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Political Parties >> The Greens >> Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
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Message started by Tony Bradshaw on May 8th, 2011 at 8:16pm

Title: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 8th, 2011 at 8:16pm
BY CHRIS JOHNSON, CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT
07 May, 2011 12:00 AM

Greens leader Bob Brown is behind a push to completely nationalise his party and pull state divisions into line so that they more fully recognise the national leadership.

The Australian Greens are currently a confederation of parties, with all states branches aligning to the national constitution but also having their own constitutions and autonomy.

Senator Brown and a significant portion of the Greens' membership across Australia want both the national and state constitutions changed to give more authority to head office.

The nationalisation issue has simmered inside the Greens for a decade but intensified following recent embarrassing episodes where the NSW and Victorian branches defied Senator Brown's advice. He rebuked the NSW Greens for promoting a highly publicised campaign to boycott Israeli goods.

The campaign led to the Marrickville Council passing a motion in support of the boycott last month before being forced to back down.

Senator Brown was also annoyed at how the Victorian Greens handled the state election in November.

During a closed-door meeting in Canberra last month, staged by party think-tank the Green Institute, Senator Brown spoke in favour of moving from a federal structure to a completely national party.

One attendee said Senator Brown spoke ''passionately and positively'' about the need to make the transition and that he was warmly applauded by the hundred-strong audience.

''Bob said there were problems still arising in the state branches and that they needed more support around election times ... no one spoke against it,'' the source said.

The meeting, at the Australian National University on April 16, was a day-long gathering of party members to discuss where they wanted the Greens to be in five years' time. The feeling was that the party had to appear to be more united and professional.

Other party sources say Senator Brown spoke diplomatically but was privately outraged at how the branches were embarrassing the Greens brand. ''Bob has spent years positioning the party as a serious and moderate player, but NSW has always been a problem ... It has always been the block to reform and change,'' one source said.

Another party source said mismanagement of the Israel boycott issue had spooked some inside the Greens because it made the party look like a bunch of radicals who were happy to fight with each other.

Senator-elect Lee Rhiannon, who dominates the NSW Greens, had repeatedly spoken in favour of the boycott.

''Bob is genuinely concerned about Lee Rhiannon going into the Senate,'' the source said.

''He doesn't want to see everything he's worked for collapse and he knows there is one or two of his federal team that could be vulnerable to be people like Lee.''

The reform to nationalise the Greens structure could take a year or more to succeed. The NSW and the West Australian branches are expected to be the most resistant.

Western Australia was the last branch to join the confederation, while the NSW branch resisted giving head office its membership database for many years.

Neither Senator Brown nor Ms Rhiannon could be contacted for comment yesterday.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 8th, 2011 at 8:25pm
Good Luck Bob, only a matter of time before Lee O'Gorman oops i meant Rhiannon challenges for the leadership.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by dsmithy70 on May 8th, 2011 at 8:29pm
Frankly I think anyone who wishes to see a 3rd alternative available is concerned with the damage Ms Rhiannon can and probably will cause.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 8th, 2011 at 8:36pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on May 8th, 2011 at 8:29pm:
Frankly I think anyone who wishes to see a 3rd alternative available is concerned with the damage Ms Rhiannon can and probably will cause.


Agreed. Even Greens_Win must have his reservations about Ms Rhiannon.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Prevailing on May 9th, 2011 at 6:01am
Frankly I see every stand against fascism as a positive and I hope Bob Brown does not get his way nationalizing the Greens and pulling Senator Lee Rhiannon into line - people have to start speaking their own mind for fascism to fall and every example of this is a positive.  Break the mold, hop out of line, stop saying yes, me too, stand up for what you genuinely believe, fight injustice and tyranny, let the bells of freedom and peace ring out. 8-)

Peter, Paul & Mary - If I Had A Hammer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUKB3PxG-0E&feature=related 8-)

The fascism must stop - I speak it into existence!

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Greens_Win on May 9th, 2011 at 7:07am

Tony Bradshaw wrote on May 8th, 2011 at 8:36pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on May 8th, 2011 at 8:29pm:
Frankly I think anyone who wishes to see a 3rd alternative available is concerned with the damage Ms Rhiannon can and probably will cause.


