Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Jul 31
st, 2022 at 11:39am:
Just to remind you again, here is the news to date:-
Aborigines etc already have all the voice they need same as everyone else.
Well, yes for the sake of the argument.
Quote:They already have a higher percentage of representation in Parliament than their percentage representation in the community.
Correct; but among those voices is the fool Price who thinks 'personal responsibility' alone can close the gap, when unemployment is running as high as 50% in some communities...for which conservative ideologue Howard must bear some of the blame, for cancelling the successful CDEP sceme.
Quote:They are already enshrined in the constitution as Australians - same as everyone else.
Yes.
Quote: They also have lobby groups, special representative groups with access to government, and over-representation in the press.
Correct; the whole circus is a pain in the arse, and
you are responsible for it Quote:They have the support of Labor, the Greens, the majority of Independents, as well as a number of those on the 'right' side of Parliament.
Correct, and all of them - as well as those on the Right who don't support the voice - are beholden to the cutrrent vicious neoliberal survival of the fittest system.
At least the Greens are prepared to openly state their plans to raise taxes to increase health outcomes...for "decency's" sake. Those plans are doomed of course, because we are all self-interetsd sh*ts.
Quote:What the actual powers and functions of any Special Voice are intended to be has not begun to be addressed. The wording is vague, perhaps deliberately so.
Not deliberately, but owing to total confusion over the causes and consequences of poverty, and self-interest re taxation; and above all the success of private financiers convincing us all that government must borrow from them, rather than using government's own capacity for currency issuance, to fund public spending.
Quote:Such a voice is racist, discriminatory and exclusionist.
Correct - and ironic coming from you who, who are quite content to exclude those least able to compete in the vicious neoliberal job market.
Quote:It is not clear if any 'voice' has political voting power in Parliament.
That much is clear: the voice has no voting power, only the capacity to advise parliament re abo. affairs. Even so, useless.... because RW abo MPs will vote against LW abo MPs.
Quote:Such a voice body would be an ATSIC or similar that could never be abolished or stood down for corruption etc.
Don't sweat, the voice won't have any special voting power, as explained above.
Quote:It will achieve nothing that cannot be achieved without it, and at huge and unnecessary cost in money and disturbance of the democratic process
Wrong. Much legislation is sent to Senate committees for week-long examination, before being put to the vote. Accommodating the view of the 'voice' would hardly constitute a remarkable increase in expense.
Quote:The intent of 'Aboriginal activists' is not to view this as the end result, but as the stepping stone towards the creation of mini-states throughout Australia, all bound by treaty to the Australian Government and funded by the taxpayer and any relevant business wishing to operate there.
They will fail, since they won't have a vote in parliament to achieve this. iirc, Langton herself has said were are really only looking at assimilation, as the end result of the voice.
Quote:It is not simply about 'Aboriginal issues'. Any claim or demand by one group has direct effects on every member of Australia. Similar to 'women's issues' and such these do not exist in a vacuum.
Correct. Eradication of poverty and all its evils will have remarkably positive effect on the Oz nation.
Quote:Depending on the model, it could mean permanent seats in Parliament for people who are only voted on by that one group (or groups) – those claiming Aboriginal descent.
You mean like the Myanmar military reserving seats for itself?
There are no permanent seats in the Oz parliament.
Quote:To have a separate voice elected only by Aboriginals would mean that the current Aboriginal elected representatives are superfluous and should be stood down.
Now you have completely veered off course; and there will be no "3rd chamber".
Quote:The claim to have 'never ceded sovereignty', means that elected Aborigines are ineligible to be chosen or to sit in Parliament.
Interesting point. Just shows the limitations of claims to "sovereignty".
Quote:44. Any person who –
(i.) Is under any acknowledgement of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or citizen of a foreign power:
shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives.
yes, but I don't think any abo MPs claim sovereignty over the Oz parliament.
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