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15th State To Ditch Electoral College (Read 2741 times)
Brian Ross
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #45 - May 27th, 2019 at 7:25pm
 
Bias_2012 wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 5:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 2:00pm:
Ah, that would explain why more people voted for Hilary than they did for el Presidente' Trump, I take it.  Remember, he lost the popular vote.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


And yet you want a future Australian head of state appointed by Parliament, with no popular vote from the people at all


Different political systems for different societies, Bias.   Roll Eyes

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mortdooley
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #46 - May 28th, 2019 at 12:18am
 
Quote:
I am unsure what society you're talking about, Mort.  Downunder, we have lived a largely classless society since the mid-1880s.   So much so, that people sit in the front seat of taxis and actually talk to the driver!  Shock, horror, hey?  Time to grow up and look at the real world.



Said the man who is better than his countrymen because unlike them he is not descended from the convict population banished to live on the other side of the world! Why would you distract a Taxi driver by talking to him? The people who swung the popular vote you keep referring to live in New York where  many of the Taxis have bullet proof partitions to protect them from the Hillary supporters.

Quote:
[quote]Interesting.  It appears the English Civil War and the Revolution of 1688 has just disappeared from your understanding of history, Mort.  I wonder why your education has been so deficit?  No one in the UK has believed in the "divine right of kings" since Charles I had his head chopped off at the end of the English Civil War.  Parliament is sovereign in the UK.  Time I think you learnt a little about history and the effects of both events had on the political life of the UK.  It will do you good to get out and to get some learnin' little man.


That just changed the faces of those at the top, it didn't improve the lives of the average person! Far too many people are only comfortable when there is a strong hand to run their lives or it wouldn't be tolerated. The kings are chosen by the political system and have different titles, same sh1t, different day!

Quote:
Does that include the two thirds of Americans that don't want Arabic numerals taught in school?  The 39% of Americans who believe the sun revolves around the Earth?  How about the many Americans who believe that pre-historic man lived with the Dinosaurs?  Mmmm?  Strange how your inadequate education system produces such results, hey?


You are going to have to provide me with links for this one, I don't know of anything two thirds of Americans agree on.

Quote:
Why am I not surprised by such ignorance amongst the majority of Americans, Mort?  It seems American society teaches it's people to be stupid, not to take an interest in politics and to look upon those that do as abnormal or something...


I wouldn't say most but just about all who support the Left with their votes and attacks on those who disagree are brain dead. The Progressive Left is busy rewriting the history books all the time. We have just about reached the level of "Fahrenheit 451" where oral history is the only one with truth to it.
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Bias_2012
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #47 - May 28th, 2019 at 2:53pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 7:25pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 5:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 2:00pm:
Ah, that would explain why more people voted for Hilary than they did for el Presidente' Trump, I take it.  Remember, he lost the popular vote.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


And yet you want a future Australian head of state appointed by Parliament, with no popular vote from the people at all


Different political systems for different societies, Bias.   Roll Eyes



That's right ... so don't criticize or complain about the way Americans want to work their political system
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #48 - May 28th, 2019 at 3:38pm
 
Bias_2012 wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 5:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 2:00pm:
Ah, that would explain why more people voted for Hilary than they did for el Presidente' Trump, I take it.  Remember, he lost the popular vote.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes



And yet you want a future Australian head of state appointed by Parliament, with no popular vote from the people at all


When was the last time we had a popular vote for the Governor General, or the Monarch?

I'm curious.
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Brian Ross
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #49 - May 28th, 2019 at 3:44pm
 
Bias_2012 wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 2:53pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 7:25pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 5:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 2:00pm:
Ah, that would explain why more people voted for Hilary than they did for el Presidente' Trump, I take it.  Remember, he lost the popular vote.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


And yet you want a future Australian head of state appointed by Parliament, with no popular vote from the people at all


Different political systems for different societies, Bias.   Roll Eyes



That's right ... so don't criticize or complain about the way Americans want to work their political system


Why ever not?  When have you criticised the Americans for their ignorant comments about Australian political life, Bias?   I can't seem to find any such posts from you.  Interesting that, hey?   I am free to criticise American politics if I so desire.  Run along, little boy, back to the little kiddies' playground where it looks like you belong...   Roll Eyes

