Australian Politics Forum - Gay marriage and children

easel Gold Member Offline Posts: 3120	Re: Gay marriage and children Reply #270 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 4:53pm oceanZ you quoted me in regards to me saying pedophilia does not cause gayness and then where I wrote gays like young looking guys, and tried to join the dots with that. That is part of the point I was trying to make.Nov 7^th, 2008 at 4:52pm
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freediver

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Re: Gay marriage and children
Reply #271 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 5:02pm

If you know you need to prove it or shut up basically. I dont know why you bothered to go this far if your not prepared to nail it and or prove athos and I wrong.

What was the point?

The point was just to point out the absurdity of athos's comments. He is welcome to try to back them up, but given that A) he seems to have plucked his statistics from thin air, with no thought and B) it flies in the face of well established common knowledge regarding homosexuality, I see no need to 'prove' my case. Athos's absurd comment, and your support for it, have no basis at all. Thus there is no need for anyone to try to invalidate them. You can't go round making absurd claims like that with no effort to back them up, then expect people to respect them unless they make all the effort to introduce evidence.

To give an example, suppose someone claimed that America does not exist. You could A) ignore them or B) try to satisfy whatever standard of proof they require, which is bound to be as absurd as their original claim. I for one don't feel compelled to go to the effort of disproving every absurd comment I see online, especially if it involves statistics that were made up on the spot and no evidence.

In fact, the original claim cannot be disproved. You or athos could just claim that the gay people who were surveyed didn't want to admit they only turned gay because they were raped. It is one of those insidious theories provides it's own jusitification for lack of evidence, but at the same time providing justification for oppression of gays. It is the age old 'homosexuality as a disease' theory, with the act of sex itself also transmitting the disease. According to this theory, we could virtually wipe out homosexuality, and prevent a lot of rapes, by locking up all gay people. Homosexualty would then drop by 99% in one generation.

Do you really need any more evidence of the absurdity of this claim?

If you really do see homosexuality as a disease, spread by gay sex, where do you stand on quarantining gay people to prevent the further spread of the disease? Where do you stand on trying to 'cure' people of this disease? After all, gay people are like zombies according to you, out to make more zombies until everyone is gay, right?

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« Last Edit: Nov 7^th, 2008 at 5:35pm by freediver »

People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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oceanz

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Re: Gay marriage and children
Reply #272 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 6:17pm

freediver wrote on Nov 7^th, 2008 at 5:02pm:

If you know you need to prove it or shut up basically. I dont know why you bothered to go this far if your not prepared to nail it and or prove athos and I wrong.

What was the point?

The point was just to point out the absurdity of athos's comments.

[Well why attack me then? go to the maker of those claims]

He is welcome to try to back them up, but given that A) he seems to have plucked his statistics from thin air,

[You cant know that he did]

with no thought and B) it flies in the face of well established common knowledge regarding homosexuality

[well established ?..I see so you cant make a case for such "well established " infornmation yet you continue to go on and on and not proving or disproving anything at all]

, I see no need to 'prove' my case.

[then dont ask me to prove mine]

Athos's absurd comment, and your support for it, have no basis at all. Thus there is no need for anyone to try to invalidate them

[if you call me names and belittle my veiws then I think you do]

. You can't go round making absurd claims like that with no effort to back them up

[its my veiwpoint and I do have evidence but then thats my business ]

, then expect people to respect them unless they make all the effort to introduce evidence.

[your the one who said that athos was an ignoramus and me likewise for daring to agree in anyway shape or form]

To give an example, suppose someone claimed that America does not exist. You could A) ignore them or B) try to satisfy whatever standard of proof they require, which is bound to be as absurd as their original claim.

[not anything like the same argument..NEXT!!!]

I for one don't feel compelled to go to the effort of disproving every absurd comment I see online, especially if it involves statistics that were made up on the spot and no evidence.

[You have'nt even spoken yet to athos FD so how do you know yet what he is working with?..you are being proposperous right now]

In fact, the original claim cannot be disproved. You or athos could just claim that the gay people who were surveyed didn't want to admit they only turned gay because they were raped

[BUT WE DIDNT..and I certainly did'nt.]

