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Islamic University for Sydney (Read 4414 times)
Baronvonrort
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #45 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 5:36pm
 
.
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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.
 
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Bias_2012
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #46 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 6:12pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 1:09pm:
Muslims are instructed to support the laws of where they are situated, according to the Koran.



Only if the laws of the host country aren't against Shariah

"In conclusion, it is necessary by Shariah to abide by the laws of the country one lives in, regardless of the nature of the law, as long as it does not contradict Shariah. However, if the law demands something that is against Islam & Shariah, then it will be necessary to abstain from adhering to it"



Did you think I wasn't going to read the whole page?  Besides, I already know about it

However, that's not what I was talking about. I'm saying that the influence of foreign born Imams will have to be eradicated if Muslims in Australia are to get on with Jews, Hindus, and Aussie Westerners





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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #47 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 6:44pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 5:09pm:
Muslims make what, 3% of the Australian population?  How are they going to "take over"?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes



Well, they have started in the prisons, 10 years ago:

The 2013 census showed Muslims accounted for about 9.3% of the state’s prison population compared with 3.2% of the NSW population.

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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #48 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 7:55pm
 
Bias_2012 wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 6:12pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 1:09pm:
Muslims are instructed to support the laws of where they are situated, according to the Koran.


Only if the laws of the host country aren't against Shariah

Quote:
"In conclusion, it is necessary by Shariah to abide by the laws of the country one lives in, regardless of the nature of the law, as long as it does not contradict Shariah.  However, if the law demands something that is against Islam & Shariah, then it will be necessary to abstain from adhering to it"


Did you think I wasn't going to read the whole page?  Besides, I already know about it

However, that's not what I was talking about. I'm saying that the influence of foreign born Imams will have to be eradicated if Muslims in Australia are to get on with Jews, Hindus, and Aussie Westerners


So, you admit you were wrong?  I'll accept your white flag, Bias.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #49 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:01pm
 
Which lecture room will they teach beheading in?
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #50 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:02pm
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 5:30pm:
[quote author=Brian_Ross link=1710622159/38#38 date=1710904180]

Muslims are instructed to support the laws of where they are situated, according to the Koran.

[quote]Question:
Some Muslim youth in the West do not believe it is important to avoid breaking the law in countries that are not the Khilafah.

Answer:
In the name of Allah, Most Compassionate, Most Merciful,

Muslims are generally obliged to abide by the laws of the land and the country they live in, whether it is a Islamic state (al-khilafa), Muslim countries, or non-Muslim countries such as those in the west, as long as they are not ordered to practice something that is against Shariah. If they are forced by the law to commit a sin, then in such a case, it will not just be unnecessary to abide by the law, rather impermissible.

[Source]


Can you cite this verse in the Quran that says muslims must obey the law in non muslim lands? I call bullshit on this. Wink

Quote:
What is Islam’s view on obedience to the law of the land?

In Islam obedience to the law of the land is a religious duty. The Qur’an commands Muslims to remain faithful to not only Allah and the Prophet Muhammad(sa), but also the authority they live under:

    O ye who believe! obey Allah, and obey His Messenger and those who are in authority over you (Ch.4: V.60).

Any country or government that guarantees religious freedom to followers of different faiths (not just Islam) must be owed loyalty. The Prophet Muhammad(sa) stressed this point when he said:

    ‘One who obeys his authority, obeys me. One who disobeys his authority, disobeys me.’ (Muslim)

The present head of the worldwide Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad(aba), has also explained:

     ‘A true Muslim can never raise his voice in hatred against his fellow citizens, nor for that matter against the ruling authority or government of the time. It is the responsibility of a true Muslim that he should remain loyal and fully abide by the laws of the land of which he is a subject.’ (Baitul Futuh Inauguration Reception, 11 Oct 2003)

This makes clear that according to Islam Muslims must obey the law of the land as anything to the contrary would mean that they are not obeying their Prophet or their religion.

[Source]

Quote:
If you don't cite this verse we will all see your bullshit on this. Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


What was that, Baron, about bullshit again?  Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #51 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:18pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 7:55pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 6:12pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 1:09pm:
Muslims are instructed to support the laws of where they are situated, according to the Koran.


