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General Discussion >> Federal Politics >> Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
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Message started by whiteknight on May 19th, 2024 at 4:24pm

Title: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by whiteknight on May 19th, 2024 at 4:24pm
‘Shocked’: Dentists advertise superannuation raids as early withdrawals spike

New Daily
May 16, 2024,


Millions more are being withdrawn for dental work as doctors push it as a service.   



Australians are being warned about the dangers of raiding their superannuation as tax office data shows a surge in people using retirement savings for dental work. 

Approved super withdrawals for dental work have spiked by more than $250 million between 2018 and 2023 – rising by 83 per cent in 2022-23 alone, according to government data reported by AAP.


The Dental Board of Australia is now worried about complaints that dentists are advertising early super withdrawals to clients, with the internet littered with inducements from clinics across the nation.

One firm even advertises helping Australians raid their retirement savings as a service and has partnership deals with dozens of dental clinics for procedures such as root canals, braces and implants.

Financial adviser Dawn Thomas said she was “baffled” by the online advertisements, which present myriad testimonials on web pages that don’t disclose key information about financial risks.

Thomas explained that financial advisers wouldn’t even be allowed to present super withdrawal to clients without telling them in detail the potential to lose tens of thousands in retirement and tax too.

“I’m shocked,” Thomas said of the ads.

“Are they giving financial advice?”



Avenues for accessing superannuation early have existed for years, but are tightly controlled by the Australian Taxation Office (ATO) and can only be granted under strict compassionate grounds.

That’s because it can have immense financial consequences, as demonstrated during Covid-19 when Australians collectively lost billions in potential savings after the Morrison government unlocked accounts before unveiling taxpayer income support.

Modelling by the Super Members Council (SMC) earlier this year estimated up to $85 billion in potential savings was lost from $38 billion in early super withdrawals under the scheme.

Thomas explained that withdrawing super early is damaging because of compound interest; whereby the money put in super savings grows larger over time thanks to funds reinvesting returns.

“If your money is invested in something for the long term, it doesn’t make sense [to take it out],” Thomas said.

“Present you might have a need, but future you also has needs too, and that’s what superannuation is for.”

Huge tax implications
There are also severe tax implications for accessing super early, with Thomas saying that Australians must fork over up to 22 per cent of the money they plan to withdraw in tax, which could be thousands.

“That’s a hefty amount of tax,” Thomas explained.

Thomas said there are legitimate reasons for early super withdrawal, particularly in cases where Australians face life-threatening medical emergencies or financial situations that could make them worse off if they couldn’t access their super early.

But the inappropriate use of compassionate grounds is likely to make it harder for these people, she said, because the government will respond by making it harder to access it.

The tax office manages that application process and the rules around the release of superannuation and has done so since July 2018.

“Accessing super on compassionate grounds is only available in limited circumstances where individuals are unable to pay for eligible expenses using other means,” a spokesman said.

“Accessing superannuation is not ‘free money’, as it will reduce the amount available in retirement.

“Accordingly, as with any major expense item, it is often useful to get a second opinion or quote.”

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by whiteknight on May 19th, 2024 at 4:28pm
Everyone should be able to go to the dentist when they need help.   :)
greens.org.au
Many people put off going to the dentist because they can’t afford it, which doesn’t just mean worse teeth, it can lead to other health problems too.

Everyone should be able to use their Medicare card when they go to the dentist, just like when they go to the doctor. That's why it’s time to get dental into Medicare.   :)

Getting dental into Medicare is unfinished business for the Greens. In the 2010 power-sharing Parliament we got dental into Medicare for 3.4 million children and now we want it for everyone else too.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 19th, 2024 at 9:55pm
Why isn't dentistry included in Medicare?

I have top private health insurance, go to the dentist and periodontist twice a year, have 28 of my teeth, one with a crown. My gap payment is about $30-50 a pop on bills of $2-300 a visit.  I have no tattoos, I don't eat fast food, I do not gamble.

Look at people with bad teeth and they seem to have tats, eating shite food and know their way around poker machines.



Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Sir Spot of Borg on May 20th, 2024 at 3:41am
Yeah those pokies will destroy your teeth

Spot

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 20th, 2024 at 5:12am

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 3:41am:
Yeah those pokies will destroy your teeth

Spot



they will destroy your financial ability to  take "personal responsibility ' for your teeth though

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 20th, 2024 at 5:16am
in life there are givers and takers
lifters and leaners
people living in abundance and people in scarcity
hosts and parasites
resilient and fragile
powerful and weak
brave and fretful
confident and timid

the greens are the party that want you to be a taking, leaning, scarce, parasitic, fragile, weak fretful timid victim.

why on earth any man with a modicum of self respect would vibe with their disgraceful message is beyond me


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Carl D on May 20th, 2024 at 8:31am

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 5:12am:
they will destroy your financial ability to  take "personal responsibility ' for your teeth though


Funny you should say that.

I've just taken "personal responsibility" for my teeth by using my "financial ability" to withdraw another $3,000 from my superannuation pension to pay for the $400 check up and clean (with 2 X-rays) plus $2,500 for the removal of decay under the crown on one of my bottom teeth and having a new crown made and fitted.

I have a 'temporary' crown on there at the moment and the new, permanent one will be fitted this Thursday.

And this, plus the other super lump sum withdrawals I've made during the last 12 months also helps with my "financial ability" to ensure I get the age pension later this year after I turn 67 in August instead of living on my super until I reach 68 or beyond.


aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 5:16am:
in life there are givers and takers
lifters and leaners
people living in abundance and people in scarcity
hosts and parasites
resilient and fragile
powerful and weak
brave and fretful
confident and timid

the greens are the party that want you to be a taking, leaning, scarce, parasitic, fragile, weak fretful timid victim.

why on earth any man with a modicum of self respect would vibe with their disgraceful message is beyond me


Blah blah blah blah... no one wants one of your word salads for breakfast today... or any other day for that matter. Thanks.

And, yes... it's way, way past the time for dental to be covered by Medicare.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by mothra on May 20th, 2024 at 9:07am
Anyone with half a brain would simply accept that the money spent on available dental would be easily recouped through the associated health costs of the consequences of bad teeth.

But here we are, listening to Horse Boy telling us about leaners.

Frank will be along soon to call him a poet.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Daves2017 on May 20th, 2024 at 9:38am
If you have a health care card dental care is available for free in nsw and Qld ( don’t know about the other states and territories?).

So basically the idea put forward would achieve nothing other than reducing the amount already available for people doing it tough, increase taxes, and be subject to rorts  by dentists who will be delighted to buy another 3 holiday day houses!)

If you want to actually do something worthwhile that worked in the past and is extremely cheap to run, reintroduce dental education in primary school.

This was removed by liberal nsw government and labor Qld government.

A classic stupid decision.

Just as putting dental into Medicare is equally as stupid.

Ffs, you know?

Just brush your teeth properly if you know how!!

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Sir Spot of Borg on May 20th, 2024 at 11:11am

Daves2017 wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 9:38am:
If you have a health care card dental care is available for free in nsw and Qld ( don’t know about the other states and territories?).

So basically the idea put forward would achieve nothing other than reducing the amount already available for people doing it tough, increase taxes, and be subject to rorts  by dentists who will be delighted to buy another 3 holiday day houses!)

If you want to actually do something worthwhile that worked in the past and is extremely cheap to run, reintroduce dental education in primary school.

This was removed by liberal nsw government and labor Qld government.

A classic stupid decision.

Just as putting dental into Medicare is equally as stupid.

Ffs, you know?

Just brush your teeth properly if you know how!!


Its free if you wait about 3 years on a waiting list and let students do the work you mean.

Spot

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Grappler Truth Teller Feller on May 20th, 2024 at 11:23am
Putting teeth into Medicare and bulk billing!!

