Australian Politics Forum - Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition

Brian Ross Moderator Offline Representative of me Posts: 44333	Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition Aug 30^th, 2022 at 2:46pm Army fights to keep multi-billion-dollar vehicle project amid fears of defence review cuts
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Belgarion

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Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition
Reply #1 - Aug 30^th, 2022 at 4:45pm

Brian Ross wrote on Aug 30^th, 2022 at 2:46pm:

Army fights to keep multi-billion-dollar vehicle project amid fears of defence review cuts Shocked

The usual inter-service turf war over funding. The army is worried by the new strategic view that sees conflict at sea and in the air to our north as the most likely scenario, with the funding directed accordingly.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition
Reply #2 - Aug 30^th, 2022 at 5:51pm

Belgarion wrote on Aug 30^th, 2022 at 4:45pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Aug 30^th, 2022 at 2:46pm:

Army fights to keep multi-billion-dollar vehicle project amid fears of defence review cuts Shocked

The usual inter-service turf war over funding. The army is worried by the new strategic view that sees conflict at sea and in the air to our north as the most likely scenario, with the funding directed accordingly.

I don't disagree. The ADF periodically goes through this between the services. Roll Eyes

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Brian Ross Moderator Offline Representative of me Posts: 44333	Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition Reply #3 - Oct 8^th, 2022 at 4:08pm Aussie Infantry Fighting Vehicle, Army’s biggest-ever contract, faces government delays
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Belgarion Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5682 Gender:	Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition Reply #4 - Oct 8^th, 2022 at 5:30pm Brian Ross wrote on Oct 8^th, 2022 at 4:08pm: Aussie Infantry Fighting Vehicle, Army’s biggest-ever contract, faces government delays Not my area of expertise but I think the Korean option would be better for on time delivery and local content, but is it the best vehicle?
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Brian Ross

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Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition
Reply #5 - Oct 8^th, 2022 at 5:46pm

Belgarion wrote on Oct 8^th, 2022 at 5:30pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 8^th, 2022 at 4:08pm:

Aussie Infantry Fighting Vehicle, Army’s biggest-ever contract, faces government delays Cool

Not my area of expertise but I think the Korean option would be better for on time delivery and local content, but is it the best vehicle?

You get what you pay for. You can either have a Mercedes or you can have a Daewoo.

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Brian Ross Moderator Offline Representative of me Posts: 44333	Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition Reply #6 - Oct 16^th, 2022 at 1:05pm Deciding the future: the Australian Army and the infantry fighting vehicle
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Belgarion Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5682 Gender:	Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition Reply #7 - Oct 16^th, 2022 at 2:04pm Brian Ross wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 1:05pm: Deciding the future: the Australian Army and the infantry fighting vehicle Very interesting. The logistics issues especially.
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Brian Ross Moderator Offline Representative of me Posts: 44333	Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition Reply #8 - Oct 16^th, 2022 at 2:41pm Belgarion wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 2:04pm: Brian Ross wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 1:05pm: Deciding the future: the Australian Army and the infantry fighting vehicle Very interesting. The logistics issues especially. "Amateurs talk strategy, professionals talk logistics"
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Bobby.

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Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition
Reply #9 - Oct 16^th, 2022 at 2:52pm

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 1:05pm:

Deciding the future: the Australian Army and the infantry fighting vehicle Smiley

Notice it says:

To help Ukraine, the Australian Government has donated equipment, including howitzers, and—despite their inferior protection and combat survival—Bushmaster PMVs and M113 APCs (Figure 6).

Figure 6: An Australian M113 being shipped to Ukraine

Also - the M113s have undergone considerable upgrades in the last 15 years.
Many of them are almost new.

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Brian Ross Moderator Offline Representative of me Posts: 44333	Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition Reply #10 - Oct 16^th, 2022 at 3:05pm They are about to be replaced, Bobby. That is what the Land 400 competition is all about.
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Bobby.

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Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition
Reply #11 - Oct 16^th, 2022 at 3:10pm

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 3:05pm:

They are about to be replaced, Bobby. That is what the Land 400 competition is all about. Roll Eyes

I know that but I make the point that at huge expense - new ones were recently
made and older ones were upgraded too at more expense.
It was done at Albury-Wodonga by BAE systems.

https://www.anao.gov.au/sites/default/files/ANAO_Report_2005-2006_03.pdf

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Brian Ross

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Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition
Reply #12 - Oct 16^th, 2022 at 7:48pm

Bobby. wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 3:10pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 3:05pm:

They are about to be replaced, Bobby. That is what the Land 400 competition is all about. Roll Eyes

I know that but I make the point that at huge expense - new ones were recently
made and older ones were upgraded too at more expense.
It was done at Albury-Wodonga by BAE systems.

https://www.anao.gov.au/sites/default/files/ANAO_Report_2005-2006_03.pdf

Such is the nature of the armaments business, Bobby.

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Bobby.

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Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition
Reply #13 - Oct 16^th, 2022 at 8:21pm

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 7:48pm:

Bobby. wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 3:10pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 16^th, 2022 at 3:05pm:

They are about to be replaced, Bobby. That is what the Land 400 competition is all about. Roll Eyes

I know that but I make the point that at huge expense - new ones were recently
made and older ones were upgraded too at more expense.
It was done at Albury-Wodonga by BAE systems.

https://www.anao.gov.au/sites/default/files/ANAO_Report_2005-2006_03.pdf

Such is the nature of the armaments business, Bobby.

Yes and BTW - the M113 is quite a good vehicle.
It's weaknesses are against: powerful land mines, RPGs and tank rounds.
I doubt there are many landmines in Ukraine.
They have a powerful 50 cal machine gun turret that any enemy troops
would be very frightened of.
The Ukrainians still wanted them - I bet they would take them all if we let them.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Australian Army Land 400 Ph3 Competition
Reply #14 - Nov 26^th, 2022 at 1:27pm

Quote:

Land 400 Phase 3 consideration

25 NOVEMBER 2022

The Australian Government will consider the findings of the Defence Strategic Review before deciding on the tender for the LAND 400 Phase 3 Infantry Fighting Vehicle project.

The Review will make recommendations on priorities for investing in Australia’s defence capability and posture, to meet the nation’s security challenges over the next decade and beyond.

The Minister for Defence Industry, the Hon Pat Conroy MP, said it is responsible for the decision on a procurement worth between $18 billion and $27 billion to be informed by the findings of the Review.

“I would like to thank Hanwha Defense Australia, Rheinmetall Defence Australia and the many other companies involved in this tender process for their understanding and professionalism,” Minister Conroy said.

“The Government remains focused on Australia’s future defence capability. We don’t want to pre-empt the findings of the Review, which is especially critical given the rapidly changing strategic circumstances facing our nation.”

The final report from the Defence Strategic Review is due to be delivered to the Government early next year.

https://www.minister.defence.gov.au/media-releases/2022-11-25/land-400-phase-3-c...

A smart move IMHO.

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