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Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA) (Read 4325 times)
Jasin
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #15 - Jun 26th, 2022 at 2:12am
 
There is only War in Heaven.

Hell is for Suicide.
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Bias_2012
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #16 - Jun 26th, 2022 at 3:34am
 
Personally I've never wanted a gun, but during the 60s the Government threatened me with two years jail if I refused to comply with the order to use fire arms etc to kill people. I never wanted to kill anyone, it's not my nature to do that, and I still don't want a gun, never have

What the politicians should do, on behalf of the Parliament, is get on their knees and apologize to all the young blokes they threatened, old now, but young then


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Jasin
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #17 - Jun 26th, 2022 at 7:24am
 
random wrote on Jun 25th, 2022 at 8:32pm:
Jasin wrote on Jun 25th, 2022 at 7:21pm:
In my Shire. There are over 12,000 registered guns.

Guns are essential if you want the Free Settlers to kill natives in an unofficial, undisciplined way of doing the dirty work that the Military can't get away with if there is no 'war' aspect.
Australian Free Settlers and their 'right' to own a gun were the major contributers to the Cheer Mobs getting shot.
Don't blame the Convicts, they were still in chains and under watch of the British Troopers. Seems 'America's' influence was the main perpetrator.

But hey, Australia sold out to America when its meagre British Colony of Convicts had to rely upon American Whaling vessels for provisions and more - just to survive.
America owns Australia, just as much as Britain does.

I'm sure if these Celebrity Media Republicans who pipe up every 10 years for a Republic, want to 'usurp' the Cheer Mob in getting their country back 'fully' - then they're gonna need some guns.  Wink


I read a book on Ludwig Leichhardt a couple of years ago.  The book was carefully coded to make sure that the reader got the message that some of his men were only on the expedition to kill the aboriginal men and rape the women.  Some of the men had a tactic to stay another day or three in an area, they scattered the small herd they had and it sometimes took days to round them up, while raping the women some more.  Happened repeatedly.

The leader of the few bad guys was killed one night in a raid on the explorers camp.  They only killed to rapist organizer.

Think about it, a new colony with few women, while naked ones were running about in the bush.  No wonder there were so many half white children.

All enabled by Gunz!


Yep. Good example of what is many examples around the country. The British bought their Convicts here for the crimes they committed in Britain.
But it was the Free Settlers who committed far worse crimes here with their guns that they also committed Genocide in Tasmania in such a way, HG.Wells put it into a book called War of the Worlds - based on the Free Settler's 'Free-for-all' turkey shoot of Denisovian Tasmanians into obliteration.
If the Boongs fought back, then the Free Settlers would cry like some of the Trolls here, and force the British Troopers to take a reluctant action on their behalf.
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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AusGeoff
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #18 - Jun 26th, 2022 at 9:10am
 
Bias_2012 wrote on Jun 26th, 2022 at 3:34am:
Personally I've never wanted a gun, but during the 60s the Government threatened me with two years jail if I refused to comply with the order to use fire arms etc to kill people. I never wanted to kill anyone, it's not my nature to do that, and I still don't want a gun, never have

What the politicians should do, on behalf of the Parliament, is get on their knees and apologize to all the young blokes they threatened, old now, but young then


You might like to check out this site mate...

Nasho Fair Go.

"The mission of this web site is unashamedly to obtain some justice
for a group of men who have been treated very shabbily by successive
federal governments over the last 50 years – since National service
was abolished on 7 December 1972."
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #19 - Jun 26th, 2022 at 9:45am
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Jun 26th, 2022 at 1:10am:
freediver wrote on Jun 25th, 2022 at 5:33pm:
Not sure about the natives. If that were a real factor, you would expect NZ to have a bigger gun culture than here. I expect fellow immigrants were a bigger danger to most early Americans, unless they were pro mink hunters or something.

They also had the civil war, so a much higher level of fear of the government.


Damn you Freediver lol! You beat me to it! I had to log off because I was cooking and as I was stirring the stew I found myself reflecting on the Maoris. They were warriors. Even so ... there's no gun culture in NZ today.

