Australian Politics Forum - Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism

tallowood

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #75 - Dec 6^th, 2008 at 10:52pm

ex-member DonaldTrump wrote on Dec 6^th, 2008 at 10:25pm:

....
I guess the point you're trying　make is that you want to learn and understand the 'history' behind the wacist insults? Yeah, sure. I find it interesting too.

I guess you're other point is that people need to be in your position to 'understand' wacism?

If not, what is your point?

On the contrary, Middle Sky, the area where I was born had a mass influx of Southern Europeans as I was growing up. My suburb was made up of about 30% Australians. I copped plenty of racially motivated insults in my schools and I was in the minority. Yet, I didn't take it to heart.

I am now in a country where about 99% of the population is non-European in origin. I've copped plenty of discrimination since I arrived here around a year ago (So please spare me the 'you don't know what it's like' routine). Yet, I don't really care about it.

And everytime I come onto a political forum or talk to them in person all I hear are a bunch of whining foreigners claiming they were 'unfairly treated' and 'discriminated against' because somebody looked at them funny in the street (Mind you, head to toe Islamic outfits are more suitable for costume parties than supermarkets in modern Australia).

I guess what I'm trying to find out is the reason why different races react so differently to racially motivated attacks. 'White' people, in my experience, are the least likely to take a wacist attack seriously. An African on the other hand...

Mｙ statement 'whites invented the modern world' was not intended to be an insult. It's just a fact. Sorry if that makes you feel smaller, but it's simply the truth. Chinese people invented a few good things too and　created a pretty kick-@ss civilisation if that makes you feel any better?

Yet, you reacted in a negative way and thought I was insulting you.

I guess what i'm trying to say with the 'whites invented everything' argument is: An African or Asian can't really carry out a wacist attack on a white for being 'stupid' effectively in an offensive way, because historically, whites have invented pretty much everything in the modern world. However, whites can attack an African for being stupid, becasue they've invented hardly anything and Africans know it. Which is why Africans feel the need to attack Europeans with the 'physical' insults (Ie. Weak, small penises etc).

Anyway, feel free to discuss the origin of wacist insults. I don't really mind.

I don't subscribe to the race theory because of lack of scientific definition of races but I must say this above is a good analyses of inter human relationship in general.

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Middle Sky

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #76 - Dec 7^th, 2008 at 10:27am

ex-member DonaldTrump wrote on Dec 6^th, 2008 at 10:25pm:

I guess the point you're trying　make is that you want to learn and understand the 'history' behind the wacist insults? Yeah, sure. I find it interesting too.

It's the sentiment and history that helps makes words offensive. The "N" word is just a sound, but the associated history and sentiment make it offensive for a black person. Calling a woman a 'slut' would be really offensive. Calling me a slut wouldn't really do anything since it doesnt really mean much to a guy.

Quote:

I guess you're other point is that people need to be in your position to 'understand' wacism?

If not, what is your point?

No, i was saying i don't know how to explain it if someone hasn't experienced it.

Quote:

On the contrary, Middle Sky, the area where I was born had a mass influx of Southern Europeans as I was growing up. My suburb was made up of about 30% Australians. I copped plenty of racially motivated insults in my schools and I was in the minority. Yet, I didn't take it to heart.

yeah probably cause you felt you had the rest of the white country to back you up? Because you feel whites 'invented everything'?

Quote:

I am now in a country where about 99% of the population is non-European in origin. I've copped plenty of discrimination since I arrived here around a year ago (So please spare me the 'you don't know what it's like' routine). Yet, I don't really care about it.

Maybe because your opportunities in life were not affected by people poo talking to you.

Quote:

And everytime I come onto a political forum or talk to them in person all I hear are a bunch of whining foreigners claiming they were 'unfairly treated' and 'discriminated against' because somebody looked at them funny in the street (Mind you, head to toe Islamic outfits are more suitable for costume parties than supermarkets in modern Australia).

Now i've heard this with some expatriates in Hong Kong. They get cushy jobs, overpaid, much more than a local would for the same position and whatnot. All because of 'the system' that makes idiots think that whites would make their company 'look more international'. But they still complain a lot anyway cause some chinese guy was giving him poo for rubbing it in his face or dumb poo like that.
Some people have had many worse experiences and are in a way suspicious about these things.
Also some people are just whingers.

Quote:

I guess what I'm trying to find out is the reason why different races react so differently to racially motivated attacks. 'White' people, in my experience, are the least likely to take a wacist attack seriously. An African on the other hand...

