Australian Politics Forum - 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran

polite_gandalf

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #30 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 2:33pm

freediver wrote on May 21^st, 2019 at 9:59pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on May 21^st, 2019 at 2:14pm:

moses wrote on May 18^th, 2019 at 2:40pm:

Now gandi makes much of a single verse in the qur'an 2:256 which says there is no compulsion in religion.

O.K. gandi if it comes down to only the verses which actually use the words matter, do tell us: how many verses actually say there is no compulsion in religion?

Is there only one?

No there is not only one. I reference 18:29 all the time.

But thats not the point. You are disingenuously verbling me as saying that instead of being full of rape and torture, the Quran is really full of saying no compulsion in religion.

I am not.

The Quran is chock full of imagery and metaphors related to finding spiritual peace and harmony in belief (which itself is really just a metaphor for freeing oneself from base and earthly desires). If nothing else just read chapter 2 - the longest surah in the Quran and tell me roughly how much is 'rape and torture' and how much is a personal conversation with the individual to have and maintain faith. Read Al Fatiha at the very least - the first and by far the most important verse - as muslims say it before every prostration (ruka'a) in their prayer - 17 times a day, and countless other times as the 'go to' verse to recite for just about any occassion - weddings, funerals, or just when you're feeling anxious. What does Al Fatiha say? It is in two parts - the first part is to acknowledge/remind ourselves that God is a) the most merciful b) the sustainer of all life and c) the master of judgement. The second half is to ask God to guide us and keep us on the righteous path (the "right path" defined elsewhere in the Quran as the path of peace). Thats it. No murder rape or pillage - just remembering God as the master over all things and seeking his guidance to stay on the right path.

In fact Al Fatiha is just a microcosm of what the overall theme in the Quran is about. And this is the theme muslims recite the most - the most important verse. And the theme is further encapsulated by the 5 pillars - belief/faith in God, prayer, alms giving, pilgrimage and fasting - every one of them is a form of spiritual cleansing for the individual, to grow their spiritual side (Iman)

Should he read chapter 9? Or should he only read the bits you tell him to if he wants a true indication of the amount of slaughter bits in the Quran?

Ideally all of it FD, and he'll find that chapter 9 is quite the anomaly in an otherwise meditative and deeply spiritual book.

If there's one verse that encapsulates the entire Quran, and Islam for that matter, its the very first, and by the far the most well known and common verse. We recite it more than any other verse. Literally a bare minimum of 17 times a day. It has nothing to do with fighting others. Nor do the 5 pillars - universally understood as the core essences of Islam.

Guess what FD? Chapter 9 is not recited by muslims 17 times a day. Chapter 9 has no bearing whatsoever on the 5 pillars.

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran Reply #31 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 2:42pm You misinterpret as usual moses. muslims are 'hateful' towards what they are doing/saying - not to them personally. "I hate what you are doing" =/= "I hate you"
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moses

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #32 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 3:09pm

hate the sin = / = hate the sinner.

I very much believe that is the message of the qur'an (as do the millions of muslims who persecute and oppress the non muslims globally).

Why does allah make it impossible for them to get back on the straight and narrow If he only hates their deeds and not the sinners themselves?

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aquascoot Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 32848 Gender:	Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran Reply #33 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:20pm aquascoot wrote on May 21^st, 2019 at 7:05pm: Gandi, do you think some of the suicide bombers think they are going to paradise gandi, ive asked this one to gweg and mothra and bwian and they ignore it. Et too Brutee ??
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Frank

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #34 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:46pm

polite_gandalf wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 2:42pm:

You misinterpret as usual moses.

muslims are 'hateful' towards what they are doing/saying - not to them personally.

"I hate what you are doing" =/= "I hate you"

But of course you will never credit the same about people who oppose Islam ('what you are doing') and not particular Muslims ('you').

For your idiotic and dishonest agit-prop its ALL 'Islamophobia'.

You are an intelligent and, when you don't guard yourself, a well-meaning man. But you are as dishonest and untrustworthy as any Muslim Brotherhood, Hamas, Hizbi or Hezbollah operative. Or Bwian and the Paki Karnal. Dishonesty and blatant agit-prop is just what you all DO. It's your jihad.

Your creed allows you and positively encourages you to be dishonest and to lie and so you are dishonest and do lie.

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Auggie Gold Member Offline The Bull Moose Posts: 8571	Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran Reply #35 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:51pm Frank wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:46pm: Or Bwian and the Paki Karnal. Me too!
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aquascoot

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #36 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 7:03pm

600 years ago, christianity was pretty brutal.
plenty of people being boiled in oil thanks to the book.
but 600 years of science and secularism beating it down has made it very benign and pretty harmless.

in another 600 years, after the secular west get the guts to publish lots of cartoons of mo and just keeping laughing at the pretty dumb ideas (like getting 64 virgins for blowing yourself up), islam will be beaten into shape. its just come to the game a bit late and the west seems unwilling to teach the lessons.
but they'll come to their senses eventually and it will all be sweet

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Frank

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #37 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 7:16pm

Auggie wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:51pm:

Frank wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:46pm:

Or Bwian and the Paki Karnal.

