Australian Politics Forum - the mindless compulsion to increase super

The_Barnacle

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Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super
Reply #180 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:10am

freediver wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:06am:

Sure, if you think objecting to them taking your money against your will "for your own good" must be some kind of ideology.

How do industry super funds compare to retail non-super funds?

Why don't you tell us?
The highest Term Deposit rate at the CBA is 0.4%

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freediver

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Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super
Reply #181 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:19am

The_Barnacle wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:10am:

freediver wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:06am:

Sure, if you think objecting to them taking your money against your will "for your own good" must be some kind of ideology.

How do industry super funds compare to retail non-super funds?

Why don't you tell us?
The highest Term Deposit rate at the CBA is 0.4%

A CBA term deposit is not a retail managed fund. I put some money into retail managed funds in 2018. So far they are up 93% on average. I put more in last year - that is up 45% on average.

These industry super funds are not lobbying for you to put your super with them rather than with retail super funds. They are lobbying to force the government to take your money off you because you cannot be trusted to manage it yourself. They have a vested interest, because they live off it. Huge amounts of money are taken out of people's saving every year just to manage superannuation compliance costs, before you even get to paying these people to manage the investment in the conventional sense.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47364 At my desk.	Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super Reply #182 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:29am Anyone who tells you to hand over your money without thinking about what you are doing is a fool. If they try to force you to do it, they are a thief.
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The_Barnacle

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Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super
Reply #183 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:33am

freediver wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:19am:

The_Barnacle wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:10am:

freediver wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:06am:

Sure, if you think objecting to them taking your money against your will "for your own good" must be some kind of ideology.

How do industry super funds compare to retail non-super funds?

Why don't you tell us?
The highest Term Deposit rate at the CBA is 0.4%

A CBA term deposit is not a retail managed fund. I put some money into retail managed funds in 2018. So far they are up 93% on average. I put more in last year - that is up 45% on average.

I'm going to call BS on that.
According to
https://www.investsmart.com.au/managed-funds/top-funds
No fund has returned more than 30% over the past 3 years
You also forgot to mention the additional fees you are paying to shareholders of retail funds

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47364 At my desk.	Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super Reply #184 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:37am That's 30% per annum. Over 3 years, that gives you 120%. The one at the top of your list is one of the ones I put money into in 2018 and 2020.
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The_Barnacle

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Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super
Reply #185 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:48am

freediver wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:37am:

That's 30% per annum. Over 3 years, that gives you 120%.

The one at the top of your list is one of the ones I put money into in 2018 and 2020.

No it isn't FD. They are "returns", not "returns per annum"
If you seriously think you have got a 93% return on your money in 3 years then I have a bridge I can sell you

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47364 At my desk.	Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super Reply #186 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:50am Maybe you should give your money to the union-run super funds.
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The_Barnacle Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6205 Melbourne Gender:	Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super Reply #187 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:57am freediver wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 10:50am: Maybe you should give your money to the union-run super funds. Like I said. This is just ideological union bashing, and letting your emotions decide how you invest isn't recommended.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47364 At my desk.	Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super Reply #188 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 11:00am They are returns per annum barnacle. You are the one being sold a bridge, and now you are announcing to everyone how clever you are for buying it.
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Captain Nemo Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 8428 Melbourne Gender:	Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super Reply #189 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 11:13am https://www.superratings.com.au/top-10-super-funds/
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The_Barnacle

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Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super
Reply #190 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 11:20am

freediver wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 11:00am:

They are returns per annum barnacle. You are the one being sold a bridge, and now you are announcing to everyone how clever you are for buying it.

I still call BS that you have actually bought into it. Those manged funds are basically gambling.
Have a look at this fund also from Hyperion

https://www.eurekareport.com.au/managed-funds/fund/hyperion-managed-fund/2967

If you had bought into this fund you would have actually lost money

I don't know about you but I'm not going to risk my life savings in something like that

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freediver

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Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super
Reply #191 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 12:34pm

The_Barnacle wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 11:20am:

freediver wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 11:00am:

They are returns per annum barnacle. You are the one being sold a bridge, and now you are announcing to everyone how clever you are for buying it.

I still call BS that you have actually bought into it. Those manged funds are basically gambling.
Have a look at this fund also from Hyperion

https://www.eurekareport.com.au/managed-funds/fund/hyperion-managed-fund/2967

If you had bought into this fund you would have actually lost money

I don't know about you but I'm not going to risk my life savings in something like that

Why would I have bought into that one? You can see the performance prior to 2018 easily enough.

This is the nonsense the unions feed you about having better performance than retail funds "on average" (before you factor in super compliance costs). If you had to choose a manage fund, there are literally 10s of thousands to choose from. Would you rank them by performance, go to the middle of the pack where there "average" performers are, then scroll up a bit because you are satisfied with "above average"? Only a fool would do that, yet that is what their marketing campaign is almost entirely based on. They are capitalising on your ignorance, and they are trying to leverage that to force you to hand over even more of your hard earned money so they can siphon it off in management fees and "compliance costs".

They sold you a bridge, and you are so happy with this bridge that you own that you are recommending bridges to all your friends.

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Laugh till you cry

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Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super
Reply #192 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 5:18pm

The more the compulsory superannuation contributions increase, the more the returns will tend towards zero. In fact, in the worst case, the returns may be negative.

People should be able to make their own judgments on how to invest their money.

Compulsory superannuation funds enrich the management and the salespersons of those funds.

One of the reasons for the sell-off of public utilities was to create entities that could be invested in as the market was becoming awash with compulsory investment money.

Governments and superannuation fund managers will need to invent new entities or schemes to invest in if contribution rates increase.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47364 At my desk.	Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super Reply #193 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 5:53pm Quote: Compulsory superannuation funds enrich the management and the salespersons of those funds. It also creates a huge industry of people filling out super compliance paperwork. It comes to nearly 1% of members' funds every year.
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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: the mindless compulsion to increase super
Reply #194 - Feb 7^th, 2021 at 6:15pm

Laugh till you cry wrote on Feb 7^th, 2021 at 5:18pm:

The more the compulsory superannuation contributions increase, the more the returns will tend towards zero. In fact, in the worst case, the returns may be negative.

People should be able to make their own judgments on how to invest their money.

Compulsory superannuation funds enrich the management and the salespersons of those funds.

One of the reasons for the sell-off of public utilities was to create entities that could be invested in as the market was becoming awash with compulsory investment money.

Governments and superannuation fund managers will need to invent new entities or schemes to invest in if contribution rates increase.

You need to explain you premise and reasoning more than that..... HOW will such things trend towards zero, for one?

Perhaps they could grow an industry such as John Smith alluded to.... 'drought envoys'..... now WTF is that... but apparently the money's good and the perks magnificent and the work zero...... sort of like the disaster recovery manager chick at Kempsey shire who is frightened to get out of the office in case the hostiles out there in the hills attack her when she does nothing for their disaster relief..... should've employed a big and decent Boori and a big and decent Wharte man to do the same job...

(many are still homeless and living in tents etc one year later)

...two will fit into a Land Cruiser as easily as one, and they won't worry about being attacked... and I'm pretty sure those 'toxic males' would get out and do the WORK instead of holding down the seat in the office all day ...

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