Agreed. Even Greens_Win must have his reservations about Ms Rhiannon.



Neutral at the moment ... to give Lee a fair go, lets see if she will be as much of a handful as some are predicting.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Sprintcyclist on May 9th, 2011 at 8:36am

the greens are
Quote:
.............a bunch of radicals who were happy to fight with each other..............


totally impractical, undiscliplined, thoughtless and irresponsible.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Greens_Win on May 9th, 2011 at 8:38am

Sprintcyclist wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 8:36am:
the greens are
Quote:
.............a bunch of radicals who were happy to fight with each other..............


totally impractical, undiscliplined, thoughtless and irresponsible.



If this was true, which we all know it isn't, then it would show how bad the other parties are considering Greens have growing in support across the country.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by cods on May 9th, 2011 at 9:52am

____ wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 8:38am:

Sprintcyclist wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 8:36am:
the greens are
Quote:
.............a bunch of radicals who were happy to fight with each other..............


totally impractical, undiscliplined, thoughtless and irresponsible.



If this was true, which we all know it isn't, then it would show how bad the other parties are considering Greens have growing in support across the country.



well I think most are waiting for booby to step down.. then we will see how stable the party is.. you know as well as I do that you have a lot of dissatisfied Labor and Liberal voters voting for you at the moment.

personally I dont think most are voting for your policies.. more out of frustration..

sooner or later that will settle down.. your party is the one that has disturbed things with it PANIC policies..the world is ending..the world is ending..

and all of a sudden people are waking up and saying... "No it isnt"

Al Gore lied to us..now we are seeing your true colours hate for Israel is just the begining..

I am looking forward to July to be honest.. its going to be ineteresting to see which way the greens will lead this govt..very interesting..

of course if the people are happy they will increase your vote..wont they?

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 9th, 2011 at 12:38pm
Dark past 'to haunt Rhiannon'
   * Lanai Vasek
   * From: The Australian
   * May 06, 2011 12:00AM

A CHILDHOOD friend of Lee Rhiannon says the controversial Greens senator-elect is incapable of admitting mistakes and won't hold a senior leadership role in the party due to increasing tensions between her and Bob Brown.

Former communist Mark Aarons has launched a scathing attack on Ms Rhiannon in The Monthly magazine, saying the former NSW Greens leader had "virtually no support" within the federal Greens team -- which she will join when the Senate changes over on July 1.

Aarons said he and Ms Rhiannon "cut our political teeth together in anti-Vietnam War and anti-racist campaigns".

He said the 59-year-old's dark past promoting Soviet policies would come back to bite her.

"In failing to deal with her history honestly, Rhiannon places a question mark over her suitability for any leadership role, especially in a party supposedly built on integrity," Aarons said.

Aarons said Ms Rhiannon's push for a boycott of Israel was also a mistake and "offensive".

"The policy is so extreme that even those who, like me, are critical of some of Israel's policies (the West Bank occupation and continuing construction of settlements, for example) found it offensive," he writes.

"To compare Israel's actions with apartheid is shallow and inaccurate."

Ms Rhiannon is the daughter of women's rights activist Freda Yetta Brown and Bill Brown, who were both Communist Party of Australia members.

She has insisted her parents joined the CPA because of their deep commitment to social justice and equal rights, not for any subversive reason, and has denied the family was pro-Soviet.

"I am not a communist," Ms Rhiannon told The Weekend Australian in August.

Ms Rhiannon did not answer The Australian's request for comment yesterday, nor has she done so for several weeks.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Equitist on May 9th, 2011 at 12:46pm



Tony Bradshaw wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 12:38pm:
Dark past 'to haunt Rhiannon'
   * Lanai Vasek
   * From: The Australian
   * May 06, 2011 12:00AM

A CHILDHOOD friend of Lee Rhiannon says the controversial Greens senator-elect is incapable of admitting mistakes and won't hold a senior leadership role in the party due to increasing tensions between her and Bob Brown.

Former communist Mark Aarons has launched a scathing attack on Ms Rhiannon in The Monthly magazine, saying the former NSW Greens leader had "virtually no support" within the federal Greens team -- which she will join when the Senate changes over on July 1.