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 20th, 2024 at 11:26am

Frank wrote on May 19th, 2024 at 9:55pm:
Why isn't dentistry included in Medicare?

I have top private health insurance, go to the dentist and periodontist twice a year, have 28 of my teeth, one with a crown. My gap payment is about $30-50 a pop on bills of $2-300 a visit.  I have no tattoos, I don't eat fast food, I do not gamble.

Look at people with bad teeth and they seem to have tats, eating shite food and know their way around poker machines.


What about people with impacted wisdom teeth - lots of tatts too?

What are the millions of people with painful wisdom teeth doing wrong?

I'm curious.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Black Orchid on May 20th, 2024 at 11:53am
Over $4000 per year for dental was available through Medicare to those with a chronic disease or pensioners.

The Gillard government killed it in 2011.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Daves2017 on May 20th, 2024 at 11:54am

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 11:26am:

Frank wrote on May 19th, 2024 at 9:55pm:
Why isn't dentistry included in Medicare?

I have top private health insurance, go to the dentist and periodontist twice a year, have 28 of my teeth, one with a crown. My gap payment is about $30-50 a pop on bills of $2-300 a visit.  I have no tattoos, I don't eat fast food, I do not gamble.

Look at people with bad teeth and they seem to have tats, eating shite food and know their way around poker machines.


What about people with impacted wisdom teeth - lots of tatts too?

What are the millions of people with painful wisdom teeth doing wrong?

I'm curious.





There not doing anything wrong.

You actually just described myself!

Cost $325 last Thursday. I valued the service and can’t complain about the price.

It’s called being responsible for yourself rather than believe everyone else in the world needs to take care of you.

Try it yourself, you might enjoy the feeling of independence you will feel rather than begging the government and pleading your a victim  to solve your own problems?

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 20th, 2024 at 12:01pm

Daves2017 wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 11:54am:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 11:26am:

Frank wrote on May 19th, 2024 at 9:55pm:
Why isn't dentistry included in Medicare?

I have top private health insurance, go to the dentist and periodontist twice a year, have 28 of my teeth, one with a crown. My gap payment is about $30-50 a pop on bills of $2-300 a visit.  I have no tattoos, I don't eat fast food, I do not gamble.

Look at people with bad teeth and they seem to have tats, eating shite food and know their way around poker machines.


What about people with impacted wisdom teeth - lots of tatts too?

What are the millions of people with painful wisdom teeth doing wrong?

I'm curious.





There not doing anything wrong.

You actually just described myself!

Cost $325 last Thursday. I valued the service and can’t complain about the price.

It’s called being responsible for yourself rather than believe everyone else in the world needs to take care of you.

Try it yourself, you might enjoy the feeling of independence you will feel rather than begging the government and pleading your a victim  to solve your own problems?


I have private health cover and pay for all of my dental/medical expenses.

I've never taken a cent from the government.

However, many are not as fortunate as I am and they should be given access to free or discounted dental care through Medicare.

And yes, I'm willing to pay more in taxes to fund it.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Daves2017 on May 20th, 2024 at 12:02pm

Black Orchid wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 11:53am:
Over $4000 per year for dental was available through Medicare to those with a chronic disease or pensioners.

The Gillard government killed it in 2011.

Are you sure it was Gillard and not Rudd?

It’s hard to keep track off as they outed each other every couple of months?

At labor has settled and will never allow a woman to be in charge again, boys only now on for labor.

Shame

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 20th, 2024 at 12:37pm
Denmark's comprehensive dental care system emphasizes strong preventive measures, leading to a low rate of oral disease over a lifetime.
Government initiatives promote dental education and regular check-ups, ensuring early intervention.
Denmark sets the standard in its comprehensive dental care system, prioritizing preventive measures to achieve and maintain minimal rates of oral diseases. Government initiatives actively promote oral health intelligence through education within communities and schools. These programs encourage and provide regular dental exams, with active preventive dentistry, while ensuring early intervention is accomplished when necessary.
Denmark initiated the Child Dental Health Care Act in 1972, which mandated municipalities to establish dental clinics. These clinics were tasked with offering essential and preventive dental services to children without any cost. Given the compulsory education system in Denmark, integrating free dental services within the school system proved to be an effective and streamlined approach.
The success of Denmark's approach is evident in its population's remarkable oral health, reflected in a DMFT index score of 0.4, showcasing the efficacy of their preventive strategies. The Danish Health Authority's dedication to oral health is a model for countries aspiring to establish successful and accessible dental care systems, highlighting the significance of education and early intervention.


2. Sweden
Sweden's public-private collaboration ensures widespread access to dental services.
Government-supported research initiatives drive continuous improvement in dental treatments.
Sweden's exemplary dental health system is driven by a unique blend of accessibility and patient-focused care, with an impressive 80 plus dentists per 100,000 citizens. With a commitment to preventive measures, the government invests significantly in public dental health programs, ensuring early detection and intervention.
Sweden's “Public Dental Service” (PDS or “Folktandvården”) is a significant contributor to its standing, offering nationwide oral healthcare. The PDS is financed through tax revenues and patient fees and is staffed by salaried personnel who serve urban communities and sparsely populated areas throughout the country.
Sweden ensures subsidies for citizens under 23, fostering a culture of oral care initiatives that have led to Swedish children having some of the lowest rates of oral disease.
Swedish dentists are also known for their advanced training and patient education, offering detailed insights into oral health practices for their patients. This holistic approach, combining accessibility, education, and patient empowerment, positions Sweden at the forefront of global dental health excellence.



So it is about encouraging and educating you while young so you will take good care of your teeth when you grow up. Not even in Scandi heaven is it all free for adults.




Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 20th, 2024 at 12:46pm

Carl D wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 8:31am:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 5:12am:
they will destroy your financial ability to  take "personal responsibility ' for your teeth though


Funny you should say that.

I've just taken "personal responsibility" for my teeth by using my "financial ability" to withdraw another $3,000 from my superannuation pension to pay for the $400 check up and clean (with 2 X-rays) plus $2,500 for the removal of decay under the crown on one of my bottom teeth and having a new crown made and fitted.

I have a 'temporary' crown on there at the moment and the new, permanent one will be fitted this Thursday.

And this, plus the other super lump sum withdrawals I've made during the last 12 months also helps with my "financial ability" to ensure I get the age pension later this year after I turn 67 in August instead of living on my super until I reach 68 or beyond.


aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 5:16am:
in life there are givers and takers
lifters and leaners
people living in abundance and people in scarcity
hosts and parasites
resilient and fragile
powerful and weak
brave and fretful
confident and timid

the greens are the party that want you to be a taking, leaning, scarce, parasitic, fragile, weak fretful timid victim.

why on earth any man with a modicum of self respect would vibe with their disgraceful message is beyond me


Blah blah blah blah... no one wants one of your word salads for breakfast today... or any other day for that matter. Thanks.

And, yes... it's way, way past the time for dental to be covered by Medicare.



bragging about taking from your fellow citizens

shameful behaviour :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 20th, 2024 at 12:47pm

mothra wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 9:07am:
Anyone with half a brain would simply accept that the money spent on available dental would be easily recouped through the associated health costs of the consequences of bad teeth.

But here we are, listening to Horse Boy telling us about leaners.

Frank will be along soon to call him a poet.



people are "victims" of tooth decay arent they mothra.

and as 'victims' they cant actually take any action, like , say  'clean their teeth" ::) ::) ::)

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 20th, 2024 at 1:03pm

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 12:47pm:

mothra wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 9:07am:
Anyone with half a brain would simply accept that the money spent on available dental would be easily recouped through the associated health costs of the consequences of bad teeth.

But here we are, listening to Horse Boy telling us about leaners.