Me too!

Nah. Bwian is mad in a Lady in the Van kind of way, bought his doctorate online, lives in fantasy land with major unresolved psychic blockages and underwear scattered all over the place. The Paki is an 80s Fouckalldian idiot whose mind was destroyed by buggery, sociology and political 'science', in that order. He likes to cross-dress as a Vietnam veteran to reminisce.

You are neither an unmoored mad woman nor an unmoored educated moron like them. You are just 20 thousand leagues under the sea, Nemo, bubbling away inconsequentially whenever there is an opportunity.

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freediver

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #38 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 7:42pm

polite_gandalf wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 2:33pm:

freediver wrote on May 21^st, 2019 at 9:59pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on May 21^st, 2019 at 2:14pm:

moses wrote on May 18^th, 2019 at 2:40pm:

Now gandi makes much of a single verse in the qur'an 2:256 which says there is no compulsion in religion.

O.K. gandi if it comes down to only the verses which actually use the words matter, do tell us: how many verses actually say there is no compulsion in religion?

Is there only one?

No there is not only one. I reference 18:29 all the time.

But thats not the point. You are disingenuously verbling me as saying that instead of being full of rape and torture, the Quran is really full of saying no compulsion in religion.

I am not.

The Quran is chock full of imagery and metaphors related to finding spiritual peace and harmony in belief (which itself is really just a metaphor for freeing oneself from base and earthly desires). If nothing else just read chapter 2 - the longest surah in the Quran and tell me roughly how much is 'rape and torture' and how much is a personal conversation with the individual to have and maintain faith. Read Al Fatiha at the very least - the first and by far the most important verse - as muslims say it before every prostration (ruka'a) in their prayer - 17 times a day, and countless other times as the 'go to' verse to recite for just about any occassion - weddings, funerals, or just when you're feeling anxious. What does Al Fatiha say? It is in two parts - the first part is to acknowledge/remind ourselves that God is a) the most merciful b) the sustainer of all life and c) the master of judgement. The second half is to ask God to guide us and keep us on the righteous path (the "right path" defined elsewhere in the Quran as the path of peace). Thats it. No murder rape or pillage - just remembering God as the master over all things and seeking his guidance to stay on the right path.

In fact Al Fatiha is just a microcosm of what the overall theme in the Quran is about. And this is the theme muslims recite the most - the most important verse. And the theme is further encapsulated by the 5 pillars - belief/faith in God, prayer, alms giving, pilgrimage and fasting - every one of them is a form of spiritual cleansing for the individual, to grow their spiritual side (Iman)

Should he read chapter 9? Or should he only read the bits you tell him to if he wants a true indication of the amount of slaughter bits in the Quran?

Ideally all of it FD, and he'll find that chapter 9 is quite the anomaly in an otherwise meditative and deeply spiritual book.

If there's one verse that encapsulates the entire Quran, and Islam for that matter, its the very first, and by the far the most well known and common verse. We recite it more than any other verse. Literally a bare minimum of 17 times a day. It has nothing to do with fighting others. Nor do the 5 pillars - universally understood as the core essences of Islam.

Guess what FD? Chapter 9 is not recited by muslims 17 times a day. Chapter 9 has no bearing whatsoever on the 5 pillars.

And chapter 8?

Are you conceding your 1.7% calculation was bogus?

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Mattyfisk

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #39 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 9:03pm

Auggie wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:51pm:

Frank wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:46pm:

Or Bwian and the Paki Karnal.

Me too!

As for silly old Karnal, he's not even a Paki. He's British, as every schoolboy knows. Aussie Aussie Aussie.

Quote:

Your creed allows you and positively encourages you to be dishonest and to lie and so you are dishonest and do lie.

University of Balogney, innit, but I'm curious. Let's hear some jolly old truth.

Old boy, which passport do you use?

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Mattyfisk

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #40 - May 22^nd, 2019 at 9:11pm

freediver wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 7:42pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 2:33pm:

freediver wrote on May 21^st, 2019 at 9:59pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on May 21^st, 2019 at 2:14pm:

moses wrote on May 18^th, 2019 at 2:40pm:

Now gandi makes much of a single verse in the qur'an 2:256 which says there is no compulsion in religion.

O.K. gandi if it comes down to only the verses which actually use the words matter, do tell us: how many verses actually say there is no compulsion in religion?

Is there only one?

No there is not only one. I reference 18:29 all the time.

But thats not the point. You are disingenuously verbling me as saying that instead of being full of rape and torture, the Quran is really full of saying no compulsion in religion.

