abu_rashid wrote on Jan 16^th, 2009 at 2:50am:


What pathetic shite again.

1. Saudi is a muslim kingdom. Iran is a muslim republic. NONE of the muslim countries are secular constitutionally.
And how long does it take after the end of colonialism to snap out of the 'woe is me' sloth and decadent self pity that causes the 'no military, no training, no money'? Why don't they make some money?
Israel was NOT superior in arms when it was first attacked and it hadd no powerful allies helping.  But that attack taught it to make sure that it armed itself.

2. Wouldn't expect anything less when your neighbours attack you on the first day. And you are soree because the joos are prudent and have the smartss to learn?  Well, they don't think that Allan knows best, but they go and work for what they want. The fifference betweeen an active and a passive mindset.


3. That was only true for the Yom Kippur war in '73. And it was the right thing. And the smart thing. The US managed to detach Egypt frm the Soviet sphere.

4. All the more reason to call the Arabs stupid and bloody minded. Why keep attacking the joos if they are so supeerior in arms, money, training, brains, have more powerful friends. Again and again, suicide by israel. Each war is calculated to at least enlarge the sense of Arab victimhood.

The palestinians never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity. They ccould have accepted the results of the '48 war and negotiate incremental improvements of their position since. Now they would be where Dubai is and without oil. Or from '67, or 73, or '82 or Oslo, the latest great chance. Any one of these would have been far, far better for ordinary people, espeacilly the young, than what is their situation now. ESPECIALLY considring that thy are counting on eventual vitory on demographic grounds. Why make themselves so myserable in the meantime?? Ah, 'muslim land'. That's worth sacrificing generations for.

You can trust the pallos to find themselves in a hole and keep digging furiously.  Reminds me of a the image of madness in a Kafka sketch: madness, something like a Cossack dance between the two houses, whereby the Cossack goes on scraping and throwing aside the earth with the heels of his boots until his grave is dug out under him.

abu_rashid wrote on Jan 16^th, 2009 at 2:55am:


I didn't drop anything. My position on the BMP, has not changed.

No need to speak for me. I am quite capable of speaking for myself.

Quote:


They are also stopping Hamas watching live on CNN the troop deployment of the IDF. That's kind of more important than the freedom of the press.

And where's the loss - the propaganda arms of Hamas are still able to release their coverage?

Quote:


Really Calanen!  So how come we don't get to read Hamas's propaganda - only Israels?

mantra wrote on Jan 17^th, 2009 at 7:28am:


Pallywood has been in full swing, Abu has been posting their stuff. Have a read. That doesnt seem like Israeli propaganda to me.

Grendel, you are being too abusive, too often, or is your intention to just get more posts deleted, so you can then whine about it some more?

I have no idea what you want an apology for, but I would ask you post requests by whim, rather than ruining threads with sill demands.

I am sure that you don't realise that your hysterical ranting lends as much credibility to your arguments, as Lestats posts lend credibility to Islam.

Now, back to the topic, if you don't mind?

I felt that the point Abu made about settlers taking up all the newly occupied land, was a good point, you just said that it was not, but failed to provide any reasoning as to why you disagree, would you care to expand?

At the moment, we seem to be stuck with the polarised views of each side, happy to demonise their opponents, but unwilling to attach any blame to the side they support.

Helian turns it around from saying each side has done wrongs, to saying that each side is right, which amounts to the same thing, but puts it in a good perspective, and grants the legitimacy of each side's cause, to become the focus.

Now, starting from this point of acceptance, of both sides right to exist, and to live in peace, and with security, we need to see the Palestinians reject Hamas, and Islamist extremism.

While we are waiting for this to happen, the palestinians continue to give Israel all the excuses it needs to keep using aggression and occupying more land, they would be smart to stop doing that.

mozzaok wrote on Jan 17^th, 2009 at 8:54am:

And I think also that to focus on the two equal causes of right humanizes both sides and grants to each a deserved legitimacy. To focus on the doing-of-wrong as opposed to the being-of-right is firstly to shackle each cause to acts of violence or war or murder which then become the focus of all future debate. Secondly it can lend itself to potent non sequiturs such as ‘Islam is the sole cause of the conflict’, which is about as true as concluding that Catholicism (or Protestantism) was the sole cause of the Troubles of Northern Ireland. (Heard that old joke about the atheist walking home one night ambushed by a paramilitary? “Catholic or Protestant?” barks the paramilitary. “Neither”, replies the pedestrian, “I’m an atheist”. “Catholic atheist or Protestant atheist?” asks the paramilitary.).

I believe though that the Palestinian cause has been hijacked by Islamism – a cause with an illegitimate agenda and contemptible goals that must be resisted with extreme and necessarily lethal force. It’s a cause unconcerned by its own futility, whose adherents can think only in terms of war and destruction and the dream of murderous acts through suicide for which they will receive a depraved egocentric reward. It has as much disregard for the welfare of Palestinians as it has for the lives of any other peoples or cultures.

What I wish for the Palestinians is the rise of Palestinian leaders who have a clear vision of a secure, prosperous and peaceful Palestine alongside a secure, prosperous and peaceful Israel. Leaders whose focus is on the aspirations of young Palestinians not just of today but those born in 50 or 100 years time.

And I look forward to the day when athletes from the Republic of Palestine are welcomed into the Olympic arena. Can you hear the cheer of the crowd?