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Bias_2012
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #50 - May 28th, 2019 at 4:18pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 3:44pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 2:53pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 7:25pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 5:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 2:00pm:
Ah, that would explain why more people voted for Hilary than they did for el Presidente' Trump, I take it.  Remember, he lost the popular vote.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


And yet you want a future Australian head of state appointed by Parliament, with no popular vote from the people at all


Different political systems for different societies, Bias.   Roll Eyes



That's right ... so don't criticize or complain about the way Americans want to work their political system


Why ever not?  When have you criticised the Americans for their ignorant comments about Australian political life, Bias?   I can't seem to find any such posts from you.  Interesting that, hey?   I am free to criticise American politics if I so desire.  Run along, little boy, back to the little kiddies' playground where it looks like you belong...   Roll Eyes



Americans have their own system

But an Australian head of state (President or whatever) should be elected by the people, not Parliament. The head of state must have allegiance to all the people without prejudice nor political allegiance.

A new Australian head of state (if ever we become a republic) must not be aligned to any political party or ideology, but only aligned to the Australian people as a whole
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« Last Edit: May 28th, 2019 at 5:20pm by Bias_2012 »  

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Brian Ross
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #51 - May 28th, 2019 at 5:50pm
 
Bias_2012 wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 4:18pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 3:44pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 2:53pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 7:25pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 5:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 2:00pm:
Ah, that would explain why more people voted for Hilary than they did for el Presidente' Trump, I take it.  Remember, he lost the popular vote.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


And yet you want a future Australian head of state appointed by Parliament, with no popular vote from the people at all


Different political systems for different societies, Bias.   Roll Eyes



That's right ... so don't criticize or complain about the way Americans want to work their political system


Why ever not?  When have you criticised the Americans for their ignorant comments about Australian political life, Bias?   I can't seem to find any such posts from you.  Interesting that, hey?   I am free to criticise American politics if I so desire.  Run along, little boy, back to the little kiddies' playground where it looks like you belong...   Roll Eyes



Americans have their own system

But an Australian head of state (President or whatever) should be elected by the people, not Parliament. The head of state must have allegiance to all the people without prejudice nor political allegiance.


According to whom, Bias?  Many HoSs are not elected "by the people".  The problem is convincing "the people" that this a purely ceremonial position, except for the reserve powers, which are very powerful indeed, would be difficult as they are force-fed Hollywood bullshit 24x7.   The GG as it stands always acts on the advice of the Federal Executive Council which is chaired by the PM (and controlled by the PM).  The President would be expected to do the same.   The only time he didn't, he provoked a massive constitutional crisis which resounds to this day.

Quote:
A new Australian head of state (if ever we become a republic) must not be aligned to any political party or ideology, but only aligned to the Australian people as a whole


Parliament is sovereign, Bias.  Until you (and "the people") face that fact, you'll never see an Australian HoS.   I would love for my children to become an Australian President.  However, it will not happen.  Howard was clever in that he didn't ask whether we wanted to become a Republic and then present "the people" with a choice of models after a period of honest discussion, he just presented them with a choice of unacceptable models, so the referendum was defeated.   Roll Eyes
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #52 - May 28th, 2019 at 5:58pm
 
AiA wrote on May 23rd, 2019 at 3:59am:
Nevada Poised To Become 15th State To Ditch Electoral College


Quote:
President Hillary Clinton?

That would have been the result of the 2016 presidential election — if the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact were in effect.

With a state Senate vote Tuesday, Nevada is close to becoming the latest state to sidestep the Electoral College when it comes to electing presidents.

According to the National Popular Vote organization, which oversees efforts to persuade states to join the compact, 14 states and the District of Columbia have agreed to pledge their 189 electors to the winner of the national popular vote — regardless of which candidate won the state. Nevada, with its six electoral votes, would bring the total to 195. Once 270 electors are pledged, the compact would kick in.



https://www.npr.org/2019/05/22/725616541/nevada-poised-to-become-15th-state-to-d...


I expect they control enough votes already to make it work.
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Brian Ross
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #53 - May 28th, 2019 at 9:22pm
 
mortdooley wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 12:18am:
Quote:
I am unsure what society you're talking about, Mort.  Downunder, we have lived a largely classless society since the mid-1880s.   So much so, that people sit in the front seat of taxis and actually talk to the driver!  Shock, horror, hey?  Time to grow up and look at the real world.


Said the man who is better than his countrymen because unlike them he is not descended from the convict population banished to live on the other side of the world!