I am not.

The Quran is chock full of imagery and metaphors related to finding spiritual peace and harmony in belief (which itself is really just a metaphor for freeing oneself from base and earthly desires). If nothing else just read chapter 2 - the longest surah in the Quran and tell me roughly how much is 'rape and torture' and how much is a personal conversation with the individual to have and maintain faith. Read Al Fatiha at the very least - the first and by far the most important verse - as muslims say it before every prostration (ruka'a) in their prayer - 17 times a day, and countless other times as the 'go to' verse to recite for just about any occassion - weddings, funerals, or just when you're feeling anxious. What does Al Fatiha say? It is in two parts - the first part is to acknowledge/remind ourselves that God is a) the most merciful b) the sustainer of all life and c) the master of judgement. The second half is to ask God to guide us and keep us on the righteous path (the "right path" defined elsewhere in the Quran as the path of peace). Thats it. No murder rape or pillage - just remembering God as the master over all things and seeking his guidance to stay on the right path.

In fact Al Fatiha is just a microcosm of what the overall theme in the Quran is about. And this is the theme muslims recite the most - the most important verse. And the theme is further encapsulated by the 5 pillars - belief/faith in God, prayer, alms giving, pilgrimage and fasting - every one of them is a form of spiritual cleansing for the individual, to grow their spiritual side (Iman)

Should he read chapter 9? Or should he only read the bits you tell him to if he wants a true indication of the amount of slaughter bits in the Quran?

Ideally all of it FD, and he'll find that chapter 9 is quite the anomaly in an otherwise meditative and deeply spiritual book.

If there's one verse that encapsulates the entire Quran, and Islam for that matter, its the very first, and by the far the most well known and common verse. We recite it more than any other verse. Literally a bare minimum of 17 times a day. It has nothing to do with fighting others. Nor do the 5 pillars - universally understood as the core essences of Islam.

Guess what FD? Chapter 9 is not recited by muslims 17 times a day. Chapter 9 has no bearing whatsoever on the 5 pillars.

And chapter 8?

Are you conceding your 1.7% calculation was bogus?

Let's ask FD.

Quote:

Your creed allows you and positively encourages you to be dishonest and to lie and so you are dishonest and do lie.

FD, do you uphold the use of porkies in your campaign against the Muselman?

A simple yes or no will suffice.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #41 - May 23^rd, 2019 at 11:51am

freediver wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 7:42pm:

Are you conceding your 1.7% calculation was bogus?

No. What I said exactly in the OP is a simple statement of fact. Actually I got it from Islamophobic website the religion of peace.

Your attempts to misconstrue what I said into something else doesn't change this.

The only relevant point is that the vast majority of the Quran is not about fighting. And lets not forget your attempts to clearly imply that it is.

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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Frank

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #42 - May 23^rd, 2019 at 6:47pm

Mattyfisk wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 9:03pm:

Auggie wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:51pm:

Frank wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:46pm:

Or Bwian and the Paki Karnal.

Me too!

As for silly old Karnal, he's not even a Paki. He's British, as every schoolboy knows. Aussie Aussie Aussie.

Of course you are a Paki. They even have a statue of you in the Karnal District of India, near the paki border.

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Mattyfisk

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #43 - May 23^rd, 2019 at 10:30pm

Frank wrote on May 23^rd, 2019 at 6:47pm:

Mattyfisk wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 9:03pm:

Auggie wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:51pm:

Frank wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 6:46pm:

Or Bwian and the Paki Karnal.

Me too!

As for silly old Karnal, he's not even a Paki. He's British, as every schoolboy knows. Aussie Aussie Aussie.

Of course you are a Paki. They even have a statue of you in the Karnal District of India, near the paki border.

Karnal is near Delhi, dear.

Flew there, did you?

Perhaps one should try the bus.

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freediver

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Re: 'rape torture and slaughter bits' in the Quran
Reply #44 - May 24^th, 2019 at 5:54am

polite_gandalf wrote on May 23^rd, 2019 at 11:51am:

freediver wrote on May 22^nd, 2019 at 7:42pm:

Are you conceding your 1.7% calculation was bogus?

No. What I said exactly in the OP is a simple statement of fact. Actually I got it from Islamophobic website the religion of peace.

Your attempts to misconstrue what I said into something else doesn't change this.

The only relevant point is that the vast majority of the Quran is not about fighting. And lets not forget your attempts to clearly imply that it is.

The vast majority of the Quran is not about the things you claim are the core message of Islam.

But there is plenty of promotion of slaughter in the name of Islam.

Quote:

One thing that strikes anyone who actually bothers to read the Quran is how rarely violence (as in physically fighting people) is mentioned - in comparison to everything else in the Quran.

Is this a statement of fact from an Islamophobic website? Why does it take so much effort to get a Muslim to own what they say about Islam?

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