Only if the laws of the host country aren't against Shariah

Quote:
"In conclusion, it is necessary by Shariah to abide by the laws of the country one lives in, regardless of the nature of the law, as long as it does not contradict Shariah.  However, if the law demands something that is against Islam & Shariah, then it will be necessary to abstain from adhering to it"


Did you think I wasn't going to read the whole page?  Besides, I already know about it

However, that's not what I was talking about. I'm saying that the influence of foreign born Imams will have to be eradicated if Muslims in Australia are to get on with Jews, Hindus, and Aussie Westerners


So, you admit you were wrong?  I'll accept your white flag, Bias.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Your trouble is that you can't read, I've struck that with you before. You're trying to win an argument you've already lost

"However, if the law demands something that is against Islam & Shariah, then it will be necessary to abstain from adhering to it"


You're getting laughed at for trying to be a smart arse. I suggest you go back to university and learn how to comprehend, without simultaneously wondering who you're going to insult next   




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Brian Ross
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #52 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:27pm
 
Bias_2012 wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:18pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 7:55pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 6:12pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 1:09pm:
Muslims are instructed to support the laws of where they are situated, according to the Koran.


Only if the laws of the host country aren't against Shariah

Quote:
"In conclusion, it is necessary by Shariah to abide by the laws of the country one lives in, regardless of the nature of the law, as long as it does not contradict Shariah.  However, if the law demands something that is against Islam & Shariah, then it will be necessary to abstain from adhering to it"


Did you think I wasn't going to read the whole page?  Besides, I already know about it

However, that's not what I was talking about. I'm saying that the influence of foreign born Imams will have to be eradicated if Muslims in Australia are to get on with Jews, Hindus, and Aussie Westerners


So, you admit you were wrong?  I'll accept your white flag, Bias.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Your trouble is that you can't read, I've struck that with you before. You're trying to win an argument you've already lost

"However, if the law demands something that is against Islam & Shariah, then it will be necessary to abstain from adhering to it"


You're getting laughed at for trying to be a smart arse. I suggest you go back to university and learn how to comprehend, without simultaneously wondering who you're going to insult next


I understand what you are saying but what you are saying does not win the argument.  You are claiming an exception is the general rule, rather than an exception.  I would recommend that you actually graduate to University and learn how to argue properly and stop resorting to crayons to emphase  your points, it just demonstrates that you don't really have an argument.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Bias_2012
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #53 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:32pm
 

"I'm saying that the influence of foreign born Imams will have to be eradicated if Muslims in Australia are to get on with Jews, Hindus, and Aussie Westerners"


No comment from you yet on this either Ross. It's actually part of the criteria that will supposedly will be taught in the new Islamic university




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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #54 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:38pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:27pm:
I understand what you are saying but what you are saying does not win the argument.  You are claiming an exception is the general rule, rather than an exception.  I would recommend that you actually graduate to University and learn how to argue properly and stop resorting to crayons to emphase  your points, it just demonstrates that you don't really have an argument.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Sorry, but you said one thing, and the link you posted said an additional thing that made you look like a dumb-ass ... that muslims are to abstain from obeying laws contrary to Islam and Shariah




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Baronvonrort
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #55 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 9:08pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:02pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 5:30pm:
[quote author=Brian_Ross link=1710622159/38#38 date=1710904180]

Muslims are instructed to support the laws of where they are situated, according to the Koran.

[quote]Question:
Some Muslim youth in the West do not believe it is important to avoid breaking the law in countries that are not the Khilafah.

Answer:
In the name of Allah, Most Compassionate, Most Merciful,

Muslims are generally obliged to abide by the laws of the land and the country they live in, whether it is a Islamic state (al-khilafa), Muslim countries, or non-Muslim countries such as those in the west, as long as they are not ordered to practice something that is against Shariah. If they are forced by the law to commit a sin, then in such a case, it will not just be unnecessary to abide by the law, rather impermissible.

[Source]


Can you cite this verse in the Quran that says muslims must obey the law in non muslim lands? I call bullshit on this. Wink

Quote:
What is Islam’s view on obedience to the law of the land?

In Islam obedience to the law of the land is a religious duty. The Qur’an commands Muslims to remain faithful to not only Allah and the Prophet Muhammad(sa), but also the authority they live under:

    O ye who believe! obey Allah, and obey His Messenger and those who are in authority over you (Ch.4: V.60).

Any country or government that guarantees religious freedom to followers of different faiths (not just Islam) must be owed loyalty. The Prophet Muhammad(sa) stressed this point when he said:

    ‘One who obeys his authority, obeys me. One who disobeys his authority, disobeys me.’ (Muslim)

The present head of the worldwide Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad(aba), has also explained:

     ‘A true Muslim can never raise his voice in hatred against his fellow citizens, nor for that matter against the ruling authority or government of the time. It is the responsibility of a true Muslim that he should remain loyal and fully abide by the laws of the land of which he is a subject.’ (Baitul Futuh Inauguration Reception, 11 Oct 2003)

This makes clear that according to Islam Muslims must obey the law of the land as anything to the contrary would mean that they are not obeying their Prophet or their religion.

