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You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again (Read 1232 times)
greggerypeccary
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #15 - Oct 27th, 2020 at 12:37pm
 
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 10:06am:
Jasin wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:50am:
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:46am:
Jasin wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:36am:
Of course I have the luxury not to have to deal with any of the above mentioned as I do only have my self to deal with. I will submit to that. But if I had to employ others - then I would hope I can be as 'discriminatory' as I can for my own benefit and not take on someone, just because the Govt says I have to, etc.
But I know many a business that would 'wish' it was like what I said above... but for the 'anti-discrimination' laws.
Some manage to side-step having to take all that on.


So can I take it that you're an employer and not an employee. Which I hope you agree is helpful to clarify when you comment in future about the value of Worker Unions.   


Coming from an Employee who had to do the duties of Female staff that were long in their pregancies and still getting paid their higher rate upon me doing their work - forced to by Employers 'because they were pregnant' (emotional sexist blackmail).
Personally, I reckon their husbands should have come in to do their knocked-up wives jobs.

Not a productive way to conduct business.
I, as an Employee, shouldn't have to put up with that.


Sorry but that confused jumble of words is totally off topic. We weren't debating the merits of maternity leave. In any event i think I got my answer; you're an employer and not a worker.

So tell me this. It really is a very simple question to answer. Are you subscribed to or a member of some small business organization or ever got advice or assistance from a small business organization in the running of your business? 


JaSin?
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Jest
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #16 - Oct 27th, 2020 at 1:21pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 12:37pm:
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 10:06am:
Jasin wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:50am:
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:46am:
Jasin wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:36am:
Of course I have the luxury not to have to deal with any of the above mentioned as I do only have my self to deal with. I will submit to that. But if I had to employ others - then I would hope I can be as 'discriminatory' as I can for my own benefit and not take on someone, just because the Govt says I have to, etc.
But I know many a business that would 'wish' it was like what I said above... but for the 'anti-discrimination' laws.
Some manage to side-step having to take all that on.


So can I take it that you're an employer and not an employee. Which I hope you agree is helpful to clarify when you comment in future about the value of Worker Unions.   


Coming from an Employee who had to do the duties of Female staff that were long in their pregancies and still getting paid their higher rate upon me doing their work - forced to by Employers 'because they were pregnant' (emotional sexist blackmail).
Personally, I reckon their husbands should have come in to do their knocked-up wives jobs.

Not a productive way to conduct business.
I, as an Employee, shouldn't have to put up with that.


Sorry but that confused jumble of words is totally off topic. We weren't debating the merits of maternity leave. In any event i think I got my answer; you're an employer and not a worker.

So tell me this. It really is a very simple question to answer. Are you subscribed to or a member of some small business organization or ever got advice or assistance from a small business organization in the running of your business? 


JaSin?


Im not sure what you mean Greg
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Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.
 
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greggerypeccary
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #17 - Oct 27th, 2020 at 1:57pm
 
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 1:21pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 12:37pm:
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 10:06am:
Jasin wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:50am:
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:46am:
Jasin wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:36am:
Of course I have the luxury not to have to deal with any of the above mentioned as I do only have my self to deal with. I will submit to that. But if I had to employ others - then I would hope I can be as 'discriminatory' as I can for my own benefit and not take on someone, just because the Govt says I have to, etc.
But I know many a business that would 'wish' it was like what I said above... but for the 'anti-discrimination' laws.
Some manage to side-step having to take all that on.


So can I take it that you're an employer and not an employee. Which I hope you agree is helpful to clarify when you comment in future about the value of Worker Unions.   


Coming from an Employee who had to do the duties of Female staff that were long in their pregancies and still getting paid their higher rate upon me doing their work - forced to by Employers 'because they were pregnant' (emotional sexist blackmail).
Personally, I reckon their husbands should have come in to do their knocked-up wives jobs.

Not a productive way to conduct business.
I, as an Employee, shouldn't have to put up with that.


Sorry but that confused jumble of words is totally off topic. We weren't debating the merits of maternity leave. In any event i think I got my answer; you're an employer and not a worker.

So tell me this. It really is a very simple question to answer. Are you subscribed to or a member of some small business organization or ever got advice or assistance from a small business organization in the running of your business? 


JaSin?


Im not sure what you mean Greg


I'm asking JaSin to answer your question.