Frank will be along soon to call him a poet.



people are "victims" of tooth decay arent they mothra.

and as 'victims' they cant actually take any action, like , say  'clean their teeth" ::) ::) ::)


Impacted wisdom teeth.

Thoughts?


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 20th, 2024 at 2:00pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 1:03pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 12:47pm:

mothra wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 9:07am:
Anyone with half a brain would simply accept that the money spent on available dental would be easily recouped through the associated health costs of the consequences of bad teeth.

But here we are, listening to Horse Boy telling us about leaners.

Frank will be along soon to call him a poet.



people are "victims" of tooth decay arent they mothra.

and as 'victims' they cant actually take any action, like , say  'clean their teeth" ::) ::) ::)


Impacted wisdom teeth.

Thoughts?


put that one on medicare and no others  ;)

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 20th, 2024 at 2:01pm

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 2:00pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 1:03pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 12:47pm:

mothra wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 9:07am:
Anyone with half a brain would simply accept that the money spent on available dental would be easily recouped through the associated health costs of the consequences of bad teeth.

But here we are, listening to Horse Boy telling us about leaners.

Frank will be along soon to call him a poet.



people are "victims" of tooth decay arent they mothra.

and as 'victims' they cant actually take any action, like , say  'clean their teeth" ::) ::) ::)


Impacted wisdom teeth.

Thoughts?


put that one on medicare and no others  ;)


We're getting somewhere. 

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 20th, 2024 at 2:14pm
not a problem

people should always be supported by the taxpayer for things beyond their control

a kid with a brain tumour deserves the best free neurourgeon
a kid with polio deserves the best NDIS technology

a 200 kg sloppy pig does not deserve a set of $30,000 taxpayer funded new knees
a drug addict with a personality disorder does not deserve an NDIS package and a disability pension


with regards teeth

impacted wisdon teeth are deserving
meth mouth is not

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 20th, 2024 at 2:26pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 1:03pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 12:47pm:

mothra wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 9:07am:
Anyone with half a brain would simply accept that the money spent on available dental would be easily recouped through the associated health costs of the consequences of bad teeth.

But here we are, listening to Horse Boy telling us about leaners.

Frank will be along soon to call him a poet.



people are "victims" of tooth decay arent they mothra.

and as 'victims' they cant actually take any action, like , say  'clean their teeth" ::) ::) ::)


Impacted wisdom teeth.

Thoughts?



Folly fangs.



Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Sophia on May 20th, 2024 at 3:59pm
I figured out some few years ago, ditching the extras from my private health… saving $1000 per annum.
Since I only used extras for spec savers once a year ($180 rebate) and twice for dentist, which I still payed out of pocket … plus the $1000 for extras on top… it was cheaper to just pay as I go.
So I paid $130 for new specs, $600 for dentist recently…. I’m still ahead by $270 in place of extras.
Didn’t need to go to dentist last year… so saved full amount.
But extras included ambulance cover so I pay $105 pa for that cover.
So I’m $170 ahead ….



Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Carl D on May 20th, 2024 at 4:10pm
[quote author=aquascoot link=1716099883/17#17 date=1716173166]
bragging about taking from your fellow citizens

shameful behaviour :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[/quote]

Well, at least I didn't retire and spend all of my super on a big overseas holiday then apply for the age pension like one of my neighbours did some years ago.

When she told me about it I said "well done".

Mind you, I might have done the same thing if I didn't have my elderly aunt to look after as well as having a few medical issues of my own to deal with over the last few years.

:)

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 20th, 2024 at 4:56pm

Carl D wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 4:10pm:
[quote author=aquascoot link=1716099883/17#17 date=1716173166]
bragging about taking from your fellow citizens

shameful behaviour :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[/quote]

Well, at least I didn't retire and spend all of my super on a big overseas holiday then apply for the age pension like one of my neighbours did some years ago.

When she told me about it I said "well done".

Mind you, I might have done the same thing if I didn't have my elderly aunt to look after as well as having a few medical issues of my own to deal with over the last few years.

:)


well done , you say.

maybe the young people paying more tax to fund the pension of the entitled retirees might quit their jobs at the nursing home and go surfing

as you lie in a soiled bed and no one answers your buzzer, you can reflect on the "I'm alright jack" attitude of the entitled.

to the young i would say "well done for going surfing" , why waste your time helping the elderly when they are self interested dicks



Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Carl D on May 20th, 2024 at 5:57pm

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 4:56pm:
well done , you say.

maybe the young people paying more tax to fund the pension of the entitled retirees might quit their jobs at the nursing home and go surfing

as you lie in a soiled bed and no one answers your buzzer, you can reflect on the "I'm alright jack" attitude of the entitled.

to the young i would say "well done for going surfing" , why waste your time helping the elderly when they are self interested dicks


Perhaps I might actually start to give a damn if the pollies had to play by the same rules that the rest of us have to.

For example, I've downloaded the Claim for Age Pension and Pension Bonus (SA002) form from Centrelink the other day and it's 28 pages long with 94 questions to answer (not all of them apply to me thank goodness).

I will be doing the application online through my myGov account in a few months time but in the meantime I might print the form out and fill it in then copy it over to my online application when the time comes, seems easier that way.

In addition, there is also an Income and assets (SA369) form to fill in which is 18 pages long with 60 questions to answer (again, not all of them apply to me. And again - thank goodness).

This Income and assets form is actually quite hilarious (well, it would be if it wasn't for the fact they're serious about it) because they want to know about everything you own and how much you think it's all worth - car, TV, computers, etc., etc. WTF has all that got to do with getting the age pension?

I wonder if Mark "Sneakers" McGowan had to fill in these forms before he got his $275,000 a year taxpayer funded pension after he retired "exhausted" from politics last year? Yeah, right.

And doesn't Centrelink have anything to say about the fact that he's also working in 4 part time private sector jobs while he's getting his big, fat taxpayer funded pension? Just imagine if Joe or Jane Average tried to do something like that... heck, they'd have Centrelink hounding them non stop if they started earning $10 a week over what their 'rules' say they're allowed to have.

And McGowan is just the 'tip of the iceberg', all of the pollies have been doing/are still doing the same thing.

So, as I said, until the pollies have to play by the same 'rules' as the rest of us I really couldn't care less about getting my age pension as soon as I'm eligible (and I had to wait 2 years longer to get it than I should have had to after the pollies put the pension age up to 67).

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 20th, 2024 at 6:41pm

Carl D wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 5:57pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 4:56pm:
well done , you say.

maybe the young people paying more tax to fund the pension of the entitled retirees might quit their jobs at the nursing home and go surfing

as you lie in a soiled bed and no one answers your buzzer, you can reflect on the "I'm alright jack" attitude of the entitled.

to the young i would say "well done for going surfing" , why waste your time helping the elderly when they are self interested dicks


Perhaps I might actually start to give a damn if the pollies had to play by the same rules that the rest of us have to.

For example, I've downloaded the Claim for Age Pension and Pension Bonus (SA002) form from Centrelink the other day and it's 28 pages long with 94 questions to answer (not all of them apply to me thank goodness).

I will be doing the application online through my myGov account in a few months time but in the meantime I might print the form out and fill it in then copy it over to my online application when the time comes, seems easier that way.

In addition, there is also an Income and assets (SA369) form to fill in which is 18 pages long with 60 questions to answer (again, not all of them apply to me. And again - thank goodness).

This Income and assets form is actually quite hilarious (well, it would be if it wasn't for the fact they're serious about it) because they want to know about everything you own and how much you think it's all worth - car, TV, computers, etc., etc. WTF has all that got to do with getting the age pension?

I wonder if Mark "Sneakers" McGowan had to fill in these forms before he got his $275,000 a year taxpayer funded pension after he retired "exhausted" from politics last year? Yeah, right.