The other thing I found myself reflecting on was this :

NZ (like Australia) also didn't have a War of Independence nor did they have a Civil War. The enemies in such conflicts were therefore non existent. Not so for the USA so once again....guns played a pivotal role in getting from 1775 –--> 1865 ( the start of the American War Of Independence through to the end of  the American Civil War ). In any event, the American Indian Wars timeline 1609–1924 (intermittent) also pushed the gun culture along so that the 1st 309 years of the existence of the USA ... its gun culture effectively defined its mode of survival.

So we've reached the mid 1920's. And right now we're in 2022. What's happened in THIS 100 yr period to perpetuate the gun culture in the US?i


Two world wars and a bunch of smaller ones. Plus a devastating war on drugs. There are still regular gun battles just south of the border in Mexico.

Plus people like Trump and Bush jnr getting elected. That would hardly give you faith in the government.
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Jasin
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #20 - Jun 26th, 2022 at 10:01am
 
Give me an amateur President who know's he's stupid,
than a professional President who is stupid but believes that he isn't - anytime.
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Lisa Jones
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #21 - Jun 27th, 2022 at 11:45am
 
freediver wrote on Jun 26th, 2022 at 9:45am:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jun 26th, 2022 at 1:10am:
freediver wrote on Jun 25th, 2022 at 5:33pm:
Not sure about the natives. If that were a real factor, you would expect NZ to have a bigger gun culture than here. I expect fellow immigrants were a bigger danger to most early Americans, unless they were pro mink hunters or something.

They also had the civil war, so a much higher level of fear of the government.


Damn you Freediver lol! You beat me to it! I had to log off because I was cooking and as I was stirring the stew I found myself reflecting on the Maoris. They were warriors. Even so ... there's no gun culture in NZ today.

The other thing I found myself reflecting on was this :

NZ (like Australia) also didn't have a War of Independence nor did they have a Civil War. The enemies in such conflicts were therefore non existent. Not so for the USA so once again....guns played a pivotal role in getting from 1775 –--> 1865 ( the start of the American War Of Independence through to the end of  the American Civil War ). In any event, the American Indian Wars timeline 1609–1924 (intermittent) also pushed the gun culture along so that the 1st 309 years of the existence of the USA ... its gun culture effectively defined its mode of survival.

So we've reached the mid 1920's. And right now we're in 2022. What's happened in THIS 100 yr period to perpetuate the gun culture in the US?i


Two world wars and a bunch of smaller ones. Plus a devastating war on drugs. There are still regular gun battles just south of the border in Mexico.

Plus people like Trump and Bush jnr getting elected. That would hardly give you faith in the government.


😳

You left out Biden.
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #22 - Jun 27th, 2022 at 1:10pm
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Jun 26th, 2022 at 1:10am:
And right now we're in 2022. What's happened in THIS 100 yr period to perpetuate the gun culture in the US?


Paranoid inherent individual rights Conservative Libertarian 'self-defense' ideologues who hate government, remain powerful in the US, and they have the US Constitution's  obsolete 2nd Amendment to back them up.

A well regulated militia ...the US now has the world's most powerful military...being necessary for the defense of a free state  .....defense of the state against the 'evil' British king in the conditions of the late 18th century(!)....the right to bear arms shall not be infringed...now to 'defend', not to arm the state against the British king,  but to arm individuals against one another ie against one's own neighbors.  Nice.

Result: the highest DOMESTIC gun deaths of any rich nation on the planet.i

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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #23 - Jun 28th, 2022 at 9:02pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Jun 25th, 2022 at 1:58pm:


It's MUCH more difficult to own guns in Oz (after the Port Arthur massacre...) 




Yes it's more difficult to legally own a gun after 1996 yet it has made no difference with obtaining illegal guns.


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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #24 - Jun 28th, 2022 at 10:37pm
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Jun 28th, 2022 at 9:02pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Jun 25th, 2022 at 1:58pm:


It's MUCH more difficult to own guns in Oz (after the Port Arthur massacre...) 