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The_Barnacle
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #18 - Oct 27th, 2020 at 3:07pm
 
whiteknight wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 8:01am:
McDonald’s chain fined for denying toilet or drink breaks to young staff 



It's no surprise that this is happening more now that there has been deregulation of the labour market
Wage theft
calling employees "contractors" so they don't have to pay them their entitlements
It's returning to Victorian times
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The Right Wing only believe in free speech when they agree with what is being said.
 
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Jest
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #19 - Oct 27th, 2020 at 3:35pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 1:57pm:
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 1:21pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 12:37pm:
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 10:06am:
Jasin wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:50am:
Jest wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:46am:
Jasin wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 9:36am:
Of course I have the luxury not to have to deal with any of the above mentioned as I do only have my self to deal with. I will submit to that. But if I had to employ others - then I would hope I can be as 'discriminatory' as I can for my own benefit and not take on someone, just because the Govt says I have to, etc.
But I know many a business that would 'wish' it was like what I said above... but for the 'anti-discrimination' laws.
Some manage to side-step having to take all that on.


So can I take it that you're an employer and not an employee. Which I hope you agree is helpful to clarify when you comment in future about the value of Worker Unions.   


Coming from an Employee who had to do the duties of Female staff that were long in their pregancies and still getting paid their higher rate upon me doing their work - forced to by Employers 'because they were pregnant' (emotional sexist blackmail).
Personally, I reckon their husbands should have come in to do their knocked-up wives jobs.

Not a productive way to conduct business.
I, as an Employee, shouldn't have to put up with that.


Sorry but that confused jumble of words is totally off topic. We weren't debating the merits of maternity leave. In any event i think I got my answer; you're an employer and not a worker.

So tell me this. It really is a very simple question to answer. Are you subscribed to or a member of some small business organization or ever got advice or assistance from a small business organization in the running of your business? 


JaSin?


Im not sure what you mean Greg


I'm asking JaSin to answer your question.


I see. Yes, I would like him to answer too.
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Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.
 
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Steampipe
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #20 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 10:29am
 
The_Barnacle wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 3:07pm:
whiteknight wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 8:01am:
McDonald’s chain fined for denying toilet or drink breaks to young staff 



It's no surprise that this is happening more now that there has been deregulation of the labour market
Wage theft
calling employees "contractors" so they don't have to pay them their entitlements
It's returning to Victorian times


Entitlements for business owners have diminished also.
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Jest
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #21 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 11:01am
 
Steampipe wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 10:29am:
The_Barnacle wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 3:07pm:
whiteknight wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 8:01am:
McDonald’s chain fined for denying toilet or drink breaks to young staff 



It's no surprise that this is happening more now that there has been deregulation of the labour market
Wage theft
calling employees "contractors" so they don't have to pay them their entitlements
It's returning to Victorian times


Entitlements for business owners have diminished also.

Such as?
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Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.
 
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Steampipe
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #22 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 11:08am
 
Jest wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 11:01am:
Steampipe wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 10:29am:
The_Barnacle wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 3:07pm:
whiteknight wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 8:01am:
McDonald’s chain fined for denying toilet or drink breaks to young staff 



It's no surprise that this is happening more now that there has been deregulation of the labour market
Wage theft
calling employees "contractors" so they don't have to pay them their entitlements
It's returning to Victorian times


Entitlements for business owners have diminished also.

Such as?



Loyalty from employees.

Getting a good days work for the pay they give.

Ability to run their business with flexibility.

Being able to react to markets forces.


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Jest
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #23 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 12:02pm
 
Steampipe wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 11:08am:
Jest wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 11:01am:
Steampipe wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 10:29am:
The_Barnacle wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 3:07pm:
whiteknight wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 8:01am:
McDonald’s chain fined for denying toilet or drink breaks to young staff 



It's no surprise that this is happening more now that there has been deregulation of the labour market
Wage theft
calling employees "contractors" so they don't have to pay them their entitlements
It's returning to Victorian times


Entitlements for business owners have diminished also.

Such as?



Loyalty from employees.

Getting a good days work for the pay they give.

Ability to run their business with flexibility.

Being able to react to markets forces.




