Islam and Australian values - Revision history

Freediver: /* Racism and antisemitism */

2022-06-18T11:28:20Z

Racism and antisemitism

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:28, 18 June 2022
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	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1341787168]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1341787168]
	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1338172056]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1338172056]
			Muslims will attempt to sanitise racism in support of Australian Aborigines, by using propaganda that is almost identical to that used by modern neo-nazis, but with the identities swapped around. They will attempt to replace racial identities with "distinct societies" and ancestors from 200 years ago in an attempt to make racism appear more benign.
			[https://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1655551245]
	In the USA, the Nation of Islam is a racist Muslim 'black power' movement - ironic given that the biggest racism problem in Islam's heartland is against Africans.		In the USA, the Nation of Islam is a racist Muslim 'black power' movement - ironic given that the biggest racism problem in Islam's heartland is against Africans.

Freediver: /* Blaming races for diseases */

2019-12-19T09:17:16Z

Blaming races for diseases

← Older revision		Revision as of 09:17, 19 December 2019
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	==== Blaming races for diseases ====		==== Blaming races for diseases ====

	Muslims will hold Europeans collectively accountable for 'European' diseases introduced to the Americas. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1503024544/348#348] Arabs are also collectively accountable for 'Arab' diseases introduced by Arabs, but generally get an exception because their diseases were introduced "as a result of friendly traders making contact with natives in good faith and instigating trade based on mutual respect" (in fact the main item traded by Muslim Arabs were female sex slaves). Europeans get no such exemptions because European diseases were introduced to the Americas by Spaniards with the intention of raping the locals (Europeans were actually trying to discover an alternative trade route to Asia after the Muslim Ottomans made the land route too dangerous). Europeans are to be blamed regardless of whether the introduction of diseases was intentional. Muslims will even argue that the native Americans would have somehow avoided introduced diseases were it not for the sinister intentions of Europeans.		Muslims will hold Europeans collectively accountable for 'European' diseases introduced to the Americas. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1503024544/348#348][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1576746962/0#0] Arabs are also collectively accountable for 'Arab' diseases introduced by Arabs, but generally get an exception because their diseases were introduced "as a result of friendly traders making contact with natives in good faith and instigating trade based on mutual respect" (in fact the main item traded by Muslim Arabs were female sex slaves). Europeans get no such exemptions because European diseases were introduced to the Americas by Spaniards with the intention of raping the locals (Europeans were actually trying to discover an alternative trade route to Asia after the Muslim Ottomans made the land route too dangerous). Europeans are to be blamed regardless of whether the introduction of diseases was intentional. Muslims will even argue that the native Americans would have somehow avoided introduced diseases were it not for the sinister intentions of Europeans.

	=== Honesty ===		=== Honesty ===

Freediver: /* Collective Punishment, Genocide and Ethnic Cleansing */

2018-12-10T10:18:17Z

Collective Punishment, Genocide and Ethnic Cleansing

← Older revision		Revision as of 10:18, 10 December 2018
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	[[Muslims_Promote_Genocide]]		[[Muslims_Promote_Genocide]]

			All Muslims Support Genocide[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1543371381].

	Islam supports the collective punishment of non-Muslims, particularly Jews.		Islam supports the collective punishment of non-Muslims, particularly Jews.

Freediver: /* Blasphemy/free speech */

2018-08-22T08:39:18Z

Blasphemy/free speech

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:39, 22 August 2018
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	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1217813944/169#169]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1217813944/169#169]
	Blasphemy laws make any kind of progressive reform within Islam very difficult. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1360382901]		Blasphemy laws make any kind of progressive reform within Islam very difficult. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1360382901]

			Muslims will claim to support freedom of speech, but seek out the flimsiest excuses to support the denial of free speech to Islam's critics, for example by insisting that a citizen journalist should have been banned from walking down streets with mosques on them, from talking to Lakemba residents and from criticising Islam, because she was "accosting" people. This was based on a single media report that quoted a member of the public accusing her of "baiting" people - ie asking difficult questions.
			[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1533643370/197#197]
			[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1532831241/536#536]
			They will then turn around and equate a ban on face coverings in a courtroom with support for a nationwide ban on wearing burkas in public.
			[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1533809902/75#75]
			[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1531979449/165#165]

