Australian Politics Forum - Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler

MeisterEckhart

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 10454
Gender: male

Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Sep 28^th, 2022 at 1:47pm

Which comes first - The chicken or the Time Traveller?

The night before a man is to step into a time machine, to travel back in time by 1 month, he eats a roast chicken.

The next day, he travels back in time by one month.

If the chicken he ate the night before is still alive when he gets to the past, do the chicken's atoms and molecules evaporate from his system, or does the chicken spontaneously disappear?

Back to top

IP Logged

FutureTheLeftWant

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 6625
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #1 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 1:53pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 1:47pm:

Which comes first - The chicken or the Time Traveller?

The night before a man is to step into a time machine, to travel back in time by 1 month, he eats a roast chicken.

The next day, he travels back in time by one month.

If the chicken he ate the night before is still alive when he gets to the past, do the chicken's atoms and molecules evaporate from his system, or does the chicken spontaneously disappear?

By your logic the traveller should get younger and can only travel back to the time of his birth

Back to top

IP Logged

MeisterEckhart

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 10454
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #2 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 1:57pm

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 1:53pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 1:47pm:

Which comes first - The chicken or the Time Traveller?

The night before a man is to step into a time machine, to travel back in time by 1 month, he eats a roast chicken.

The next day, he travels back in time by one month.

If the chicken he ate the night before is still alive when he gets to the past, do the chicken's atoms and molecules evaporate from his system, or does the chicken spontaneously disappear?

By your logic the traveller should get younger and can only travel back to the time of his birth

Would there by two of them alive simultaneously if one returned from the future?

Back to top

IP Logged

Grappler Truth Teller Feller Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 80190 Proud pre-1850's NO Voter Gender:	Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler Reply #3 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 7:00pm
Back to top	“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” ― John Adams IP Logged

chimera Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 8561 armidale Gender:	Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler Reply #4 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 7:22pm He takes the whole chicken inside him and rushes to the chemist for indigestion pills/ vomits on the time machine. After a month as himself again he orders a roast chicken, gobbles in 7 bites and presses the time button. This will happen forever and is pure hell, believe me.
Back to top	IP Logged

Grappler Truth Teller Feller

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 80190
Proud pre-1850's NO Voter
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #5 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 9:48pm

Seems to me that the time traveler has already incorporated all the atoms of the chicken, and thus it would make no difference since the chicken (temporary visa) and the TT are two separate beings...

Nick: Here's a thought. Why don't we get an egg and start our own chicken farm? That way we'd have all the eggs we could eat.

Fetcher: Right. We'll need a chicken, then.

Nick: No, no, we need an egg. You have the egg first, that's where you get the chicken from.

Fetcher: No, that's cobblers. If you don't have a chicken, how are you going to get the egg?

Nick: From the chicken that comes from the egg.

Fetcher: Yeah, but you have to have an egg to have a chicken.

Nick: Yeah, but you've got to get the chicken first to get the egg, and then you get the egg to get the chicken out of...

Fetcher: Hang on. Let's go over this again?

Back to top

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

IP Logged

MeisterEckhart

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 10454
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #6 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 9:59pm

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 9:48pm:

Seems to me that the time traveler has already incorporated all the atoms of the chicken, and thus it would make no difference since the chicken (temporary visa) and the TT are two separate beings...

Under our current understanding of energy - it cannot be created or destroyed - and energy once collapsed into particles, cannot be in superposition, or in two places at the same time, how can the chicken's atoms and molecules exist in the chicken and the time traveller at the same time?

Back to top

IP Logged

Carl D

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 8397
Rivervale, Perth
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #7 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 10:02pm

I'm more inclined to wonder if the time traveller would be able to meet himself after travelling back in time a month?

Then there would be two time travellers (actually, one would be a future time traveller, of course).

One with the chicken inside and one without.

Whether the two of them coming face to face would result in the immediate annihilation of the entire known universe is another matter.

Doc Brown was concerned about that very possibility in Back To The Future Part II but when Jennifer came face to face with her future self all that happened was they both passed out, fortunately for the universe.

Back to top

"Masks are sand in the gears of the economy" - some f-wit pollie or big business CEO.

IP Logged

Grappler Truth Teller Feller

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 80190
Proud pre-1850's NO Voter
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #8 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 10:09pm

Carl D wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 10:02pm:

I'm more inclined to wonder if the time traveller would be able to meet himself after travelling back in time a month?