. It is one of those insidious theories provides it's own jusitification for lack of evidence, but at the same time providing justification for oppression of gays

homosexuals Freediver

. It is the age old 'homosexuality as a disease' theory

[in your world maybe]

, with the act of sex itself also transmitting the disease

[again ,sounds like your predjudice not mine ]

. According to this theory, we could virtually wipe out homosexuality, and prevent a lot of rapes, by locking up all gay people. Homosexualty would then drop by 99% in one generation. [color=#ff0000[how does the SIDE issue of pedeophiles can traumatise young boys to the point of confusing / impairing their psychological development so that in the future they may actually be confused if they are actually straight or gay translate to your hysterical assertions about what you THINK I mean? good grief[/color]

Do you really need any more evidence of the absurdity of this claim?

Evidence ..??? your joking right!!!! This whole rave of yours was hardly relevant to anything I have ever said on this topic about gay pple and as for athos...he hasnt even said his peice or defended himself at all...

If you really do see homosexuality as a disease

[Wild accusations based in nothing ..AGAIN].

, spread by gay sex, where do you stand on quarantining gay people to prevent the further spread of the disease?

[Where do you stand..its your nightmare we are living here dude

Where do you stand on trying to 'cure' people of this disease?

[They dont need to be cured..or do you believe they do..once again your predjudice not mine and the fact you raise all these questions that btw never even entered my head means we are dealing with your issues NOT MINE!]

After all, gay people are like zombies according to you,

I suspect maybe according to you in fact- your words not mine

out to make more zombies until everyone is gay, right?

You sound hysterical and irrational Freediver...its only damaged your argument..

So Freediver your a christian right?..where do you stand on the Church not recognising homosexuals?

And excuse a little atheist like me not knowing squat about this but why does the Church not recognise homosexuals ??..do you support that stance by the church?

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« Last Edit: Nov 7^th, 2008 at 6:34pm by oceanz »

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freediver

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Re: Gay marriage and children
Reply #273 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 6:28pm

well why attack me then?

I did not attack you. I asked you a question, after you appeared to support his absurd claim.

go to the maker of those claims

I did, but this seems to have been a drive-by windup.

you cant know that he did

Yes I can. He plucked those stats out of thin air. He has no evidence to back them up. He will not present any.

well established ?..I see so you cant make a case for such "well established "

I can, I'm just not going to bother, because it's well established.

if you call me names and belittle my veiws then I think you do

What name did I call you? I wasn't referring to you when I said Athos.

your the one who said that athos was an ignoramus and me likewise for daring to agree in anyway shape or form

Would you mind quoting me please?

You havent even spoken yet to athos FD so how do you know yet what he is working with?..

Yes I have. He just didn't respond. Which is understandable, given that he made up those statistics.

You or athos could just claim that the gay people who were surveyed didn't want to admit they only turned gay because they were rapedBUT WE DIDNT..I certainly did'nt..

Yet you reject the well establish common knowledge regarding the nature of homosexuality.

It is the age old 'homosexuality as a disease' theoryin your world maybe, with the act of sex itself also transmitting the diseasesounds like your predjudice not mine .

You are the one saying you 'catch' gayness by being gay raped.

noone is trying to wipe out homosexuality...

I didn't say you were. I asked, given that it would be inevitable if your theory were true.

where do you stand..its your nightmare we are living here

It is not a nightmare and we are not living it. People don't become gay by being raped.

where did I say that?...,

That's what your theory amounts to.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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oceanz Gold Member Offline Auzgurl.. Posts: 3531 Gender:	Re: Gay marriage and children Reply #274 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 6:35pm the whole post above yours now reads slightly differently... and Im not having this converstation with you FD.. AND did it ever occur to you that athos might just be out doing a spot of shopping instead of hanging off the end of your every utterance?
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oceanz

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Re: Gay marriage and children
Reply #275 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 6:39pm

oceanz wrote on Nov 7^th, 2008 at 6:17pm:

[quote author=freediver link=1187874397/270#271 date=1226041355]If you know you need to prove it or shut up basically. I dont know why you bothered to go this far if your not prepared to nail it and or prove athos and I wrong.

