Australian Politics Forum - Australian Racism

fakir

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Australian Racism
Feb 28^th, 2008 at 2:38pm

I am Australian now living in Canada, and racism is not more apparent then when you're outside the country living in a similar country looking back. My ancestors were Chinese, just to give some context.

I think Australia is inherently a racist country, but even as I discuss some of this with my cousin back in Australia he is quick to defend Australia simply because as someone living there, he cannot see what is obvious to me now that I'm out looking in. I'm saying this because I sense that some of you may defend the below points because you yourself cannot see the great gorge that sits between a culturally progressive society like Canada versus Australia.

Here are some examples of racism:

1) every Australian advertisement I've seen does not show one person of a minority race. I think it's shameful especially for international Australian companies to persistently represent Australia as a country of white people (eg. Qantas advertisements). This goes for TV shows too. I'm out of touch with Australian shows, but a fairly "recent" one I enjoy is "Kath and Kim": it has not one minority as a major character. Even the vast majority of minor characters are white. In Canada I FREQUENTLY see minorities represented in REGULAR advertising and television. What's the difference? Why is there no "fear" in Canada that featuring a minority in media might "alienate" the majority?

2) interracial couples: I think one of the great indicators for acceptance of other races is the ratio of interracial couples where the male is of a minority race versus where the female is the minority. In Australia, the overwhelming majority I see on the streets are where the female is of the minority race. In Canada, I see an even split, and in fact MOST of the interracial couples I personally know the male is the minority. This tells me that Canadians in general do not have xenophobic tendencies and fear toward "coloured men".

3) The perception that "Australian" means "white". In Australia, if you're coloured, you're NEVER referred to as an "Australian". This to me is the greatest travesty of all. I have never been referred to as an Australian by a "white Australian". The ONLY time in my entire life I have been called an Australian is by non-Australians (eg. Canadians). In Australia, I am "Chinese" or a "Chink" or a "Chinaman". Even in the racial riots of 2005 (a shame on Australia by the way, I was very ashamed of this), the media portrayed it as a battle between the Lebanese vs "Australians" WTF? In Canada - everyone recognizes their original heritage alike. Canadians freely say they are of "British" heritage, or "Ukrainian" heritage or "Chinese" heritage - everyone recognizes themselves as migrants. In Australia, a first generation German migrant will be called "Australian" because he's white, but a third generation Chinese migrant will still be called a "Chinese". This is the greatest shame of all.

Why am I writing all of this? It is by comparing yourself with others that you can truly measure progress. A caveman comparing his cave with another caveman proves nothing. A caveman comparing his cave with Bill Gates shows him his backwardness. All I'm saying that until you see what is happening elsewhere in the world, you cannot truly see how little Australia has progressed culturally in the last 20 years. It is my hope that "white Australians" will open their eyes and slowly begin to rejoin the rest of the first world. You may find what I wrote insulting, patronizing or demeaning, but these are the observations of a "non white Australian" who doesn't even have his own heritage recognized by his own countrymen - so believe me I have it worst than you.

ps. these observations are ignoring the extremes of society. We are going to ignore the extreme elements like Jack Van Tongeran and other white supremacists which of course also exist in Canada. I am primarily focused on your Joe Average on the street and popular media.

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freediver

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Re: Australian Racism
Reply #1 - Feb 28^th, 2008 at 2:51pm

Hi fakir and Welcome to OzPolitic.

every Australian advertisement I've seen does not show one person of a minority race

How long have you been out of the country for? I think there are proper surveys on this. I don't pay much attention, but I'm pretty sure they tokenise ads these days.

but a fairly "recent" one I enjoy is "Kath and Kim": it has not one minority as a major character

It is making fun of white Australians. Minorities would ruin the joke.

In Australia, the overwhelming majority I see on the streets are where the female is of the minority race. In Canada, I see an even split

Perhaps you should get a job with Asio with a memory like that.

How does SBS fit into your argument? It is choc ful of chocos, with pizza, that show about the asian girl with the white male flatmate, skins with gay people etc.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Acid Monkey

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Re: Australian Racism
Reply #2 - Feb 28^th, 2008 at 3:49pm

Hi fakir,

For a first post it is pretty incindiary. I'd imagine thatthere will be a flood of rebuttals coming your way. I hope that you are prepared to talk through and back up your observations.

Having travelled to the EU extensively, I too have witnessed some of your observation.

It's true to say also that the Asian countries do not have a good opinion of Australia. Malaysia's former PM's comment of us being the "White deputy sheriff in Asia" ring true in the hearts of most of Asia. However, whether that is because of their local media's reporting influence, who knows?