Aarons said he and Ms Rhiannon "cut our political teeth together in anti-Vietnam War and anti-racist campaigns".

He said the 59-year-old's dark past promoting Soviet policies would come back to bite her.

"In failing to deal with her history honestly, Rhiannon places a question mark over her suitability for any leadership role, especially in a party supposedly built on integrity," Aarons said.

Aarons said Ms Rhiannon's push for a boycott of Israel was also a mistake and "offensive".

"The policy is so extreme that even those who, like me, are critical of some of Israel's policies (the West Bank occupation and continuing construction of settlements, for example) found it offensive," he writes.

"To compare Israel's actions with apartheid is shallow and inaccurate."

Ms Rhiannon is the daughter of women's rights activist Freda Yetta Brown and Bill Brown, who were both Communist Party of Australia members.

She has insisted her parents joined the CPA because of their deep commitment to social justice and equal rights, not for any subversive reason, and has denied the family was pro-Soviet.

"I am not a communist," Ms Rhiannon told The Weekend Australian in August.

Ms Rhiannon did not answer The Australian's request for comment yesterday, nor has she done so for several weeks.



This is just another right wing media beat-up - using a vindictive former associate...

FFS, Peter Costello was a member of a Socialist movement during his university days - and he was entrusted with the role of National Treasurer by the Libs...

Many even wanted him to take over as PM from Howard...


Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by dsmithy70 on May 9th, 2011 at 12:52pm

Equitist wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 12:46pm:

Tony Bradshaw wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 12:38pm:
Dark past 'to haunt Rhiannon'
   * Lanai Vasek
   * From: The Australian
   * May 06, 2011 12:00AM

A CHILDHOOD friend of Lee Rhiannon says the controversial Greens senator-elect is incapable of admitting mistakes and won't hold a senior leadership role in the party due to increasing tensions between her and Bob Brown.

Former communist Mark Aarons has launched a scathing attack on Ms Rhiannon in The Monthly magazine, saying the former NSW Greens leader had "virtually no support" within the federal Greens team -- which she will join when the Senate changes over on July 1.

Aarons said he and Ms Rhiannon "cut our political teeth together in anti-Vietnam War and anti-racist campaigns".

He said the 59-year-old's dark past promoting Soviet policies would come back to bite her.

"In failing to deal with her history honestly, Rhiannon places a question mark over her suitability for any leadership role, especially in a party supposedly built on integrity," Aarons said.

Aarons said Ms Rhiannon's push for a boycott of Israel was also a mistake and "offensive".

"The policy is so extreme that even those who, like me, are critical of some of Israel's policies (the West Bank occupation and continuing construction of settlements, for example) found it offensive," he writes.

"To compare Israel's actions with apartheid is shallow and inaccurate."

Ms Rhiannon is the daughter of women's rights activist Freda Yetta Brown and Bill Brown, who were both Communist Party of Australia members.

She has insisted her parents joined the CPA because of their deep commitment to social justice and equal rights, not for any subversive reason, and has denied the family was pro-Soviet.

"I am not a communist," Ms Rhiannon told The Weekend Australian in August.

Ms Rhiannon did not answer The Australian's request for comment yesterday, nor has she done so for several weeks.



This is just another right wing media beat-up - using a vindictive former associate...

FFS, Peter Costello was a member of a Socialist movement during his university days - and he was entrusted with the role of National Treasurer by the Libs...

Many even wanted him to take over as PM from Howard...


If that's so she should come out & comment/refute these accusations.
Instead she seems to hide, now she might not think these articles are worth a response but that just gives her knockers a free kick.
She's a federal senator now not some minor player in the NSW leg council.
LOL cant wait to check the letterbox & read that article.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by remember_when64 on May 9th, 2011 at 12:54pm

Equitist wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 12:46pm:
FFS, Peter Costello was a member of a Socialist movement during his university days ...