What was the point?

The point was just to point out the absurdity of athos's comments.

[Well why attack me then? go to the maker of those claims]

He is welcome to try to back them up, but given that A) he seems to have plucked his statistics from thin air,

[You cant know that he did]

with no thought and B) it flies in the face of well established common knowledge regarding homosexuality

[well established ?..I see so you cant make a case for such "well established " information yet you continue to go on and on and not proving or disproving anything at all]

,

I see no need to 'prove' my case.

[then dont ask me to prove mine]

Athos's absurd comment, and your support for it, have no basis at all. Thus there is no need for anyone to try to invalidate them

[If you call me names and belittle my veiws then I think you do]

.

You can't go round making absurd claims like that with no effort to back them up

[its my veiwpoint and I do have evidence but then thats my business and my claims are not even remotely as you say they are..your making it up as you go along]

,

[Your the one who said that athos was an ignoramus and me likewise for daring to agree in anyway shape or form]

To give an example, suppose someone claimed that America does not exist. You could A) ignore them or B) try to satisfy whatever standard of proof they require, which is bound to be as absurd as their original claim.

[Not anything like the same argument..NEXT!!!]

I for one don't feel compelled to go to the effort of disproving every absurd comment I see online, especially if it involves statistics that were made up on the spot and no evidence.

[You have'nt even spoken yet to athos FD so how do you know yet what he is working with?..you are being proposperous right now]

It is one of those insidious theories provides it's own jusitification for lack of evidence, but at the same time providing justification for oppression of gays

.It is the age old 'homosexuality as a disease' theory

[In your world maybe]

with the act of sex itself also transmitting the disease

[Again ,sounds like your predjudice not mine- you have issues Fd and are projecting your predjudice onto me ]

.

According to this theory, we could virtually wipe out homosexuality, and prevent a lot of rapes, by locking up all gay people.

So you want to do that then?

Homosexualty would then drop by 99% in one generation.

[How does the SIDE issue of "pedeaphiles can traumatise young boys to the point of confusing / impairing their psychological development so that in the future they may actually be confused if they are actually straight or gay "..translate to your hysterical assertions about what you THINK I mean? good grief

Do you really need any more evidence of the absurdity of this claim?

Evidence ..??? your joking right!!!! This whole rave of yours was hardly relevant to anything I have ever said on this topic about gay pple and as for athos...he hasnt even said his peice or defended himself at all...

If you really do see homosexuality as a disease

[If?

Who said I did ?...Wild accusations based in nothing ..AGAIN..you see homosexuality as disease not me, that much is obvious..].

, spread by gay sex, where do you stand on quarantining gay people to prevent the further spread of the disease?

[Where do you stand..its your nightmare we are living here dude]

Where do you stand on trying to 'cure' people of this disease?

[They dont need to be cured..or do you believe they do..once again your predjudice not mine and the fact you raise all these questions that btw never even entered my head means we are dealing with your issues NOT MINE!]

You sound hysterical and irrational Freediver...

So Freediver your a christian right?..where do you stand on the Church not recognising homosexuals?

And excuse a little atheist like me not knowing squat about this but why does the Church not recognise homosexuals ??..do you support that stance by the church?

*

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« Last Edit: Nov 7^th, 2008 at 7:04pm by oceanz »

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freediver

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Re: Gay marriage and children
Reply #276 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 7:19pm

The church is free to think whatever it wants about gays, but not to use the government to impose those views on other religions, atheists, gays etc.

AND did it ever occur to you that athos might just be out doing a spot of shopping instead of hanging off the end of your every utterance?

