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Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby (Read 8726 times)
Brian Ross
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Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Nov 16th, 2018 at 3:28pm
 
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Baronvonrort
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #1 - Nov 16th, 2018 at 4:33pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 16th, 2018 at 3:28pm:



What gun control laws are they trying to chip away Brian or is this just a fear campaign from the gun grabbers?

How is their Not Happy Dan slogan chipping away at gun laws?
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Brian Ross
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #2 - Nov 17th, 2018 at 1:34pm
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 16th, 2018 at 4:33pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 16th, 2018 at 3:28pm:



What gun control laws are they trying to chip away Brian or is this just a fear campaign from the gun grabbers?

How is their Not Happy Dan slogan chipping away at gun laws?


Read the article, Baron.  You questions are answered there.    Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #3 - Nov 17th, 2018 at 9:36pm
 


I have read that article brian it doesn't answer my questions.

Perhaps you should read what SIFA say and take note of how they want to work within our existing laws- https://sifa.net.au/newsroom/media-releases/


The leftists supported by the ABC appear to be engaging in a bit of dog whistling with licensed gun owners on the eve of an election like they did recently in Tasmania.


Perhaps you should read this as well-

Quote:
When your election campaign fizzles, rub some gun paranoia on it


The ALP’s push-back against the Liberal Party’s gun discussion has little to do with the greater good, and everything to do with political point-scoring.

Gun laws have been in the news lately, with revelations that the Shooting Industry Foundation of Australia is having its say about the upcoming Victorian state election. Usually, headlines about guns mean one of two things: there has been a shooting incident, or it is a slow news week. But this time, something else going on. This is about major party political games. Struggling to gain traction against the Liberal party’s “tough on crime” platform, news about “the gun lobby” is exactly what the Labor Party has been yearning for.

The Liberals, long dominant in the race to the bottom on law and order, have been scoring easy political points painting Labor as weak on security and unable to tackle crime. Unsurprisingly, the ALP is frantically trying to beef up its credentials at state and federal levels. They know that law and order campaigns play a crucial role in signalling not just legal, but moral authority – a desperately sought after commodity in today’s climate of distrust for major parties.

Yet Labor’s efforts are frequently hamstrung not only by the preference-wielding Greens, but by their own vociferous and powerful left faction. When Labor leaders talk tough, they face in-house ideological fury. Throw in some nods to evidence-based policy, civil liberties and the constraint of police powers, and the result is often ungainly backpedalling or embarrassing reversal. This fuels further allegations of weakness. To counter the Liberals and create a perception of credibility on law and order, the ALP needs an issue where it can look tough but avoid messy battles within its ranks.

Enter gun control: the one issue where values the “left” routinely bring to the law and order debate get tossed aside and replaced by mouth-foaming fervour. Suddenly, sweeping prohibitions, more police powers and more government intrusion into people’s lives become eminently desirable. By creating a sense of hysteria around guns, the ALP can posture as tough on crime while safe in the knowledge that – for once – they are shielded from criticism from their own side.


The mythology manufactured around our gun laws means any re-appraisal is likened to inviting the deaths of children. This encourages frenzied public shaming of anybody who disputes the ALP’s pose – or calls it out for the subterfuge it is.


The ALP’s moral panic about guns has nothing to do with guns, and everything to do with crushing the Liberals. History tells us that when gun laws are tightened a swathe of voters abandon the party they blame for that. Failing to provide opposition also gets punished. Knowing this, Labor has started using gun laws as a sneaky wedge issue.

The aim is to force the Liberals into a corner where their only choices are to oppose Labor, agree with Labor, or get into “even tougher” one-upmanship. In the first scenario, the Liberals can be portrayed as immorally pandering to the gun lobby. In the other scenarios, the Liberals lose votes to “gun-friendly” minor parties. Although the ALP will also lose votes, they are gambling that the Liberals will sustain more damage.

This attack plan got its first serious electoral run in Queensland. The Liberal National Party pledged to oppose reclassification of the now-infamous Adler shotgun, and the Labor government went into full fear-mongering mode. Amid carefully timed claims about putting guns on the streets and placing communities at risk, the LNP got spooked, changed their tune just before the 2017 election, and were thumped.

The same tactic was rolled out in the recent Tasmanian election, but unlike their Queensland counterparts, the Tasmanian Liberals did not follow the script. After proposing changes to a handful of gun laws, they refused to back down despite a Labor/Greens-driven media blitz about the evil gun lobby dictating policy. Far from being weakened, they won another term in power.

Undeterred by the initial failure of “Operation Gun Wedge”, Labor still managed to do them slowly. The Tasmanian Liberals have now penitently vowed to observe the legacy of John Howard


Well aware that gun control is a fashionable cause among virtue-signalling sectors of the media, by choosing this issue as a battleground the ALP has not only shielded itself from scrutiny but has co-opted press sympathisers to act as a cheer squad.


More here- https://thebigsmoke.com.au/2018/10/29/when-election-campaign-fizzles-rub-gun-par...
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Brian Ross
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #4 - Nov 18th, 2018 at 12:41am
 
How typical of you to characterise the most trusted broadcaster in Australia as being somehow "evil" and "Leftist", Baron.   Perhaps you need to reacquaint yourself with Australian society and it's values?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #5 - Nov 20th, 2018 at 12:15am
 
Would it really do any harm to review all of the restrictions placed on your citizens? It is my understanding that your restrictions include regulating the ownership of the Daisy Red Rider BB gun. A smooth bore, spring powered device that might shoot your eye out per "A Christmas Story"!

Are your people so indoctrinated by your time as a colony of a Monarchy that you still feel the population is subservient to government? Would it really be so bad to go down a list of restrictions and say some of them serve no reasonable purpose and delete them? Occasionally we have a burst of common sense here and remove pointless restrictions. Maybe your government needs a little common sense gun law reviews. The likelihood that something will be used in a crime is a good indication of whether it should be restricted or not.

"Because you don't need that" isn't a valid reason to restrict!
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #6 - Nov 20th, 2018 at 12:34am
 
MortDooley.

Just because Australia represents the 'Thief' on the hill, that accepted the love of God (and keeps the Union Jack 'faith') while on the other side of Jesus being crucified, is the 'Thief' that represents the USA and 'rejected' Jesus (Union Jack).