[Source]

Quote:
If you don't cite this verse we will all see your bullshit on this. Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


What was that, Baron, about bullshit again?  Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes




You're full of BS Bwhine Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

What does the Quran say why is it different to your link? Is there nothing there to back your BS?  Roll Eyes
Have you not seen those who claim to have believed in what was revealed to you, [O Muhammad], and what was revealed before you? They wish to refer legislation to Taghut, while they were commanded to reject it; and Satan wishes to lead them far astray.
https://legacy.quran.com/4/60

What do the tafsirs say?
The following verse was revealed when a Jew and a [b]hypocrite fell into a dispute. The hypocrite called on Ka‘b b. al-Ashraf to arbitrate between them while the Jew called on the Prophet s. When they came to him the Prophet ruled in favour of the Jew. But the hypocrite was not satisfied and so they went before ‘Umar. The Jew told him what had happened whereupon he ‘Umar turned to the hypocrite and asked him ‘Is this true?’ and when he replied ‘Yes’ he ‘Umar killed him.[/b]
https://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=74&tSoraNo=4&tAyahNo=60...
Did Umar kill a hypocrite who went against the ruling of Muhammad?  Roll Eyes Was Umar following the quran in killing this munafiq?  Grin

So far you have nothing to back your BS!
Grin Grin Grin Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Grin Grin Grin

The Ahamdis are considered deviant heretics they can't even call themselves muslims in Pakistan is that your best source?
Grin Grin Grin Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Grin Grin Grin
Persecution of Ahmadis

Ahmadis are considered non-Muslims by many mainstream Muslims

In 1973, the Organisation of Islamic Cooperation (an organization of 57 member countries) declared that the Ahmadi movement was not linked to the Muslim faith.[212]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Ahmadis#:~:text=Hundreds%20of%20Ahm...

Abdus Salam won the first nobel prize for a muslim in science they removed the word muslim from his grave because he was Ahmadi
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdus_Salam

There is nothing in the Quran or Sunnah that says muslims must obey laws in non islamic lands.

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« Last Edit: Mar 20th, 2024 at 9:13pm by Baronvonrort »  

Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.
 
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #56 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 9:48pm
 
Bias_2012 wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:38pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 8:27pm:
I understand what you are saying but what you are saying does not win the argument.  You are claiming an exception is the general rule, rather than an exception.  I would recommend that you actually graduate to University and learn how to argue properly and stop resorting to crayons to emphase  your points, it just demonstrates that you don't really have an argument.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Sorry, but you said one thing, and the link you posted said an additional thing that made you look like a dumb-ass ... that muslims are to abstain from obeying laws contrary to Islam and Shariah


As I said, that is the exception, not the general rule.  You really do need to learn how to construct an argument properly, Bias.  You look more and more like a fool with every post you make on this subject.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #57 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 9:54pm
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 9:08pm:
You're full of BS Bwhine Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

What does the Quran say why is it different to your link? Is there nothing there to back your BS?  Roll Eyes


The Koran often contradicts itself.  It is the problem with a book constructed, like the Bible, well after the death of the main actors.  Particularly one that has been reconstructed by latter rulers for their own purposes.  I have repeated what Imans publicly teach.  I believe what they are saying.  Only fools like you who want to deliberately stir trouble teach otherwise.  Time to grow up, Baron and actually meet and talk to some Muslims for a change and actually understand what they believe, rather than listen to the Islamophobic sites you continually quote from.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #58 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 10:10pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 5:09pm:

Muslims make what, 3% of the Australian population?  How are they going to "take over"?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...
  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes




Brian_Ross, or Abdullah ?.......you are such a deceitful sheeeeeeet.
......pretending your innocence and ignorance.



Quote:

Muslim Behavior/Terrorism Correlated With Population Size

.....As long as the Muslim population remains around or under 2% in any given country, they will be for the most part be regarded as a peace-loving minority, and not as a threat to other citizens. This is the case in:




United States — Muslim 0.6%
Australia — Muslim 1.5%
Canada — Muslim 1.9%
China — Muslim 1.8%
Italy — Muslim 1.5%
Norway — Muslim 1.8%

At 2% to 5%, they begin to proselytize from other ethnic minorities and disaffected groups, often with major recruiting from the jails and among street gangs. This is happening in:

Denmark — Muslim 2%
Germany — Muslim 3.7%
United Kingdom — Muslim 2.7%
Spain — Muslim 4%
Thailand — Muslim 4.6%

From 5% on, they exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their percentage of the population. For example, they will push for the introduction of halal (clean by Islamic standards) food, thereby securing food preparation jobs for Muslims. They will increase pressure on supermarket chains to feature halal on their shelves — along with threats for failure to comply. This is occurring in:

France — Muslim 8%
Philippines — Muslim 5%
Sweden — Muslim 5%
Switzerland — Muslim 4.3%
The Netherlands — Muslim 5.5%
Trinidad & Tobago — Muslim 5.8%

At this point, they will work to get the ruling government to allow them to rule themselves (within their ghettos) under Sharia, the Islamic Law. The ultimate goal of Islamists is to establish Sharia law over the entire world.