I seriously doubt 'other races' are more prone to whinging about it. It's more about the percieved situation. Whoever gets the poo end of the stick will make more noise about it.
Quote:

Mｙ statement 'whites invented the modern world' was not intended to be an insult. It's just a fact. Sorry if that makes you feel smaller, but it's simply the truth. Chinese people invented a few good things too and　created a pretty kick-@ss civilisation if that makes you feel any better?

Yet, you reacted in a negative way and thought I was insulting you.

Because you mentioned this 'races are more intelligent due to genetics' thing as if it were fact. It's rather baseless don't you think? Kids without an education don't often do as well as kids who get to go to better schools. So would it make sense to think that because some countries have had it good for so long, that they perform better academically since each generation builds upon the last? A lot of places around the world have experienced a lot of political turbulence and war for the past few hundred years, but you want to attribute poorer academic performance and number of inventions developed to race and genetics?

Quote:

I guess what i'm trying to say with the 'whites invented everything' argument is: An African or Asian can't really carry out a wacist attack on a white for being 'stupid' effectively in an offensive way, because historically, whites have invented pretty much everything in the modern world. However, whites can attack an African for being stupid, becasue they've invented hardly anything and Africans know it. Which is why Africans feel the need to attack Europeans with the 'physical' insults (Ie. Weak, small penises etc).

You admit there can be differences in certain situations, can't you apply that logic to other situations? Maybe then eventually you'll realise what i'm trying to say? I dunno.

Quote:

Anyway, feel free to discuss the origin of wacist insults. I don't really mind.

Well i actually don't want to argue about this anymore because you're not going to change your mind about this and neither am i. I spend a bit more time than i'd like thinking of how to articulate things which in the end, i don't feel i really could very well.

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muso

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #77 - Dec 7^th, 2008 at 11:57am

I found your account of 'reverse racism' in Hong Kong to be interesting. I came across something similar in Ghana. A guy who ran the local branch of a company that I worked for a few years ago, explained to me how he had to put up with all kinds of nonsense when doing his banking. He was Ghanaian.

I went in to the bank with him and he was made to wait 30 minutes before anybody could see him. While we were waiting, we were talking to pass the time, when the bank manager came up and apologised to me. I was unknown to the bank manager. He explained that had he realised that we were together, he would have seen him right away.

It made my blood boil at the time, although I didn't make a scene. Having thought about it, it was probably some kind of perverted economic discrimination. A known rich Ghanaian would have probably received the same treatment as me.

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Middle Sky New Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 14	Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism Reply #78 - Dec 8^th, 2008 at 11:51am hmm interesting. I guess often it really is that money talks.
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fakir

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #79 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 12:35pm

freediver wrote on Nov 11^th, 2008 at 5:21pm:

Fakir you can't even count the number of non-whites on Australian TV ads, so I can hardly expect you to accurately gauge the actual level of racism in Australia. It's like you live in a different world, with different TV ads showing only white people. I have lived overseas for a large portion of my life. I didn't experience the things you claim to have experienced. Instead of confronting us with the truth, you are confronting us with an absurd conspiracy theory to explain why we cannot see what you can see and what you claim is right in front of us. Why would you expect any other response?

hmm.. conspiracy eh?

Latest news from Austraya: Indians burn effigies of Rudd decrying the racist attacks on Indians in Melbourne. Rudd replies "Australia is not racist".

Hmm.. where have I heard that before? I think I heard it from the previous PM. It seems every PM is trying to convince the rest of the world that Australia is not racist.

Now I wonder why OZ PMs feel the need to say that, when apparently it's just some stupid conspiracy theory made up by 6.6 billion people minus the 20 million oblivious white racists in Australia.

How many other world leaders have to say their country isn't racist?

You're a joke because you're arguing from a such an ignorant point of view.

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Happy

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #80 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 12:46pm

fakir wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 12:35pm:

... Indians burn effigies of Rudd decrying the racist attacks on Indians in Melbourne. Rudd replies "Australia is not racist".

...

I find this unacceptable in Australia and it would be very nice to stop it before this form of expression becomes "normal way of protest" here.

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NorthOfNorth

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #81 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:17pm

Happy wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 12:46pm:

fakir wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 12:35pm:

... Indians burn effigies of Rudd decrying the racist attacks on Indians in Melbourne. Rudd replies "Australia is not racist".

...

I find this unacceptable in Australia and it would be very nice to stop it before this form of expression becomes "normal way of protest" here.