I have 3 personal experience similar to what you have described. My circle of racially ecletic friends includes a Bosnian and several (Malaysian) Chinese. Many (10?) years ago, one my my Chinese friends (1st generation Aussie) were racially taunted. My Bosnian friend was called a traitor to Australia for befriending the "chink migrant". "Go home, chinaman!" The incident was minor and forgotten.

During the Cronulla riots, the same Bosnian friend was taunted and pushed by "white Aussies" and called a Lebo. It's strange that he was a "white Aussie" when standing next to an Asian but suddenly a Lebo migrant 10 years later.

Also, I have another Asian friend who is 4th generation Aussie. His experience is that he often get subtle haughty looks until he opens his mouth. He speaks perfect English (or Aussie) without any hint of Asian accent. After that, he's treated with a little more respect. My 1st generation Chinese friend speaks Cantonese at home to his parents but English in public. His English has a hint of accent his experience is different to my friend mentioned before even though he is borned in Australia.

It the in-your-face racism that we always hear about. However, its the subtle ones that we Aussies don't know about or deny because it's not experienced or noticed by us "whiteys". I only know about this because my Asian friends are my best friends and I notice it for their sake as much as my country's.

True freediver, SBS has those shows and good on them. However, the Average Joe (Fakir's words) are likely to dismiss SBS as Migrant TV; or the ABC as Lefty TV. Who wants them? Get rid of it. Or, "I can't be bothered reading the subtitles" to justify their narrow-mindedness.

Having said that, I don't think that it's as bad as what fakir suggests. Then again, I've never been to Canada so I really can't comment further on his opinions.

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freediver

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Re: Australian Racism
Reply #3 - Feb 28^th, 2008 at 4:15pm

I nearly got beat up once by some neo-nazis. It was kind of ironic because I look Aryan and the guy trying to assault me looked like a Turk. I was off in my own world on my way home from school and failed to notice that every other student had crossed the road to avoid this bunch. I was in Germany at the time. I can't imagine that happening here.

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Acid Monkey

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Re: Australian Racism
Reply #4 - Feb 28^th, 2008 at 5:15pm

freediver wrote on Feb 28^th, 2008 at 4:15pm:

I nearly got beat up once by some neo-nazis. It was kind of ironic because I look Aryan and the guy trying to assault me looked like a Turk. I was off in my own world on my way home from school and failed to notice that every other student had crossed the road to avoid this bunch. I was in Germany at the time. I can't imagine that happening here.

Actually, I saw a guy get headbutted and punched by a skinhead 3 years ago. He and his mate then tried to kick the poo out of him when he was down. Luckily, his friends saved him. Their excuse? They were doing it for Pauline Hanson.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 53268 At my desk.	Re: Australian Racism Reply #5 - Feb 28^th, 2008 at 5:17pm I was more referring to an entire school (almost anyway ) crossing the road to avoid a violent gang on their way home. It just wouldn't get to that stage.
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Acid Monkey Gold Member Offline Goth Father Posts: 1064 EU Gender:	Re: Australian Racism Reply #6 - Feb 28^th, 2008 at 5:21pm Oh ok. My bad. However, anedoctally isn't it supposed to be that way now in Cronulla?? Also, I remember years ago in Footscray, Melbourne where there used to be 2 different groups of skin heads roaming the street.
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merou Full Member Offline Less Tolerance, More Shooting Posts: 193 Pilbara WA Gender:	Re: Australian Racism Reply #7 - Feb 28^th, 2008 at 7:28pm Fakir stay in Canada you bloody chink
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boxingkangaroo

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Re: Australian Racism
Reply #8 - Feb 28^th, 2008 at 8:03pm

Acid Monkey wrote on Feb 28^th, 2008 at 5:15pm:

freediver wrote on Feb 28^th, 2008 at 4:15pm:

I nearly got beat up once by some neo-nazis. It was kind of ironic because I look Aryan and the guy trying to assault me looked like a Turk. I was off in my own world on my way home from school and failed to notice that every other student had crossed the road to avoid this bunch. I was in Germany at the time. I can't imagine that happening here.

Actually, I saw a guy get headbutted and punched by a skinhead 3 years ago. He and his mate then tried to kick the poo out of him when he was down. Luckily, his friends saved him. Their excuse? They were doing it for Pauline Hanson.

Hanson? Acid monkey that sucks..Australia is a very racist country in general..

Kids are not born racist though..they learn that from racist redneck parents with ignorant spiteful hearts. Sad

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fakir

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Re: Australian Racism
Reply #9 - Feb 29^th, 2008 at 3:32am

First of all, there's nothing to flame. I've lived in Australia for over 20 years and the only time in my life that I wasn't taunted was during University when I predominantly hung out with "my own kind" - go figure. I wasn't about to waste the better part of my life trying to fit in with whiteys. What's there to flame? I'm not going around insulting everyone, I was the one racially abused for the better part of my years in Australia, and I am just venting with the hope that the ignorant whiteys will realize what damage they are "generally" doing to non-white Australians.