	Muslims will claim to be the standard bearer for freedom of speech [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1439514326/236#236]		Muslims will claim to be the standard bearer for freedom of speech [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1439514326/236#236]

Freediver: /* Economics */

2018-08-15T05:30:06Z

Economics

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:30, 15 August 2018
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	=== Economics ===		=== Economics ===

	Islam has it's own peculiar economic system. When foreign governments set up regional monopolies within Australia to approve Halal meat for export (and charge extortionist prices for doing so [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1468052946/94#94][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1468233758][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1392774047/30#30][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1378852212/25#25]), Muslims attempt to pass this off as an example of how capitalism is supposed to work. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1393493672] This money supposedly goes to educating children. Similar excuses are made when the Australian Federation of Islamic Councils siphons off millions of dollars from the Australian government that should have gone to educating their own children in private Muslim schools. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1392774047/30#30]		Islam has it's own peculiar economic system. The Muslim community has a 'difficult' history with, and philosophical approach to, the use of government funds. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1534310293] When foreign governments set up regional monopolies within Australia to approve Halal meat for export (and charge extortionist prices for doing so [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1468052946/94#94][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1468233758][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1392774047/30#30][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1378852212/25#25]), Muslims attempt to pass this off as an example of how capitalism is supposed to work. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1393493672] This money supposedly goes to educating children. Similar excuses are made when the Australian Federation of Islamic Councils siphons off millions of dollars from the Australian government that should have gone to educating their own children in private Muslim schools. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1392774047/30#30]

	== Justice ==		== Justice ==

Freediver: /* The Jewish tribes of Medina */

2017-12-26T08:41:48Z

The Jewish tribes of Medina

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:41, 26 December 2017
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	Muslims will attempt to 'flood' a discussion about the Jewish tribes a Medina with a long list of excuses and justifications. None of these justifications stand up to scrutiny, however Muslims will change between them rapidly in order to avoid detailed consideration of any one of them, in the hope that people will loose interest before gaining an appreciation of what happened. Some examples:		Muslims will attempt to 'flood' a discussion about the Jewish tribes a Medina with a long list of excuses and justifications. None of these justifications stand up to scrutiny, however Muslims will change between them rapidly in order to avoid detailed consideration of any one of them, in the hope that people will loose interest before gaining an appreciation of what happened. Some examples:

	Jews were tribal and had no concept of individuality. The Jews were a 'mindless collective'. The fact that there were only 700 of them shows they had a collective mind. The Jewish tribe failed to act consistently as a collective.		Jews were tribal and had no concept of individuality. The Jews were a 'mindless collective'.
			[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1503024544]
			The fact that there were only 700 of them shows they had a collective mind. The Jewish tribe failed to act consistently as a collective.
	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1463911375/22#22]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1463911375/22#22]
	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1438922302/5#5]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1438922302/5#5]
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	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1438922302/65#65]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1438922302/65#65]
	It's OK because they were not bona fide Jews.		It's OK because they were not bona fide Jews.

			==== Blaming races for diseases ====

			Muslims will hold Europeans collectively accountable for 'European' diseases introduced to the Americas. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1503024544/348#348] Arabs are also collectively accountable for 'Arab' diseases introduced by Arabs, but generally get an exception because their diseases were introduced "as a result of friendly traders making contact with natives in good faith and instigating trade based on mutual respect" (in fact the main item traded by Muslim Arabs were female sex slaves). Europeans get no such exemptions because European diseases were introduced to the Americas by Spaniards with the intention of raping the locals (Europeans were actually trying to discover an alternative trade route to Asia after the Muslim Ottomans made the land route too dangerous). Europeans are to be blamed regardless of whether the introduction of diseases was intentional. Muslims will even argue that the native Americans would have somehow avoided introduced diseases were it not for the sinister intentions of Europeans.

