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Hamas and Islamic Jihad (Read 3051 times)
NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #15 - May 15th, 2021 at 12:12pm
 
freediver wrote on May 14th, 2021 at 5:37pm:
NorthOfNorth wrote on May 14th, 2021 at 10:29am:
issuevoter wrote on May 14th, 2021 at 10:09am:
The present situation stems from WW1, when the Turks and Germans tried to seize the Suez Canal, which was administered by the British in Egypt. The Turks were driven out or the Sainni and Palestine by mainly Australian Imperial Troops. At the time, the Arab and Jewish Palestinians coexisted more or less peacefully. The League of Nations and the British Government decided to allow European Jews to emigrate to the British captured territory. At first, the immigrants bought land off the locals and began to prosper. The Arabs had the opportunity to take part in another successful democratic Mediterranean country, but being Muzlums, they preferred going berserk.

And you.. How do you weave-in the issue of ultra-orthodox jews' determination to establish a greater Israel by illegally occupying Palestinian land and confiscation of their property to that end?

The Muslims on the other hand have created suffering and misery for 1400 years.

Really? What was the 'viral load' of suffering inflicted in, say, 975 AD, or maybe 1120AD?

How would you extricate Christio-centric atrocities over a period of 1400 years, such that they're not really atrocities?
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freediver
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #16 - May 15th, 2021 at 12:39pm
 
There was a constant stream of sex slaves being transported into the Muslim empire throughout the entire period. They have raped their way into the backwards shithole they are today. Prior to Islam, these places had been the most advanced civilisation on earth for over 10 millenia.
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Valkie
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #17 - May 15th, 2021 at 2:29pm
 
Wherever muzzos go.

Civilization suffers or goes backward

Satan's soldiers, the cult of death....Islam.
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #18 - May 15th, 2021 at 4:05pm
 
freediver wrote on May 15th, 2021 at 12:39pm:
There was a constant stream of sex slaves being transported into the Muslim empire throughout the entire period. They have raped their way into the backwards shithole they are today. Prior to Islam, these places had been the most advanced civilisation on earth for over 10 millenia.

Interesting that... It was sexual debauchery within the church (including the abuse of children) that triggered Martin Luther's Protestant Reformation.

Thomas Jefferson (as the US President) and a slave-holder himself went to war against white slavery.

Of course, there's the brutality of the Crusades.

Brutality throughout the British Empire.

Can you name a benign imperial age or people?
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moses
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #19 - May 15th, 2021 at 4:49pm
 
The Timeline of muslim and Christian crusades:

630 Two years before Muhammad’s death of a fever, he launches the Tabuk Crusades, in which he led 30,000 jihadists against the Byzantine Christians. He had heard a report that a huge army had amassed to attack Arabia, but the report turned out to be a false rumor. The Byzantine army never materialized. He turned around and went home, but not before extracting "agreements" from northern tribes. They could enjoy the "privilege" of living under Islamic "protection" (read: not be attacked by Islam), if they paid a tax.

This tax sets the stage for Muhammad’s and the later Caliphs’ policies. If the attacked city or region did not want to convert to Islam, then they paid a jizya tax. If they converted, then they paid a zakat tax. Either way, money flowed back to the Islamic treasury in Arabia or to the local Muslim governor.

632-634 Under the Caliphate of Abu Bakr the Muslim Crusaders reconquer and sometimes conquer for the first time the polytheists of Arabia. These Arab polytheists had to convert to Islam or die. They did not have the choice of remaining in their faith and paying a tax. Islam does not allow for religious freedom.

633 The Muslim Crusaders, led by Khalid al-Walid, a superior but bloodthirsty military commander, whom Muhammad nicknamed the Sword of Allah for his ferocity in battle (Tabari, 8:158 / 1616-17), conquer the city of Ullays along the Euphrates River (in today’s Iraq). Khalid captures and beheads so many that a nearby canal, into which the blood flowed, was called Blood Canal (Tabari 11:24 / 2034-35).

634 At the Battle of Yarmuk in Syria the Muslim Crusaders defeat the Byzantines. Today Osama bin Laden draws inspiration from the defeat, and especially from an anecdote about Khalid al-Walid. In Khalid’s day an unnamed Muslim remarks: "The Romans are so numerous and the Muslims so few." To this Khalid retorts: "How few are the Romans, and how many the Muslims! Armies become numerous only with victory and few only with defeat, not by the number of men. By God, I would love it . . . if the enemy were twice as many" (Tabari, 11:94 / 2095). Osama bin Laden quotes Khalid and says that his fighters love death more than we in the West love life. This philosophy of death probably comes from a verse like Sura 2:96. Muhammad assesses the Jews: "[Prophet], you are sure to find them [the Jews] clinging to life more eagerly than any other people, even polytheists" (MAS Abdel Haleem, The Qur’an, Oxford UP, 2004; first insertion in brackets is Haleem’s; the second mine).

