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Muslims blame white people for diseases (Read 16464 times)
freediver
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #90 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:54pm
 
For many of the interventions to end slavery, ending slavery was the only reason. Have you noticed how many anti-slavery movements there were in the west? Have you ever heard of a Muslim one?
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Mattyfisk
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #91 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 1:00pm
 
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:19pm:
I gave you a link to "whitey ending slavery in Arabia," as you requested. You couldn't change the topic fast enough.


We're discussing the topic here, dear. I keep asking you to tell me about the topic.

If you won't tell us, do you want to quote the relevant parts of your evidence? To date, you've provided no details whatsoever.
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #92 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 1:03pm
 
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:54pm:
For many of the interventions to end slavery, ending slavery was the only reason. Have you noticed how many anti-slavery movements there were in the west? Have you ever heard of a Muslim one?


Is that your answer?

Let's not change the topic here, dear. Why don't you describe any of those interventions to end slavery?
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moses
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #93 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 3:45pm
 
Oh come on F.D. we all know the muzzies are living in utopia, that's why all them whiteys are fleeing around the globe, a dying and a trying to gain entry into the muslim utopias - - - - --- eeeerrr, aaaaarrrr, wait up, I'll have to get back to you on this one.
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #94 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 7:58pm
 
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:54pm:
For many of the interventions to end slavery, ending slavery was the only reason.


Including the military ones? Methinks you are deliberately being vague about what you actually mean by "intervention".

Its a delicate balancing act I know FD, but you're going to have to be a bit less evasive for us. Either you come clean and admit you are reducing these particular wars to single causes (against your own advise), or you concede that the claim the west intervened simply *TO* end slavery is a gross simplification.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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polite_gandalf
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #95 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 8:02pm
 
Mattyfisk wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 1:03pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:54pm:
For many of the interventions to end slavery, ending slavery was the only reason. Have you noticed how many anti-slavery movements there were in the west? Have you ever heard of a Muslim one?


Is that your answer?

Let's not change the topic here, dear. Why don't you describe any of those interventions to end slavery?


I think FD's sticking to a single unsourced and hopelessly vague sentence from wikipedia:

The continuing pressure from European countries eventually overcame the strong resistance of religious conservatives who were holding that forbidding what God permits is just as great an offence as to permit what God forbids

I know I'm convinced - aren't you K??
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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polite_gandalf
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #96 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 8:06pm
 
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:54pm:
Have you noticed how many anti-slavery movements there were in the west? Have you ever heard of a Muslim one?


Apparently your favourite wikipedia page has:

Quote:
Throughout the 19th and 20th centuries, slavery gradually became outlawed and suppressed in Muslim lands, due to a combination of pressure exerted by Western nations such as Britain and France, internal pressure from Islamic abolitionist movements, and economic pressures
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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freediver
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #97 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 9:08pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 7:58pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:54pm:
For many of the interventions to end slavery, ending slavery was the only reason.


Including the military ones? Methinks you are deliberately being vague about what you actually mean by "intervention".


Because there were a lot of them. Obviously I am not including the military ones, as I have explained several times already.

Do you know the name of any Islamic abolitionist movements?

polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 8:02pm:
Mattyfisk wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 1:03pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:54pm:
For many of the interventions to end slavery, ending slavery was the only reason. Have you noticed how many anti-slavery movements there were in the west? Have you ever heard of a Muslim one?


Is that your answer?

Let's not change the topic here, dear. Why don't you describe any of those interventions to end slavery?


I think FD's sticking to a single unsourced and hopelessly vague sentence from wikipedia:

The continuing pressure from European countries eventually overcame the strong resistance of religious conservatives who were holding that forbidding what God permits is just as great an offence as to permit what God forbids

I know I'm convinced - aren't you K??


Do you disagree with the statement Gandalf? Or are you still having a bet each way while falling back on your own ignorance of the issue?
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Mattyfisk
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #98 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 10:28pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 8:02pm:
Mattyfisk wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 1:03pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:54pm:
For many of the interventions to end slavery, ending slavery was the only reason. Have you noticed how many anti-slavery movements there were in the west? Have you ever heard of a Muslim one?


Is that your answer?

Let's not change the topic here, dear. Why don't you describe any of those interventions to end slavery?


