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Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now! (Read 20181 times)
Laugh till you cry
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Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Nov 26th, 2018 at 12:20pm
 
The USA should never have got itself bogged in Afghanistan. There was no reason to attack or invade.

The USA is repeating the mistakes of the past in Afghanistan and it is possible that a major military defeat could cause the USA to cut and run leaving behind a horrific mess.

The First Coward Donald Trump is too afraid to visit either Iraq or Afghanistan.

"A bunch of dudes in bedsheets and flip-flops is kicking Uncle Sam's ass ... various nations have the economic wherewithal to spend $10s of billions each month to fund it all. And for almost 10 years we have pitted this unbelievable and unprecedented capability against: A bunch of dudes in bed sheets and flip-flops."

https://www.counterpunch.org/2018/11/23/afghanistan-is-collapsing-get-out-now/

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Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
by BRIAN CLOUGHLEY

November has been quite a month, so far, in Afghanistan. The level of violence has been appalling and the most serious recent atrocity was yet another suicide bombing in Kabul. It killed over fifty people and injured twice that many but didn’t merit a Trump tweet, which isn’t surprising because he doesn’t seem to be interested in the place. Further, as reported by the Washington Post on November 19, he hasn’t visited a single country in which his troops are fighting.

The reason he hasn’t visited his troops in such areas is because he is a coward. He is a physical yellow-belly who lacks the courage to go anywhere near a war zone. He is below contempt, but he could gain a little bit of respect if he ordered the US and NATO to get out of Afghanistan.

Early in November the New York Times summed up the shambles in Afghanistan by stating
In the past week, the Times confirmed that 118 members of the security forces were killed, a significant increase over the previous week, but, unusually, there were no confirmed deaths of civilians. Fighting spread to nine provinces, but the emphasis shifted to the south as cold weather intensified in the north. An entire battalion of Afghan border soldiers was wiped out in western Farah Province, and the Taliban tried — unsuccessfully so far — to take over Jaghori District in Ghazni, an anti-insurgent stronghold.

On November 3 yet another US soldier was killed by a member of Afghanistan’s military forces. Major Brent Taylor of the Utah National Guard was instructing Afghan soldiers when one of them shot him dead. He left a wife and seven young children. On the same day, as reported by the New York Times, twenty Afghan soldiers were reported missing after a Taliban attack in Uruzgan Province, and on November 5, six policemen and seven soldiers were killed in Ghazni, two Afghan Humvees were blown up, 17 policemen were killed in Kandahar Province and seven soldiers in Herat.

Seven soldiers were killed on November 7, two of them in Nangarhar Province in an airstrike by United States aircraft while NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg was visiting foreign troops in Herat. The following day seventeen soldiers were killed along with eight policemen.

After the NYT’s report that no civilians had been killed in the first week, the situation changed dramatically and the Taliban killed 15 civilians and 10 members of the special forces in Ghazni on November 11, then “In the western province of Farah, at least 37 members of the Afghan security forces were killed in overnight attacks by Taliban fighters on checkpoints that triggered hours of fighting, local officials said on November 12.” That was the day that a loonie of Islamic State killed at least six civilians and wounded 20 others in a suicide bombing in Kabul.

Stoltenberg told foreign soldiers in Herat they “have to remember that you are in Afghanistan because NATO is in Afghanistan to make sure that Afghanistan never again becomes a safe haven for international terrorism. So this is about helping the Afghans but also about helping ourselves. It is in our security interest to make sure that Afghanistan not once again becomes a platform, a territory, a country where terrorist organizations can prepare, plan attacks against our own countries.”

This is fallacious nonsense, but he’s got to say it because there is no real reason for the NATO presence in Afghanistan. In the words of the World War One dirge sung by British soldiers in France, “We’re here, because we’re here, because we’re here . . .”

They got there because the United States was hell-bent on war. And this war has had a most significant and disastrous spin-off that the drum-thumpers didn’t think about. It has shown the world that there has been yet another war which the US couldn’t and can’t win.

