure this. Israel know this, they are stuck between a rock and a hard place. They cannot annex the occupied territories because this will result in jews being a minority within Israel in less then 50 years. Yet they do not want to give up the occupied territories, as deep down, they feel that the westbank is a part of Greater Eretz...

So their strategy is to ensure that protacted negotiations go on forever, keep a perpetual state of war in tact, and keep the Palestinian population in check with oppression, and suffering. They are hoping that things get so bad for the Palestinians that they leave, and if they don't, they will be killed. In this way they keep the numbers down.

It isn't a coincidence that the majority of Israeli victims are woman and children. And the numerous reports of Israeli's refusing pregnant women passage through checkpoints, whilst they are in labour, is evidence of this policy.

Peace will destroy Israel...and they know this.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 5:53pm:
If so, how would you propose to curb Israel's increasingly catastrophic reprisals while Hamas continues its armed harassment of the state?


But thats just it, Israels reprisals aren't 'catastrophically increasing' at all. Its just that you and most in the west have very short memories.

Have you already forgotten Bait Jenin. These Israeli massacres are quite a regular occurance. Like I said, its their way of keeping the Palestinian numbers down.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 5:53pm:
Would you accept a two state solution?


No I wouldn't, especially the one that Israe/US is proposing. A state where Israel controls the borders, no military, and no control of its air space. A state scattered with Israeli settlements, and a great wall cutting right through its territory. Who in their right mind would accept such a state.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 5:53pm:
Instead of a two state solution, could you imagine the possibility of a Republic of Israel-Palestine?


I would support a one state solution, but their is absolutely no way Israel would accept this, for the reasons I have described before.

Aparthied policies are the only way Israel can survive, and they know this. Even amongst Israels arab population..it is envisaged that within 60 years arabs will make up 40% of Israel's population.

Israel is petrified of losing its jewish identity, however, it is inevitable, Palestinian demographics makes it certain.

Now I've answered your questions...would you care to answer some of mine?
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Lestat
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #130 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 7:59pm
 
Grendel wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 6:00pm:
he can't even comment of what he thinks.
Or in point form why Hamas was victoriuos.

I wouldn't be waiting around for answers.


I've already answered why Hamas was victorious....I even posted an article explaining it for those of you who are a bit slow.

It doesn't surprise me that you still don't get it.
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Lestat
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #131 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 8:09pm
 
freediver wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 3:39pm:
Lestat wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 3:18pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 2:55pm:
Quote:
Palestine upheld its end of the truce, Israel did not, and continued its blockage which was starving the people of Gaza. The UN co-ordinator of Gaza has admitted this in an article I posted in this very thread.


Would you mind quoting the bit about starving people?.


Are you serious? Are you honestly saying that palestinians were not starving under the Israeli blockage.

Seriously...how do you keep a face fd?


No Lestat. If you read what I actually posted, you would see that I merely asked you to quote the passage you claimed to have already posted that supports this claim. I notice you were unable to do so. I also checked the first link you supplied as evidence. It directly contradicted you.


Reply #47.

Oh, and tell me once again how the link I provided directly contradicted me?

And you still have failed to answer my question...do you honestly believe that the Israeli blockage of Gaza was not starving the Palestinians.

A simple yes or no will suffice.
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #132 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 8:15pm
 
I asked YOU specific question...

YOU failed to answer them.

YOU are in avoidance.

I don't recall YOU answering me at all.
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Lestat
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #133 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 8:16pm
 
locutius wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 4:42pm:
Lestat wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 2:50pm:
 

Hamas agreed to halt the rocket fire, Israel agreed to lift the blockage. Hamas stopped nearly all the rockets, Israel did absolutely nothing to lift the blockage, on the contrary, and actually increased the blockage, in addition to numerous targetted killings and the odd bomb here or their which resulted in civilian deaths.

After 6 months, Hamas realised that Israel were never going to uphold its end, therefore it decided not to renew the ccease fire agreement. Israel attacked, hamas began firing rockets.

Tell me FD? Would you have preferred that the cease fire continue, Hamas continue to uphold its end, whilst Israel did not, and that the Palestinian people slowly starve to death?

Go back and read the article I posted...I know its very unlikely, but just maybe you may learn something.




Did you mean to say stopped nearly all rockets as acting on their agreement to stop all rockets?


The PA were unable to stop all the rockets, even Israel with all their might when they occupied Gaza could not stop all the rockets. This is what happens when people live under oppression and persecution for 60 years. They lose hope.

Don't underestimate the psychological scarring that occurs Palestinian children are continuously abused by IDF soldiers..those that are lucky enough not to be killed that is.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/yt-0bdbA2Ka3Bo/palestinian_children_beaten_by_isra...
These children go up to be adults. This behaviour is what contributes to the Palestinians hate...not what Hamas teaches them.

Hamas came down hard on many splinter groups, and stopped many attacks. Yes some got through, however, the fact remains that from day one Israel were in breach, as they never lifted the blockage.

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« Last Edit: Jan 21st, 2009 at 8:23pm by Lestat »  
 
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Lestat
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Re: Hamas claims great victory
Reply #134 - Jan 21st, 2009 at 8:19pm
 
Grendel wrote on Jan 21st, 2009 at 8:15pm:
I asked YOU specific question...

YOU failed to answer them.

YOU are in avoidance.

I don't recall YOU answering me at all.


You asked me to list why Hamas was victorious...and I have done so, a number of times.

I can't be held responsible for your incapability to see what is before your very eyes.

And 10 pages on, not one person has been able to state one Israeli goal which was achieved during this operation.

I have posted many links explaining why Israel is being viewed as the loser...whereas you, once again have provided nothing..amid empty claims of 'victory'.

Its an all to familiar pattern with you. Cheesy
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« Last Edit: Jan 21st, 2009 at 8:24pm by Lestat »  
 
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