634-644 The Caliphate of Umar ibn al-Khattab, who is regarded as particularly brutal.

635 Muslim Crusaders besiege and conquer of Damascus.

636 Muslim Crusaders defeat Byzantines decisively at Battle of Yarmuk.

637 Muslim Crusaders conquer Iraq at the Battle of al-Qadisiyyah (some date it in 635 or 636).

638 Muslim Crusaders conquer and annex Jerusalem, taking it from the Byzantines.

638-650 Muslim Crusaders conquer Iran, except along Caspian Sea.

639-642 Muslim Crusaders conquer Egypt.

641 Muslim Crusaders control Syria and Palestine.

643-707 Muslim Crusaders conquer North Africa.

644 Caliph Umar is assassinated by a Persian prisoner of war; Uthman ibn Affan is elected third Caliph, who is regarded by many Muslims as gentler than Umar.

644-650 Muslim Crusaders conquer Cyprus, Tripoli in North Africa, and establish Islamic rule in Iran, Afghanistan, and Sind.

656 Caliph Uthman is assassinated by disgruntled Muslim soldiers; Ali ibn Abi Talib, son-in-law and cousin to Muhammad, who married the prophet’s daughter Fatima through his first wife Khadija,
656 Battle of the Camel, in which Aisha, Muhammad’s wife, leads a rebellion against Ali for not avenging Uthman’s assassination. Ali’s partisans win.

657 Battle of Siffin between Ali and Muslim governor of Jerusalem, arbitration goes against Ali

661 Murder of Ali by an extremist; Ali’s supporters acclaim his son Hasan as next Caliph, but he comes to an agreement with Muawiyyah I and retires to Medina.

661-680 the Caliphate of Muawiyyah I. He founds Umayyid dynasty and moves capital from Medina to Damascus

673-678 Arabs besiege Constantinople, capital of Byzantine Empire

680 Massacre of Hussein (Muhammad’s grandson), his family, and his supporters in Karbala, Iraq.

691 Dome of the Rock is completed in Jerusalem, only six decades after Muhammad’s death.

705 Abd al-Malik restores Umayyad rule.

710-713 Muslim Crusaders conquer the lower Indus Valley.

711-713 Muslim Crusaders conquer Spain and impose the kingdom of Andalus. This article recounts how Muslims today still grieve over their expulsion 700 years later. They seem to believe that the land belonged to them in the first place.

719 Cordova, Spain, becomes seat of Arab governorship.

732 The Muslim Crusaders are stopped at the Battle of Poitiers; that is, Franks (France) halt Arab advance.

749 The Abbasids conquer Kufah and overthrow Umayyids.

756 Foundation of Umayyid emirate in Cordova, Spain, setting up an independent kingdom from Abbasids.

762 Foundation of Baghdad


Continued next post
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moses
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #20 - May 15th, 2021 at 4:51pm
 
785 Foundation of the Great Mosque of Cordova

789 Rise of Idrisid emirs (Muslim Crusaders) in Morocco; foundation of Fez; Christoforos, a Muslim who converted to Christianity, is executed.

800 Autonomous Aghlabid dynasty (Muslim Crusaders) in Tunisia.

807 Caliph Harun al-Rashid orders the destruction of non-Muslim prayer houses and of the Church of Mary Magdalene in Jerusalem.

809 Aghlabids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Sardinia, Italy.

813 Christians in Palestine are attacked; many flee the country.

831 Muslim Crusaders capture of Palermo, Italy; raids in Southern Italy.

850 Caliph al-Matawakkil orders the destruction of non-Muslim houses of prayer.

855 Revolt of the Christians of Hims (Syria)

837-901 Aghlabids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Sicily, raid Corsica, Italy, France.

909 Rise of the Fatimid Caliphate in Tunisia; these Muslim Crusaders occupy Sicily, Sardinia.

928-969 Byzantine military revival, they retake old territories, such as Cyprus (964) and Tarsus (969).

937 The Ikhshid, a particularly harsh Muslim ruler, writes to Emperor Romanus, boasting of his control over the holy places.

