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Unions increase inequality (Read 5707 times)
freediver
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #15 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 8:52am
 
Perhaps Grapps et al do not even realise this is a different thread with a different topic.

freediver wrote on Oct 2nd, 2020 at 10:24am:
To the extent that unions increase salary within an industry, they reduce employment. The people who cannot get a job in a particular industry because of unions inevitably seek employment in other industries, and thus drive down wages in those industries. As unions tend to be most active in trades that already have higher salaries, they tend to drive down salaries that were already lower. Thus, they increase wage inequality.

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Ajax
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #16 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 8:59am
 
First Iím not in a union my profession has no union and our pay is good, although since the GFC the pay hasnít been as good as it was before the GFC.

My dad was in a union he was a production worker and he used to tell me what those guys had to go through to get a pay rise.

As an individual you stood no chance as a collective you got some peanuts to keep you close to the rise of the cost of living.

As for Milton Friedman and his ideologies at the University of Chicago, through his international students he first implemented his brand of economics (neo-liberalism) in nations that had dictators and it didnít go so well all these nations went bust.

Neoliberalism puts corporations above nations and that is not good for anyone especially the average man and woman because a hand full of greedy men running a corporation only  worry about their bottom line and not whatís happening to the average Joe and Jacinta out there in the real world.

Keynesian economics was in place after WW2 and most nations thrived, since the late 60ís early 70ís Milton was trying to overthrow this form of capitalism with his own neo-liberalism.

Thatcher, Reagan and here in Australia the Hawke/Keating government did away with Keynesian economics and adopted Miltonís neo-liberalism.

Thatís when the best treasurer in the world Mr Keating floated our dollar which dropped down to half the value of the green back and then the seagulls (oligarchy) swooped in to Australia and bought up most public assets for half price.

The oligarchy donít bestow you with the best treasure in the world crown unless you sell your country to them for peanuts. Followed by twits such as Jeff Kennett and John Howard who added to the damage.

And now after 40 odd years we have a corporatocracy where corporations rule the land instead of governments.

Example

Before we sold of our electricity we had the cheapest power on the planet, now after privatization we have one of the most expensive and there are many more examples, but you get the picture.

Now this BULLSHIT that everyone has bought into that if the state owns it its communism is the biggest malarkey ever.

When our government owned our public assets were we a communist nationÖÖÖ..???
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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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freediver
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #17 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:05am
 
Wow. That was a really long post Ajax. All of it completely irrelevant to the topic of course.

Is it that you recognise the truth in what I post, but strongly and sincerely wish it were not true, leading to your compulsion to post something in response, combined with your reluctance to think about and address the topic?
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Dnarever
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #18 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:06am
 
freediver wrote on Oct 2nd, 2020 at 10:24am:
This is an idea from Milton Friedman. To the extent that unions increase salary within an industry, they reduce employment. The people who cannot get a job in a particular industry because of unions inevitably seek employment in other industries, and thus drive down wages in those industries. As unions tend to be most active in trades that already have higher salaries, they tend to drive down salaries that were already lower. Thus, they increase wage inequality.


The right spread all sorts of propaganda like this - It is better to earn less everyone is better off. 3.5 seconds later they are supporting management increases?

Unions have improved a lot of things in conditions and pay across the board, saying anything different is just dishonest.
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greggerypeccary
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #19 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:06am
 
Ajax wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 8:59am:
First Iím not in a union my profession has no union ...


Of course you have a union.

What industry is it?
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JaSin.
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #20 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:16am
 
Don't you just like how the Unions scuttle a business by using the business's own workers to cause the mutiny right at crucial or crises moments.
Just when you're trying to escape the Mafia, the Union rep takes the keys to the escape vehicle.

Conan never needed a Union Rep as a Labourer with a slice of sharp metal and a price for female pleasure.
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Dnarever
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #21 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:19am
 
freediver wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 8:52am:
Perhaps Grapps et al do not even realise this is a different thread with a different topic.

freediver wrote on Oct 2nd, 2020 at 10:24am:
To the extent that unions increase salary within an industry, they reduce employment. The people who cannot get a job in a particular industry because of unions inevitably seek employment in other industries, and thus drive down wages in those industries. As unions tend to be most active in trades that already have higher salaries, they tend to drive down salaries that were already lower. Thus, they increase wage inequality.



Quote:
seek employment in other industries, and thus drive down wages in those industries.


People seeking employment drives down wages ?

John Howard as treasurer tried this around 1977,78 as treasurer to fight inflation / stagflation. The Howard / Freedman belief was that increasing unemployment  (increasing demand for employment) would force wages pressure down and correct for inflation. The result was that we got higher unemployment and increased inflation - it not only didn't work the exact opposite happened.