The only person that can qualify to rebut me is a non-white Australian who has lived a number of years in another English speaking white-majority country who has therefore the insight of comparison.

Here are some more examples of subtle and not so subtle racism in Australia (and mind you, I admit I am drawing from my own experiences):

1) The typical aussie "party" consists of hanging out in the backyard over a bbq and beers. Quite often if I'm invited to a white majority party but I hardly know anyone there - if I stand in a circle with mostly strangers - I will be largely ignored in terms of eye contact. It's as if people are too scared to talk to me because they can't relate to me or something like that. Don't for a minute think that I invite xenophobia by dressing weird, I am 100% Australian in culture, dress and speech (even then if I wasn't, I shouldn't be ostracized, but Australian culture hasn't advanced to that stage yet - let's just stick to accepting someone who at least fits in culturally!)

When I first came to Canada, I didn't know anyone, and so because of my Australian experiences I was very paranoid about parties with white majorities (and therefore I was especially cognicent of exclusion). To my utmost surprise however, when I joined a circle of strangers people gave me equal "eye time" and I felt like I was treated like an equal. How do you think that makes me feel?

2) I was working in Singapore for a while and my Wife told a white Australian that she was married to an Aussie. When both my Wife and the white Australian was in a gathering and I was there too, the white Australian asked where I was and my Wife pointed in my direction and he responded by saying "I don't see anyone". At which point he realized his faux pas and his own deep-seated racism. How do you think that makes me feel? The first Australian I come across overseas who has not previously met me, and it's a fking racist.

Now I don't think white Australians are bad people, it's just that environmental factors leads MOST white Australians to develop xenophobic and racist tendencies. Until these tendencies are brought out in the open, admitted, discussed and vilified, things will never change. One MUST recognize this shamefulness - that is the first step to change. Occasionally something really bad might happen and you will see the community rally around the minorities in support - but heck, it's not the really bad stuff that affects most people of colour. It's the really subtle stuff that isolates and excludes us.

As an example, when I was in Singapore, my Wife explained to me the difference between Asian culture and white Australian culture. In Asia, if you're the odd man out, the majority will make an effort to make you feel welcome. In Australia, white Aussies expect the outsider to fit in and assimilate and will generally make no effort to make you feel welcome. Do you as a white Australian realize that or see that? Probably not because you're on the inside and you can't compare one cave with another cave. You really need to be on the outside looking in (or be an objective person by nature) to see that it's cultural elements like these that contribute to white Australian racism.

I for one still have bitterness about the whole thing even though I have a wonderful and successful life in Canada. I feel bitter because I feel compelled by my own self-esteem to reject my Australianness because I have never resolved my racist experiences with white Australia whilst white Canada has embraced me. Therefore I feel my childhood has been lost as a result. It's in times of success and comfort that one has the time to reflect back on life and wonder about how things have unravelled. It's nice to come back to Australia after 10 years and see that things have progressed, but when I came back to Australia I took a good look around and saw posters with only white faces, TV shows with only white people and I thought bugger - how long do these people take to accept non-whites? Couple that with my cousin denying that things haven't improved and I see that I may never see a tolerant white Australian society in my lifetime.

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fakir

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Re: Australian Racism
Reply #10 - Feb 29^th, 2008 at 3:45am

Oh yes, another example:

When I came back for a vacation I visited my old friend of Asian descent, who is now a successful lawyer. I think he has self esteem issues because he spent most of the time boasting about his life and didn't care to ask about my life even though I have more interesting life experiences (having lived and worked in different countries). He invited me to his friend's musical performance, after which there was a cocktail party where I again experienced exclusion and non-eye-contact from strangers.

One of the nights I was invited to his cigar club where he played poker with his poker buddies. I couldn't help but notice that the whites had to make racist based jokes around the poker table. By chance or by xenophobia, somehow the coloured Aussies were sitting at one end of the table and the whites just couldn't prevent their inner natures by making a comment about it being the "Asian corner". My friend responded by saying that he was "French" and said some French words to emphasize his joke. I see the French joke as a defense mechanism because he doesn't want to be seen as an outsider, he wants to be seen as "cool". And these are purportedly his close friends! And my friend is supposedly rich and successful! What has changed over 10 years? What has changed indeed!

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Sprintcyclist Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 41906 Gender:	Re: Australian Racism Reply #11 - Feb 29^th, 2008 at 9:59am Fakir - good postings. Well thought out and not at all abusive. it's a pity you did not like your time in Aussie. Hope you find canada more satisfying.
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