Oh, no, I did not.  I merely pointed out, in regards to your attempt to insult me that you were wrong - I was not convict descended.   I am proud of my nation's history, convicts and all.  However, you being a Septic, it's obvious you're been reading "A Fatal Shore" - that contrived piece of rubbish.   Each Australian colony was unique in it's formation and mine was free, all the way.

Quote:
Why would you distract a Taxi driver by talking to him? The people who swung the popular vote you keep referring to live in New York where  many of the Taxis have bullet proof partitions to protect them from the Hillary supporters.


Such a nice attitude you have towards your fellow Americans.  Why would I want to chat to my fellow Australian who just happens to be driving me somewhere?  'cause I am socialable and I don't hold myself above him, merely because he is a taxi driver.  Basically, he is providing a service, he is not a servant.

Quote:
Quote:
Interesting.  It appears the English Civil War and the Revolution of 1688 has just disappeared from your understanding of history, Mort.  I wonder why your education has been so deficit?  No one in the UK has believed in the "divine right of kings" since Charles I had his head chopped off at the end of the English Civil War.  Parliament is sovereign in the UK.  Time I think you learnt a little about history and the effects of both events had on the political life of the UK.  It will do you good to get out and to get some learnin' little man.


That just changed the faces of those at the top, it didn't improve the lives of the average person! Far too many people are only comfortable when there is a strong hand to run their lives or it wouldn't be tolerated. The kings are chosen by the political system and have different titles, same sh1t, different day!


Oh, it took time, I will admit but the pace of change was steady and sure.  What it meant was that Parliament as sovereign and that the monarch ruled at it's pleasure.  Guess who elects Parliament?  The people.  Today, the UK is more democratic than the US it appears.  No need for an "electoral college", no need for the song and dance of the primaries, no way the Prime Minister can avoid the gaze of the people when he faces Parliament at Question Time.

Quote:
Quote:
Does that include the two thirds of Americans that don't want Arabic numerals taught in school?  The 39% of Americans who believe the sun revolves around the Earth?  How about the many Americans who believe that pre-historic man lived with the Dinosaurs?  Mmmm?  Strange how your inadequate education system produces such results, hey?


You are going to have to provide me with links for this one, I don't know of anything two thirds of Americans agree on.


Should Arabic numerals be taught in schools?

25% of Americans who believe the sun revolves around the Earth

Over 40% of Americans believe humans and dinosaurs shared the planet

Quote:
Quote:
Why am I not surprised by such ignorance amongst the majority of Americans, Mort?  It seems American society teaches it's people to be stupid, not to take an interest in politics and to look upon those that do as abnormal or something...


I wouldn't say most but just about all who support the Left with their votes and attacks on those who disagree are brain dead. The Progressive Left is busy rewriting the history books all the time. We have just about reached the level of "Fahrenheit 451" where oral history is the only one with truth to it.


And we have the regressive Right who disbelieve what the scientists are saying on so much.  Evolution, Global Warming, Pollution, etc., etc.   The regressive Right doesn't want even something like "Fahrenheit 451", they want people back in caves...   Roll Eyes

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Karnal
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #54 - May 28th, 2019 at 10:05pm
 
freediver wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 5:58pm:
AiA wrote on May 23rd, 2019 at 3:59am:
Nevada Poised To Become 15th State To Ditch Electoral College


Quote:
President Hillary Clinton?

That would have been the result of the 2016 presidential election — if the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact were in effect.

With a state Senate vote Tuesday, Nevada is close to becoming the latest state to sidestep the Electoral College when it comes to electing presidents.

According to the National Popular Vote organization, which oversees efforts to persuade states to join the compact, 14 states and the District of Columbia have agreed to pledge their 189 electors to the winner of the national popular vote — regardless of which candidate won the state. Nevada, with its six electoral votes, would bring the total to 195. Once 270 electors are pledged, the compact would kick in.



https://www.npr.org/2019/05/22/725616541/nevada-poised-to-become-15th-state-to-d...


I expect they control enough votes already to make it work.


What are you doing here?
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #55 - May 28th, 2019 at 11:03pm
 
freediver wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 5:58pm:
.......I expect they control enough votes already to make it work.


In order to have the desired affect 270 votes are required (presently they have 195).