Yes it's more difficult to legally own a gun after 1996 yet it has made no difference with obtaining illegal guns.




Hang on.

In Australia from 1996 ---->

1. More difficult to own a gun
2. No difference in getting access to a gun

Huh? That means we've learned nothing from the Port Arthur Massacre.





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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #25 - Jun 30th, 2022 at 1:31pm
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Jun 28th, 2022 at 10:37pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Jun 28th, 2022 at 9:02pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Jun 25th, 2022 at 1:58pm:


It's MUCH more difficult to own guns in Oz (after the Port Arthur massacre...) 




Yes it's more difficult to legally own a gun after 1996 yet it has made no difference with obtaining illegal guns.




Hang on.

In Australia from 1996 ---->

1. More difficult to own a gun
2. No difference in getting access to a gun

Huh? That means we've learned nothing from the Port Arthur Massacre.


You dropped the words "legal" and "illegal". and hence came up with your contradictory points 1 and 2, above.

And re "illegal" guns (obtained by criminals) referred to by BaronVR: criminals don't normally don't slaughter strangers, madmen - who normally won't be able to access illegal guns so readily since 1996 -  do slaughter strangers.  Note the difference in number of gun massacres,  in Oz and the US, since 1996.  
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« Last Edit: Jun 30th, 2022 at 1:39pm by thegreatdivide »  
 
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Bias_2012
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #26 - Jun 30th, 2022 at 3:56pm
 
You might like to check out this site mate...

Nasho Fair Go
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Thanks, I never knew about that, it must be pretty recent

We were young blokes working at our regular jobs fresh out of our apprenticeships, then suddenly we found ourselves with high powered guns in our hands - made sense to some I suppose




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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #27 - Jul 1st, 2022 at 9:43am
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Jun 28th, 2022 at 9:02pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Jun 25th, 2022 at 1:58pm:


It's MUCH more difficult to own guns in Oz (after the Port Arthur massacre...) 




Yes it's more difficult to legally own a gun after 1996 yet it has made no difference with obtaining illegal guns.




What makes you think that?
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #28 - Jul 10th, 2022 at 8:23pm
 
freediver wrote on Jul 1st, 2022 at 9:43am:
Baronvonrort wrote on Jun 28th, 2022 at 9:02pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Jun 25th, 2022 at 1:58pm:


It's MUCH more difficult to own guns in Oz (after the Port Arthur massacre...) 




Yes it's more difficult to legally own a gun after 1996 yet it has made no difference with obtaining illegal guns.




What makes you think that?


We made drugs illegal did that stop people taking drugs? Did this increase profits for drug dealers like Milton Friedman said it would?

At 1 min 18 former NSW police minister says greater than 97% of all gun crime in NSW is done by criminals with illegal guns.


The Islamic terrorist who did the Lindt siege picked up an illegal pump action shotgun for $600 there have been quite frw shootings in Sydney going back a few years by criminals with guns that cannot legally be bought.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/gun-found-every-two-days-in-melbourn...
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Re: Gun Laws/Behaviour (Oz vs USA)
Reply #29 - Jul 11th, 2022 at 5:38pm
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Jul 10th, 2022 at 8:23pm:
We made drugs illegal did that stop people taking drugs? [quote]

No.

[quote]Did this increase profits for drug dealers like Milton Friedman said it would?


Yes...one of the few thing Friedman got right, if he said it.......

Note: legalization of pot decreases criminal activity (and profits) 

Quote:
At 1 min 18 former NSW police minister says greater than 97% of all gun crime in NSW is done by criminals with illegal guns.


Not a good argument for allowing unrestricted access to all types of guns.   The US proves it.

[quote]The Islamic terrorist who did the Lindt siege picked up an illegal pump action shotgun for $600 there have been quite frw shootings in Sydney going back a few years by criminals with guns that cannot legally be bought.


Addressed above. Japan with stronger gun laws than Oz,   had less than 2 dozen gun deaths in the last year; the US had 45,000....


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