Then there would be two time travellers (actually, one would be a future time traveller, of course).

One with the chicken inside and one without.

Whether the two of them coming face to face would result in the immediate annihilation of the entire known universe is another matter.

Doc Brown was concerned about that very possibility in Back To The Future Part II but when Jennifer came face to face with her future self all that happened was they both passed out, fortunately for the universe.

You've been reading my writings....

Back to top

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

IP Logged

MeisterEckhart

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 10454
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #9 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 10:09pm

Carl D wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 10:02pm:

I'm more inclined to wonder if the time traveller would be able to meet himself after travelling back in time a month?
.

Yes. Even the concept of multiverses would require a universe in which the time traveller never existed; but then, his molecular energy is effectively then created energy in the alternative universe where he never existed, which currently is verboten.

Back to top

IP Logged

Grappler Truth Teller Feller

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 80190
Proud pre-1850's NO Voter
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #10 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 10:13pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 9:59pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 9:48pm:

Seems to me that the time traveler has already incorporated all the atoms of the chicken, and thus it would make no difference since the chicken (temporary visa) and the TT are two separate beings...

Under our current understanding of energy - it cannot be created or destroyed - and energy once collapsed into particles, cannot be in superposition, or in two places at the same time, how can the chicken's atoms and molecules exist in the chicken and the time traveller at the same time?

Good point.

"arriving at his time destination, Montebank felt strangely disassociated and then vomited.... slowly the effluvium coalesced into a real live chicken.... Montebank was suddenly hungry - as if he hadn't eaten for a week....."

"So, 'ang on - now we've got two chickens?"

"Nah, only one chicken and we get the egg, see?"

Back to top

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

IP Logged

Carl D

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 8397
Rivervale, Perth
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #11 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 10:19pm

One could go crazy trying to work this stuff out.

If it were possible to build a time machine it may not be possible to go back in time beyond the point of the machine's initial activation.

I liked the theory behind the 2002 remake of The Time Machine.

The creator of the machine, Alexander Hartdegen (Guy Pearce) could travel back in time but could not prevent the event (the death of his fiancee, Emma) which was responsible for him building the machine in the first place.

But, with Alexander's brilliant mind I never understood why he didn't work out why he couldn't save her (I think he said he tried 27 times and if he saved her from a "previous" death she would then die a different way) and the Uber Morlock (Jeremy Irons) from 800,000 years in the future had to explain it to him.

Back to top

« Last Edit: Sep 28^th, 2022 at 10:24pm by Carl D »

"Masks are sand in the gears of the economy" - some f-wit pollie or big business CEO.

IP Logged

Carl D

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 8397
Rivervale, Perth
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #12 - Sep 28^th, 2022 at 11:05pm

I sometimes wonder why Alexander didn't come up with the idea during his 27 failed attempts to save Emma of going back again and both of them getting into the time machine and going back 50 or 100 years and living out the rest of their lives there?

He certainly had plenty of time to do that in the first attempt to save her which is the only one the audience is shown.

Can't really see how that would create a paradox but it would definitely have created a very short and probably boring film.

Back to top

"Masks are sand in the gears of the economy" - some f-wit pollie or big business CEO.

IP Logged

chimera

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 8561
armidale
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #13 - Sep 29^th, 2022 at 6:25am

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 1:57pm:

Would there by two of them alive simultaneously if one returned from the future?

Obviously since one has no chicken and the other is full of it. They/he gets paid twice that month. Every month he meets the time machine and there are 12 new men people each year. Over time (or in no time at all, really) the earth population becomes mainly one person and his chicken.
The chicken must be born before the month starts to keep the atomic count balanced.

Back to top

IP Logged

FutureTheLeftWant

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 6625
Gender: male

Re: Which comes first-The chicken or the Time Traveler
Reply #14 - Sep 29^th, 2022 at 7:43am

Carl D wrote on Sep 28^th, 2022 at 11:05pm:

I sometimes wonder why Alexander didn't come up with the idea during his 27 failed attempts to save Emma of going back again and both of them getting into the time machine and going back 50 or 100 years and living out the rest of their lives there?

He certainly had plenty of time to do that in the first attempt to save her which is the only one the audience is shown.

Can't really see how that would create a paradox but it would definitely have created a very short and probably boring film.

Time travel is always a cheap trick that is manipulated to feed a narrative

Back to top

IP Logged