As are a lot of students, but most people grow out of it when they enter the real world :D

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Prevailing on May 9th, 2011 at 1:11pm
Its sad how the fascists ask a person to justify her parents political associations but wont answer simple questions themselves about extra judicial assassinations they have cheered and agreed with as just and right, illegal invasions, killing of civilians, threats and persecutions of the working class, the disabled, the pensioners and unemployed ect.  Dont expect them too either, no fascist thinks for themselves or accepts personal liability, thats why they form corporations - so they can have associations of sociopaths and blood suckers. 8-)

8-)

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 9th, 2011 at 1:44pm
From 1 July the Senate will have a genuine centre-left majority for the first time in 60 years. The 1951 double dissolution election stripped Labor of its Senate majority; it has never again held or shared a majority with an avowedly left-wing party. This will change when nine Australian Greens senators (four newly elected) assume the balance of power, including Lee Rhiannon, who was recently embroiled in a public dispute with her leader, Bob Brown, over the NSW Greens’ Middle East policy.

Despite the new reality in the Senate, there are ominous signs for centre-left politics. The bitter invective recently directed at the Greens indicates Labor is rattled. Julia Gillard is desperate to shore up her flagging support among Labor’s traditional working– and lower middle–class base, and simultaneously win back left-wing voters who defected to the Greens because of Labor’s cowardice over climate change policy.

More alarming for both parties is the collapse of their combined vote. Two years ago there was talk of an emerging, long-term centre-left political ascendancy. Polling indicated a Labor–Greens primary vote of between 52% and 56%. At the August 2010 election, they did not reach 50%; recent polls place their vote 10% below the 2009 high.

Labor led this collapse. Kevin Rudd’s abandonment of his climate change platform frittered away his commanding lead in the polls. Gillard rendered this situation worse: by adopting a fake climate change policy during last year’s election campaign; then by ruling out a carbon tax; and, finally, by breaking this promise. No compelling explanation or policy detail has been proffered for these changes.

Newspoll tracked the unfolding disaster: Labor has lost up to 15% of its primary vote since 2009. The Greens have gained between 3% and 6%, but most of the support Labor has lost has bled to the Coalition, which is well positioned to win the 2013 election. Tony Abbott has promised to dismantle any carbon tax introduced by Labor with Greens’ support. So the battlelines are drawn on the environmental issue that defines the Greens. How they handle this will be a test of the party’s maturity.

The Greens’ two most recent electoral tests were in Victoria and NSW but, despite great expectations, its performance was disappointing. Before last November’s Victorian election, Newspoll had the Greens on 19%; it looked set to take several inner-city lower house seats. But its support collapsed to 11% on polling day; Labor withstood its challenge, but narrowly lost government. Similarly, in NSW’s recent election the Greens fell from 17% to just over 10%. It scraped home (with Labor preferences) to take Balmain, its first lower house seat, and also won three upper house seats, narrowly defeating Pauline Hanson on Labor preferences, having refused to reciprocate.

The Greens seek to attract support with their professed commitment to a “new politics”, repudiating the dirty tactics used by the old parties. Their rhetoric condemns Labor’s spin, character assassination and underhand tactics. During the recent election, however, the NSW Greens were strongly criticised for supporting the international Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions (BDS) campaign, which notoriously compares Israel with apartheid-era South Africa. Launched in 2005 by ‘Palestinian civil society’ groups, the BDS has attempted to mask its real aim, which – in the words of one BDS founder – is to establish “a Palestine next to a Palestine, rather than a Palestine next to an Israel”. That is, Israel would disappear in a ‘one-state’ solution.

The NSW Greens adopted the BDS campaign last December; the leadership immediately prevailed on Marrickville Council to embrace it. The mayor, Fiona Byrne, was the Greens’ candidate for the state seat of Marrickville and was expected to defeat Labor’s left-wing deputy premier, Carmel Tebbutt. Labor’s state-wide vote collapsed but Byrne failed to unseat Tebbutt, despite a Galaxy poll predicting a comfortable win. The BDS policy contributed to this result.

The NSW Greens leaders behaved just like the old parties. Byrne erred in denying that she had undertaken to bring BDS into the NSW parliament if she won Marrickville. She was damaged when the recording of her statement was produced; she exacerbated this error by denying she had agreed to speak at a BDS rally, only to have a flyer produced flatly contradicting her. The Greens dismissed these blunders, claiming they were a Labor “dirty tricks campaign”. This might have worked in the past, when there was little scrutiny of Greens’ policies. But the words of both the party’s policy and Marrickville Council’s resolution expose a determination to impose BDS as state (and federal) government policy.

