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“God doesn't write books” (Read 5211 times)
Lestat
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Re: “God doesn't write books”
Reply #15 - Nov 18th, 2008 at 9:00am
 
Grendel wrote on Dec 19th, 2008 at 4:58am:
yep and other terminology in another language...  but hey, we are just "dumb" infidels so that doesn't matter.


As you've been told a number of times, infidel is a latin term used by Christians to describe muslims. You know....'infidelity'...lack of faith.

mod: personal attack. let's leave the narky comments aside shall we
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« Last Edit: Nov 18th, 2008 at 12:14pm by Gaybriel »  
 
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Soren
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Re: “God doesn't write books”
Reply #16 - Nov 18th, 2008 at 11:48am
 
This is one of the more pertinent quotes from the guy:

"Prof. Kalisch says he "never told students 'just believe what Kalisch thinks' " but seeks to teach them to think independently. Religions, he says, are "crutches" that help believers get to "the spiritual truth behind them." To him, what matters isn't whether Muhammad actually lived but the philosophy presented in his name."

The point is, Islam is now being questioned, anaylised, subjected to the same criticism as other religious or philosophical ideas. People can mount rearguard action, legislate against discussion in particular countries or forums but it is too late. For Islam to be anything other than a religion for the ignorant or the fanatic, it has to become reasonable. "Faith and reason" is not religion-specific, not just for Catholics or Christians or Jews.

Communication and the dissection and dissemination of news, of views and ideas are now uncontrollable by any Big Brother.

Muslim arguments must be able to stand up without the authority of the Koran because the authority of the Koran itself is questioned. The questioning is based on reasoning and the answer has to be on the same basis. That is a massive hallenge and Islam will either come through and be better for it or it will go the way of all other unreasonable belief systems.





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Soren
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Re: “God doesn't write books”
Reply #17 - Nov 21st, 2008 at 8:05pm
 
If you don't read anything else on this between now and the next embassy burning, read this:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/JK18Aa01.html



Kalisch is the first Muslim scholar to dispute the Prophet's existence, while continuing to profess Muslim. If the Prophet did not exist, or in any case did not dictate the Koran, "then it might be that the Koran was truly inspired by God, a great narration from God, but it was not dictated word for word from Allah to the Prophet", he told a German newspaper. A German Protestant who converted to Islam as a teenager in search of a religion of reason, Kalisch can live with an alternative of reading of Islam. Very few of the world's billion and a half Muslims can.


Islam cannot abide historical criticism of the sort that Judaism and Christianity have sustained for centuries. "Abie, if you're here, then who is that there in my bed?," responds the Jewish wife in the old joke when her husband catches her in delicto flagrante. No one can offer an alternative explanation for the unique persistence of the Jewish people after 30 documented centuries of Jewish life. "If Moses didn't exist," the Jews respond to skeptics, "then who brought us out of Egypt?" Told that perhaps they didn't come out of Egypt, the Jews will respond, "Then what are we doing here today?"
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freediver
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Re: “God doesn't write books”
Reply #18 - Nov 21st, 2008 at 9:03pm
 
Yes it will be interesting to see how Islam fares in an age of enlightenment. For a religion apparently founded on it, it's followers spend an extraordinary amount of time trying to shut people up.
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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