937 The Church of the Resurrection (known as Church of Holy Sepulcher in Latin West) is burned down by Muslims; more churches in Jerusalem are attacked .

960 Conversion of Qarakhanid Turks to Islam

966 Anti-Christian riots in Jerusalem

969 Fatimids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Egypt and found Cairo.

973 Israel and southern Syria are again conquered by the Fatimids.

1003 First persecutions by al-Hakim; the Church of St. Mark in Fustat, Egypt, is destroyed.

1009 Destruction of the Church of the Resurrection by al-Hakim

1012 Beginning of al-Hakim’s oppressive decrees against Jews and Christians

1015 Earthquake in Palestine; the dome of the Dome of the Rock collapses.

1031 Collapse of Umayyid Caliphate and establishment of 15 minor independent dynasties throughout Muslim Andalus

1048 Reconstruction of the Church of the Resurrection completed

1050 Creation of Almoravid (Muslim Crusaders) movement in Mauretania; Almoravids (also known as Murabitun) are coalition of western Saharan Berbers; followers of Islam, focusing on the Quran, the hadith, and Maliki law.

1055 Seljuk Prince Tughrul enters Baghdad, consolidation of the Seljuk Sultanate.

1055 Confiscation of property of Church of the Resurrection

1071 Battle of Manzikert, Seljuk Turks (Muslim Crusaders) defeat Byzantines and occupy much of Anatolia.

1071 Turks (Muslim Crusaders) invade Palestine.

1073 Conquest of Jerusalem by Turks (Muslim Crusaders)

1075 Seljuks (Muslim Crusaders) capture Nicea (Iznik) and make it their capital in Anatolia.

1076 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) (see 1050) conquer western Ghana.

1086 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) (see 1050) send help to Andalus, Battle of Zallaca.

1090-1091 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) occupy all of Andalus except Saragossa and Balearic Islands.

1095 Pope Urban II preaches first Crusade; they capture Jerusalem in 1099
So it is only after all of the Islamic aggressive invasions that western Christendom launches its first Crusades.
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Valkie
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #21 - May 15th, 2021 at 7:12pm
 
OkNorthOfNorth wrote on May 15th, 2021 at 4:05pm:
freediver wrote on May 15th, 2021 at 12:39pm:
There was a constant stream of sex slaves being transported into the Muslim empire throughout the entire period. They have raped their way into the backwards shithole they are today. Prior to Islam, these places had been the most advanced civilisation on earth for over 10 millenia.

Interesting that... It was sexual debauchery within the church (including the abuse of children) that triggered Martin Luther's Protestant Reformation.

Thomas Jefferson (as the US President) and a slave-holder himself went to war against white slavery.

Of course, there's the brutality of the Crusades.

Brutality throughout the British Empire.

Can you name a benign imperial age or people?



But the big difference is that these behaviours are not acceptable to civilization today.

Whereas, muzzos are still living in the 12th century and just as brutal, just as violent, just as barbaric as ever.

Until they wake up and act civilized, they will never fit in.
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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freediver
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #22 - May 16th, 2021 at 8:28am
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on May 15th, 2021 at 4:05pm:
freediver wrote on May 15th, 2021 at 12:39pm:
There was a constant stream of sex slaves being transported into the Muslim empire throughout the entire period. They have raped their way into the backwards shithole they are today. Prior to Islam, these places had been the most advanced civilisation on earth for over 10 millenia.

Interesting that... It was sexual debauchery within the church (including the abuse of children) that triggered Martin Luther's Protestant Reformation.

Thomas Jefferson (as the US President) and a slave-holder himself went to war against white slavery.

Of course, there's the brutality of the Crusades.

Brutality throughout the British Empire.

Can you name a benign imperial age or people?


Every empire changed the world. Islam's brought endless misery to this day.

Are you trying to equate 1400 years of sex slavery on an enormous scale with "debauchery" within a church? Are you having difficulty understanding the words here?
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Ayn Marx
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #23 - May 16th, 2021 at 10:06am
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on May 14th, 2021 at 10:29am:
And you.. How do you weave-in the issue of ultra-orthodox jews' determination to establish a greater Israel by illegally occupying Palestinian land and confiscation of their property to that end?