Basically, just because the USA became a 'privatised' Political nation which will soon be held accountable for its 'International' crimes (Yankees thinking that just because they beat the Confederates on a 'domestic' front, they can do what they like on the International scene  Roll Eyes)

Considering your Political & Military industries are empowered by the 'top of the pyramid' (unlike your Art Industry, which is bottom of the pyramid) - why your nation should 'arm its populace' as if they are Military is ABSOLUTELY WRONG AND STUPID.
If your population can NOT have faith in its own Government or Military - then who can they have faith in at all.

USA needs to HTFU and make its mind up.
Arm the Military or Arm the People.
Only Military should have guns (weapons) - not Police and definitely not People.
Or maybe you think its ok to let everyone have drugs besides the Medical Industry?  Huh

Maybe your argument is that decriminalising it all is the best way from preventing it going 'underground' so to speak?
If that's the case - then de-criminalise Peadophilia, I mean - it will stop it going 'under-ground' right!?  Roll Eyes

I think your country has lost the plot.
I think your country is stuck in the past, even if it is indeed at the End of the World back there in the 'rear' of the International Dateline.

Farmers have a pest problem and need things shot?
Then 'hire' a soldier (good training practice).

Your nation is now a nation of TERRORISTS.
USA IS A TERRORIST NATION.
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #7 - Nov 20th, 2018 at 5:10pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 12:15am:
Would it really do any harm to review all of the restrictions placed on your citizens? It is my understanding that your restrictions include regulating the ownership of the Daisy Red Rider BB gun. A smooth bore, spring powered device that might shoot your eye out per "A Christmas Story"!

Are your people so indoctrinated by your time as a colony of a Monarchy that you still feel the population is subservient to government? Would it really be so bad to go down a list of restrictions and say some of them serve no reasonable purpose and delete them? Occasionally we have a burst of common sense here and remove pointless restrictions. Maybe your government needs a little common sense gun law reviews. The likelihood that something will be used in a crime is a good indication of whether it should be restricted or not.

"Because you don't need that" isn't a valid reason to restrict!


The restrictions have not resulted in fewer firearms.  Just fewer firearms of the types that Cowboys and lunatics seem to prefer.  There are now more firearms in private hands than there were before Port Arthur.   So, the claim that Australia has been disarmed are completely false, which is so typical of the US NRA - relying on lies and innuendo to create an atmosphere of fear to justify their acquisition of firearms of types unsuitable to hunting.

Our firearm laws are suitable to Australian society - firearms ownership has always been a privilege, not a "right" downunder.   Scoot back to America, please with your bullshit.  The overwhelming majority of Australians are quite happy with the gun laws we have...   Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #8 - Nov 20th, 2018 at 6:09pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 5:10pm:
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 12:15am:
Would it really do any harm to review all of the restrictions placed on your citizens? It is my understanding that your restrictions include regulating the ownership of the Daisy Red Rider BB gun. A smooth bore, spring powered device that might shoot your eye out per "A Christmas Story"!

Are your people so indoctrinated by your time as a colony of a Monarchy that you still feel the population is subservient to government? Would it really be so bad to go down a list of restrictions and say some of them serve no reasonable purpose and delete them? Occasionally we have a burst of common sense here and remove pointless restrictions. Maybe your government needs a little common sense gun law reviews. The likelihood that something will be used in a crime is a good indication of whether it should be restricted or not.

"Because you don't need that" isn't a valid reason to restrict!


The restrictions have not resulted in fewer firearms.  Just fewer firearms of the types that Cowboys and lunatics seem to prefer.  There are now more firearms in private hands than there were before Port Arthur.   So, the claim that Australia has been disarmed are completely false, which is so typical of the US NRA - relying on lies and innuendo to create an atmosphere of fear to justify their acquisition of firearms of types unsuitable to hunting.

Our firearm laws are suitable to Australian society - firearms ownership has always been a privilege, not a "right" downunder.   Scoot back to America, please with your bullshit.  The overwhelming majority of Australians are quite happy with the gun laws we have...   Roll Eyes



Aye !!!
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #9 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 12:40am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 5:10pm:
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 12:15am:
Would it really do any harm to review all of the restrictions placed on your citizens? It is my understanding that your restrictions include regulating the ownership of the Daisy Red Rider BB gun. A smooth bore, spring powered device that might shoot your eye out per "A Christmas Story"!

Are your people so indoctrinated by your time as a colony of a Monarchy that you still feel the population is subservient to government? Would it really be so bad to go down a list of restrictions and say some of them serve no reasonable purpose and delete them? Occasionally we have a burst of common sense here and remove pointless restrictions. Maybe your government needs a little common sense gun law reviews. The likelihood that something will be used in a crime is a good indication of whether it should be restricted or not.

"Because you don't need that" isn't a valid reason to restrict!


The restrictions have not resulted in fewer firearms.  Just fewer firearms of the types that Cowboys and lunatics seem to prefer.  There are now more firearms in private hands than there were before Port Arthur.   So, the claim that Australia has been disarmed are completely false, which is so typical of the US NRA - relying on lies and innuendo to create an atmosphere of fear to justify their acquisition of firearms of types unsuitable to hunting.

Our firearm laws are suitable to Australian society - firearms ownership has always been a privilege, not a "right" downunder.   Scoot back to America, please with your bullshit.  The overwhelming majority of Australians are quite happy with the gun laws we have...   Roll Eyes




Privilege is for children and employees, Citizens have Rights even if they are not recognized by their country. While I am not criticizing your system, self defense in your country seems to be less than a privilege and can result in prosecution! Your legal system is based on throwing innocent people to the wolves as in Russian folk lore. 

The troika hurtles across the frozen plain. The wolves are close behind, and from time to time a peasant is hurled from the sleigh in the hope of letting the more important people escape. But nothing distracts the pack for long, not even when the occupants of the sleigh move up the pecking order and throw a couple of minor aristocrats to the wolves.

https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/7033/did-travelers-by-troika-throw-...

We have totally different views about how responsible your fellow citizens are, I give them more credit than you! Since your family tree does not include convict immigrants you are clearly the superior man!
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #10 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 12:42am
 
Jasin wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 6:09pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 5:10pm:
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 12:15am:
Would it really do any harm to review all of the restrictions placed on your citizens? It is my understanding that your restrictions include regulating the ownership of the Daisy Red Rider BB gun. A smooth bore, spring powered device that might shoot your eye out per "A Christmas Story"!

Are your people so indoctrinated by your time as a colony of a Monarchy that you still feel the population is subservient to government? Would it really be so bad to go down a list of restrictions and say some of them serve no reasonable purpose and delete them? Occasionally we have a burst of common sense here and remove pointless restrictions. Maybe your government needs a little common sense gun law reviews. The likelihood that something will be used in a crime is a good indication of whether it should be restricted or not.