And doesn't Centrelink have anything to say about the fact that he's also working in 4 part time private sector jobs while he's getting his big, fat taxpayer funded pension? Just imagine if Joe or Jane Average tried to do something like that... heck, they'd have Centrelink hounding them non stop if they started earning $10 a week over what their 'rules' say they're allowed to have.

And McGowan is just the 'tip of the iceberg', all of the pollies have been doing/are still doing the same thing.

So, as I said, until the pollies have to play by the same 'rules' as the rest of us I really couldn't care less about getting my age pension as soon as I'm eligible (and I had to wait 2 years longer to get it than I should have had to after the pollies put the pension age up to 67).



So you are excusing yourself by pretending that you are diddling the pollies, not your fellow tax payers.

What IS it with people in Perth? The chips on your parochial shoulders are enormous.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 20th, 2024 at 6:55pm

Frank wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 6:41pm:

Carl D wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 5:57pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 4:56pm:
well done , you say.

maybe the young people paying more tax to fund the pension of the entitled retirees might quit their jobs at the nursing home and go surfing

as you lie in a soiled bed and no one answers your buzzer, you can reflect on the "I'm alright jack" attitude of the entitled.

to the young i would say "well done for going surfing" , why waste your time helping the elderly when they are self interested dicks


Perhaps I might actually start to give a damn if the pollies had to play by the same rules that the rest of us have to.

For example, I've downloaded the Claim for Age Pension and Pension Bonus (SA002) form from Centrelink the other day and it's 28 pages long with 94 questions to answer (not all of them apply to me thank goodness).

I will be doing the application online through my myGov account in a few months time but in the meantime I might print the form out and fill it in then copy it over to my online application when the time comes, seems easier that way.

In addition, there is also an Income and assets (SA369) form to fill in which is 18 pages long with 60 questions to answer (again, not all of them apply to me. And again - thank goodness).

This Income and assets form is actually quite hilarious (well, it would be if it wasn't for the fact they're serious about it) because they want to know about everything you own and how much you think it's all worth - car, TV, computers, etc., etc. WTF has all that got to do with getting the age pension?

I wonder if Mark "Sneakers" McGowan had to fill in these forms before he got his $275,000 a year taxpayer funded pension after he retired "exhausted" from politics last year? Yeah, right.

And doesn't Centrelink have anything to say about the fact that he's also working in 4 part time private sector jobs while he's getting his big, fat taxpayer funded pension? Just imagine if Joe or Jane Average tried to do something like that... heck, they'd have Centrelink hounding them non stop if they started earning $10 a week over what their 'rules' say they're allowed to have.

And McGowan is just the 'tip of the iceberg', all of the pollies have been doing/are still doing the same thing.

So, as I said, until the pollies have to play by the same 'rules' as the rest of us I really couldn't care less about getting my age pension as soon as I'm eligible (and I had to wait 2 years longer to get it than I should have had to after the pollies put the pension age up to 67).



So you are excusing yourself by pretending that you are diddling the pollies, not your fellow tax payers.

What IS it with people in Perth? The chips on your parochial shoulders are enormous.


Diddling?   How?   :-/

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 20th, 2024 at 7:02pm

Quote:
Well, at least I didn't retire and spend all of my super on a big overseas holiday then apply for the age pension like one of my neighbours did some years ago.

When she told me about it I said "well done".

Mind you, I might have done the same thing if I didn't have my elderly aunt to look after as well as having a few medical issues of my own to deal with over the last few years.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 20th, 2024 at 7:02pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 6:55pm:

Frank wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 6:41pm:

Carl D wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 5:57pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 4:56pm:
well done , you say.

maybe the young people paying more tax to fund the pension of the entitled retirees might quit their jobs at the nursing home and go surfing

as you lie in a soiled bed and no one answers your buzzer, you can reflect on the "I'm alright jack" attitude of the entitled.

to the young i would say "well done for going surfing" , why waste your time helping the elderly when they are self interested dicks


Perhaps I might actually start to give a damn if the pollies had to play by the same rules that the rest of us have to.

For example, I've downloaded the Claim for Age Pension and Pension Bonus (SA002) form from Centrelink the other day and it's 28 pages long with 94 questions to answer (not all of them apply to me thank goodness).

I will be doing the application online through my myGov account in a few months time but in the meantime I might print the form out and fill it in then copy it over to my online application when the time comes, seems easier that way.

In addition, there is also an Income and assets (SA369) form to fill in which is 18 pages long with 60 questions to answer (again, not all of them apply to me. And again - thank goodness).

This Income and assets form is actually quite hilarious (well, it would be if it wasn't for the fact they're serious about it) because they want to know about everything you own and how much you think it's all worth - car, TV, computers, etc., etc. WTF has all that got to do with getting the age pension?

I wonder if Mark "Sneakers" McGowan had to fill in these forms before he got his $275,000 a year taxpayer funded pension after he retired "exhausted" from politics last year? Yeah, right.

And doesn't Centrelink have anything to say about the fact that he's also working in 4 part time private sector jobs while he's getting his big, fat taxpayer funded pension? Just imagine if Joe or Jane Average tried to do something like that... heck, they'd have Centrelink hounding them non stop if they started earning $10 a week over what their 'rules' say they're allowed to have.

And McGowan is just the 'tip of the iceberg', all of the pollies have been doing/are still doing the same thing.

So, as I said, until the pollies have to play by the same 'rules' as the rest of us I really couldn't care less about getting my age pension as soon as I'm eligible (and I had to wait 2 years longer to get it than I should have had to after the pollies put the pension age up to 67).



So you are excusing yourself by pretending that you are diddling the pollies, not your fellow tax payers.

What IS it with people in Perth? The chips on your parochial shoulders are enormous.


Diddling?   How?   :-/


cant you read   :-/ :-/ :-/

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 20th, 2024 at 7:04pm

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 7:02pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 6:55pm:

Frank wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 6:41pm:

Carl D wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 5:57pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 4:56pm:
well done , you say.

maybe the young people paying more tax to fund the pension of the entitled retirees might quit their jobs at the nursing home and go surfing

as you lie in a soiled bed and no one answers your buzzer, you can reflect on the "I'm alright jack" attitude of the entitled.

to the young i would say "well done for going surfing" , why waste your time helping the elderly when they are self interested dicks


Perhaps I might actually start to give a damn if the pollies had to play by the same rules that the rest of us have to.

For example, I've downloaded the Claim for Age Pension and Pension Bonus (SA002) form from Centrelink the other day and it's 28 pages long with 94 questions to answer (not all of them apply to me thank goodness).

I will be doing the application online through my myGov account in a few months time but in the meantime I might print the form out and fill it in then copy it over to my online application when the time comes, seems easier that way.

In addition, there is also an Income and assets (SA369) form to fill in which is 18 pages long with 60 questions to answer (again, not all of them apply to me. And again - thank goodness).

This Income and assets form is actually quite hilarious (well, it would be if it wasn't for the fact they're serious about it) because they want to know about everything you own and how much you think it's all worth - car, TV, computers, etc., etc. WTF has all that got to do with getting the age pension?

I wonder if Mark "Sneakers" McGowan had to fill in these forms before he got his $275,000 a year taxpayer funded pension after he retired "exhausted" from politics last year? Yeah, right.

And doesn't Centrelink have anything to say about the fact that he's also working in 4 part time private sector jobs while he's getting his big, fat taxpayer funded pension? Just imagine if Joe or Jane Average tried to do something like that... heck, they'd have Centrelink hounding them non stop if they started earning $10 a week over what their 'rules' say they're allowed to have.

And McGowan is just the 'tip of the iceberg', all of the pollies have been doing/are still doing the same thing.

So, as I said, until the pollies have to play by the same 'rules' as the rest of us I really couldn't care less about getting my age pension as soon as I'm eligible (and I had to wait 2 years longer to get it than I should have had to after the pollies put the pension age up to 67).