He may well be, but he is still wrong. The stat is still made up. He will still not produce any evidence for it.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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athos Gold Member Offline Re-educate barbarians Posts: 6421 Hong Kong Gender:	Re: Gay marriage and children Reply #277 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 7:20pm freediver wrote on Nov 7^th, 2008 at 1:21pm: Do you believe everything you hear athos? Well maybe I am too trusty, but the common sense talk as well.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 53256 At my desk.	Re: Gay marriage and children Reply #278 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 7:21pm athos wrote on Nov 7^th, 2008 at 7:20pm: freediver wrote on Nov 7^th, 2008 at 1:21pm: Do you believe everything you hear athos? Well maybe I am too trusty, but the common sense talk as well. And what does the common sense tell you? That 99% of gays caught homosexuality when they were raped as kids?
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oceanz

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Re: Gay marriage and children
Reply #279 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 7:24pm

Freediver says-
Quote:

You are the one saying you 'catch' gayness by being gay raped.

Rape is not always the correct term to describe a child who has been assaulted by a pedeophile..it is either molestation or sexual assault..rape implies that the child was violently attacked and so would live in fear of his attacker..thereby implying that the experience was unpleasant.

Some children are raped yes..

Children are often confused by the fact they were assaulted and yet enjoyed and participated in the molestations..this is where feelings of confusion come in for the child.."If I'm not a meant to have sex with a man why did I enjoy what he did to me.?"

At such a impressionable formative stages of a childs life when these assaults take place..how is a child supposed to process and internalise such powerful messages?

This is what I am talking about..clever child molesters seduce their victims...leaving them confused and guilty.

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« Last Edit: Nov 7^th, 2008 at 7:32pm by oceanz »

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athos

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Re: Gay marriage and children
Reply #280 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 7:37pm

oceanz wrote on Nov 7^th, 2008 at 4:51pm:

freediver wrote on Nov 7^th, 2008 at 4:45pm:

And how could you call it "absurd" if you really don't know?

But I do know Oceans. I'm just not going to go out of my way to prove something that is already common knowledge[/b].

I dont care either way..but your the one making a meal out of it FD..

If you know you need to prove it or shut up basically. I dont know why you bothered to go this far if your not prepared to nail it and or prove athos and I wrong.

What was the point?

If your not prepared to prove your point you cant invalidate mine..end of story.

OK I feel responsible to give further explanation how it usually happens.
Catholic priest jumps and rapes a boy telling him that was normal because of God’s wish. Boy started believing in that for the rest of his life and became a gay.

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« Last Edit: Nov 7^th, 2008 at 7:45pm by athos »

Do we need to be always politically correct.
In the world of universal deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 53256 At my desk.	Re: Gay marriage and children Reply #281 - Nov 7^th, 2008 at 9:22pm That's not getting any less absurd Athos. Where did you study psychology? Porn school?
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athos

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Re: Gay marriage and children
Reply #282 - Nov 8^th, 2008 at 10:12am

No it’s not about pornography it’s about logical way of thinking.
In the world of absolute relativity everything is possible and everything allowed. Our world is relative because we and the world that we create around us is imperfect. Relativity is nothing else then expression of imperfection. If something is perfect does not need to be relative.
In such world, there are no bad and good people there are only those who do or don’t suit each other.
After this let’s come back to relativity of heterosexuals. They are programmed to have desire and sex with women, and simply can not understand gays behaviour because they live in parallel imperfect worlds.
For example for a heterosexual having sex with man is like f …… himself, Which is very difficult to do, after all the are not hermaphrodites as well.
In accordance with psychoanalysts every human has male and female parts in his personality. It is quite possible that, for a very young boy, having sex with horny mystical catholic priest can trigger and bust his female personality to such extent that he can become a gay for the rest of his life.

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Do we need to be always politically correct.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 53256 At my desk.	Re: Gay marriage and children Reply #283 - Nov 8^th, 2008 at 12:13pm Could you please provide a link to the gay porn movie on whose storyline your absurd theory is based?
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athos Gold Member Offline Re-educate barbarians Posts: 6421 Hong Kong Gender:	Re: Gay marriage and children Reply #284 - Nov 8^th, 2008 at 5:52pm Film is not only form of artistic expression. There are books as well.
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