"Because you don't need that" isn't a valid reason to restrict!


The restrictions have not resulted in fewer firearms.  Just fewer firearms of the types that Cowboys and lunatics seem to prefer.  There are now more firearms in private hands than there were before Port Arthur.   So, the claim that Australia has been disarmed are completely false, which is so typical of the US NRA - relying on lies and innuendo to create an atmosphere of fear to justify their acquisition of firearms of types unsuitable to hunting.

Our firearm laws are suitable to Australian society - firearms ownership has always been a privilege, not a "right" downunder.   Scoot back to America, please with your bullshit.  The overwhelming majority of Australians are quite happy with the gun laws we have...   Roll Eyes



Aye !!!
Wink



It doesn't take much to make you panty wetters frightened!
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rhino
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #11 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 1:09am
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 21st, 2018 at 12:42am:
Jasin wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 6:09pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 5:10pm:
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 12:15am:
Would it really do any harm to review all of the restrictions placed on your citizens? It is my understanding that your restrictions include regulating the ownership of the Daisy Red Rider BB gun. A smooth bore, spring powered device that might shoot your eye out per "A Christmas Story"!

Are your people so indoctrinated by your time as a colony of a Monarchy that you still feel the population is subservient to government? Would it really be so bad to go down a list of restrictions and say some of them serve no reasonable purpose and delete them? Occasionally we have a burst of common sense here and remove pointless restrictions. Maybe your government needs a little common sense gun law reviews. The likelihood that something will be used in a crime is a good indication of whether it should be restricted or not.

"Because you don't need that" isn't a valid reason to restrict!


The restrictions have not resulted in fewer firearms.  Just fewer firearms of the types that Cowboys and lunatics seem to prefer.  There are now more firearms in private hands than there were before Port Arthur.   So, the claim that Australia has been disarmed are completely false, which is so typical of the US NRA - relying on lies and innuendo to create an atmosphere of fear to justify their acquisition of firearms of types unsuitable to hunting.

Our firearm laws are suitable to Australian society - firearms ownership has always been a privilege, not a "right" downunder.   Scoot back to America, please with your bullshit.  The overwhelming majority of Australians are quite happy with the gun laws we have...   Roll Eyes



Aye !!!
Wink



It doesn't take much to make you panty wetters frightened!
Just a point. You are the one insisting on owning and carrying firearms because you are scared of criminals Mort.
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #12 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 2:58am
 
USA IS A JEWISH NATION

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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #13 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 10:14am
 
rhino wrote on Nov 21st, 2018 at 1:09am:
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 21st, 2018 at 12:42am:
Jasin wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 6:09pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 5:10pm:
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 12:15am:
Would it really do any harm to review all of the restrictions placed on your citizens? It is my understanding that your restrictions include regulating the ownership of the Daisy Red Rider BB gun. A smooth bore, spring powered device that might shoot your eye out per "A Christmas Story"!

Are your people so indoctrinated by your time as a colony of a Monarchy that you still feel the population is subservient to government? Would it really be so bad to go down a list of restrictions and say some of them serve no reasonable purpose and delete them? Occasionally we have a burst of common sense here and remove pointless restrictions. Maybe your government needs a little common sense gun law reviews. The likelihood that something will be used in a crime is a good indication of whether it should be restricted or not.

"Because you don't need that" isn't a valid reason to restrict!


The restrictions have not resulted in fewer firearms.  Just fewer firearms of the types that Cowboys and lunatics seem to prefer.  There are now more firearms in private hands than there were before Port Arthur.   So, the claim that Australia has been disarmed are completely false, which is so typical of the US NRA - relying on lies and innuendo to create an atmosphere of fear to justify their acquisition of firearms of types unsuitable to hunting.

Our firearm laws are suitable to Australian society - firearms ownership has always been a privilege, not a "right" downunder.   Scoot back to America, please with your bullshit.  The overwhelming majority of Australians are quite happy with the gun laws we have...   Roll Eyes



Aye !!!
Wink



It doesn't take much to make you panty wetters frightened!
Just a point. You are the one insisting on owning and carrying firearms because you are scared of criminals Mort.



Why would I be afraid, I carry a gun to protect what I love! If others choose not to I am fine with that.
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #14 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 2:27pm
 
Americans need guns because no-one likes them.
They are a lone wolf, they are a law unto themselves.
They are a crazed maverick of selfish design.
They don't conform to the International scene.
They are a 'Privatised' Political system.
They are all Jewish and we know, by the look of Israel - it is just an 'Empire' of Military agendas.

...they are all 'Criminals'  Wink
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #15 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 5:55pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 21st, 2018 at 12:40am:
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 5:10pm:
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 20th, 2018 at 12:15am:
Would it really do any harm to review all of the restrictions placed on your citizens? It is my understanding that your restrictions include regulating the ownership of the Daisy Red Rider BB gun. A smooth bore, spring powered device that might shoot your eye out per "A Christmas Story"!

Are your people so indoctrinated by your time as a colony of a Monarchy that you still feel the population is subservient to government? Would it really be so bad to go down a list of restrictions and say some of them serve no reasonable purpose and delete them? Occasionally we have a burst of common sense here and remove pointless restrictions. Maybe your government needs a little common sense gun law reviews. The likelihood that something will be used in a crime is a good indication of whether it should be restricted or not.

"Because you don't need that" isn't a valid reason to restrict!


The restrictions have not resulted in fewer firearms.  Just fewer firearms of the types that Cowboys and lunatics seem to prefer.  There are now more firearms in private hands than there were before Port Arthur.   So, the claim that Australia has been disarmed are completely false, which is so typical of the US NRA - relying on lies and innuendo to create an atmosphere of fear to justify their acquisition of firearms of types unsuitable to hunting.

Our firearm laws are suitable to Australian society - firearms ownership has always been a privilege, not a "right" downunder.   Scoot back to America, please with your bullshit.  The overwhelming majority of Australians are quite happy with the gun laws we have...   Roll Eyes


Privilege is for children and employees, Citizens have Rights even if they are not recognized by their country. While I am not criticizing your system, self defense in your country seems to be less than a privilege and can result in prosecution! Your legal system is based on throwing innocent people to the wolves as in Russian folk lore. 


