is there something wrong with you abu? cant you buggeren moderate??????

Moderate what exactly imperial?
Where you used inflammatory terms to refer to homosexuals?
Although I obviously don't agree with homosexuals, using that kind of language, and especially in such a childish manner is not going to achieve much.

Imperial, using terms like that to just inflame others doesn't really defend Islam, if that's what your stated aim was. If you've got a valid argument, make it in an intelligent and logical manner please.

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You didn't do me any favours to begin with.

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You were defending Islam as a favour? First I knew about this favour.

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If that's where your convictions lie, then so be it.

He was his adopted son, and she was still considered his daughter in law.

But that is not telling you anything you did not know is it?

The most disturbing part is he wrote a bit in the koran about it, so he could claim that god made him do it, to set an example for us all.

That is why we bring up the issue of the age and number of sexual partners he had, if his was the example, is that what we all should do?

As for wives, why stop at four?
He didn't.

I was asking what the Islamic definition of a concubine is, because it is you that claims a moral superiority for Islamic teaching, I am merely challenging your previous assertions in that area, if mohammed is to be the benchmark we are judged by.

Thanks for answering abu, I will not bother you further on this subject, because you think I am doing it to try and insult you, I really just was trying to highlight that I believe strictly sticking to 1400 year old rules and examples does not help Islam to progress, and fit into modern society.

I haven't found your answers very forthcoming or convincing, but I don't think pursuing you on the subject will see that change, so I will remain convinced that Islam needs to adapt to the modern world, and you will remain convinced that the modern world must adapt to an ancient and fundamentalist interpretation of Islam.

My sincere hope is that Islam and the west can coexist peacefully, and I have to hope that you do also.

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Why would it be ethically and morally wrong to marry someone who was legally able to marry you, under the law? I really can't understand the Western viewpoint on this. It's ok to have sex with other males or for females to have sex with other female, yet a man marrying a younger girl is all of a sudden unethical and morally wrong...

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If you cared to actually *read* what's written, it's a table of countries whose age of consent is UNDER 14, since Australia's is over 14, that's why it's not included in a table for countries whose age of consent is UNDER 14.

Marriage in Islam has two components. The actual commencement of the marriage, when consummation can occur, is when both parties have attained puberty, ie. they are physically and mentally mature.

1400 years ago, that just happened to occur a lot younger than it does today. As is witnessed by many historical facts, such as the great Muslim general Muhammad Bin Qasim, who led an army and conquered most of the Indian sub-continent at about the age of 16-17. And it's this historical context that has to be kept in mind when examining this marriage. Today we baby children and don't really allow them to be grown up until they've well passed physical maturity, but that is quite obviously something we've conditioned our society into. And it's quite logical that people would generally attain physical and mental maturity around the same time, unless social conditions exist that retard that process, and leave children in this dificult period of 'adolescence', neither children nor adults. Not surprisingly a lot of our societies problems actually originate during this period in people's lives.