The only problematic fly in the ointment for the Compact Movement will come from 5 votes...........Yes, 5 of the 9 votes in the United States Supreme Court that, based on the 230+ year old electoral process in the United States Constitution, they will, in my honest opinion, decide that what the States are attempting to do undermines the underpinnings of Article II, Section 1, Clause 3, & the 12th Amendment of the US Constitution, & therefore the laws devised by the individual States to basically do away with the Electoral College, are inconsistent with the US Constitution, & therefore are unconstitutional in total.


Quote:
In deciding how electors are appointed, state lawmakers may choose among a range of procedures. But they have a constitutional duty to choose a method consistent with the electoral system’s purpose and design. Attempting to convert electors into agents of other states—like selling them to the highest bidder—would be an unconstitutional breach of public trust.


Source: 
 
https://pagetwo.completecolorado.com/2019/02/04/why-the-national-popular-vote-scheme-is-unconstitutional/


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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #56 - May 29th, 2019 at 9:18am
 
Bias_2012 wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 4:18pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 3:44pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on May 28th, 2019 at 2:53pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 7:25pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 5:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 27th, 2019 at 2:00pm:
Ah, that would explain why more people voted for Hilary than they did for el Presidente' Trump, I take it.  Remember, he lost the popular vote.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


And yet you want a future Australian head of state appointed by Parliament, with no popular vote from the people at all


Different political systems for different societies, Bias.   Roll Eyes



That's right ... so don't criticize or complain about the way Americans want to work their political system


Why ever not?  When have you criticised the Americans for their ignorant comments about Australian political life, Bias?   I can't seem to find any such posts from you.  Interesting that, hey?   I am free to criticise American politics if I so desire.  Run along, little boy, back to the little kiddies' playground where it looks like you belong...   Roll Eyes



Americans have their own system

But an Australian head of state (President or whatever) should be elected by the people, not Parliament. The head of state must have allegiance to all the people without prejudice nor political allegiance.




When was the last time the Governor General or Monarch was elected by the people?
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mortdooley
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #57 - May 30th, 2019 at 11:14pm
 
Quote:
Such a nice attitude you have towards your fellow Americans.  Why would I want to chat to my fellow Australian who just happens to be driving me somewhere?  'cause I am sociable and I don't hold myself above him, merely because he is a taxi driver.  Basically, he is providing a service, he is not a servant.


Actually I have never had a reason to use a Taxi, shuttle bus, tour bus, public rail but never a Taxi. I rent Vehicles and take myself where I choose to go. That being said I have had no problem speaking to the drivers. One that I recall was a woman from New Zealand who drove us from our cruise ship to the airport in Seattle. She told me how many preconceived beliefs she had about us and that they all proved wrong. When you criticize you don't know what you are talking about either, at least she was happy to be among people who were not the stereotype she was led to believe.

Quote:
Should Arabic numerals be taught in schools?

25% of Americans who believe the sun revolves around the Earth

Over 40% of Americans believe humans and dinosaurs shared the planet



Your links come from very bias sources and if not made up by them are a sampling of a very strange group and do not represent common beliefs.  They have no credibility!

Quote:
And we have the regressive Right who disbelieve what the scientists are saying on so much.  Evolution, Global Warming, Pollution, etc., etc.   The regressive Right doesn't want even something like "Fahrenheit 451", they want people back in caves...


Do you mean phony Scientists like "Bill Nye the science guy" who doesn't have any more education than I do! Or people who are so far outside of their expertise that their opinion is no better then the average citizen. Basically they use a system I have disagreed with at work. You start with the conclusion you want and work backwards to prove it ignoring any information that doesn't fit the agenda.

Funny you should mention caves, I am a big fan of "Earth Ships" which don't require loin clothes or saber tooth tigers. Passive systems to heat and cool buildings is a positive thing, trading carbon credits and not reducing pollution is counter productive. It is nothing more than a redistribution of wealth while continuing to live with dirty air!
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Brian Ross
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #58 - May 31st, 2019 at 6:55pm
 
mortdooley wrote on May 30th, 2019 at 11:14pm:
Quote:
Such a nice attitude you have towards your fellow Americans.  Why would I want to chat to my fellow Australian who just happens to be driving me somewhere?  'cause I am sociable and I don't hold myself above him, merely because he is a taxi driver.  Basically, he is providing a service, he is not a servant.