So in other words when you said "Entitlements for business owners have diminished also", you didn't mean the Govt has taken any entitlements away from you. You meant the usual Farmer/Small Business gripe that everyone owes them a living. Workers have to put aside their own interests and forget about how much money they need to survive and just be loyal to you instead. And just because farmer's/Small Business say they pay their workers fairly doesn't mean its true AND more often than not its patently untrue AND thats even before we factor in that most workers are expected to increasingly donate more and more free hours to their employer (who is still not satisfied and will never be satisfied) and who eventually cheats him of his proper wage anyway.   

Which gets us to what you really mean by "Ability to run their business with flexibility". See in the past Small Business people have used this expression as a euphemism for not being allowed to pay under the minimum wage, offer appalling conditions of work for long hours, obey the laws like everyone else, pay their taxes and not steal their workers wages whenever they get the opportunity. Is that what you mean by "flexibility"?

And finally whats changed that you say that now farmers and Small Business people are stopped from reacting to markets forces. Is this another one of those "flexibility" euphemism or is it just making excuses for not being good at farming and conducting a business.   
 
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Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.
 
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Steampipe
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #24 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 12:14pm
 
Jest wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 12:02pm:
Steampipe wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 11:08am:
Jest wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 11:01am:
Steampipe wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 10:29am:
The_Barnacle wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 3:07pm:
whiteknight wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 8:01am:
McDonald’s chain fined for denying toilet or drink breaks to young staff 



It's no surprise that this is happening more now that there has been deregulation of the labour market
Wage theft
calling employees "contractors" so they don't have to pay them their entitlements
It's returning to Victorian times


Entitlements for business owners have diminished also.

Such as?



Loyalty from employees.

Getting a good days work for the pay they give.

Ability to run their business with flexibility.

Being able to react to markets forces.




So in other words when you said "Entitlements for business owners have diminished also", you didn't mean the Govt has taken any entitlements away from you. You meant the usual Farmer/Small Business gripe that everyone owes them a living. Workers have to put aside their own interests and forget about how much money they need to survive and just be loyal to you instead. And just because farmer's/Small Business say they pay their workers fairly doesn't mean its true AND more often than not its patently untrue AND thats even before we factor in that most workers are expected to increasingly donate more and more free hours to their employer (who is still not satisfied and will never be satisfied) and who eventually cheats him of his proper wage anyway.   

Which gets us to what you really mean by "Ability to run their business with flexibility". See in the past Small Business people have used this expression as a euphemism for not being allowed to pay under the minimum wage, offer appalling conditions of work for long hours, obey the laws like everyone else, pay their taxes and not steal their workers wages whenever they get the opportunity. Is that what you mean by "flexibility"?

And finally whats changed that you say that now farmers and Small Business people are stopped from reacting to markets forces. Is this another one of those "flexibility" euphemism or is it just making excuses for not being good at farming and conducting a business.   
 


No, you said all that poo not me.

Do you have any experience employing people?.
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Jest
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #25 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 1:04pm
 
Steampipe wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 12:14pm:
Jest wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 12:02pm:
Steampipe wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 11:08am:
Jest wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 11:01am:
Steampipe wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 10:29am:
The_Barnacle wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 3:07pm:
whiteknight wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 8:01am:
McDonald’s chain fined for denying toilet or drink breaks to young staff 



It's no surprise that this is happening more now that there has been deregulation of the labour market
Wage theft
calling employees "contractors" so they don't have to pay them their entitlements
It's returning to Victorian times


Entitlements for business owners have diminished also.

Such as?



Loyalty from employees.

Getting a good days work for the pay they give.

Ability to run their business with flexibility.

Being able to react to markets forces.




So in other words when you said "Entitlements for business owners have diminished also", you didn't mean the Govt has taken any entitlements away from you. You meant the usual Farmer/Small Business gripe that everyone owes them a living. Workers have to put aside their own interests and forget about how much money they need to survive and just be loyal to you instead. And just because farmer's/Small Business say they pay their workers fairly doesn't mean its true AND more often than not its patently untrue AND thats even before we factor in that most workers are expected to increasingly donate more and more free hours to their employer (who is still not satisfied and will never be satisfied) and who eventually cheats him of his proper wage anyway.   