The foreign soldiers killed in Afghanistan — almost 3,500 of them, including 1,892 American combatants — have died for nothing. The entire war has been a disgraceful catastrophe, and as I recorded in Counterpunch in 2012, the US-NATO fiasco was well described by US Colonel David Davis:
The United States, along with over 40 NATO and other allied nations, possesses the most sophisticated, powerful, and technologically advanced military force that has ever hit the field of combat. We have the finest and most well trained soldiers that exist anywhere; we have armored vehicles of every type, to include MIA2 Main Battle Tanks; artillery, mortars, advanced rockets, precision guided missiles, and hand-held rocket launchers; we have a wholly uncontested air force composed of NATO’s most advanced ground attack fighter jets, bombers, AWACS ...
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polite_gandalf
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #1 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 2:41pm
 
After 9/11 when the US demanded the taliban hand over bin Laden, the taliban reasonably asked for evidence of his guilt, and then offered to extradite bin Laden to a third country for trial.

Blind Freddy would have known that working with the only outfit in Afghanistan that resembled a functioning government in order to dismantle Al Qaeda and bring bin Laden to justice was the only viable way forward. Not least of all for the security interests of US citizens.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Grappler Truth Teller Feller
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #2 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 3:10pm
 
It was always going to relapse into its old near-primeval state once the 'Allies' departed... the moment the flags are furled and the troops on the planes out, the rule of the gun will come in again and chaos will erupt with countless innocent lives lost.. again...
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #3 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 9:56pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 2:41pm:
After 9/11 when the US demanded the taliban hand over bin Laden, the taliban reasonably asked for evidence of his guilt, and then offered to extradite bin Laden to a third country for trial.

Blind Freddy would have known that working with the only outfit in Afghanistan that resembled a functioning government in order to dismantle Al Qaeda and bring bin Laden to justice was the only viable way forward. Not least of all for the security interests of US citizens.


Do all Muslims prefer puppet regimes to democracy?
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Mattyfisk
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #4 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 10:11pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 9:56pm:
polite_gandalf wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 2:41pm:
After 9/11 when the US demanded the taliban hand over bin Laden, the taliban reasonably asked for evidence of his guilt, and then offered to extradite bin Laden to a third country for trial.

Blind Freddy would have known that working with the only outfit in Afghanistan that resembled a functioning government in order to dismantle Al Qaeda and bring bin Laden to justice was the only viable way forward. Not least of all for the security interests of US citizens.


Do all Muslims prefer puppet regimes to democracy?


No, FD, ALL of Uncle's puppet states prefer puppet regimes to democracy.

Correlation not causation, innit.
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Laugh till you cry
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #5 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 10:17pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 9:56pm:
polite_gandalf wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 2:41pm:
After 9/11 when the US demanded the taliban hand over bin Laden, the taliban reasonably asked for evidence of his guilt, and then offered to extradite bin Laden to a third country for trial.

Blind Freddy would have known that working with the only outfit in Afghanistan that resembled a functioning government in order to dismantle Al Qaeda and bring bin Laden to justice was the only viable way forward. Not least of all for the security interests of US citizens.


Do all Muslims prefer puppet regimes to democracy?


Like Donald Trump's administration?
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Please don't thank me. Effusive fawning and obeisance of disciples, mendicants, and foot-kissers embarrass me.
 
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #6 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 10:35pm
 
Laugh till you cry wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 10:17pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 9:56pm:
polite_gandalf wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 2:41pm:
After 9/11 when the US demanded the taliban hand over bin Laden, the taliban reasonably asked for evidence of his guilt, and then offered to extradite bin Laden to a third country for trial.

Blind Freddy would have known that working with the only outfit in Afghanistan that resembled a functioning government in order to dismantle Al Qaeda and bring bin Laden to justice was the only viable way forward. Not least of all for the security interests of US citizens.


Do all Muslims prefer puppet regimes to democracy?


Like Donald Trump's administration?


FD doesn't talk about that, Laugh. No more questions about Mr Trump, thanks.
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Laugh till you cry
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #7 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 10:43pm
 
Mattyfisk wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 10:35pm:
Laugh till you cry wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 10:17pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 9:56pm:
polite_gandalf wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 2:41pm:
After 9/11 when the US demanded the taliban hand over bin Laden, the taliban reasonably asked for evidence of his guilt, and then offered to extradite bin Laden to a third country for trial.