Actually I have never had a reason to use a Taxi, shuttle bus, tour bus, public rail but never a Taxi. I rent Vehicles and take myself where I choose to go. That being said I have had no problem speaking to the drivers. One that I recall was a woman from New Zealand who drove us from our cruise ship to the airport in Seattle. She told me how many preconceived beliefs she had about us and that they all proved wrong. When you criticize you don't know what you are talking about either, at least she was happy to be among people who were not the stereotype she was led to believe. .


Really?  I make no such assumptions about Americans - most are nice, hard working, industrious people.  Of course, many are also crazies who hug their fetish objects to themselves at night in order to ward off this mythical, tyrannical government that they fear so much, Mort.  You sound just like one of them for some strange reason.  I wonder why?   Roll Eyes

Quote:
Quote:
Should Arabic numerals be taught in schools?

25% of Americans who believe the sun revolves around the Earth

Over 40% of Americans believe humans and dinosaurs shared the planet



Your links come from very bias sources and if not made up by them are a sampling of a very strange group and do not represent common beliefs.  They have no credibility!.


Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Insulting the message, rather than addressing the message that he conveys?  How unusual for you, Mort.  Rather an obvious and also rather a poor tactic.  Now, explain why they are "biased" and do not "represent common beliefs".   Their credentials appear more than adequate for the purposes of this discussion.  You'll just have to try harder, boyo.   Roll Eyes

Quote:
Quote:
And we have the regressive Right who disbelieve what the scientists are saying on so much.  Evolution, Global Warming, Pollution, etc., etc.   The regressive Right doesn't want even something like "Fahrenheit 451", they want people back in caves...


Do you mean phony Scientists like "Bill Nye the science guy" who doesn't have any more education than I do! Or people who are so far outside of their expertise that their opinion is no better then the average citizen. Basically they use a system I have disagreed with at work. You start with the conclusion you want and work backwards to prove it ignoring any information that doesn't fit the agenda.


Where did I quote Bill Nye, Mort?  That he is a scientific commentator and knows and understands the science about which he commentates seems to have missed you by, BTW.  I am referring to the scientists who have been forecasting about Global Warming now for nearly a generation and their forecasts appear to being proved right.  Funny that, hey?   Roll Eyes

Quote:
Funny you should mention caves, I am a big fan of "Earth Ships" which don't require loin clothes or saber tooth tigers. Passive systems to heat and cool buildings is a positive thing, trading carbon credits and not reducing pollution is counter productive. It is nothing more than a redistribution of wealth while continuing to live with dirty air!


...

Run along, Mort.  You're wasting my time here with your bullshit.   Roll Eyes
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Re: 15th State To Ditch Electoral College
Reply #59 - May 31st, 2019 at 11:33pm
 
Poor brian, I see I have hurt your feelings again. I don't suppose you have applied for that federal license so you can own Ralphies Red Rider BB Gun yet.

Quote:
mythical, tyrannical government


Venezuela is a model for the long term plans of the Left. In 1998 the people voted in Hugo Chavez and everything was going to be great because he imposed redistribution on producers of wealth. As bad as it has become their people probably don't accept they did this to themselves. They voted for more government handouts and lost their country! Why would you believe it couldn't happen here or over there? Those are famous last words when freedom is lost to a "mythical, tyrannical government"!

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-19652436

Quote:
Insulting the message


I can't imagine that you could find any crowd in any Western Country that would have twenty five percent of people who believe the Sun revolves around the Earth. At best surveys can represent how questions are asked and who they ask to get a somewhat different answer. Maybe it was a survey of Americans 4 to 7 years old or the aged with dementia. Unfortunately you could probably ask most younger Americans about their favorite Sports Figure or Celebrity and they could give you more facts about their Idols then you would ever care to know. Maybe the old saw is represented here, you ask a stupid question, you get a stupid answer!

Quote:
I am referring to the scientists who have been forecasting about Global Warming now for nearly a generation and their forecasts appear to being proved right.


Global Warming is a religion, not a science. As I have stated in the past, it is a scam to transfer wealth by creating a system of carbon credits that can be sold between countries. China buys the assigned credits from third world,non industrialized countries and its air and water are still poisoned. Topographic Maps show the contours of land masses among many other features. Water seeks its own level and will flow to rivers, canals and oceans. When the original paths are interrupted by development it changes those paths and can cause flooding where it never flooded before. It isn't the rise of Oceans or global temperatures and the Ice Caps are not shrinking.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/02/15/el-nino-effects-climate-we...

That's all the time I have for you today, the Stock Market is opening and needs my attention!
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