	=== Honesty ===		=== Honesty ===

Freediver: /* Treason and national allegiance */

2017-05-30T08:00:32Z

Treason and national allegiance

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:00, 30 May 2017
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	=== Treason and national allegiance ===		=== Treason and national allegiance ===
	There is currently no Caliphate, but as soon as one is (re)created, Muslims are required to abandon the countries they live in and move to the Caliphate, which is where their true allegiance lies. This is likely to be in the context of a war between the Caliphate and other nations. If Australia was at war with the Caliphate, Australian Muslims would be required to take up arms against Australia. There is no clear guideline for identifying when this should occur, however many Australian Muslims believe that the west has been at war with the Muslim world for over a century.		There is currently no Caliphate, but as soon as one is (re)created, Muslims are required to abandon the countries they live in and move to the Caliphate, which is where their true allegiance lies. This is likely to be in the context of a war between the Caliphate and other nations. If Australia was at war with the Caliphate, Australian Muslims would be required to take up arms against Australia. There is no clear guideline for identifying when this should occur, however many Australian Muslims believe that the west has been at war with the Muslim world for over a century. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1318025595]

	=== War ===		=== War ===

Freediver: /* Blasphemy/free speech */

2017-04-06T08:44:30Z

Blasphemy/free speech

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:44, 6 April 2017
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	When the media refrains from publishing Muhammad cartoons, it is because they are being "considerate and responsible" rather than because they might get killed, and it is hysterical and pointless to discuss the matter any further. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1369558442/2#2]		When the media refrains from publishing Muhammad cartoons, it is because they are being "considerate and responsible" rather than because they might get killed, and it is hysterical and pointless to discuss the matter any further. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1369558442/2#2]
	The Jews in the Australian Labour Party are trying to censor criticism of Israel. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1369558442/3#3]		The Jews in the Australian Labour Party are trying to censor criticism of Israel. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1369558442/3#3]

			An organisation of Australian Muslim women who petitioned to stop Ayaan Hirsi Ali (a famous women's rights campaigner) visiting Australia called it a 'victory for free speech' when she had to cancel her visit due to threats to her life. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1491466442] Her colleague Theo van Gogh was assassinated in response to a video they made together calling for women's rights in Muslim countries, and the assassin left a message pinned to the corpse threatening Ali, western countries and Jews. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1491382260]

			Muslims and their apologists will deny that Islam is he greatest modern threat to freedom and democracy without being able to identify a single other threat. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1487846626/14#14]

	=== Apostasy ===		=== Apostasy ===

Freediver at 11:31, 2 April 2017

2017-04-02T11:31:53Z

Freediver at 11:26, 2 April 2017

2017-04-02T11:26:56Z

Show changes

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:31, 2 April 2017
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	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1434596646/3#3]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1434596646/3#3]
	The term 'shirkh' encompasses many of the sins that are considered to put a person 'outside' of Islam and thus subject to this penalty [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1215058243/9#9][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1215058243/6#6], however it has been hard to get more details on this.		The term 'shirkh' encompasses many of the sins that are considered to put a person 'outside' of Islam and thus subject to this penalty [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1215058243/9#9][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1215058243/6#6], however it has been hard to get more details on this.
	For Sunnis, this includes ~~Shites~~ and other 'heretics'. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1337120583/0#0] Rejecting Islam is interpretted broadly. Acting gay for example is considered apostasy (see section on homosexuality). Some Muslim scholars tried to change this (most recently in 1839) so that the death penalty only applied to treasonous apostates. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/wiki/index.php?title=Talk:Islam_and_Australian_values#Apostasy] However mainstream Islam still considers the death penalty for apostasy to be correct. Also, since Islam is both a state (or form of government) and a religion, many Muslims consider apostasy itself to be treason. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1233881017/25#25] Muslims often portray the penalty as being limited to treason, even though they have a very broad interpretation of apostasy,		For Sunnis, this includes Shiites and other 'heretics'. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1337120583/0#0] Rejecting Islam is interpretted broadly. Acting gay for example is considered apostasy (see section on homosexuality). Some Muslim scholars tried to change this (most recently in 1839) so that the death penalty only applied to treasonous apostates. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/wiki/index.php?title=Talk:Islam_and_Australian_values#Apostasy] However mainstream Islam still considers the death penalty for apostasy to be correct. Also, since Islam is both a state (or form of government) and a religion, many Muslims consider apostasy itself to be treason. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1233881017/25#25] Muslims often portray the penalty as being limited to treason, even though they have a very broad interpretation of apostasy,
	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1316600915/1#1]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1316600915/1#1]
	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1254303083/42#42]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1254303083/42#42]
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	Many Muslims consider Israel's destruction to be inevitable and oppose any surrender to Israel for this reason (see war [http://www.ozpolitic.com/wiki/index.php?title=Islam_and_Australian_values#War]). Muslims often portray Israel as being inflicted on the middle east by Europe and insist the Jews be sent back to Europe, however the greatest contributor to Israel's Jewish population were Jews that were expelled by Muslims from middle eastern countries - thus nearly completing Muhammad's prediction that this ethnic cleansing would happen. Those countries then attempted to invade Israel. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1372552172][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1353809434]		Many Muslims consider Israel's destruction to be inevitable and oppose any surrender to Israel for this reason (see war [http://www.ozpolitic.com/wiki/index.php?title=Islam_and_Australian_values#War]). Muslims often portray Israel as being inflicted on the middle east by Europe and insist the Jews be sent back to Europe, however the greatest contributor to Israel's Jewish population were Jews that were expelled by Muslims from middle eastern countries - thus nearly completing Muhammad's prediction that this ethnic cleansing would happen. Those countries then attempted to invade Israel. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1372552172][http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1353809434]