Blind Freddy would have known that working with the only outfit in Afghanistan that resembled a functioning government in order to dismantle Al Qaeda and bring bin Laden to justice was the only viable way forward. Not least of all for the security interests of US citizens.


Do all Muslims prefer puppet regimes to democracy?


Like Donald Trump's administration?


FD doesn't talk about that, Laugh. No more questions about Mr Trump, thanks.


FleaDriver must have a flea in his ear.
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #8 - Nov 27th, 2018 at 6:02am
 
you cant help people who are operating at a lower paradigm.

a successful businessman who takes on a homeless guy and offers him great opportunities will usually see that homeless guy raid the fridge, raid the petty cash and head off to the pub to buy a "drink".
if people are in low vibration energy, if they are used to violence and fighting and anger and sexism and intimidation and selling drugs, they arent capable of just seeing a better life.

its like if you were a druggie with a hangover and you werent eating right and you hadnt been socialised well and your brain literally doesnt work.
if i gave you a copy of nelson mandellas "long walk to freedom" and said "read this, it will help you move up", you wouldnt get past page 1 before you felt like a nap or declared it was garbage and used it to burn in the fire.
you cant help people who are not close to a mental state that aspires to something better.
the afghanis are not in the mental state to assume western democracy.
it was naive and arrogant to assume otherwise
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #9 - Nov 27th, 2018 at 6:26am
 
I could never figure out those videos of US marines assigned to protecting opium / Poppy fields.
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #10 - Nov 27th, 2018 at 6:31am
 
At least the "Get out" part is right. Afghanistan is a primitive and loosely associated group of tribes who think it is OK to root little boys as long as the men remain good Muzlums, and the women remain like cattle or possessions.
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #11 - Nov 27th, 2018 at 9:51am
 
I wanted to reply to FD, unfortunately I have no idea what he's talking about.

Is he talking about Karzai et al?
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #12 - Nov 28th, 2018 at 12:45pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 2:41pm:
After 9/11 when the US demanded the taliban hand over bin Laden, the taliban reasonably asked for evidence of his guilt, and then offered to extradite bin Laden to a third country for trial.

Blind Freddy would have known that working with the only outfit in Afghanistan that resembled a functioning government in order to dismantle Al Qaeda and bring bin Laden to justice was the only viable way forward. Not least of all for the security interests of US citizens.


You are lying again Gandalf. Nothing resembled a functioning government in Afghanistan. It was a failed state, and was recognised as such by pretty much every nation on earth.

Bin Laden openly declared war on the US and openly attacked the US on more than one occasion, causing thousands of deaths.

Yet the same Muslim who trots out the "tough titties, off with their heads" excuse for genocide by Muslims, insists that every tribal warlord from the coast to the mountains should have been given the opportunity to stand in the US' way and delay or block their efforts to stop Bin Laden for as long as they want. Only a Muslim would insist on having negotiations after they had declared war and carried out attacks.

The US gave these scum more respect than they deserved when it offered them the opportunity to hand Bin Laden over themselves. They were neither willing nor able to do so, and no amount of negotiations would have changed that. The fact alone that Bin Laden had declared war already was all that was needed for any Afghan leader with a genuine interest in peace. But they were desperate for handouts from the US (to fund more terrorism) or to gain more kudos from their fellow jihadis by being seen as equals to the US and being able to stand in the US' way. As every blind freddy could see.
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Laugh till you cry
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #13 - Nov 28th, 2018 at 1:39pm
 
FleaDriver just quotes miscellaneous stuff off his propaganda scripts.

His policy is that when he doesn't have any valid arguments he publishes some nonsense to create confusion and diversion.
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Re: Afghanistan is Collapsing. Get Out: Now!
Reply #14 - Nov 28th, 2018 at 7:02pm
 
Laugh till you cry wrote on Nov 28th, 2018 at 1:39pm:
FleaDriver just quotes miscellaneous stuff off his propaganda scripts.

His policy is that when he doesn't have any valid arguments he publishes some nonsense to create confusion and diversion.


Do you disagree with it, or just not understand it?
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