So you are excusing yourself by pretending that you are diddling the pollies, not your fellow tax payers.

What IS it with people in Perth? The chips on your parochial shoulders are enormous.


Diddling?   How?   :-/


cant you read   :-/ :-/ :-/


He's applying for the pension.

How is that "diddling"?


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Daves2017 on May 21st, 2024 at 12:28am
Brush and floss your teeth and teach your kids.

It doesn’t need government interfere or Medicare ( us) funding it.

Ffs, how to completely dumb people down.

Brush your buggerkkk teeth.

Save taxpayer billions.

Lazy stupid buggers!

Has the Australian population really reached the point they don’t want brush their teeth but want the government to pay their dental bills?

Hold the immigration thread.

Maybe we need to look at swapping some our dumbarses out and replace with people who have the basic ability to use a toothbrush?

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Carl D on May 21st, 2024 at 12:45am

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 7:04pm:
He's applying for the pension.

How is that "diddling"?


It would seem that people like aquascoot and Frank would like to see as many elderly people "drop off the perch" as possible - preferably before they are able to claim the age pension.

Something that our pollies apparently also want to happen when you look at how many elderly people are dying/have died in aged care from Covid and the fact that our governments don't care or even mention it these days.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 21st, 2024 at 5:22am
incorrect. i dont want them to die

i want them to man up and contribute and set a good example and stop being selfish takers and parasitic grubs

this chap would be a good role model

no way i want people like him dead



One of Queensland's hardest working Surf Life Saving volunteers, Peter Anderson, has just turned 80. He spends about 500 hours a year volunteering in the red and yellow on the Gold Coast and insists he has no intention of slowing down.


strong powerful inspirational giving life affirming brave resourceful and self reliant


you should put that on your frige carl  :P :P

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Carl D on May 21st, 2024 at 7:26am

aquascoot wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 5:22am:
incorrect. i dont want them to die

i want them to man up and contribute and set a good example and stop being selfish takers and parasitic grubs


So, if aquascoot doesn't want the elderly to die before they reach pension age then retire and access the age pension (currently 67 years, might be 70 or more eventually if the pollies get their way and they probably will) it looks like he wants to see them work until they drop (again, so they don't get the age pension).

I would have thought that after working and paying tax for nearly 50 years these "selfish takers and parasitic grubs" would be entitled to a quiet retirement and the age pension but maybe that's just me?

Mind you, with the rampant selfishness and greed in Australia today (just look at house prices and rents as a perfect example) I'm guessing there aren't too many people around these days who think like I do.

Anyway, we're getting more and more off topic here so I'll just say again that it's time dental was covered by Medicare and bulk billing.



Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Grappler Truth Teller Feller on May 21st, 2024 at 11:03am

Carl D wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 12:45am:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 7:04pm:
He's applying for the pension.

How is that "diddling"?


It would seem that people like aquascoot and Frank would like to see as many elderly people "drop off the perch" as possible - preferably before they are able to claim the age pension.

Something that our pollies apparently also want to happen when you look at how many elderly people are dying/have died in aged care from Covid and the fact that our governments don't care or even mention it these days.


Clearly that is part of The Plan in place - look at the way they are diddling away at superannuation stashes and getting people to put that cash back into the economy so they can die before they get a pension.  I look around me at 74 and am amazed at how many are falling from the tree before 67 .... and those with the least and thus more likely to get a pension are more likely to have health issues  sooner and more severely ... look at their teeth ....

Way for a government to get your super stash by the back door - oh - just use some of that to tide you over through covid.... oh, just use a stash of that to buy your house while my investments grow and grow and the cost gets higher... oh, just spend it now so the economy is buoyant and vibrant ... the ant and the grasshopper....

It's just getting your super into the economy and thus back into government hands via taxation - the back door method - we all know by now that what the funds invest in - 'business' - doesn't pay back taxes into the government till, so that's a dead end for parasitic government... they need YOUR money as the small guy who is subject to all taxes.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 11:16am

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 7:04pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 7:02pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 6:55pm:

Frank wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 6:41pm:

Carl D wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 5:57pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 4:56pm:
well done , you say.

maybe the young people paying more tax to fund the pension of the entitled retirees might quit their jobs at the nursing home and go surfing

as you lie in a soiled bed and no one answers your buzzer, you can reflect on the "I'm alright jack" attitude of the entitled.

to the young i would say "well done for going surfing" , why waste your time helping the elderly when they are self interested dicks


Perhaps I might actually start to give a damn if the pollies had to play by the same rules that the rest of us have to.

For example, I've downloaded the Claim for Age Pension and Pension Bonus (SA002) form from Centrelink the other day and it's 28 pages long with 94 questions to answer (not all of them apply to me thank goodness).

I will be doing the application online through my myGov account in a few months time but in the meantime I might print the form out and fill it in then copy it over to my online application when the time comes, seems easier that way.

In addition, there is also an Income and assets (SA369) form to fill in which is 18 pages long with 60 questions to answer (again, not all of them apply to me. And again - thank goodness).

This Income and assets form is actually quite hilarious (well, it would be if it wasn't for the fact they're serious about it) because they want to know about everything you own and how much you think it's all worth - car, TV, computers, etc., etc. WTF has all that got to do with getting the age pension?

I wonder if Mark "Sneakers" McGowan had to fill in these forms before he got his $275,000 a year taxpayer funded pension after he retired "exhausted" from politics last year? Yeah, right.

And doesn't Centrelink have anything to say about the fact that he's also working in 4 part time private sector jobs while he's getting his big, fat taxpayer funded pension? Just imagine if Joe or Jane Average tried to do something like that... heck, they'd have Centrelink hounding them non stop if they started earning $10 a week over what their 'rules' say they're allowed to have.

And McGowan is just the 'tip of the iceberg', all of the pollies have been doing/are still doing the same thing.

So, as I said, until the pollies have to play by the same 'rules' as the rest of us I really couldn't care less about getting my age pension as soon as I'm eligible (and I had to wait 2 years longer to get it than I should have had to after the pollies put the pension age up to 67).



So you are excusing yourself by pretending that you are diddling the pollies, not your fellow tax payers.

What IS it with people in Perth? The chips on your parochial shoulders are enormous.


Diddling?   How?   :-/


cant you read   :-/ :-/ :-/


He's applying for the pension.

How is that "diddling"?


Still waiting for an answer on this.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by John Smith on May 21st, 2024 at 2:10pm
Dentistry in this country is a ripp off. I've just been quoted $9k for my 14yr old to get his teeth fixed. 
He brushes his teeth twice daily and no, he doesn't binge on junk food nor does he have tats, despite what horseboy tells himself.

Whilst I'm not overly concerned as I'm in a position where I can pay for it, others cannot.

There's a reason why pensioners are traveling to Thailand and Turkey to get their teeth fixed.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 2:35pm

John Smith wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:10pm:
Dentistry in this country is a ripp off. I've just been quoted $9k for my 14yr old to get his teeth fixed. 
He brushes his teeth twice daily and no, he doesn't binge on junk food nor does he have tats, despite what horseboy tells himself.

Whilst I'm not overly concerned as I'm in a position where I can pay for it, others cannot.

There's a reason why pensioners are traveling to Thailand and Turkey to get their teeth fixed.


I wouldn't recommend that   :(

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by JC Denton on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm
brush ya teef more

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 21st, 2024 at 2:55pm

John Smith wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:10pm:
Dentistry in this country is a ripp off. I've just been quoted $9k for my 14yr old to get his teeth fixed. 
He brushes his teeth twice daily and no, he doesn't binge on junk food nor does he have tats, despite what horseboy tells himself.

Whilst I'm not overly concerned as I'm in a position where I can pay for it, others cannot.

