Isn't this hate speech?

Am i a religious bigot??




Quote:

“Muslims are the vilest of animals…” “Show mercy to one another, but be ruthless to Muslims” “How perverse are Muslims!” “Strike off the heads of Muslims, as well as their fingertips” “Fight those Muslims who are near to you” “Muslim mischief makers should be murdered or crucified”

The Religion of Peace
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Articles/Quran_Hate.htm




Explanation......

The statements above, reflect ISLAMIC doctrine towards non-moslems,
.....with the enemies of Allah [those, non-moslems], substituted with the word, 'Muslims'.







There are no moderate good moslems - ANYWHERE.

Why not?

Because the moment a good moslem, becomes a sincere 'moderate' moslem, he becomes an apostate [a moslem heretic], and worthy of execution, for insulting ISLAM by his disbelief.

A moslem who ceases to believe the things, which other good moslems believe,

• ceases being a moslem,
  
• he relinquishes his right to live, and
  
• he deserves to die.
  

That is not my claim, but ISLAM's own assertion.

"...If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him."
http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/hadith/bukhari/052.sbt.html#004.052.260





THE KORAN, instructs good moslems...

"....take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends....
......he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them."
http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/005.qmt.html#005.051
[i.e. those 'moslems' who make sincere friendships with unbelievers, ARE unbelievers]





ISLAMIC law texts declare, whom moslems can 'lawfully' kill,
....'unbelievers',

"Ibn 'Abbas reported that the Prophet said: "The bare essence of Islam and the basics of the religion are three [acts], upon which Islam has been established. Whoever leaves one of them becomes an unbeliever and his blood may legally be spilled. [The acts are:] Testifying that there is no God except Allah, the obligatory prayers, and the fast of Ramadan."...."
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/law/fiqhussunnah/fus3_50.html#3.110
alternate site...
http://www.islamonline.net/English/Ramadan/1424/10/fiqhi_issues/Rulings_of_Fasting/article_02.shtml

n.b. "Whoever......*becomes an unbeliever*.....his blood may legally be spilled."





All good moslems are, intolerant, deceitful, religious bigots.




Me?

I am telling you the TRUTH.

Am i a bigot, because i tell you the TRUTH about ISLAM / good moslems ???

I'll let you judge me.

Quote:

“Muslims are the vilest of animals…”

Since it doesn't say "Christians" in that verse, this twisting of the verse is not really correct.

It says those who disbelieve in God. Do you consider yourself a disbeliever in God? If so, then of course you'd be no better than a beast, you'd be just like any other beast going around acting on it's instincts, unaware of the guidance of your Creator. I really don't see what your problem is with that...

abu_rashid wrote on Sep 28^th, 2009 at 12:17pm:

Quote: “Muslims are the vilest of animals…” Since it doesn't say "Christians" in that verse, this twisting of the verse is not really correct. It says those who disbelieve in God. Do you consider yourself a disbeliever in God? If so, then of course you'd be no better than a beast, you'd be just like any other beast going around acting on it's instincts, unaware of the guidance of your Creator. I really don't see what your problem is with that...

abu,

I will concede that yes, many non-moslems 'go around', acting like beasts.

That doesn't give those who claim to be God's people, OR 'good' moslems, the right to slaughter non-moslems as if they are beasts.

Moslems do not have the authority from God to kill other human beings, because they don't believe as they themselves [moslems] do.

To act in such a way, is a bestial act in itself.



John 16:2
They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service.

Quote:

It says those who disbelieve in God. Do you consider yourself a disbeliever in God? If so, then of course you'd be no better than a beast, you'd be just like any other beast going around acting on it's instincts, unaware of the guidance of your Creator. I really don't see what your problem is with that...

Well I have a problem with it, when these texts were written people knew little else, now many people know there is no god, those people are not beasts, just realists.

Yadda,


Quote:

That doesn't give those who claim to be God's people, OR 'good' moslems, the right to slaughter non-moslems as if they are beasts.

And nowhere did I state it does.


Quote:

Moslems do not have the authority from God to kill other human beings, because they don't believe as they themselves [moslems] do.

Agreed.

skip,


Quote:

Well I have a problem with it, when these texts were written people knew little else, now many people know there is no god, those people are not beasts, just realists.