I think FD's sticking to a single unsourced and hopelessly vague sentence from wikipedia:

The continuing pressure from European countries eventually overcame the strong resistance of religious conservatives who were holding that forbidding what God permits is just as great an offence as to permit what God forbids

I know I'm convinced - aren't you K??


Not really, because I read the next paragraph saying how slavery was stopped by Muslims themselves, economic factors and "external pressure".

So let's stay on topic. FD, what was that external pressure, and how did it end Muslim slavery?

This time, G, he'll tell us for sure.
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #99 - Jan 27th, 2020 at 10:29pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 8:06pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 12:54pm:
Have you noticed how many anti-slavery movements there were in the west? Have you ever heard of a Muslim one?


Apparently your favourite wikipedia page has:

Quote:
Throughout the 19th and 20th centuries, slavery gradually became outlawed and suppressed in Muslim lands, due to a combination of pressure exerted by Western nations such as Britain and France, internal pressure from Islamic abolitionist movements, and economic pressures


Ah.
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moses
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #100 - Jan 28th, 2020 at 4:49pm
 
Rumour has it that Trumpy foiled a plot by the *loony leftards of the world get America campaign*.

Apparently the American lunatics of the left, had devised a plan to get everyone to run off to the many muslim paradises under a world refugee programme.

The leftards only came unstuck, when the white-house staff became aware of the loony leftards flight, after they heard kettle drums playing in the distance, as they explained it, they heard trump trump, trump trump trump.

Now one of the staff (a former army man) became alert when he heard the loony left drill sergeant shouting LEFT LEFT, LEFT LEFT LEFT.

So he went outside and there they were, millions of loony lefties all marching towards the beach, where the illegal boats were lined up waiting to take them to la la land of the muzzies, where life is just so beautiful (well all the houses and roads have been destroyed), but the muzzies are still proud of the fact that the one decent thing they did, was, in then past they went against the core values of islam and abolished slavery of the kufir.

Well the rest, as they say, is history

I can't find a link, but I knew it was true when I read the bit about muzzies lead the world in abolishing slavery.
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #101 - Jan 28th, 2020 at 5:47pm
 
moses wrote on Jan 28th, 2020 at 4:49pm:
Rumour has it that Trumpy foiled a plot by the *loony leftards of the world get America campaign*.

Apparently the American lunatics of the left, had devised a plan to get everyone to run off to the many muslim paradises under a world refugee programme.

The leftards only came unstuck, when the white-house staff became aware of the loony leftards flight, after they heard kettle drums playing in the distance, as they explained it, they heard trump trump, trump trump trump.

Now one of the staff (a former army man) became alert when he heard the loony left drill sergeant shouting LEFT LEFT, LEFT LEFT LEFT.

So he went outside and there they were, millions of loony lefties all marching towards the beach, where the illegal boats were lined up waiting to take them to la la land of the muzzies, where life is just so beautiful (well all the houses and roads have been destroyed), but the muzzies are still proud of the fact that the one decent thing they did, was, in then past they went against the core values of islam and abolished slavery of the kufir.

Well the rest, as they say, is history

I can't find a link, but I knew it was true when I read the bit about muzzies lead the world in abolishing slavery.


Sure, but that was FD's source, you can't trust that. Why do you think we've been asking FD to give us examples?

He can tell us about Whitey saving Darkie from the Muselman's heinous sex slavery, gays from being executed for doing it Mardi Gras-style, 8 year old schoolgirls from being shot in the back of the head for being caught in school, you name it. FD can say whatever he likes.

That's his right in a free country, no? FD is free to tell us as many porkies as he likes.

If he gets caught, he can ask us if we prefix everything we say as being the truth, then start threads about Muslims being so unfair for asking him why he's telling fibs.
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #102 - Jan 28th, 2020 at 10:48pm
 
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 9:08pm:
Because there were a lot of them. Obviously I am not including the military ones, as I have explained several times already.


You have explained nothing FD. All you have done in this thread is deliberately obfuscate the word 'intervention', such that even now we have no idea what you mean by this concept of western intervention *to* end muslim slavery. Especially so since you are now categorically ruling out any military intervention.

And the best you can come up with to substantiate this is a vague and unsourced claim in wikipedia about "continuing pressure" from Europe that "overcame" (whatever that means) muslims and their slaving.