There's a reason why pensioners are traveling to Thailand and Turkey to get their teeth fixed.



There is a good argument for semi-compulsory dental reviews and care for children and teenagers until about age 18 or 20 or so. Including orthodontic care, with some means testing.

After the first two decades of life, however,  people should be able take care of their teeth.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by UnSubRocky on May 21st, 2024 at 4:03pm

Daves2017 wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 9:38am:
If you have a health care card dental care is available for free in nsw and Qld ( don’t know about the other states and territories?).


My health care card runs out this year. Last year, I got a free dental clean from the Base Hospital Dental Clinic. Other places charge at least $100 for consultation and clean -- actually, that is at the CQU dental clinic. I don't know what it costs at the private dentists. But the free dental clinics have over a year's wait time. Had I the brains, I would have gone to the dentist every year of my student days, and then rebooked so that I could have a proper descaling clean.


Quote:
Just brush your teeth properly if you know how!!


That is not really true. Someone criticised me for taking 2 minutes to brush my teeth. He said that it should only take 20 seconds at most. I thought, "WTF?". 2 minutes should be the minimum amount of time to brush your teeth. Dentists tell me that a lot of people miss the back and inside of their teeth. They just brush the front and sides of their teeth.

The last time I went to the dentist, I spent the evening before sitting in front of my tv, whilst I brushed my teeth about 3 times over. It took 10 minutes per brushing. I had a bottle of water, and a jar to spit the toothpaste into. Then it was a matter of flossing for a while. The next day, before the appointment, I used baking soda as a mouthwash -- holding the baking soda in my mouth for a few minutes before swishing the melted baking soda around for another minute or so before expulsion. Then I brushed my teeth for 3 minutes, just to make sure that I did enough to impress the hot, young dental student.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by UnSubRocky on May 21st, 2024 at 4:18pm

John Smith wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:10pm:
Dentistry in this country is a ripp off. I've just been quoted $9k for my 14yr old to get his teeth fixed. 
He brushes his teeth twice daily and no, he doesn't binge on junk food nor does he have tats, despite what horseboy tells himself.


At 14 years of age, I was fairly disciplined with my dental hygiene. But, I had inherited the gene in between for my mother's crooked teeth and my father's relatively straight teeth. I basically developed a type of crowded mouth that only improved as I grew. The left side of my teeth actually look quite alright -- probably as the result of being right handed and being able to brush that side more thoroughly. The right side looks like a rollercoaster rail twist. Second incisor behind the first/front incisor, with my canine tooth slightly inward, and my premolar following suit. One of my molars is actually alright, whilst the back one is jagged outwards.

Had I been able to get braces in my early teens, I would have been looking alright by the time I got out of high school, with some straight teeth. Dental work over the years has removed the broken and worthless back molars. My teeth look better. But I wish I could have something done to resort the right side of my teeth. But, yes, $9,000 is too much to have teeth fixed, unless the teeth are really bad.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.



My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.




Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Aquarius on May 21st, 2024 at 4:52pm

Daves2017 wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 9:38am:
If you have a health care card dental care is available for free in nsw and Qld ( don’t know about the other states and territories?).

So basically the idea put forward would achieve nothing other than reducing the amount already available for people doing it tough, increase taxes, and be subject to rorts  by dentists who will be delighted to buy another 3 holiday day houses!)

If you want to actually do something worthwhile that worked in the past and is extremely cheap to run, reintroduce dental education in primary school.

This was removed by liberal nsw government and labor Qld government.

A classic stupid decision.

Just as putting dental into Medicare is equally as stupid.

Ffs, you know?

Just brush your teeth properly if you know how!!


I agree regarding Medicare covering dental.  It would cost a fortune and there would have to be limits because so much of dental work these days is cosmetic.  I can't see it happening though because doctors are abandoning Medicare and dentists would be much the same. 

Maybe the govt could make a co payment towards dental costs for pensioners.  Free dental is just that - you get what you pay for and if you're not paying you don't get anything in return.  I think for older people they have a fill or pull attitude to dentistry because they're not going to spend time and money on the elderly. 

But they definitely should be spending more on preventative dentistry for younger kids.  A school dental health service should be compulsory. 

However I wouldn't be too harsh about baby boomers and their teeth - they didn't always have the benefits of fluorided water. They never had dental floss until much later in their lives.  They didn't have access as young children to preventative dentistry.  Most people smoked back then and their diets were full of carbonated drinks and carbohydrates. Hopefully most people know better now.  Unfortunately many are now suffering from decreased saliva caused by medications and chronic health conditions.  Teeth like bones become more brittle.  If these people need treatment and cannot afford it, they will have to go on a waiting list and they will find that there are only two treatments - either fill or pull. 

But it's always been thus - back in the 70s I worked at the Dental Hospital in Admin. At the time, the professors were waging war against the govt because funding was so inadequate that young children whose teeth and mouths were grossly malformed and their appearance so horrifying due in many cases to genetic causes that they were too afraid to go out in public, were waiting years and years to have their conditions corrected.

Nothing seems to have changed.  There is never enough funding. 



Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 4:56pm

Aquarius wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:52pm:
I agree regarding Medicare covering dental.  It would cost a fortune and there would have to be limits because so much of dental work these days is cosmetic. 


Sure.

Limit it to, for example, two checkups & cleans a year, two fillings a year, and one set of x-rays every two years.

Just that alone would be a huge benefit.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Aquarius on May 21st, 2024 at 5:56pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:56pm:

Aquarius wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:52pm:
I agree regarding Medicare covering dental.  It would cost a fortune and there would have to be limits because so much of dental work these days is cosmetic. 


Sure.

Limit it to, for example, two checkups & cleans a year, two fillings a year, and one set of x-rays every two years.

Just that alone would be a huge benefit.


Yes, that would be helpful and would hopefully get more people to attend a dental surgery.  This could actually be done by dental therapists which would be a big cost saving.  Or maybe a dental hygienist if necessary.  And they would only need to be seen by a dentist if they had more serious conditions. 


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 21st, 2024 at 6:04pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm:

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.



My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.


Pikseters - like flossing, only better and easier.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by aquascoot on May 21st, 2024 at 6:15pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm:

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.



My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.



never use mouthwash

it destroys your micro biome


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTSt3TetjxA

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 6:23pm

Aquarius wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 5:56pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:56pm:

Aquarius wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:52pm:
I agree regarding Medicare covering dental.  It would cost a fortune and there would have to be limits because so much of dental work these days is cosmetic. 


Sure.

Limit it to, for example, two checkups & cleans a year, two fillings a year, and one set of x-rays every two years.

Just that alone would be a huge benefit.


Yes, that would be helpful and would hopefully get more people to attend a dental surgery.  This could actually be done by dental therapists which would be a big cost saving.  Or maybe a dental hygienist if necessary.  And they would only need to be seen by a dentist if they had more serious conditions. 


Yep   :)

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 21st, 2024 at 6:27pm

aquascoot wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 6:15pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm:

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.



My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.



never use mouthwash

it destroys your micro biome


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTSt3TetjxA

Good one. My dentist advised against mouthwash for those reasons.

Baking soda is base - opposite of acid - so a baking soda toothpaste reduces the acidity in the mouth.

Picketers, rinse with water = pH neutral. Fluoride treatment.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 6:29pm

Frank wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 6:27pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 6:15pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm:

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.



My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.



never use mouthwash

it destroys your micro biome


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTSt3TetjxA

Good one. My dentist advised against mouthwash for those reasons.

Baking soda is base - opposite of acid - so a baking soda toothpaste reduces the acidity in the mouth.

Picketers, rinse with water = pH neutral. Fluoride treatment.


Hmm, I'll look into this.

The only reason I use mouthwash is for the "whitening".