The policy is so extreme that even those, who, like me, are critical of some of Israel’s policies (the West Bank occupation and continuing construction of settlements, for example) found it offensive. To compare Israel’s actions with apartheid is shallow and inaccurate: in one case, a white minority refused voting, civil and legal rights to the black majority; in the other, voting, civil and legal rights are universal. Israel is a fully functioning democracy where governments change after elections; an independent judiciary and media hold the government to account; and minorities (including Palestinians) are represented in parliament (under the Greens’ preferred system of proportional representation).

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 9th, 2011 at 1:44pm
Furthermore, the NSW Greens’ policy is silent about decades of Palestinian terrorism and aggression by Arab dictatorships.

Responsibility for the BDS catastrophe rests with the NSW Greens’ leadership, especially retiring upper house member Sylvia Hale (who initiated it) and senator-elect Lee Rhiannon. In the wake of the party’s poor showing in the March election, Bob Brown took the unprecedented step of publicly reprimanding Rhiannon. This underlines long-standing, bitter factional differences in the Greens.

In making his criticism, Brown reiterated the Greens’ national policy on Israel–Palestine. In contrast to BDS, this supports both a Palestinian and a Jewish state; it also rejects violence as a means of resolving the conflict (whether by a state or other groups), and advocates “negotiations to achieve the democratic aspirations of both peoples within an environment of mutual respect and equality”. In March 2010, NSW unsuccessfully attempted to impose BDS as national policy.

This issue is, however, only one instance of conflict between NSW and the national leadership. Over the past decade there have been several significant disputes: in NSW, these centred on struggles between supporters of retiring upper house member Ian Cohen and Rhiannon’s faction. This has been presented as a battle between Cohen’s environmental focus and Rhiannon’s social and political activism, but that is an over-simplification.

There have been several bitter pre-selection contests, especially for upper house seats, in which Rhiannon has demonstrated astute organisational skills. While she has not had unfettered victories in internal skirmishes, she has emerged as the best-known NSW Greens leader.

Individual disputes are indications of deeper problems. For some years, Brown and his supporters have worked to create a coherent national party; as the Greens’ membership and support base have grown, this has become a high priority. But Rhiannon and her largely NSW-based faction have resisted, skilfully exploiting the party’s founding ethos that control should be exercised by the grassroots, and using its ‘consensus decision-making’ process to stymie a national approach.

Rhiannon’s switch to Canberra has led to speculation of a confrontation with Brown. Ironically for a party that is built around an overwhelmingly youthful base, she will turn 60 this year while Brown will be 67. But she has virtually no support among the other Greens members of federal parliament, so a short-term challenge would be doomed. It would, however, be unwise to underestimate Rhiannon; she is a tough and seasoned campaigner who would shine as potential leadership material in any party. She has a significant weakness, though, in refusing to admit mistakes, even when it would be politically wise to do so. This was demonstrated in the aftermath of Byrne’s defeat in Marrickville. Most politically literate observers, including Brown, rightly concluded that the mishandling of BDS contributed significantly. Rhiannon stubbornly refused to concede, claiming that the policy should have been better promoted. This typifies her approach. Marrickville Council’s attempt to introduce BDS has since collapsed, amidst widespread criticism and internecine warfare inside the NSW Greens.

*

Born in May 1951, Rhiannon’s parents were Bill and Freda Brown, leading members of the Communist Party of Australia (CPA). Lee Brown (she later changed her name to Rhiannon) and I grew up together as young communists and cut our political teeth in anti–Vietnam War and anti-racist campaigns. The August 1968 Soviet invasion of Czechoslovakia precipitated a bitter struggle inside the CPA. The majority condemned Moscow but a vocal minority supported the invasion. Recently, Rhiannon has sparred with Gerard Henderson about her parents’ role in the pro-Soviet faction; her defence has largely obscured the truth.