When Muslims approach 10% of the population, they tend to increase lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions. In Paris , we are already seeing car-burnings. Any non-Muslim action offends Islam, and results in uprisings and threats, such as in Amsterdam , with opposition to Mohammed cartoons and films about Islam. Such tensions are seen daily, particularly in Muslim sections, in:

Guyana — Muslim 10%
India — Muslim 13.4%
Israel — Muslim 16%
Kenya — Muslim 10%
Russia — Muslim 15%

After reaching 20%, nations can expect hair-trigger rioting, jihad militia formations, sporadic killings, and the burnings of Christian churches and Jewish synagogues, such as in:

Ethiopia — Muslim 32.8%

At 40%, nations experience widespread massacres, chronic terror attacks, and ongoing militia warfare, such as in:

Bosnia — Muslim 40%
Chad — Muslim 53.1%
Lebanon — Muslim 59.7%

From 60%, nations experience unfettered persecution of non-believers of all other religions (including non-conforming Muslims), sporadic ethnic cleansing (genocide), use of Sharia Law as a weapon, and Jizya, the tax placed on infidels, such as in:

Albania — Muslim 70%
Malaysia — Muslim 60.4%
Qatar — Muslim 77.5%
Sudan — Muslim 70%

After 80%, expect daily intimidation and violent jihad, some State-run ethnic cleansing, and even some genocide, as these nations drive out the infidels, and move toward 100% Muslim, such as has been experienced and in some ways is on-going in:

Bangladesh — Muslim 83%
Egypt — Muslim 90%
Gaza — Muslim 98.7%
Indonesia — Muslim 86.1%
Iran — Muslim 98%
Iraq — Muslim 97%
Jordan — Muslim 92%
Morocco — Muslim 98.7%
Pakistan — Muslim 97%
Palestine — Muslim 99%
Syria — Muslim 90%
Tajikistan — Muslim 90%
Turkey — Muslim 99.8%
United Arab Emirates — Muslim 96%

100% will usher in the peace of ‘Dar-es-Salaam’ — the Islamic House of Peace. Here there’s supposed to be peace, because everybody is a Muslim, the Madrases are the only schools, and the Koran is the only word, such as in:

Afghanistan — Muslim 100%
Saudi Arabia — Muslim 100%
Somalia — Muslim 100%
Yemen — Muslim 100%

......
......

https://www.commonsenseevaluation.com/2013/06/03/muslim-behaviorterrorism-correl...
2022-01......
https://commonsenseevaluation.com/2022/01/05/muslim-terrorism-correlated-with-po...


WWW search....
muslim terrorism correlated with population size




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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Baronvonrort
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Re: Islamic University for Sydney
Reply #59 - Mar 20th, 2024 at 10:33pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 9:54pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 20th, 2024 at 9:08pm:
You're full of BS Bwhine Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

What does the Quran say why is it different to your link? Is there nothing there to back your BS?  Roll Eyes


The Koran often contradicts itself.  It is the problem with a book constructed, like the Bible, well after the death of the main actors.  Particularly one that has been reconstructed by latter rulers for their own purposes.  I have repeated what Imans publicly teach.  I believe what they are saying.  Only fools like you who want to deliberately stir trouble teach otherwise.  Time to grow up, Baron and actually meet and talk to some Muslims for a change and actually understand what they believe, rather than listen to the Islamophobic sites you continually quote from.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes



Muslims say there are no contradictions in the Quran. Ask your muslim friend about this verse.
Quote:
Then do they not reflect upon the Qur'an? If it had been from [any] other than Allah , they would have found within it much contradiction.

https://legacy.quran.com/4/82


You cited links from Ahmadis who aren't allowed to call themselves muslims. It's a tiny minority sect who are attacked and killed by mainstream muslims.

You can read what the Quran actually says in the verse you cited.Where does it mention obeying non muslim laws? Muslims have Qurans they know what it says some of these english websites are for useful idiots like you. https://legacy.quran.com/4/60

I have cited the actual verses from Quran and Altafsir.com which are Islamic websites they're not Islamophobic websites that idiots like you claim.

Everyone can see you're full of BS that's why your Debate and Relate forum died.
Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Grin Grin Grin Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy


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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.
 
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