"Rights" must be recognised in order for them to exist.  Australians have few "rights" under our Constitution.   Comes from being a British colony originally.   Britains have few "rights" as well.   Gun ownership has, since 1788 been recognised as a privilege, one granted by Government to the citizens when they are deemed responsible enough and under conditions of ownership.   As you much as you may dislike that, Australians accept it.  You must demonstrate that you are responsible, fit and are not intending to use your firearm to cause harm and mayhem to your fellow citizens.   Unfortunately, some firearms owners failed in that and after Port Arthur, the types of firearms were restricted.   Again, Australians were overwhelming in favour of those measures.   We have no had anything like Port Arthur occur again as a consequence.  Something Americans seem to suffer weekly in their society where firearms are considered a "right".   Guess which society I prefer to live in?

Quote:
The troika hurtles across the frozen plain. The wolves are close behind, and from time to time a peasant is hurled from the sleigh in the hope of letting the more important people escape. But nothing distracts the pack for long, not even when the occupants of the sleigh move up the pecking order and throw a couple of minor aristocrats to the wolves.

https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/7033/did-travelers-by-troika-throw-...


There are several major errors with your story which move it to the realm of folklore, rather than fact, mate.  There is a major error there: aristocrats never rode together with peasants.  Russians if going through a Wolf prone area, carried weapons.   Finally, the number of Wolf attacks are easily counted on one hand's fingers.   They were as rare as hen's teeth.

Quote:
We have totally different views about how responsible your fellow citizens are, I give them more credit than you! Since your family tree does not include convict immigrants you are clearly the superior man!


I trust my fellow Australians because they are Australians and not Americans.  They know they don't live in the Wild West, unlike Americans who believe they need to murder each other with gay abandon...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #16 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 6:57pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 21st, 2018 at 5:55pm:
I trust my fellow Australians because they are Australians and not Americans.  They know they don't live in the Wild West, unlike Americans who believe they need to murder each other with gay abandon...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Brian you need to watch your use of ordinary language, because unless you stipulate "some" Americans, forum morons will leap to the strawman accusing you of accusing all Americans and say things like "not a monolith" and "majority are peaceloving" and garnishing it all with spastic tics like tsk tsk and spasms of eye rolling.

It's stupid, moronic and pointless I know, so just a heads up for you. 

Grin Grin
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #17 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 9:12pm
 
Well said Brian.

In the USA - every idiot can own a gun. Every 'irresponsible' person can own a gun.
Every psychotic with a social issue can own a gun.
The USA constitution shoots itself in the foot and hence why the USA is a nation of...
TERRORISTS
as well.

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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #18 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 11:33pm
 
Quote:
"Rights" must be recognised in order for them to exist.



Not so, you have a right to the air you breathe and the time nature (God)gives you to live on this earth. No one has a right to deny you that, at least not without due process!

Quote:
I trust my fellow Australians because they are Australians and not Americans.  They know they don't live in the Wild West, unlike Americans who believe they need to murder each other with gay abandon...



I don't live in the Wild West either and stay out of the Barrios and Ghettos. Call it racist but white Americans don't commit violent crimes at a rate any higher than other majority white nations regardless of gun laws! Those that do have been overwhelmingly liberal, the Media would dearly love to be able to report that Conservative voting NRA members were the shooters! But then this isn't about me or our laws, it is about yours.

What is wrong with looking at the whole of your gun laws? If something has never been a problem and has little likelihood of ever being one why regulate or ban it? Are you Citizens or Subjects?
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #19 - Nov 21st, 2018 at 11:37pm
 
No reason to trust idiots with firearms. Idiots comprise at least 50 percent of the population and increasing. Case closed.
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Reply #20 - Nov 22nd, 2018 at 12:54am
 
So Mortdooley.

There's a shooter massacring kids in a school.
Your only option from President down, is to all agree
that Teachers should be armed with guns too.
  Roll Eyes
So obviously - its all about creating more excuses to sell guns.
Then one of the Teachers has a bad hair day and shoots all the kids in class because one did a spit ball from a pen.
Are they going to arm all the kids with guns too
Roll Eyes

So you see - we know what the USA 'Guns Rights' really are - just a manufactured production sell.

You may have 'your' Gun rights in 'your' nation.
But in the INTERNATIONAL scene - the USA is in the WRONG.


Every nation is in the 'International' Pub.
Then an American walks in.
Is asked to leave his gun outside.
He cries "Its my right!"
The Publican states "Only in your own house drongo. Not here on the World stage. Disarm or get lost!"
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #21 - Nov 22nd, 2018 at 1:09am
 
PS: Better to serve Britain, than to serve JEWS like you do in the USA
Tongue
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #22 - Nov 22nd, 2018 at 10:38pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 21st, 2018 at 11:33pm:
Quote:
"Rights" must be recognised in order for them to exist.


Not so, you have a right to the air you breathe and the time nature (God)gives you to live on this earth. No one has a right to deny you that, at least not without due process!


Governments must recognise rights for them to exist.  Without the Rule of Law, you are faced with the Rule of Man and that is what rules in the US - who ever has the largest number or type of gun plus the fastest trigger finger rules.  Tsk, tsk, one only has to listen to the news from the US every day - another gun massacre, another pre-school full of dead children, another party which was popped by a passerby with a gun...   Roll Eyes

Quote:
Quote:
I trust my fellow Australians because they are Australians and not Americans.  They know they don't live in the Wild West, unlike Americans who believe they need to murder each other with gay abandon...


I don't live in the Wild West either and stay out of the Barrios and Ghettos. Call it racist but white Americans don't commit violent crimes at a rate any higher than other majority white nations regardless of gun laws! Those that do have been overwhelmingly liberal, the Media would dearly love to be able to report that Conservative voting NRA members were the shooters! But then this isn't about me or our laws, it is about yours.

What is wrong with looking at the whole of your gun laws? If something has never been a problem and has little likelihood of ever being one why regulate or ban it? Are you Citizens or Subjects?


Our gun laws are too young to need revision along the lines the NRA wants.  We want fewer guns in our society, not more and definitely not owned by gun nuts who believe in killing their fellow citizens.  Run along, back to your WIld West society, back to where violence is accepted, where people are taught to hate one another and have the means to carry out their hatreds.   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #23 - Nov 22nd, 2018 at 10:55pm
 
Jasin wrote on Nov 22nd, 2018 at 12:54am:
So Mortdooley.

There's a shooter massacring kids in a school.
Your only option from President down, is to all agree
that Teachers should be armed with guns too.
  Roll Eyes
So obviously - its all about creating more excuses to sell guns.
Then one of the Teachers has a bad hair day and shoots all the kids in class because one did a spit ball from a pen.
Are they going to arm all the kids with guns too
Roll Eyes

So you see - we know what the USA 'Guns Rights' really are - just a manufactured production sell.