Maybe I need to reassess.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 6:53pm

aquascoot wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 6:15pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm:

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.



My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.



never use mouthwash

it destroys your micro biome


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTSt3TetjxA


Okay, I looked into this.

He really has nothing to back up his claims.

Multiple Google searches suggest he's just a podcaster out to make money.

"Fake! He takes studies and blow them out of proportion. His academic credentials are often not in line with his topics. It’s like when chiropractors like to play the role of nutritionists. - You get the wrong impression that he is an authority. He is not! - He is cherry-picking studies or partial results from within a study and then hype the heck out of it."

I actually have an appointment with my dentist tomorrow, for a checkup, so I'm gonna ask him about mouthwashes.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by UnSubRocky on May 21st, 2024 at 7:07pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm:

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.

My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.


You would still need to brush your teeth twice a day. If I simply just flossed and rinsed twice a day, I would still have the plaque building up in my teeth. Brushing your teeth helps keep the plaque at bay, and even slowly removes the build up.

And I use baking soda as a mouthwash. Hold the baking soda in your mouth for 3 minutes. Then swish around the liquid for a minute or two. Then expel. Baking soda helps break down the plaque build up much better than mouthwash. Only the dentist can remove the plaque in your mouth more effectively.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 7:11pm

UnSubRocky wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 7:07pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm:

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.

My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.


You would still need to brush your teeth twice a day.


Ideally, yes.

But I said: "If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste".

For example, you get lucky at the pub and spend the night at a stranger's house.

You probably don't want to use their toothbrush, but you can quite safely use their dental floss and water.

Ideally, you brush twice a day.  I was just offering an alternative if a brush isn't available.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 21st, 2024 at 7:21pm

UnSubRocky wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 7:07pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm:

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.

My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.


You would still need to brush your teeth twice a day. If I simply just flossed and rinsed twice a day, I would still have the plaque building up in my teeth. Brushing your teeth helps keep the plaque at bay, and even slowly removes the build up.

And I use baking soda as a mouthwash. Hold the baking soda in your mouth for 3 minutes. Then swish around the liquid for a minute or two. Then expel. Baking soda helps break down the plaque build up much better than mouthwash. Only the dentist can remove the plaque in your mouth more effectively.

The thing about brushing is about
On/under the gum line - tilt your brush
Between the teeth


A toothbrush doesn't  do a good enough job between the teeth where most of the festering happens. I am amazed how much brushing DOESN'T get but flossing/pikster does.


Today's word: interdental.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 7:27pm

Frank wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 7:21pm:
A toothbrush doesn't  do a good enough job between the teeth where most of the festering happens. I am amazed how much brushing DOESN'T get but flossing/poster does.


Frank is, surprisingly, right.

If I could only choose one item from a) a toothbrush or b) a roll of dental floss, I'd choose b) the dental floss, in a heart beat.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Grappler Truth Teller Feller on May 21st, 2024 at 8:13pm
I have le toothbrush electrique and use tooth picks... with the brush I get right down to the gum line and dig a little, and do it twice, once with plaque remover and then with toothpaste ... sometimes I run a tooth pick along the gums and scrape like the dentist does.  My dentist says my teeth are clean even though some have committed suicide.... bloody hell...

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by John Smith on May 21st, 2024 at 8:19pm

Frank wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:55pm:

John Smith wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:10pm:
Dentistry in this country is a ripp off. I've just been quoted $9k for my 14yr old to get his teeth fixed. 
He brushes his teeth twice daily and no, he doesn't binge on junk food nor does he have tats, despite what horseboy tells himself.

Whilst I'm not overly concerned as I'm in a position where I can pay for it, others cannot.

There's a reason why pensioners are traveling to Thailand and Turkey to get their teeth fixed.



There is a good argument for semi-compulsory dental reviews and care for children and teenagers until about age 18 or 20 or so. Including orthodontic care, with some means testing.

After the first two decades of life, however,  people should be able take care of their teeth.


That'll work.


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by John Smith on May 21st, 2024 at 8:23pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:35pm:

John Smith wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:10pm:
Dentistry in this country is a ripp off. I've just been quoted $9k for my 14yr old to get his teeth fixed. 
He brushes his teeth twice daily and no, he doesn't binge on junk food nor does he have tats, despite what horseboy tells himself.

Whilst I'm not overly concerned as I'm in a position where I can pay for it, others cannot.

There's a reason why pensioners are traveling to Thailand and Turkey to get their teeth fixed.


I wouldn't recommend that   :(


I'm not so sure.  They're much better than they used to be.  Just find one trained here or in the UK.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Frank on May 21st, 2024 at 9:05pm
The old Soviet sattelites, now in the EU, have world standard dental and medical facilities, and skill at half price.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by UnSubRocky on May 21st, 2024 at 10:23pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 7:11pm:
Ideally, yes.

But I said: "If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste".

For example, you get lucky at the pub and spend the night at a stranger's house.

You probably don't want to use their toothbrush, but you can quite safely use their dental floss and water.

Ideally, you brush twice a day.  I was just offering an alternative if a brush isn't available.


Ideally, if you were getting lucky at the pub and spend the night at the stranger's house, are you going to spend that evening flossing away for 5 minutes with a packet of floss you brought along with you and then whip out a small bottle of mouthwash? If you brought those conspicuous items along, why not a toothbrush and toothpaste to put in your carry bag?

Your initial scenario was that if you are out of a toothbrush and toothpaste, use dental floss and mouthwash. At what point do you run out of toothpaste that you did not have another toothpaste packet awaiting to be opened for at least the previous week's grocery shop? "Oops, I have run out of toothpaste. Better start using my dental floss". ??? Even at a poorly planned grocery shop of not getting replacement toothpaste, I would be using the handle of the toothbrush to squeeze the remainder of the toothpaste out of the near empty tube of toothpaste. And then I would make the trip to a nearby 24 hour service station to buy another packet of toothpaste to last me until my next grocery shop.

Btw, did you notice that people said not to use mouthwash, as it destroys the mouth's biome? If you were to get lucky, you would not use mouthwash also because it lessens the likelihood of getting a strong erection. The nitric oxide helps with vasodilation. You want a stronger erection, don't destroy the bacteria that helps produce nitric oxide.

Source: https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/how-to-increase-nitric-oxide#limit-mouthwash

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 21st, 2024 at 10:28pm

UnSubRocky wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 10:23pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 7:11pm:
Ideally, yes.

But I said: "If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste".

For example, you get lucky at the pub and spend the night at a stranger's house.

You probably don't want to use their toothbrush, but you can quite safely use their dental floss and water.

Ideally, you brush twice a day.  I was just offering an alternative if a brush isn't available.


Ideally, if you were getting lucky at the pub and spend the night at the stranger's house, are you going to spend that evening flossing away for 5 minutes with a packet of floss you brought along with you and then whip out a small bottle of mouthwash? If you brought those conspicuous items along, why not a toothbrush and toothpaste to put in your carry bag?


FFS   ::)

You'd bring nothing with you.

You'd borrow 300mm of dental floss from the bathroom cabinet and then rinse with the water from the tap.

It was just an example of what to do when no toothbrush is available.

Nobody goes to the pub with a bag containing a toothbrush, toothpaste, floss, and mouthwash.

I swear you're trolling at times   ::)

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by UnSubRocky on May 21st, 2024 at 10:37pm

Frank wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 7:21pm:
The thing about brushing is about
On/under the gum line - tilt your brush
Between the teeth


A toothbrush doesn't  do a good enough job between the teeth where most of the festering happens. I am amazed how much brushing DOESN'T get but flossing/pikster does.


Today's word: interdental.