Soon after the invasion, Lee’s parents formed a clandestine relationship with the Soviet embassy, which directed and financed those who opposed the CPA’s principled stand on Czechoslovakia. By late 1971, it was clear they could not seize back control of the CPA. So the dissidents formed a new, pro-Soviet communist party, the Socialist Party of Australia (SPA), which uncritically supported and promoted Soviet policies.

Lee joined the SPA, attending its founding congress. She became a senior office-bearer of the youth wing, serving on the central committee’s youth subcommittee; attended Australia–Soviet Friendship Society meetings; and developed close relations with Soviet, Czechoslovak and East German communist youth groups. In 1977, Rhiannon led an SPA delegation to Moscow at the invitation of Leonid Brezhnev’s neo-Stalinist regime. Persecution of Soviet dissidents was widespread in 1977, with psychiatry routinely used as an instrument of torture. Repression of Jews and the wider population was also endemic under the most pervasive secret police regime in history. All of this became even clearer after communism’s collapse but was apparent well before 1977.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 9th, 2011 at 1:45pm
This would be simply history if Rhiannon had admitted her youthful errors and moved on. But, in a lengthy blog posted last August, she defended her parents’ and her own political records, noting that like “so many of their generation who joined the Communist Party my Mum and Dad worked hard for a more just and peaceful society”. This is partly true but many communists also faced up to the awful reality of Soviet mass crimes and publicly condemned them. Rhiannon’s explanation of her mother’s silence on such matters was to refer to an SBS documentary, in which “my mother talked about the internal problems that she saw in the socialist world, but commented that previously she had not gone public with those criticisms. In the context of the cold war she was unwilling to add her voice to the criticism of the socialist world.”

Rhiannon also remained silent, but now lauds “my youthful past, of which I am proud”. There are things of which she can be proud, including opposing the immoral Vietnam War and apartheid (the real version). But nowhere does she acknowledge how dreadfully wrong she was about the Soviet Union, nor express regrets for her gullible admiration of this abominable system. In failing to deal with her history honestly, Rhiannon places a question mark over her suitability for any leadership role, especially in a party supposedly built on integrity.

*

Rhiannon’s comments at left-wing conferences are also revealing. At an October 2000 seminar commemorating the CPA’s founding, she reportedly “argued that a broad-based left movement is being built already, and argued that the Greens is closest to the best of the CPA’s politics and methods”. In May 2010, she addressed the Left Renewal Conference, lamenting her job in keeping the Greens on a left-wing trajectory:



… the challenge to keep the Greens Left is huge and I’m convinced social movements are the key to that. This is the way to keep the pressure on left parliamentarians so that they work to advance the social objectives of our movement not just their party’s political interests.



What Rhiannon means by “Left” is her own brand of fundamentalism; by definition, others who have different left politics are wrong and have to be opposed in order to impose her own version. This is overlooked by right-wing commentators and political leaders – Coalition and Labor alike – who dismiss the Greens holus-bolus as unrepresentative ‘extremists’: there are, in fact, several tendencies within the Greens, most of which are not extreme or fundamentalist.

The debate about BDS illustrates this; for example, after the disappointing NSW election result, party elder Drew Hutton and emerging leader, NSW upper house member Cate Faehrmann, took the Rhiannon forces to task. Such people identify themselves as ‘progressives’ and on the Left. But they want the Greens to be a serious force with the capacity to grow its support base by demonstrating good policies that can be implemented in government. They reject fundamentalism because it does not connect with Australians and has prevented the Greens from making further electoral gains.

There are also problems beyond ideology, especially tension between policy formulation and practical politics. The Greens routinely adhere rigidly to their policies, even when political realities indicate that short-term compromise might be more effective in achieving longer-term objectives. This is frequently expressed in ‘holier-than-thou’ terms that are not suited to the realities of coalition with Labor, which remains the only route to government (state or federal) for the foreseeable future.

An example was the Greens’ decision to vote against Rudd’s emissions trading scheme in late 2009, because – among other reasons – of the risible greenhouse gas reduction target of 5% and the generous compensation offered to ‘big polluters’. Such deficiencies were real but in 2009 public debate had drifted away from a solid majority favouring action towards climate change scepticism.