Which gets us to what you really mean by "Ability to run their business with flexibility". See in the past Small Business people have used this expression as a euphemism for not being allowed to pay under the minimum wage, offer appalling conditions of work for long hours, obey the laws like everyone else, pay their taxes and not steal their workers wages whenever they get the opportunity. Is that what you mean by "flexibility"?

And finally whats changed that you say that now farmers and Small Business people are stopped from reacting to markets forces. Is this another one of those "flexibility" euphemism or is it just making excuses for not being good at farming and conducting a business.   
 


No, you said all that poo not me.

Do you have any experience employing people?.


No my response was to the poo you wrote.

So to recap, when you said that "Entitlements for business owners have diminished also", turns out there are in fact no entitlements that you are able to point to that the Govt or any other authority has taken away from business owners. But of course you can change your answer if you want. So what entitlements have been taken away from small business owners at the same time that the labour market has been deregulated by Govt laws to allow the things Barnacle referred to, including wholesale wage theft and diminishing Worker's pay and conditions by allowing Business owners to now classify their employees as contractors. A straight answer would be nice this time.   

As to your questions, which I will give a straight answer to; no I have never employed anyone.  But I have been employed by many small businesses and farmers and so has my wife, my 2 kids, my father and mother, my 4 siblings and too many friends and acquaintances to count and I can therefore say with as much authority as you about the pressures that can impact on the employment relationship between employers and employees.

Now have you any experience employing people and in what kind of business was that and for how long?
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Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.
 
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UnSubRocky
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #26 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 2:02pm
 
I have a coffee a couple of hours before I go to work. I cannot last 4 hours before my break. If I need to go to the toilet during a shift, I will hold on until I get a momentary break in my work before going.

I usually have a green tea water sitting in a canister in the fridge at work for those other short breaks. It is not unreasonable to have quick breaks for those. We are required to wash and sanitise our hands at least 4 times a shift, anyway. So, it does not matter if we do that after we have a quick drink of water.
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greggerypeccary
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #27 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 2:34pm
 
UnSubRocky wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 2:02pm:
I have a coffee a couple of hours before I go to work. I cannot last 4 hours before my break.


You don't have to.

No employer can legally stop an employee from having a drink of water or going to the toilet when they need to.

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Frank
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #28 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 5:16pm
 
UnSubRocky wrote on Oct 28th, 2020 at 2:02pm:
I have a coffee a couple of hours before I go to work. I cannot last 4 hours before my break. If I need to go to the toilet during a shift, I will hold on until I get a momentary break in my work before going.

I usually have a green tea water sitting in a canister in the fridge at work for those other short breaks. It is not unreasonable to have quick breaks for those. We are required to wash and sanitise our hands at least 4 times a shift, anyway. So, it does not matter if we do that after we have a quick drink of water.



Sounds like you are in a re-education camp, Rocky...
Is it working?


Tongue
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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.
 
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Jasin
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Re: You Got To Have A Sick Day Now And Again
Reply #29 - Oct 28th, 2020 at 5:53pm
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 11:06am:
Jasin wrote on Oct 27th, 2020 at 8:52am:
Best way to run a successful business is to
Not employ kids.
Don't employ Yellow Minions (just like kids) for poor quality mass production.
Don't employ lazy Black men - who only like to stroke the size of their dicks (see movie by Lars Von Trier: Nymphomaniac) with utter vanity about their superior masculinity.
Don't employ women who are prone to 'relationships' in the workplace.
Don't employ women who are away on maternity leave most of the time (and still getting paid).
Don't employ Unionists - they'll take a cut from the till.
Don't employ people who are only in it for the money either.

Employ someone who will enjoy working for you - simple as that.


Pretty good until you got to your Pet Hate - Unionists take nothing from the till that everyone doesn't get.... you're all on the same deal.

And always remember - those preggers etc women will carry some of the load for you some day in return - in a pig's arse they will...

Downe at Ye Olde Nursinge Home:-

"Oh, JaSin - could I help you with that heavy box to that top shelf?"

"Jeez, Miranda - I never thought you'd offer given that you had your PPL etc only three years ago and I filled in for you without extra pay for twenty months or so while still doing all my own work on top!"

"Nah - NAH - I wasn't OFFERING - I was asking for your input on my decision as to whether or not I might do it - looks too heavy for me, so you can stick it unless Fred comes along!"





Don't worry, I got compensated though - the Confederated (Federation Star) way. Wink
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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