Forum

 
  Back to OzPolitic.com   Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
  Forum Home Album HelpSearch Recent Rules LoginRegister  
 

Pages: 1 ... 11 12 13 14 15 
Send Topic Print
Unions increase inequality (Read 18256 times)
Grappler Truth Teller Feller
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 79545
Proud pre-1850's NO Voter
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #180 - Dec 11th, 2020 at 6:53pm
 
Gnads wrote on Dec 11th, 2020 at 10:53am:
Jasin wrote on Dec 2nd, 2020 at 7:50am:
Gnads wrote on Nov 20th, 2020 at 7:44am:
Jasin wrote on Nov 16th, 2020 at 11:59am:
FD is right. Many workers shy away from heavily Unionised Employments. The Unions also seem to hang off the Industries that make the most money. You might get the odd dead-beat Union Rep in some low paying job who tells you they'll get back to you next month's meeting upon an issue.
So apparently on the Big Earners like Mining attract the Union focus and dedication. Not there for you if there is no money in it for them.



What nonsense. Grin

It's a common opinion in a lot of workplaces.


Is that by a collective of Scabs?

You should form a Union. Grin


The Honourable Order Of Scabs ....   Grin  Grin  Grin 
a.k.a. the Imperial Guild of Soul-less Parasites.....

Back to top
 

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams
 
IP Logged
 
John Smith
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 71950
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #181 - Dec 11th, 2020 at 8:29pm
 
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2020 at 3:49pm:
I am not going to bother reading the tons of irrelevant crap posted



of course not .... 

By the way, how do you know it's irrelevant if you haven't read it? Is that the same way you know all economists agree with Milton Friedman. Cheesy Cheesy
Back to top
 

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
IP Logged
 
Gnads
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 27647
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #182 - Dec 12th, 2020 at 5:41am
 
John Smith wrote on Dec 11th, 2020 at 8:29pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2020 at 3:49pm:
I am not going to bother reading the tons of irrelevant crap posted



of course not .... 

By the way, how do you know it's irrelevant if you haven't read it? Is that the same way you know all economists agree with Milton Friedman. Cheesy Cheesy


The tons of  Trade Union bashing crap he posts is usually lies or irrelevant.
Back to top
 

"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais
 
IP Logged
 
freediver
Gold Member
*****
Offline


www.ozpolitic.com

Posts: 47043
At my desk.
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #183 - Dec 15th, 2020 at 7:06pm
 
John Smith wrote on Dec 11th, 2020 at 8:29pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2020 at 3:49pm:
I am not going to bother reading the tons of irrelevant crap posted



of course not .... 

By the way, how do you know it's irrelevant if you haven't read it? Is that the same way you know all economists agree with Milton Friedman. Cheesy Cheesy


Because you fail to make a coherent point from it. You cannot just copy and paste John. One of these days you will have to learn to think for yourself. Then we won't have to try to guess why you are so confused.

Quote:
The tons of  Trade Union bashing crap he posts is usually lies or irrelevant.


If the hysterics are anything to go by I hit the mark.
Back to top
 

I identify as Mail because all I do is SendIT!
WWW  
IP Logged
 
John Smith
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 71950
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #184 - Dec 15th, 2020 at 9:02pm
 
freediver wrote on Dec 15th, 2020 at 7:06pm:
Because you fail to make a coherent point from it



what has what I say got to do with whether or not the article is relevant? Just admit that instead of being informed, you opted to make it up .
Back to top
 

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
IP Logged
 
Gnads
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 27647
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #185 - Dec 16th, 2020 at 5:51am
 
freediver wrote on Dec 15th, 2020 at 7:06pm:
John Smith wrote on Dec 11th, 2020 at 8:29pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2020 at 3:49pm:
I am not going to bother reading the tons of irrelevant crap posted



of course not .... 

By the way, how do you know it's irrelevant if you haven't read it? Is that the same way you know all economists agree with Milton Friedman. Cheesy Cheesy


Because you fail to make a coherent point from it. You cannot just copy and paste John. One of these days you will have to learn to think for yourself. Then we won't have to try to guess why you are so confused.