You may have 'your' Gun rights in 'your' nation.
But in the INTERNATIONAL scene - the USA is in the WRONG.


Every nation is in the 'International' Pub.
Then an American walks in.
Is asked to leave his gun outside.
He cries "Its my right!"
The Publican states "Only in your own house drongo. Not here on the World stage. Disarm or get lost!"



The dishonest narrative of giving teachers guns along with their study plans is a canard. No one ever proposed that! If any staff member at a school is willing to get the proper training and willing to place their lives on the line for their students they should be allowed to have a firearm handy. I personally know a man that works as a History teacher at a private school, he supported his family as a Police Officer while earning his university Degree. I expect you feel it would be wrong for him to be discretely armed.

In all time I have had these types of conversations I have only had one person tell me what their real issue is. You feel if you had a gun available and had some emotional episode you would shoot innocent people! I don't think you would but I don't know you.
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #24 - Nov 22nd, 2018 at 11:33pm
 
Quote:
Our gun laws are too young to need revision along the lines the NRA wants.  We want fewer guns in our society, not more and definitely not owned by gun nuts who believe in killing their fellow citizens.  Run along, back to your WIld West society, back to where violence is accepted, where people are taught to hate one another and have the means to carry out their hatreds.




I shutter shudder to think what could happen if one of your citizens were found on a public place in possession of a boomerang. (fixed it just for you)

At what velocity does a pellet gun become a firearm or a cross bow and how many crimes have been committed with each?  Does the Italian reproductions of percussion and flintlock firearms have the same restrictions as modern design firearms?
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #25 - Nov 22nd, 2018 at 11:47pm
 
A boomerang is not classed as a firearm Mort, learn the difference. Never been a mass school shooting in Australia Mort, how many in your country just the last year. Get a grip man.
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #26 - Nov 22nd, 2018 at 11:50pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 22nd, 2018 at 11:33pm:
Quote:
Our gun laws are too young to need revision along the lines the NRA wants.  We want fewer guns in our society, not more and definitely not owned by gun nuts who believe in killing their fellow citizens.  Run along, back to your WIld West society, back to where violence is accepted, where people are taught to hate one another and have the means to carry out their hatreds.


I shutter to think what could happen if one of your citizens were found on a public place in possession of a boomerang.


I think you mean, "shudder" not "shutter", Mort.

Boomerangs are not considered dangerous weapons.  It takes real skill to use a Boomerang and then, the worse it could do for you is give you a clout on the back of your head.  Hunting Boomerangs are rare beasts and resemble small throwing logs, rather than a curved stick and they definitely don't come back once thrown.

Quote:
At what velocity does a pellet gun become a firearm or a cross bow and how many crimes have been committed with each?  Does the Italian reproductions of percussion and flintlock firearms have the same restrictions as modern design firearms?


In Western Australia, where I reside Firearms are defined as:

Quote:
Firearm types
Pneumatic firearms

Pneumatic firearms are commonly referred to as air guns. Some firearms have rifled barrels and some do not. Most are not fitted with any type of safety catch. They come in various calibres however mainly .177 or .22 and there are pneumatic pistols and rifles available in these calibres. They are usually single shot firearms although some gas operated models have magazines.
Break open firearms

Break open firearms are usually single or double barrel shotguns in various gauges but can include some rifles and handguns. In most cases there is a lever on the rear of the action or top tang. Generally moving this lever to the right allows the action to be opened.

Usually firearms of this type will have the safety catch located at the rear of the lever that opens the action making it readily accessible to the shooter's thumb. Some models have no external safety catch.
Bolt action firearms

Bolt action firearms are usually a repeating rifle or single shot in almost every conceivable calibre and can include some shotguns. They may have a fixed or removable box magazine, hinged floor or tubular magazine under the barrel or in the butt of the firearm. These firearms can be easily identified by a turned bolt, with the bolt handle usually on the right-hand side of the action. The bolt is raised and drawn to the rear to open the action. Safety catches are normally found at the rear of the action behind the bolt handle or near the trigger guard.
Lever action firearms

Lever action firearms are usually manually operated repeating rifles and can be identified by the cocking lever under the action of the firearm. They usually have a tubular magazine under the barrel or movable box magazine. They are available in a variety of calibres.

Downwards movement on the lever opens the action. Most of the western style rifles will not be fitted with a safety however the newer models have been fitted with a push button safety just in front of the hammer.
Pump action firearms

Pump action firearms are common in shotguns of various gauges but can also include rifles in rim fire and centre fire calibres.

They can be identified by a sliding fore end that is drawn to the rear to open the action. They can be fitted with a tubular magazine under the barrel or a box magazine. Most have a safety catch located near the trigger guard.
Self loading firearms

Self loading firearms are available in a large variety of rifle calibres and in shotgun gauges. They are usually identifiable by a small cocking handle which usually protrudes to the right-hand side of the breech bolt. They may be fitted with box or tubular magazines and can vary greatly in ammunition capacity.

Self loading firearms are also referred to as semi automatic firearms as each press of the trigger cycles the action automatically. These firearms will operate in one of the following manners: blowback, gas operated or recoil operated.
Fully automatic

Most fully automatic weapons take the form of general purpose machine guns fed from either a cloth or disintegrating link belt, or sub machine guns of varying size and styles. They usually have a large capacity box or drum magazine. Most have a select fire switch to allow either semi automatic or full automatic fire. Some military rifles have selective fire capacity.
Single shot rifles

[cont'd]
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #27 - Nov 22nd, 2018 at 11:54pm
 
Quote:
Single shot rifles do not have a magazine. Bolt or lever action single shot rifles are manually loaded through the ejection port and into the chamber.

Firearms categories
Category      Description
A1      an air rifle
A2.1      a single shot rim fire rifle
A2.2      a repeating rim fire rifle
A3.1      a single shot shotgun
A3.2      a double barrel shotgun
A3.3      a repeating shotgun (bolt action)
A4.1      a combination firearm made up of a shotgun and a rifle each of which would individually be of category A
A4.2      a rifle combination made up of rifles each of which would individually be of category A

Category B
Category      Description
B1      a muzzle loading firearm (except a handgun)
B2.1      a single shot centre fire rifle
B2.2      a double barrel centre fire rifle
B2.3      a repeating centre fire rifle
B2.4      a repeating shotgun (lever action) with a magazine capacity of no more than 5 rounds
B3.1      a combination firearm, not of category C or D, made up of a shotgun and a rifle at least one of which would individually be of category B
B3.2      a rifle combination, not of category C or D, made up of rifles at least one of which would individually be of category B

Genuine need test for Category B: the applicant is required to satisfy the Commissioner that a firearm of category A would be inadequate or unsuitable for the purpose for which the firearm is required.