And how do so many of you manage to avoid religious belief as central to these problems? Any group suffering the delusion God is on their side, and only theirs, gives itself permission to indulge in endless evil for and on behalf of the deity they imagine is theirs.

https://www.swarthmore.edu/friends-historical-library/why-religions-facilitate-war-and-how-religions-facilitate-peace
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_terrorism
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2019.02560/full

Not that atheist political ideology is innocent of slaughtering ’non-believers’ in their particular systems. Again we face the ‘devil’ within. Human nature and where it is inevitably leading us.


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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #24 - May 16th, 2021 at 10:26am
 
Ayn Marx wrote on May 16th, 2021 at 10:06am:
NorthOfNorth wrote on May 14th, 2021 at 10:29am:
And you.. How do you weave-in the issue of ultra-orthodox jews' determination to establish a greater Israel by illegally occupying Palestinian land and confiscation of their property to that end?

And how do so many of you manage to avoid religious belief as central to these problems? Any group suffering the delusion God is on their side, and only theirs, gives itself permission to indulge in endless evil for and on behalf of the deity they imagine is theirs.

https://www.swarthmore.edu/friends-historical-library/why-religions-facilitate-war-and-how-religions-facilitate-peace
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_terrorism
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2019.02560/full

Not that atheist political ideology is innocent of slaughtering ’non-believers’ in their particular systems. Again we face the ‘devil’ within. Human nature and where it is inevitably leading us.



It wouldn't matter if we humans were not predisposed to belief in the divine... We can easily divide and endlessly divide the world into us and them; with 'us' being righteous and 'them' being contemptible.
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #25 - May 16th, 2021 at 10:30am
 
Are you suggesting Hamas is not contemptible? Or that it is easy to identify that they are contemptible?
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #26 - May 16th, 2021 at 11:11am
 
freediver wrote on May 16th, 2021 at 10:30am:
Are you suggesting Hamas is not contemptible? Or that it is easy to identify that they are contemptible?

Hamas cynically exploited the forced evictions of Palestinians from their homes to initiate a full-blown intifada.

After 75 years of this, I don't believe it's possible to imagine a resolution to the Israel/Palestine such that the two can co-exist sharing the same land or even existing adjacently.

God and religion have as much to do with it as the Catholic / Protestant divide in Northern Ireland, which is to say, while it may be superficially predicated on them, they no longer necessarily need to be invoked for the lethal divide to persist.

Two great causes of 'right' that are irreconcilable and unresolvable, leaving only a protracted war of attrition as the only likely outcome.
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #27 - May 16th, 2021 at 11:13am
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on May 16th, 2021 at 10:26am:
It wouldn't matter if we humans were not predisposed to belief in the divine... We can easily divide and endlessly divide the world into us and them; with 'us' being righteous and 'them' being contemptible.

As I asserted "Not that atheist political ideology is innocent of slaughtering ’non-believers’ in their particular systems. Again we face the ‘devil’ within. Human nature and where it is inevitably leading us.”

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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #28 - May 16th, 2021 at 11:14am
 
Ayn Marx wrote on May 16th, 2021 at 11:13am:
NorthOfNorth wrote on May 16th, 2021 at 10:26am:
It wouldn't matter if we humans were not predisposed to belief in the divine... We can easily divide and endlessly divide the world into us and them; with 'us' being righteous and 'them' being contemptible.

As I asserted "Not that atheist political ideology is innocent of slaughtering ’non-believers’ in their particular systems. Again we face the ‘devil’ within. Human nature and where it is inevitably leading us.”


It runs deeper than human nature.
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Re: Hamas and Islamic Jihad
Reply #29 - May 16th, 2021 at 12:08pm
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on May 16th, 2021 at 11:11am:
freediver wrote on May 16th, 2021 at 10:30am:
Are you suggesting Hamas is not contemptible? Or that it is easy to identify that they are contemptible?

Hamas cynically exploited the forced evictions of Palestinians from their homes to initiate a full-blown intifada.

After 75 years of this, I don't believe it's possible to imagine a resolution to the Israel/Palestine such that the two can co-exist sharing the same land or even existing adjacently.

God and religion have as much to do with it as the Catholic / Protestant divide in Northern Ireland, which is to say, while it may be superficially predicated on them, they no longer necessarily need to be invoked for the lethal divide to persist.

Two great causes of 'right' that are irreconcilable and unresolvable, leaving only a protracted war of attrition as the only likely outcome.


Ireland and Northern Ireland now coexist peacefully. Of course, neither side is Muslim, so that helps. In Israel, even Muslims and Jews can coexist peacefully.

Do you have a point, or are you just aimlessly meandering through thoughtspace? Do you agree that Hamas is contemptible?
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