Quote:
The tons of  Trade Union bashing crap he posts is usually lies or irrelevant.


If the hysterics are anything to go by I hit the mark.


You couldn't hit a bull elephant in the arse with a bucket of rice.
Back to top
 

"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais
 
IP Logged
 
polite_gandalf
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 20023
Canberra
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #186 - Dec 16th, 2020 at 11:14am
 

freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2020 at 3:49pm:
I am not going to bother reading the tons of irrelevant crap posted to to prove to myself that it is irrelevant. If you cannot figure out which bit is relevant and post it, I stop there.


It is a paper that is literally about proving that unions reduce wage inequality with actual real world data. Or in other words, it directly refutes the claim in the thread topic, as well as an even more stupid claim of yours - that no economist would disagree with Friedman's cliam. Understandable I suppose why you would think such a paper is "irrelevant crap".

Quote:
What about if you do not treat men and women separately?


If you're asking is the disequalising effect on women so strong that it overrides the reverse effect on men, the answer is no. Not even close. The impact on unions on women workers is not the reverse of men - it just isn't equalising or disequalising.

But in any case, I highly doubt that Friedman's brainfart was contingent entirely on the effect happening only to women.
Back to top
 

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
IP Logged
 
polite_gandalf
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 20023
Canberra
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #187 - Dec 16th, 2020 at 11:16am
 
John Smith wrote on Dec 11th, 2020 at 8:29pm:
By the way, how do you know it's irrelevant if you haven't read it?


bing!
Back to top
 

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
IP Logged
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 79545
Proud pre-1850's NO Voter
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #188 - Dec 16th, 2020 at 11:45am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Dec 16th, 2020 at 11:14am:
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2020 at 3:49pm:
I am not going to bother reading the tons of irrelevant crap posted to to prove to myself that it is irrelevant. If you cannot figure out which bit is relevant and post it, I stop there.


It is a paper that is literally about proving that unions reduce wage inequality with actual real world data. Or in other words, it directly refutes the claim in the thread topic, as well as an even more stupid claim of yours - that no economist would disagree with Friedman's cliam. Understandable I suppose why you would think such a paper is "irrelevant crap".

Quote:
What about if you do not treat men and women separately?


If you're asking is the disequalising effect on women so strong that it overrides the reverse effect on men, the answer is no. Not even close. The impact on unions on women workers is not the reverse of men - it just isn't equalising or disequalising.

But in any case, I highly doubt that Friedman's brainfart was contingent entirely on the effect happening only to women. 


This needs exploring........... no woman is worse off than any man under the rules regardless of unions or otherwise ....... real average incomes per hour have tipped in favour of women.... largely due to unwarranted preference and affirmative action starting at school level (see my post on the blurb from the Russian defector) to 'redress' past alleged 'wrongs' - how many years are we expected to swallow that?

Comments????
Back to top
 

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams
 
IP Logged
 
freediver
Gold Member
*****
Offline


www.ozpolitic.com

Posts: 47043
At my desk.
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #189 - Dec 20th, 2020 at 8:34am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Dec 16th, 2020 at 11:14am:
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2020 at 3:49pm:
I am not going to bother reading the tons of irrelevant crap posted to to prove to myself that it is irrelevant. If you cannot figure out which bit is relevant and post it, I stop there.


It is a paper that is literally about proving that unions reduce wage inequality with actual real world data. Or in other words, it directly refutes the claim in the thread topic, as well as an even more stupid claim of yours - that no economist would disagree with Friedman's cliam. Understandable I suppose why you would think such a paper is "irrelevant crap".

Quote:
What about if you do not treat men and women separately?


If you're asking is the disequalising effect on women so strong that it overrides the reverse effect on men, the answer is no. Not even close. The impact on unions on women workers is not the reverse of men - it just isn't equalising or disequalising.

But in any case, I highly doubt that Friedman's brainfart was contingent entirely on the effect happening only to women. 