Category C
Category      Description
C1      a self loading rim fire rifle with a magazine capacity no more than 10 rounds
C2      a self loading shotgun with a magazine capacity no more than 5 rounds
C3      a pump action shotgun with a magazine capacity no more than 5 rounds
C4.1      a combination firearm, not of category D, made up of a shotgun and a rifle at least one of which would individually be of category C
C4.2      a rifle combination, not of category D, made up of rifles at least one of which would individually be of category C

Category E
Category      Description
E1      a cannon
E3      a line thrower
E4      a tranquilliser
E5      a paintball gun
E6      any firearm that is not of sub-category E1, E2, E3, E4 or E5, or category A, B, C, D, or H
Category H
Category      Description
H1      a handgun (including an air pistol)
H2      an underwater explosive device
Genuine need test for Category H:

    The applicant is required to satisfy the Commissioner that a firearm of category A, B, or C would be inadequate or unsuitable for the purpose for which the firearm is required.
    A person does not have a genuine need to acquire or possess a firearm of category H because it is required for:
    (a) hunting,
    (b) recreational shooting, other than by a person described in paragraph under the heading “Restrictions for category H”, and for a purpose described in that paragraph; or
    (c) destroying stock or vermin.

[Source]

Blackpowder firearms would be classified as being a Category E6 Firearm.

Wikipedia however makes the point that:

Quote:
Certain antique firearms (generally muzzle loading black powder flintlock firearms manufactured before 1 January 1901) can in some states be legally held without a licence.[23] In other states they are subject to the same requirements as modern firearms.[24] All single-shot muzzleloading firearms manufactured before 1 January 1901 are considered antique firearms. Four states require licences for antique percussion revolvers and cartridge repeating firearms, but in Queensland and Victoria a person may possess such a firearm without a licence, so long as the firearm is registered (percussion revolvers require a licence in Victoria).

[[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Australia#Firearms_categories]Source[url]]


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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #28 - Nov 23rd, 2018 at 12:31am
 
rhino wrote on Nov 22nd, 2018 at 11:47pm:
A boomerang is not classed as a firearm Mort, learn the difference. Never been a mass school shooting in Australia Mort, how many in your country just the last year. Get a grip man.



And neither is a pellet gun, that was my point!
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #29 - Nov 23rd, 2018 at 12:36am
 
No Mort, pellet guns are guns. They fire projectiles capable of injury. They havent always been banned in Australia, I seem to remember them mainly being used for target practise on stray cats. I think we can live without them.
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #30 - Nov 23rd, 2018 at 12:50am
 
Quote:
I think you mean, "shudder" not "shutter", Mort.

Boomerangs are not considered dangerous weapons.  It takes real skill to use a Boomerang and then, the worse it could do for you is give you a clout on the back of your head.  Hunting Boomerangs are rare beasts and resemble small throwing logs, rather than a curved stick and they definitely don't come back once thrown.



Blame spell check.

Hey, I saw The Road Warrior and the scene where the Toady lost his fingers trying to catch a boomerang. It looked pretty dangerous to me. If you let the inaccurate fantasy world of Hollywood form your opinions I can too. 


This list of unnecessary regulations is a sad statement about the opinion of your government about the governed.
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #31 - Nov 23rd, 2018 at 12:52am
 
rhino wrote on Nov 23rd, 2018 at 12:36am:
No Mort, pellet guns are guns. They fire projectiles capable of injury. They havent always been banned in Australia, I seem to remember them mainly being used for target practise on stray cats. I think we can live without them.



You said firearm, there is no fire in a spring powered or pneumatic rifle or pistol!
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #32 - Nov 23rd, 2018 at 6:45am
 
Pellet Gun/Slug Gun: Yep - I received a 1 year Good Behaviour Bond as a young teenager because such a gun was placed in my hand and straight away, a glazed look came over me and I just began shooting at people. I mean - that's what guns are for, no? I shot five people with the sluggy. They received 'injuries' because my shots were pretty spot on for a first time beginner. I was lucky the Cops didn't shoot me when they arrived in numbers.  Shocked

I remember your Oprah Winfrey has a special on Guns.
They placed a replica pistol in a school locker that was left unlocked. Hidden camera. When the kids discovered it - the first thing they did is put it to their friends head and pulled the trigger. It was instinctual.
...this is what happens when kids have guns.
Giving guns to unprofessional populace is like giving guns to kids.
Hell, even Cops shouldn't have guns - only Military.
But your Police look like Military these days because of 'your rights'.  Huh

So Mort. How's it feel to live in a country that serves JEWS?
(which is like serving the Middle-East and its military agendas).
I bet you can't get rid of the Jews peacefully in the USA, unlike what happened in Europe - violently, with GUNS.  Wink

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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #33 - Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:14pm
 
More than 300 mass shootings in the US so far this year.  Angry

meanwhile ...

Sing-a-long time.  Wink

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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #34 - Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:20pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 23rd, 2018 at 12:50am:
Quote:
I think you mean, "shudder" not "shutter", Mort.

Boomerangs are not considered dangerous weapons.  It takes real skill to use a Boomerang and then, the worse it could do for you is give you a clout on the back of your head.  Hunting Boomerangs are rare beasts and resemble small throwing logs, rather than a curved stick and they definitely don't come back once thrown.


Blame spell check.


I blame you for not checking your own spelling.  Ignored the Three 'Rs at school did you?  You know, Readin', 'Rithmatic and 'Riting?

Quote:
Hey, I saw The Road Warrior and the scene where the Toady lost his fingers trying to catch a boomerang. It looked pretty dangerous to me. If you let the inaccurate fantasy world of Hollywood form your opinions I can too. 


...

Road Warrior == Mad Max?   I wonder why they changed the name?  Perhaps 'cause Americans are so ignorant, hey?   I hear tell they overdubbed the voices with American accented ones 'cause 'mericans don't understand good 'Strine, right?   Roll Eyes

Quote:
This list of unnecessary regulations is a sad statement about the opinion of your government about the governed.