What is unacceptable is the passive acceptance of racial violence. Why did we need the Indian Prime Minister and the Indian High Commissioner to remind us that kicking people half to death is wrong? And if there's a racial pattern to this violence, then it's gravely wrong.

Perhaps you should read about the treatment and regard of the Chinese in late 19th early 20th century to gain an understanding of what passive acceptance of their underclass status meant. Indian students, to their credit, are not prepared to be treated as garbage.

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Happy

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #82 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:26pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:17pm:

What is unacceptable is the passive acceptance of racial violence. Why did we need the Indian Prime Minister and the Indian High Commissioner to remind us that kicking people half to death is wrong? And if there's a racial pattern to this violence, then it's gravely wrong.

….
Indian students, to their credit, are not prepared to be treated as garbage.

So far we have Australia's name tarnished, well ahead of finding out who did it and why.

It could also be conspiracy to undermine export of our education.

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NorthOfNorth

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #83 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:31pm

Happy wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:26pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:17pm:

What is unacceptable is the passive acceptance of racial violence. Why did we need the Indian Prime Minister and the Indian High Commissioner to remind us that kicking people half to death is wrong? And if there's a racial pattern to this violence, then it's gravely wrong.

….
Indian students, to their credit, are not prepared to be treated as garbage.

So far we have Australia's name tarnished, well ahead of finding out who did it and why.

It could also be conspiracy to undermine export of our education.

So far, what we have is a society and a Parliament slow to respond and condemn what are clearly unprovoked racial attacks on decent non-violent guests in our country.

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Happy

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #84 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:46pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:31pm:

So far, what we have is a society and a Parliament slow to respond and condemn what are clearly unprovoked racial attacks on decent non-violent guests in our country.

I suppose society and a Parliament want to know some more details before jumping on your wagon.

On the other hand, if you know something for sure, why not to contact Crimestoppers?

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NorthOfNorth

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #85 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:55pm

Happy wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:46pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:31pm:

So far, what we have is a society and a Parliament slow to respond and condemn what are clearly unprovoked racial attacks on decent non-violent guests in our country.

I suppose society and a Parliament want to know some more details before jumping on your wagon.

Maybe a quick look at the victims lying in hospital with their faces bashed in would be a start. Maybe a report on these incidents by the Police Commissioner to Parliament, perhaps. This didn't just begin over the long weekend.

As someone of apparent foreign background, Happy, apologising for the worst in our society doesn't make you more Australian, it makes you more a target.

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muso

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #86 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 2:00pm

Happy wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:26pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:17pm:

What is unacceptable is the passive acceptance of racial violence. Why did we need the Indian Prime Minister and the Indian High Commissioner to remind us that kicking people half to death is wrong? And if there's a racial pattern to this violence, then it's gravely wrong.

….
Indian students, to their credit, are not prepared to be treated as garbage.

So far we have Australia's name tarnished, well ahead of finding out who did it and why.

It could also be conspiracy to undermine export of our education.

I tend to agree with you there. People often jump on the racist bandwagon. I was speaking to a young Asian friend who complained that Australian women are so racist. It turned out that he was saying that because his advances had been rejected by a woman he fancied Grin

I told him that maybe she just didn't find him attractive - nothing to do with race LOL.

In the case of the Indian students, mmm the jury is still out. Maybe they were just seen as 'soft targets' as was reported recently.

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Happy

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #87 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 2:06pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 1:55pm:

Maybe a quick look at the victims lying in hospital with their faces bashed in would be a start. Maybe a report on these incidents by the Police Commissioner to Parliament, perhaps. This didn't just begin over the long weekend.

As someone of apparent foreign background, Happy, apologising for the worst in our society doesn't make you more Australian, it makes you more a target.

Bit of a basher yourself?

Let me repeat:

I suppose society and a Parliament want to know some more details before jumping on your wagon.

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NorthOfNorth

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Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism
Reply #88 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 2:13pm

Happy wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 2:06pm:

I suppose society and a Parliament want to know some more details before jumping on your wagon.

Do they, Happy? Does that explain why MPs are now speaking out? ... and only after the Indian Prime Minister and High Commissioner expressed their concerns?

Let me repeat.. Don't be an apologist for the worst as payment for acceptance.

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Happy Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 559	Re: Asian Australians and Australian-style Racism Reply #89 - Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 2:36pm NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2009 at 2:13pm: Does that explain why MPs are now speaking out? ... and only after the Indian Prime Minister and High Commissioner expressed their concerns? ... It is part of Governmental etiquette to reply.
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