Why do you have a problem with it? It's in fact the core belief of all those who don't believe in God. When Darwin propounded his theory of evolution, upon which most, if not all, atheists base their belief about humanity, he clearly classified human beings as animals/beasts. Therefore why on earth would you have a problem with Islam merely stating about you what you already believe about yourself??

Or am  I misunderstanding you here? do you believe yourself to be an animal or no??

abu_rashid wrote on Sep 28^th, 2009 at 12:17pm:

Quote: “Muslims are the vilest of animals…” ......you'd be no better than a beast, you'd be just like any other beast going around acting on it's instincts, unaware of the guidance of your Creator.

abu,

These acts [below] by Mohammed, and his 'companions', were the acts of beasts.

And YOU endorse these bestial actions, by following, and being an apologist for ISLAM.




Quote:

The Hadith itself, is a testimony against the pirate raider Mohammed, and his own men. The Hadith itself, gives the testimony that Mohammed and his men commonly raped captive women. And, the Hadith itself, is a testimony that Mohammed and his men were not 'marrying', or establishing 'a duty of care to clothe, feed and house' these captive women. The Hadith itself, gives the testimony that some of these captive women would be 'dishonoured' [raped by their moslem captors] and then be offered back to their menfolk, to redeem them, with a ransom price.

Rape your 'war booty', its OK, say ISLAMIC texts
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1251760605/0#0
AND,
Bikeway rapist gets 25 years in jail
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1251431040/8#8


abu,

You said previousle that these acts by Mohammed, and his 'companions', were permissible, because God's people, the ancient Hebrews, also did these things.


Deuteronomy 21:10
When thou goest forth to war against thine enemies, and the LORD thy God hath delivered them into thine hands, and thou hast taken them captive,
11  And seest among the captives a beautiful woman, and hast a desire unto her, that thou wouldest have her to thy wife;
12  Then thou shalt bring her home to thine house; and she shall shave her head, and pare her nails;
13  And she shall put the raiment of her captivity from off her, and shall remain in thine house, and bewail her father and her mother a full month: and after that thou shalt go in unto her, and be her husband, and she shall be thy wife.
14  And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not make merchandise of her, because thou hast humbled her.






Quote:

The Hadith itself, gives the testimony that some of these captive women would be 'dishonoured' [raped by their moslem captors] and then be offered back to their menfolk, to redeem them, with a ransom price.

"Abu Sirma said to Abu Sa'id al Khadri (Allah he pleased with him): 0 Abu Sa'id, did you hear Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) mentioning al-'azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) on the expedition to the Bi'l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them......"
http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/hadith/muslim/008.smt.html#008.3371


Common BEASTS.

We are all animals abu, you and yadda included.
The way the text is written is to offend non believers and encourage believers to harm non believers.
Here's a simple question abu, are you animal, vegetable or mineral?

Quote:

We are all animals abu, you and yadda included.

So you don't really have a problem with the text referring to people as animals after all. What you really have a problem with, is that it implies believers are above that, right?


Quote:

The way the text is written is to offend non believers and encourage believers to harm non believers

That's purely your opinion and assumptions, that's not stated in the text at all.


Quote:

Here's a simple question abu, are you animal, vegetable or mineral?

Skip I don't think anyone doubts that biologically speaking we are animate organisms made with the same amino acids etc. as beasts. That's not the point, and you know it.

The point is that those who do not adhere to a moral belief system are no better than beasts. They just act on their lusts and desires (instincts) and can quite easily carry out any action they feel like because they had the urge.

It's in the Koran

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtePF8p-eIo

Quote:

You said previousle that these acts by Mohammed, and his 'companions', were permissible, because God's people, the ancient Hebrews, also did these things.

I said no such thing. The Hebrew texts hold no authority for me whatsoever, nice try though. I mentioned the Hebrew texts and their permitting these acts because you yourself consider them to hold some authority.

So if the act of having sex with a female captive is an act of a beast, then you'd be saying the same thing about the Prophet's of the OT. And in fact about God himself, since he commanded this act according to your own book.


Quote:

And, the Hadith itself, is a testimony that Mohammed and his men were not 'marrying', or establishing 'a duty of care to clothe, feed and house' these captive women. The Hadith itself, gives the testimony that some of these captive women would be 'dishonoured' [raped by their moslem captors] and then be offered back to their menfolk, to redeem them, with a ransom price. ... Common BEASTS.