Doesn't worry me.  I benefit from a safer society.  You live in the Wild West, mate.   Roll Eyes
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Reply #35 - Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:49pm
 
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Reply #36 - Nov 24th, 2018 at 7:00am
 
She highlights in her essay there is to much black on black crime....hmmmmm.
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Reply #37 - Nov 24th, 2018 at 8:15am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:49pm:



Why do blacks have a higher homicide rate in the USA Brian?

Quote:
Page 3-

 Blacks were disproportionately represented as both homicide victims and offenders. Th e victimization rate for blacks (27.8 per 100,000) was 6 times higher than the rate for whites (4.5 per 100,000). Th e off ending rate for blacks (34.4 per 100,000) was almost 8 times higher than the rate for whites (4.5 per 100,000) (table 1).

https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf



I lived and worked in Bristol Rhode Island for a year, no murders there it's safer than anywhere in Australia, they have a murder rate of 0 per 100K

http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Bristol-Rhode-Island.html
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Reply #38 - Nov 24th, 2018 at 8:26am
 
Captain Nemo wrote on Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:14pm:
More than 300 mass shootings in the US so far this year. 



That's bullshit, there have been 108 mass shootings in the US since 1982.

Mother Jones is a leftist group that pushes gun cntrol they have a tally of all mass shootings here- https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/mass-shootings-mother-jones-full-da...


If we use the Australian definition of 5 or more killed for mass shootings then the US drops to just over 80 mass shootings since 1982, if we are going to compare countries it would be dishonest to use different definitions for mass shootings.

Quote:
Conclusions and Relevance  Following enactment of gun law reforms in Australia in 1996, there were no mass firearm killings through May 2016. There was a more rapid decline in firearm deaths between 1997 and 2013 compared with before 1997 but also a decline in total nonfirearm suicide and homicide deaths of a greater magnitude. Because of this, it is not possible to determine whether the change in firearm deaths can be attributed to the gun law reforms.

Using several online news media databases (Factiva, ProQuest, NewsText, and News Store online) as well as web search engine queries for mass shootings, one author (P.A.) verified reports of all mass shooting incidents in Australia (defined here, as in a previous analysis,8 as ≥5 victims killed by gunshot, not including the perpetrator).

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2530362


There you go the Journal of the American Medical Association says it's not possible to determine if our gun laws reduced firearm homicides because non  firearm homicides declined by a far greater magnitude during that time period.

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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #39 - Nov 24th, 2018 at 10:10am
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 24th, 2018 at 8:26am:
Captain Nemo wrote on Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:14pm:
More than 300 mass shootings in the US so far this year. 



That's bullshit, there have been 108 mass shootings in the US since 1982....



The number of mass shootings around the country in 2018 has risen above 300 so far.

According to data from the Gun Violence Archive, a total of 314 mass shooting incidents have occurred as of November 19.

A shooting injuring four people, including a suspect, at a Chicago hospital and a Monday evening shooting in Denver, injuring at least 4 and killing 1, marked the 315th and 316th mass shootings so far this year, respectively.

https://www.abc15.com/news/data/mass-shootings-in-the-us-when-where-they-have-oc...

In 2017, the U.S. saw a total of 346 mass shootings.

...


https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1jl901ZAtyFSXvVsoRAxkMP_V2S-nM7-Z&ll=37...


...


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Reply #40 - Nov 24th, 2018 at 3:29pm
 
Funny how you don't seem to read the conclusion to the American Medical Association journal article, Baron:

Quote:
In the 20 years (May 1996-May 2016) since the gun law reforms and buyback programs, no mass shootings (ie, ≥5 victims) have occurred in Australia. In addition, there was a more rapid decline in total firearm deaths after gun law reforms (1997-2013) compared with before gun law reforms (1979-1996).

[Source]

Seems to be to be saying the reverse of what you're claiming, Baron.  Funny that, hey?   Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #41 - Nov 24th, 2018 at 5:37pm
 
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #42 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 12:32am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:49pm:



You destroy your own argument with this link, that is not America. That is everyday black behavior, if you doubt it get drunk in any Bar in any black neighborhood in America. I doubt you will be in the best of health in the morning!

You could live in any of the Black neighborhoods in the US to find the kind of violent society you imagine! We are not a homogeneous society united by culture, beliefs or appearance. The wife of our former divider-in-chief bemoaned the lack of large grocery stores in the black communities. Simple business formulas discourage locations where crime is a major problem. No one wants to have their store robbed on a regular basis and burned down during the riot season! 

This is about your Country, not mine and your rules appear to be based on "The Minority Report". It really causes you great concern that people who have never been criminals and not likely to ever become criminals have something that has never been a problem and unlikely to be one!

Do you have regulations on sling shots as well?
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #43 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 4:26pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 12:32am:
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:49pm:



You destroy your own argument with this link, that is not America. That is everyday black behavior, if you doubt it get drunk in any Bar in any black neighborhood in America. I doubt you will be in the best of health in the morning!

You could live in any of the Black neighborhoods in the US to find the kind of violent society you imagine! We are not a homogeneous society united by culture, beliefs or appearance. The wife of our former divider-in-chief bemoaned the lack of large grocery stores in the black communities. Simple business formulas discourage locations where crime is a major problem. No one wants to have their store robbed on a regular basis and burned down during the riot season! 

This is about your Country, not mine and your rules appear to be based on "The Minority Report". It really causes you great concern that people who have never been criminals and not likely to ever become criminals have something that has never been a problem and unlikely to be one!

Do you have regulations on sling shots as well?


Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Sandra Parks is an American, Mort.  Please keep your racism away from here.  "Race" is a social construct created by idiots on the basis of prejudice and hatred, not science.  "Race" does not exist scientifically.  There are more differences within each so-called "racial" group than there are between them.  Modern Genetics has proved that we all share the same genetic pool, it is what allows us all to interbreed with one another.  We are all descended according to Genetic theory from Africans.   You're slighting your own racial heritage with your mindless and senseless prejudice.    Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #44 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 5:30pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 24th, 2018 at 3:29pm:
Funny how you don't seem to read the conclusion to the American Medical Association journal article, Baron:

Quote:
In the 20 years (May 1996-May 2016) since the gun law reforms and buyback programs, no mass shootings (ie, ≥5 victims) have occurred in Australia. In addition, there was a more rapid decline in total firearm deaths after gun law reforms (1997-2013) compared with before gun law reforms (1979-1996).

[Source]

Seems to be to be saying the reverse of what you're claiming, Baron.  Funny that, hey?   Roll Eyes


Does anyone else use 5 or more killed for a mass shooting or is that unique to the Aussie gun grabbers Simon Chapman and Philip Alpers?