Abbott’s defeat of Malcolm Turnbull was a stark warning. With bipartisanship swept aside, major reform became extremely difficult. At this point, the Greens should have voted for a scheme they believed was inadequate, while reserving their right to improve it. This would have allowed Labor and the Greens to fight the 2010 election from a position of strength: united around action against the greatest moral and economic threat of our age, with the Greens free to criticise the scheme’s shortcomings and propose major improvements through legislative amendments.

As things now stand, Australia has nothing on the books; the centre Left presently seems becalmed on polling figures that would win government for Abbott and the deniers in an election fought on a carbon tax passed by a Labor–Greens dominated Senate. The Greens blame Labor, citing Rudd’s spineless capitulation and Gillard’s gutless election policy; Labor blames the Greens for being extremists who will not compromise.

The Greens face a well-worn dilemma: how does an emerging minor party promote its key principles, and simultaneously practise ‘the art of the possible’? Even without a fundamentalist faction, the Greens would have to face this dilemma and deal with it on a case-by-case policy basis. The carbon tax debate will test whether they can balance principle and pragmatism.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 9th, 2011 at 1:45pm
But while the centre Left is in disarray, Abbott can sit back and oppose everything Labor (and the Greens) support. This is Abbott’s tactic: simply to oppose the government out of office. In this situation, Labor should deal sensibly with the current Greens’ leadership, who should accommodate themselves to the prospect of long-term coalition with Labor. The alternative is another long period of conservative government, both state and federal.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Prevailing on May 9th, 2011 at 1:55pm
Dont forget all of the problems in the Middle East stem from more then a century of ongoing British and American colonial fascism of the Middle East.  The Palestinians are the victims in all of this - illegally dispossessed by Americans and Europeans. 8-)

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Prevailing on May 9th, 2011 at 2:07pm
The century of Western Fascism in the Middle East is prolly the worst atrocities committed in human history - how many illegal invasions?  How many massacres?  How many dead?  How many dispossessed from their homelands?

War on Terror anyone?

The Fascists created Osama Bin Laden and created 9/11 and the war on Terror - nobody else is responsible but them.

And they are still not satisfied they have a master plan drawn up in the "Project For A New American Century" for ongoing wars, ethnic cleansings and regime change in the middle east. 8-)

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 9th, 2011 at 2:13pm

Prevailing wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 2:07pm:
The century of Western Fascism in the Middle East is prolly the worst atrocities committed in human history - how many illegal invasions?  How many massacres?  How many dead?  How many dispossessed from their homelands?

War on Terror anyone?

The Fascists created Osama Bin Laden and created 9/11 and the war on Terror - nobody else is responsible but them.

And they are still not satisfied they have a master plan drawn up in the "Project For A New American Century" for ongoing wars, ethnic cleansings and regime change in the middle east. 8-)


Care to elaborate Prevailing? Explain how "The Fascists created Osama Bin Laden and created 9/11"

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by dsmithy70 on May 9th, 2011 at 2:16pm

Tony Bradshaw wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 2:13pm:

Prevailing wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 2:07pm:
The century of Western Fascism in the Middle East is prolly the worst atrocities committed in human history - how many illegal invasions?  How many massacres?  How many dead?  How many dispossessed from their homelands?

War on Terror anyone?

The Fascists created Osama Bin Laden and created 9/11 and the war on Terror - nobody else is responsible but them.

And they are still not satisfied they have a master plan drawn up in the "Project For A New American Century" for ongoing wars, ethnic cleansings and regime change in the middle east. 8-)


Care to elaborate Prevailing? Explain how "The Fascists created Osama Bin Laden and created 9/11"


OMG NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tony go & delete that post before he reads it & never again encourage him.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Prevailing on May 9th, 2011 at 2:35pm

Tony Bradshaw wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 2:13pm:

Prevailing wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 2:07pm:
The century of Western Fascism in the Middle East is prolly the worst atrocities committed in human history - how many illegal invasions?  How many massacres?  How many dead?  How many dispossessed from their homelands?

War on Terror anyone?

The Fascists created Osama Bin Laden and created 9/11 and the war on Terror - nobody else is responsible but them.