This is a load of bollocks. But anyway, how about you take a look in your own Bible, where it's actually stated a man can enslave his own daughter and give her out to other men to have their way with.... And you dare call the Islamic texts beastly??

Quote:

[What you really have a problem with, is that it implies believers are above that, right? /quote] No, it dosn't say that it says Strike off their heads-Murder. [quote]That's purely your opinion and assumptions, that's not stated in the text at all.

Yes it is, "strike off their heads" do you know what it means to "strike off someones head?


Quote:

The point is that those who do not adhere to a moral belief system are no better than beasts

According to the monkey who wrote it.

abu_rashid wrote on Sep 28^th, 2009 at 1:39pm:

Skip..... The point is that those who do not adhere to a moral belief system are no better than beasts. They just act on their lusts and desires (instincts) and can quite easily carry out any action they feel like because they had the urge.

abu,

To me, your description sounds like the description of any common rapist,
OR,
The description of any common moslem man, who wants to JIHAD, so as to rape his 'war booty',
...or to die in JIHAD, so as to go to Allah's 'whore house' paradise, so as to fulfil his beastly 'urges'.

What is in the heart of man [our 'lusts and desires'], reveals who we are abu.

Quote:

No, it dosn't say that it says Strike off their heads-Murder.

The part which mentions striking them is talking about when they come to wage war on you. It's not about murdering at all.


Quote:

Yes it is, "strike off their heads" do you know what it means to "strike off someones head?

Did you read the verses in context??? Or only those words??

8:53 "Because Allah will never change the grace which He hath bestowed on a people until they change what is in their (own) souls: and verily Allah is He Who heareth and knoweth (all things)."

From this point it is abundantly clear the verses are speaking about humans changing their own behaviour/beliefs (ie. not acting like wild beasts).

8:54 (Deeds) after the manner of the people of Pharaoh and those before them": They treated as false the Signs of their Lord: so We destroyed them for their crimes, and We drowned the people of Pharaoh: for they were all oppressors and wrong- doers.

Then a reference to Pharaoh and his people, who are symbolised in the Qur'an as people who rejected God and worshipped a human (which is what atheists today do in effect, making themselves or their desires or their fellow men as gods over them) and where their rejection of God led them (ie. destruction).

8:55 For the worst of beasts in the sight of Allah are those who reject Him: They will not believe.

Now the verse in question, in which it's pointed out that those who follow the way of Pharaoh and his people become like beasts.

8:56 They are those with whom thou didst make a covenant, but they break their covenant every time, and they have not the fear (of Allah..

Now their relationship to those people who made covenants with the Muslims and then betrayed them and helped to invade and attack Medina to wage war on the Muslims.

8:57 If ye gain the mastery over them in war, disperse, with them, those who follow them, that they may remember.

And how to deal with them. Tell me skip, how do you think you'd deal with people who make a covenant/alliance with you, then betray you, and aid invaders to invade and wage war on you??? Would you invite them over for a barbie would you????

Nowhere in any of these verses does it even hint that Muslims should just go around striking the heads of non-Muslims. Such claims are just baseless nonsense, and would only be propagated by a dishonest person, and believed by a gullible one.

And even if we move down to the end of the passage, it clearly states:

8:61 But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in Allah. for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things).

So even after treachery and betrayal, if they incline towards peace, so should the Muslims.

Nothing at all like what you claimed.

As for this verse:

8:12 Remember thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am with you: give firmness to the Believers: I will instill terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them."

It is not a command whatsoever, it is a recount of a battle (the Battle of Badr), in which over 1000 pagan Arabs came to invade Medinah (check where Badr is on a map compared to where Makkah and Medinah are, it's quite clear they were invading Medinah) and about 300 ill equipped Muslims defended themselves and ended up beating the far superior invaders. It is not a command to strike the heads of non-Muslims at all.

but you said to yadda in a previous post that the things he listed didn't apply to Christians just "beasts" who you went on to tell us were non believers, were you lying? or have you just decided to backpeddle?

Quote:

but you said to yadda in a previous post that the things he listed didn't apply to Christians just "beasts" who you went on to tell us were non believers

I think you're a bit confused there mate. Go back and read over it again. I said the passage did not say Christians, so reversing it and saying Muslims is just wrong. That was my point.


Quote:

were you lying? or have you just decided to backpeddle?