Yes, I am well aware of the way we need to look after our teeth by brushing a certain way. I have checked my teeth often after brushing. Sometimes, I have another go a detail brushing certain parts of the mouth so that there is not orange-brown staining of the incisors. Then I try to look at the back teeth as far as I can pull the mouth back, to see if the back teeth are discoloured that I might have to spend 5 minutes brushing just one section of the mouth to try and revive a healthy colour. For the rest, flossing/piksters helps clear up any build up of plaque. On a few occasions, I managed to remove small chunks of the tartar (or whatever the term for it is called). Most of it is removed yearly with dentician intervention.

Last year, my dentist told me that the best way of brushing your teeth is to not wash your mouth out after brushing your teeth. She said the toothpaste helps remineralise your teeth.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by UnSubRocky on May 21st, 2024 at 11:04pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 10:28pm:
FFS   ::)

You'd bring nothing with you.

You'd borrow 300mm of dental floss from the bathroom cabinet and then rinse with the water from the tap.

It was just an example of what to do when no toothbrush is available.

Nobody goes to the pub with a bag containing a toothbrush, toothpaste, floss, and mouthwash.

I swear you're trolling at times   ::)


;D ;D ;D

You said nothing about getting lucky in your first post about this. But, still... in this altered scenario, are you seriously believing that you need to be flossing your teeth after attending a pub, nightclub, cinema where you have hooked up with a date? How successful will your teeth cleaning be after having a pub meal and drinks. You might well be burping up your meal and drinks a few times after you return to your partner's place?

"Could you excuse me whilst I go to the toilet?"
*toilet flushing 3 minutes earlier and you are in the bathroom washing the blood out of your mouth from a serious flossing session*
"Honey, are you alright? You have been splashing water for a few minutes".

You might as well just "Omnomnomnom" each other without brushing or flossing. And if you are willing to do that, you might as well borrow their toothbrush and toothpaste for a quick once over.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Grappler Truth Teller Feller on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:37pm
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-05-22/australians-using-superannuation-for-dental-treatments/103870794

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Daves2017 on May 22nd, 2024 at 11:18pm
Dentist are all ready buying up farms to subdivide into villa’s on the back this thread alone!

Let the rorts begin!!!


The investigation claims approximately 30% of Medicare's annual $28 billion budget is being wasted by Australia's doctors, based on estimates from lawyer and researcher Dr Margaret Faux which have been supported by former Professional Services Review (PSR) head Dr Tony Webber.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Grappler Truth Teller Feller on May 23rd, 2024 at 12:32am

Daves2017 wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 11:18pm:
Dentist are all ready buying up farms to subdivide into villa’s on the back this thread alone!

Let the rorts begin!!!


The investigation claims approximately 30% of Medicare's annual $28 billion budget is being wasted by Australia's doctors, based on estimates from lawyer and researcher Dr Margaret Faux which have been supported by former Professional Services Review (PSR) head Dr Tony Webber.


Jeez - I hope 30% of my treatments are wasted.... better to be safe than sad, eh?  What would you all do without me?

What a great name - Margaret FAUX ..... sort of like my comment on the winning painting at the art gallery - would look terrific on a railway station wall somewhere on La Rive Gauche ..... such an artist could and should be hung anywhere ....  no wonder they hate me... then there was the intro to the Deputy Lady Mayor and my saying to her that there was no need to apologise in front of everyone (she's actually quite nice)...  I AM a conscientious bastard ....

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 23rd, 2024 at 10:44am

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 6:53pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 6:15pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 4:39pm:

JC Denton wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 2:45pm:
brush ya teef more


And floss & rinse.

If at any time you don't have access to a toothbrush & paste, just floss & rinse - it does wonders!

Since I've been flossing and rinsing with water twice a day, my dentist isn't getting any work from me.



My routine is: 1) floss, 2) rinse with water, 3) brush, 4) rinse with water, and then 5) rinse with mouthwash.   Twice a day.



never use mouthwash

it destroys your micro biome


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTSt3TetjxA


Okay, I looked into this.

He really has nothing to back up his claims.

Multiple Google searches suggest he's just a podcaster out to make money.

"Fake! He takes studies and blow them out of proportion. His academic credentials are often not in line with his topics. It’s like when chiropractors like to play the role of nutritionists. - You get the wrong impression that he is an authority. He is not! - He is cherry-picking studies or partial results from within a study and then hype the heck out of it."

I actually have an appointment with my dentist tomorrow, for a checkup, so I'm gonna ask him about mouthwashes.


Had my checkup yesterday - all good.

Asked my dentist about mouthwash.

His reply: "Don't believe everything you see on the internet".


Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by UnSubRocky on May 23rd, 2024 at 9:20pm

greggerypeccary wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 10:44am:
Had my checkup yesterday - all good.

Asked my dentist about mouthwash.

His reply: "Don't believe everything you see on the internet".


What was the question that got you that answer?

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Daves2017 on May 23rd, 2024 at 10:24pm
I asked my dentist about mouthwash as well and he said don’t waste my money.

Brush properly and rinse properly with tap water is fine.

He explained he sees many people who believe just using mouthwash is a perfectly ok alternative to brushing your teeth.

We need bring back dental care education in schools.
I appreciate dentists will lobby against it as , it ruins their business!

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by UnSubRocky on May 23rd, 2024 at 11:00pm

Daves2017 wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 10:24pm:
We need bring back dental care education in schools.
I appreciate dentists will lobby against it as , it ruins their business!


We had the dentist at schools in primary school. Our teeth still fell out. Educating children on dental hygiene will not stop the need for dentists. They already have a backlog of people on waiting lists for dental treatment.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 24th, 2024 at 10:36am

Daves2017 wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 10:24pm:
We need bring back dental care education in schools.
I appreciate dentists will lobby against it as , it ruins their business!


From my own personal experience, dentists aren't out to create more business for themselves by objecting to education or preventative actions.

There's good and bad in every industry, but I've found dentists to be mainly good.

https://www.dentalfoundation.org.au/programs/my-school-dentist-program/

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by greggerypeccary on May 24th, 2024 at 10:38am

UnSubRocky wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 11:00pm:

Daves2017 wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 10:24pm:
We need bring back dental care education in schools.
I appreciate dentists will lobby against it as , it ruins their business!


We had the dentist at schools in primary school. Our teeth still fell out.


We had maths and English teachers at school, but there are still adults who can't add up or spell.

;)

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by UnSubRocky on May 24th, 2024 at 11:21am

greggerypeccary wrote on May 24th, 2024 at 10:38am:

UnSubRocky wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 11:00pm:

Daves2017 wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 10:24pm:
We need bring back dental care education in schools.
I appreciate dentists will lobby against it as , it ruins their business!


We had the dentist at schools in primary school. Our teeth still fell out.


We had maths and English teachers at school, but there are still adults who can't add up or spell.

;)


So? Our teeth fell out naturally between primary and high school years. They were replaced by our adult teeth that we had to look after. People who are illiterate or innumerate either have some mental condition that impedes their ability to add up and read/spell. Or they just did not try hard enough in their education.

Title: Re: Put Dental Into Medicare And Bulk-Billing
Post by Aquarius on May 24th, 2024 at 11:55am

Black Orchid wrote on May 20th, 2024 at 11:53am:
Over $4000 per year for dental was available through Medicare to those with a chronic disease or pensioners.

The Gillard government killed it in 2011.



I remember this because my younger son's ex fiance worked for Maxillofacial surgeons in Bondi at the time.  She said the gays were coming in to have reconstructive surgery on their faces which actually was more cosmetic and elective than a necessary surgery.  They had to pay more for the surgery of course - but getting $4k from the govt was definitely the incentive to go ahead.   

She was double gloving and triple gloving at times which was definitely frowned on but she was so worried about needlesticks from gay patients who were probably HIV positive being older.   

Maybe due to the $4k being misused in cases like this was the reason it was killed? 


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