And they are still not satisfied they have a master plan drawn up in the "Project For A New American Century" for ongoing wars, ethnic cleansings and regime change in the middle east. 8-)


Care to elaborate Prevailing? Explain how "The Fascists created Osama Bin Laden and created 9/11"

Sure Osama Bin Laden was an employee of the Fascists in their operations in Afghanistan against the Soviet Union, is there any more proof you require?  The fascists hands are so filthy in the Middle East and 9/11 which has become a crutch to justify every atrocity they do its amazing.  Western fascists have waged an ongoing colonial imperial war in the middle east for 150 years for,  they have butchered over 200 million people. :(

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 9th, 2011 at 3:43pm

Prevailing wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 2:35pm:

Tony Bradshaw wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 2:13pm:

Prevailing wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 2:07pm:
The century of Western Fascism in the Middle East is prolly the worst atrocities committed in human history - how many illegal invasions?  How many massacres?  How many dead?  How many dispossessed from their homelands?

War on Terror anyone?

The Fascists created Osama Bin Laden and created 9/11 and the war on Terror - nobody else is responsible but them.

And they are still not satisfied they have a master plan drawn up in the "Project For A New American Century" for ongoing wars, ethnic cleansings and regime change in the middle east. 8-)


Care to elaborate Prevailing? Explain how "The Fascists created Osama Bin Laden and created 9/11"

Sure Osama Bin Laden was an employee of the Fascists in their operations in Afghanistan against the Soviet Union, is there any more proof you require?  The fascists hands are so filthy in the Middle East and 9/11 which has become a crutch to justify every atrocity they do its amazing.  Western fascists have waged an ongoing colonial imperial war in the middle east for 150 years for,  they have butchered over 200 million people. :(


Yes because you have produced no proof whatsoever. Saying "Osama Bin Laden was an employee of the Fascists in their operations in Afghanistan against the Soviet Union" does not represent proof.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by longweekend58 on May 9th, 2011 at 3:47pm
too late... the idiot read it.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by remember_when64 on May 9th, 2011 at 3:48pm
lol

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Tony Bradshaw on May 9th, 2011 at 3:56pm

longweekend58 wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 3:47pm:
too late... the idiot read it.


The Unemployed, Lazy Un-Prevailing idiot is the only Fascist on this forum.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by longweekend58 on May 9th, 2011 at 4:23pm

Tony Bradshaw wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 3:56pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 3:47pm:
too late... the idiot read it.


The Unemployed, Lazy Un-Prevailing idiot is the only Fascist on this forum.


actually he is just insane and has repeated enforced stays in mental hospitals to prove the fact.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Prevailing on May 9th, 2011 at 4:54pm
Reported for internet stalking and unprovoked personal abuse.... 8-)

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by longweekend58 on May 9th, 2011 at 4:58pm

Prevailing wrote on May 9th, 2011 at 4:54pm:
Reported for internet stalking and unprovoked personal abuse.... 8-)


you're pathetic. maybe people would mock you less if you actually posted on topic for a change.

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Prevailing on May 9th, 2011 at 5:05pm
Western Fascist Pigs are guilty of untold atrocities in the middle east including the deliberate starvation deaths of over 500,000 Iraqi children.  They illegally fly unmanned predator drones over the airspace of middle eastern nations slaughtering men, women and children from the air.  The Western fascists war of aggression has been ongoing and without relent for over a century as they have battled to conquer and rule the peoples of this region and steal their resources.  Over 200 million souls have been butchered by the Western fascists in the middle east alone and I have not even touched on their ongoing crimes in Africa and the Orient. 8-)

The fascists among us bring death upon us and terror to our doorsteps. 8-)

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Prevailing on May 9th, 2011 at 5:29pm
Western Fascist Psychopath Madeleine Albright says The deaths of 500,000 Iraqi children was worth it !!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RM0uvgHKZe8 8-)

The Fascists need to answer to these crimes against humanity... 8-)

Title: Re: Bob Brown bid to bring Greens into line
Post by Prevailing on May 9th, 2011 at 5:50pm
The Fascists are guilty of 9/11 - they are guilty of everything. 8-)

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