The reason for this evasiveness is not hard to understand of course. The moment you start to elaborate in any detail about the nature of western intervention, we quickly get neck deep in the murky waters of colonialism and empire - in which strategic control and resource exploitation were the main considerations.

You also can't spend 5 minutes exploring the decline of Islamic slavery without running into the arguments pointing out the role played by internal forces - laws and edicts made by the Ottoman Caliph - and yes, Islamic abolitionist movements. The fact that your own evidence goes on to elaborate on all those things says all there needs to be said about your habit of cherrypicking articles and oversimplifying complex topics into mindless memes.

Quote:
Do you know the name of any Islamic abolitionist movements?


No. And yet, the very same article that you present as gospel truth in its claim about European pressure "overcoming" muslim slavery, states that they were there and they helped end slavery.

So I'm afraid you're not going to get far in the credibility stakes by attempting to rubbish this claim. Not until you also rubbish all other claims in the article.

Quote:
Do you disagree with the statement Gandalf? Or are you still having a bet each way while falling back on your own ignorance of the issue?


Its impossible for any objective person to agree or disagree with it - because it is so vague that it is neither here nor there. What "pressure" exactly? What activity did this involve? What does it mean by "overcome"? Not even you can explain it. On top of that there isn't even any source for the claim. So yes, of course I "fall back on my own ignorance" - because neither you or the article gives us anything to form an informed opinion on the matter. Sure, I could go and do my own independent research on the topic, but thats not the point. The point is, it is your claim which you are attempting to substantiate to us, and the one piece of evidence you provide is entirely inadequate.
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« Last Edit: Jan 28th, 2020 at 10:53pm by polite_gandalf »  

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Re: Muslims blame white people for diseases
Reply #103 - Jan 29th, 2020 at 2:32am
 
Shame we can't use ILLEGAL immigrants as Slaves & Concubines.
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Re: slavery in Islam
Reply #104 - Jan 29th, 2020 at 8:12am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 28th, 2020 at 10:48pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 27th, 2020 at 9:08pm:
Because there were a lot of them. Obviously I am not including the military ones, as I have explained several times already.


You have explained nothing FD. All you have done in this thread is deliberately obfuscate the word 'intervention', such that even now we have no idea what you mean by this concept of western intervention *to* end muslim slavery. Especially so since you are now categorically ruling out any military intervention.

And the best you can come up with to substantiate this is a vague and unsourced claim in wikipedia about "continuing pressure" from Europe that "overcame" (whatever that means) muslims and their slaving.

The reason for this evasiveness is not hard to understand of course. The moment you start to elaborate in any detail about the nature of western intervention, we quickly get neck deep in the murky waters of colonialism and empire - in which strategic control and resource exploitation were the main considerations.

You also can't spend 5 minutes exploring the decline of Islamic slavery without running into the arguments pointing out the role played by internal forces - laws and edicts made by the Ottoman Caliph - and yes, Islamic abolitionist movements. The fact that your own evidence goes on to elaborate on all those things says all there needs to be said about your habit of cherrypicking articles and oversimplifying complex topics into mindless memes.

Quote:
Do you know the name of any Islamic abolitionist movements?


No. And yet, the very same article that you present as gospel truth in its claim about European pressure "overcoming" muslim slavery, states that they were there and they helped end slavery.

So I'm afraid you're not going to get far in the credibility stakes by attempting to rubbish this claim. Not until you also rubbish all other claims in the article.

Quote:
Do you disagree with the statement Gandalf? Or are you still having a bet each way while falling back on your own ignorance of the issue?


Its impossible for any objective person to agree or disagree with it - because it is so vague that it is neither here nor there. What "pressure" exactly? What activity did this involve? What does it mean by "overcome"? Not even you can explain it. On top of that there isn't even any source for the claim. So yes, of course I "fall back on my own ignorance" - because neither you or the article gives us anything to form an informed opinion on the matter. Sure, I could go and do my own independent research on the topic, but thats not the point. The point is, it is your claim which you are attempting to substantiate to us, and the one piece of evidence you provide is entirely inadequate.


Gandalf you quoted from my Wikipedia link on the west intervening to end slavery. Now you pretend to not know what we are talking about. You can't have it both ways.
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