	Islam is not antagonistic towards Jews alone. Jews supposedly receive a measure of protection in Islam. Atheists, polytheists etc receive far worse treatment (see freedom of religion [http://www.ozpolitic.com/wiki/index.php?title=Islam_and_Australian_values#Freedom_of_religion]), while ~~Shites~~ and any other Muslim groups that stray outside of what is considered mainstream Islam receive the death penalty for apostasy (see above).		Islam is not antagonistic towards Jews alone. Jews supposedly receive a measure of protection in Islam. Atheists, polytheists etc receive far worse treatment (see freedom of religion [http://www.ozpolitic.com/wiki/index.php?title=Islam_and_Australian_values#Freedom_of_religion]), while Shiites and any other Muslim groups that stray outside of what is considered mainstream Islam receive the death penalty for apostasy (see above).
	Anti-white racism is also common and provides an easy way to blame non-Muslims for the collapse of the Islamic empire and the current state of affairs in the middle east. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1330731658]		Anti-white racism is also common and provides an easy way to blame non-Muslims for the collapse of the Islamic empire and the current state of affairs in the middle east. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1330731658]

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	Islam even forbids Muslims from making inquiries about Islam where they may feel uncomfortable with the answer. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1360487801]		Islam even forbids Muslims from making inquiries about Islam where they may feel uncomfortable with the answer. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1360487801]
	Muslims will insist that lying is permissible in a very limited set of situations, such as war (Muslims refer to this as taqiyya [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1264288348]). They will attempt to argue that this means lying is not permitted in Islam, but also claim that they believe the west has been at war with the Muslim world for over a century. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1318025595] Historically (during the Caliphate) Islam divided the world into two parts - the house of peace and the house of war (outside the Caliphate, where lying about Islam is presumably permitted). Muslims are also encouraged to deceive in order to achieve peace, in particular by inventing 'good' information. However such fabrications are considered by Islam to not be lies, thus allowing Muslims to lie about Islam at the same time as insisting Islam forbids lying, without actually lying. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1375098020/79#79]		Muslims will insist that lying is permissible in a very limited set of situations, such as war (Muslims refer to this as taqiyya [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1264288348]). They will attempt to argue that this means lying is not permitted in Islam, but also claim that they believe the west has been at war with the Muslim world for over a century. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1318025595] Historically (during the Caliphate) Islam divided the world into two parts - the house of peace and the house of war (outside the Caliphate, where lying about Islam is presumably permitted). Muslims are also encouraged to deceive in order to achieve peace, in particular by inventing 'good' information. However such fabrications are considered by Islam to not be lies, thus allowing Muslims to lie about Islam at the same time as insisting Islam forbids lying, without actually lying. [http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1375098020/79#79]
	Sunni Muslims will also claim that ~~Shites~~ permit themselves to lie, but not Sunnis.		Sunni Muslims will also claim that Shiites permit themselves to lie, but not Sunnis.
	[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1337120583]		[http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1337120583]