So why did you only quote the bit with the caveat that it only applies if you restrict your analysis to one particular group?
Back to top
 

I identify as Mail because all I do is SendIT!
WWW  
IP Logged
 
John Smith
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 71950
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #190 - Dec 20th, 2020 at 8:38am
 
freediver wrote on Dec 15th, 2020 at 7:06pm:
If the hysterics are anything to go by I hit the mark.



IF one day you actually hit the mark, then you'll hit the mark. Pretending you hit it is no substitute for reality
Back to top
 

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
IP Logged
 
polite_gandalf
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 20023
Canberra
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #191 - Dec 23rd, 2020 at 8:44am
 
freediver wrote on Dec 20th, 2020 at 8:34am:
polite_gandalf wrote on Dec 16th, 2020 at 11:14am:
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2020 at 3:49pm:
I am not going to bother reading the tons of irrelevant crap posted to to prove to myself that it is irrelevant. If you cannot figure out which bit is relevant and post it, I stop there.


It is a paper that is literally about proving that unions reduce wage inequality with actual real world data. Or in other words, it directly refutes the claim in the thread topic, as well as an even more stupid claim of yours - that no economist would disagree with Friedman's cliam. Understandable I suppose why you would think such a paper is "irrelevant crap".

Quote:
What about if you do not treat men and women separately?


If you're asking is the disequalising effect on women so strong that it overrides the reverse effect on men, the answer is no. Not even close. The impact on unions on women workers is not the reverse of men - it just isn't equalising or disequalising.

But in any case, I highly doubt that Friedman's brainfart was contingent entirely on the effect happening only to women. 


So why did you only quote the bit with the caveat that it only applies if you restrict your analysis to one particular group?


You are wrong FD.

The only way you don't get an overall equalising effect is if you restrict your analysis to one group - ie women. Yet even there Friedman would still be wrong, since there is no disequalising effect as he promised.

You in fact get an overall equalising effect (according to the paper), if you include both men and women - which is what we should be doing. It requires cherry picking of the data just to get no equalising effect, but you still won't get what you and Friedman claim happens - ie a disequalising effect. Ergo, the paper proves you wrong - on two counts.
Back to top
 

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
IP Logged
 
freediver
Gold Member
*****
Offline


www.ozpolitic.com

Posts: 47043
At my desk.
Re: Unions increase inequalityG
Reply #192 - Jan 3rd, 2021 at 10:11am
 
Gandalf, why is it that every time you quote from this Freeman paper and criticise me for not reading the whole thing, it seems to have been published in a different year, says something different to the previous time you quoted it, and there is no link to where you got it from?
Back to top
 

I identify as Mail because all I do is SendIT!
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 79545
Proud pre-1850's NO Voter
Gender: male
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #193 - Jan 3rd, 2021 at 10:42am
 
Anyway, unions don't increase inequality - many factors of inequality create inequality, and the headline is false in intent... if the occasional contract, under government compulsion given the rules these days, means some workers in the same industry and jobs get more and others less - within the 'safety nets'* - that is not 'equality' in the true sense, but merely common contracts separated by a common language and unions do not control contracts ...... as for employment - unions do not control that... neither does government despite its perpetual claims of 'creating jobs', and often - neither does management since often they have no idea what they are doing anyway but merely blunder along.

Shame, FD, shame...

* same as some sheila whining that she's only paid $1.8m to appear on daily TV but some bloke is paid $2m - BOTH are massively overpaid compared to the average journalist - same as a bit player is massively underpaid next to a star, but both are never paid below the safety net....
Back to top
 

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams
 
IP Logged
 
freediver
Gold Member
*****
Offline


www.ozpolitic.com

Posts: 47043
At my desk.
Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #194 - Jan 3rd, 2021 at 10:48am
 
Quote:
as for employment - unions do not control that... neither does government despite its perpetual claims of 'creating jobs'


Sure they do. There is a direct link between minimum wages (whether they be by government dictate or collusion), unemployment benefits etc, and levels of employment.
Back to top
 

I identify as Mail because all I do is SendIT!
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 ... 11 12 13 14 15 
Send Topic Print