Each and every time this Freedmen theory has been tested it failed.

Conclusion: The Freedmen's should stick to training horses.
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Ajax
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #22 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:21am
 
freediver wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:05am:
Wow. That was a really long post Ajax. All of it completely irrelevant to the topic of course.

Is it that you recognise the truth in what I post, but strongly and sincerely wish it were not true, leading to your compulsion to post something in response, combined with your reluctance to think about and address the topic?


So does that mean that when the lecturer Milton Friedman at the University of Chicago got his yearly appraisal and then a higher remuneration for his good services an aspiring lecturer for the University of Chicago would lose a spot?

And go into another industry making the wages lower for that industry and its workers....?

No not at all..!

It means that the next time they have to employ a lecturer at the University of Chicago  that individual depending upon his or her experience would start off on a higher rate.

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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Ajax
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #23 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:23am
 
Dnarever wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:06am:
freediver wrote on Oct 2nd, 2020 at 10:24am:
This is an idea from Milton Friedman. To the extent that unions increase salary within an industry, they reduce employment. The people who cannot get a job in a particular industry because of unions inevitably seek employment in other industries, and thus drive down wages in those industries. As unions tend to be most active in trades that already have higher salaries, they tend to drive down salaries that were already lower. Thus, they increase wage inequality.


The right spread all sorts of propaganda like this - It is better to earn less everyone is better off. 3.5 seconds later they are supporting management increases?

Unions have improved a lot of things in conditions and pay across the board, saying anything different is just dishonest.


Yep, CEO's get millions but the workers asking for a pay rise will ruin the company....LMFAO.

FD you have truly been brainwashed.
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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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Dnarever
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #24 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:23am
 
Historically and going forward Unions have probably been and will continue to be the single greatest impediment to inequality.
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Ajax
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #25 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:25am
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:06am:
Ajax wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 8:59am:
First Iím not in a union my profession has no union ...


Of course you have a union.

What industry is it?


Lets just say engineering......... Wink

Anymore and I'll have to kill you.
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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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freediver
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #26 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:29am
 
Dnarever wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:19am:
Quote:
seek employment in other industries, and thus drive down wages in those industries.


People seeking employment drives down wages ?


Yes. If the number of jobseekers goes down, wages inevitably rise. If they go up, wages go down.

What exactly is your difficulty with this concept?
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Ajax
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #27 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:30am
 
freediver wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:29am:
Dnarever wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:19am:
Quote:
seek employment in other industries, and thus drive down wages in those industries.


People seeking employment drives down wages ?


Yes. If the number of jobseekers goes down, wages inevitably rise. If they go up, wages go down.

What exactly is your difficulty with this concept?


Yes this is what happens when you allow corporations to take their business off shore to use slave labor.
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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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greggerypeccary
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #28 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:32am
 
Ajax wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:25am:
greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:06am:
Ajax wrote on Oct 3rd, 2020 at 8:59am:
First Iím not in a union my profession has no union ...


Of course you have a union.

What industry is it?


Lets just say engineering......... Wink

Anymore and I'll have to kill you.


Well, there is both a Union and a Modern Award that covers you.

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JaSin.
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Re: Unions increase inequality
Reply #29 - Oct 3rd, 2020 at 9:34am
 
Unions are for those who 'have to' work in crap jobs that make them feel that they need to gain more from the job for lack of their own achievability to get to the top.
Unions are for those who 'have to' work 16 hours a day with no sickies and for peanuts.

In Australia - people don't 'have to' work for such businesses. Australia is getting rid of businesses (like mass production manufacturing) that supply these sort of workers that the Unions go for - like cheap Asian Labour and illegal immigrant workers. We don't need that kind here.

I work from 2 to 6 hours a day with a very high pay rate than my 'average' over life. I work when I want to which is usually just 3 days a week. Sometimes I take the odd 'week' off. So far I've only had to work 'naked' for the women twice. My long blonde hair hanging in ringlets of wet. My taunt skin glistening with man sweat. The women rubbing their legs like crickets at the sight of my tight buttocks as I vaccuum their floors, do their dishes and all the 'simple' jobs women have to do. I get paid to make women wet watching a buff 50 year old naked sex god like me - do the ironing. Oh yeah - I work 'hard'  Grin
I have my ethics though. I don't cross the line and sire kids for young women who see me as their 'daddy' issue answer.

Yeah - who needs a Union.
Working 'Australian' style like a convict is much better.  Wink
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