Is this your attempt to avoid the fact that you just wrongly interpreted the passages, based on the out of context quotes on an anti-Islamic website??

Just be man enough to admit you jumped the gun a little.

Quote:

Is this your attempt to avoid the fact that you just wrongly interpreted the passages, based on the out of context quotes on an anti-Islamic website?? Just be man enough to admit you jumped the gun a little.

Did you write this-

Quote:

Since it doesn't say "Christians" in that verse, this twisting of the verse is not really correct. It says those who disbelieve in God. Do you consider yourself a disbeliever in God? If so, then of course you'd be no better than a beast, you'd be just like any other beast going around acting on it's instincts, unaware of the guidance of your Creator

Why didn't you say then, that the text was untrue? instead you clearly wrote that it didn't apply to Christians just "beasts" who you then went on to say are the non believers.

Abu, you cant even accept ABS facts as proof you are wrong, with the confusing way you change your mind on what is true and what is not, who would know what to believe.

Quote:

Abu, you cant even accept ABS facts as proof you are wrong, with the confusing way you change your mind on what is true and what is not, who would know what to believe.

I didn't dispute them. I accept fully that I was wrong regarding the statistics, I merely went on to dispute whether that translates into real growth of the religion in terms of actual adherents. On that point I give you credit as being right, no problem.


Quote:

Why didn't you say then, that the text was untrue?

You've lost me here.

What text are you talking about? That article he posted, links to Qur'anic verses. The verses it links to are 100% true. What is untrue and deceptive is what is implied about those verses. Those verses do not give any commands to just go around slaughtering non-Muslims, or to consider all non-Muslims beasts etc. The article then dishonestly tries to reverse those verses and put Muslims into the verses, as if to insinuate the verses say the same about all non-Muslims. This is wrong, as a quick read of the verses in context will show. Some of the verses speak about specific wars that happened, and most speak about the pagan Arabs, not just about any non-Muslim one happens to stumble across.

abu_rashid wrote on Sep 28^th, 2009 at 2:44pm:

Quote: but you said to yadda in a previous post that the things he listed didn't apply to Christians just "beasts" who you went on to tell us were non believers I think you're a bit confused there mate. Go back and read over it again. I said the [Koran] passage did not say Christians, so reversing it and saying Muslims is just wrong. That was my point. [quote]were you lying? or have you just decided to backpeddle?

Is this your attempt to avoid the fact that you just wrongly interpreted the passages, based on the out of context quotes on an anti-Islamic website??

Just be man enough to admit you jumped the gun a little.[/quote]




abu,

The original site clears up this point, about what words are used within the Koran verses.....


Quote:

....Well, if you haven’t guessed it already, these are quotes from the Qur’an in which we've replaced the word ‘Christian’, ‘Jew’ or ‘unbeliever’ with the word ‘Muslim.’

The Religion of Peace
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Articles/Quran_Hate.htm

abu_rashid wrote on Sep 28^th, 2009 at 3:09pm:

Quote: Why didn't you say then, that the text was untrue? You've lost me here. What text are you talking about? That article he posted, links to Qur'anic verses. The verses it links to are 100% true. What is untrue and deceptive is what is implied about those verses. Those verses do not give any commands to just go around slaughtering non-Muslims, or to consider all non-Muslims beasts etc. The article then dishonestly tries to reverse those verses and put Muslims into the verses, as if to insinuate the verses say the same about all non-Muslims. This is wrong, as a quick read of the verses in context will show. Some of the verses speak about specific wars that happened, and most speak about the pagan Arabs, not just about any non-Muslim one happens to stumble across.

But abu, AS THOUGH YOU DID NOT KNOW IT,
.....ISLAM always regarded the pagan Arabs as 'unbelievers'.



"No compulsion Kuffar. You choose."


And ISLAM has always mandated, that ALL 'unbelievers', must either,
1/ convert to ISLAM,
2/ OR, be subjugated [enslaved] by moslems,
3/ OR, must be killed.

TRUTH.

And you, as a good moslem, know that this is TRUTH.




Verses from the Koran.....

"Let there be no compulsion in religion......."
http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/002.qmt.html#002.256

i.e. You choose Kuffar.



"If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah), never will it be accepted of him;........."
http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/003.qmt.html#003.085






All good moslems are, intolerant, deceitful, religious bigots.