Capt Nemo tried to claim the US has had many mass shootings this year he cited this group.
Quote:
Why are GVA Mass Shooting numbers higher than some other sources?

GVA uses a purely statistical threshold to define mass shooting based ONLY on the numeric value of 4 or more shot or killed, not including the shooter.


Rather than just collecting incidents of death, GVA also catalogs incidents where a victim was injured by shooting or by a victim who was the subject of an armed robber or home invader. Incidents of defensive gun use, home owners who stop a home invasion, store clerks who stop a robbery, individuals who stop an assault or rape with a gun are also collected.
https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/methodology



According to gunviolence.org which many cite for mass shootings in the US our Monash University shooting would be considered a mass shooting using their definition for mass shootings.I think the Monash university shooting was a mass shooting.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monash_University_shooting


As we see with gun grabbers in this thread they use whatever definition for mass shootings that fits their agenda.
  Roll Eyes


If we use Simon Chapmans definition of 5 or more killed for mass shootings in the USA does that result in a significant reduction of mass shootings there with gunvoilence .org and motherjones?

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/mass-shootings-mother-jones-full-da...
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« Last Edit: Nov 26th, 2018 at 5:42pm by Baronvonrort »  

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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #45 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 6:07pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 12:32am:
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 23rd, 2018 at 3:49pm:



You destroy your own argument with this link, that is not America. That is everyday black behavior, if you doubt it get drunk in any Bar in any black neighborhood in America. I doubt you will be in the best of health in the morning!

You could live in any of the Black neighborhoods in the US to find the kind of violent society you imagine! We are not a homogeneous society united by culture, beliefs or appearance. The wife of our former divider-in-chief bemoaned the lack of large grocery stores in the black communities. Simple business formulas discourage locations where crime is a major problem. No one wants to have their store robbed on a regular basis and burned down during the riot season! 

This is about your Country, not mine and your rules appear to be based on "The Minority Report". It really causes you great concern that people who have never been criminals and not likely to ever become criminals have something that has never been a problem and unlikely to be one!

Do you have regulations on sling shots as well?
white middle class kids are the most likely to be the perpetrators in these mass school shootings Mort. Kids of people like you with ready access to firearms.
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #46 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 9:33pm
 
Quote:
white middle class kids are the most likely to be the perpetrators in these mass school shootings Mort. Kids of people like you with ready access to firearms.



36 School shooters/school related violence committed by those under the influence of psychiatric drugs


Fact: At least 36 school shootings and/or school-related acts of violence have been committed by those taking or withdrawing from psychiatric drugs resulting in 172 wounded and 80 killed (in other school shootings, information about their drug use was never made public—neither confirming or refuting if they were under the influence of prescribed drugs).  The most important fact about this list, is that these are only cases where the information about their psychiatric drug use was made public. (See full list below)

https://www.cchrint.org/school-shooters/

It takes a deadening of emotions to be able to commit these acts and drugs are the deciding factor. But at least little Johnny will sit still in class until he explodes!
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #47 - Nov 26th, 2018 at 9:49pm
 
Quote:
Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Sandra Parks is an American, Mort.  Please keep your racism away from here.  "Race" is a social construct created by idiots on the basis of prejudice and hatred, not science.  "Race" does not exist scientifically.  There are more differences within each so-called "racial" group than there are between them.  Modern Genetics has proved that we all share the same genetic pool, it is what allows us all to interbreed with one another.  We are all descended according to Genetic theory from Africans.   You're slighting your own racial heritage with your mindless and senseless prejudice.



You need to be consistent in your labels and not limit them to Americans. You also are part of the whole and the violence she wrote about must include you by your own definitions!

Just like there are different breeds of dogs with different temperaments there are different races of people and tarring everyone with the same brush is dishonest!
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #48 - Nov 27th, 2018 at 4:01pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 26th, 2018 at 9:49pm:
Quote:
Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Sandra Parks is an American, Mort.  Please keep your racism away from here.  "Race" is a social construct created by idiots on the basis of prejudice and hatred, not science.  "Race" does not exist scientifically.  There are more differences within each so-called "racial" group than there are between them.  Modern Genetics has proved that we all share the same genetic pool, it is what allows us all to interbreed with one another.  We are all descended according to Genetic theory from Africans.   You're slighting your own racial heritage with your mindless and senseless prejudice.


You need to be consistent in your labels and not limit them to Americans. You also are part of the whole and the violence she wrote about must include you by your own definitions!


Why did you blank out her nationality, Mort?

Too scared to admit that your former slaves are now full citizens?  Mmmm?   Or just don't like being included with people of colour?  Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Poor, poor, Mort.  America is a nation of colours.  About time you got used to the idea that White people don't control the nation any more...   Roll Eyes

Quote:
Just like there are different breeds of dogs with different temperaments there are different races of people and tarring everyone with the same brush is dishonest!


I am not tarring everybody with any sort of brush, Mort.  You are.  Until you admit that people of colour are full American citizens, this discussion is going no where, fast.   You simply cannot disown 30+% of your nation's population simply 'cause you don't like the colour of their skin or are afraid of them.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes
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Reply #49 - Nov 27th, 2018 at 10:17pm
 
Quote:
Why did you blank out her nationality, Mort?


Why? Because the bad behavior of 13% (not 30%) is not the behavior of a whole Nation. As for full citizenship, they have more than that. They are a protected class of people elevated beyond their abilities.

As for tarring, of course you are. All Americans are irresponsible as demonstrated by this victimized little girl! Your whole point is based on saying look at how violent the Americans are, they need more gun control! Not in my neighborhood bubba, we don't beat our women or kill a stranger because he disrespected us by stepping on our Nike shoes. A people who as a race never discovered the wheel or built anything that lasted 100 years or a structure over two stories tall.

We can't have gun control laws for one group and not another so we will continue to be responsible citizens and they will continue to victimize mostly each other.

This is all a distraction from the purpose of the original post, your citizens deserve to have your laws liberalized. The majority of projectile expelling devices need fewer regulation, not more.  Whether spring powered, air powered or using gun powder the likelihood of them being used illegally is so remote there is no reason for regulation!

You need to get over this authoritarian attitude. Your citizens need less government, not more!
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Reply #50 - Nov 27th, 2018 at 10:35pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 27th, 2018 at 10:17pm:
Quote:
Why did you blank out her nationality, Mort?


Why? Because the bad behavior of 13% (not 30%) is not the behavior of a whole Nation. As for full citizenship, they have more than that. They are a protected class of people elevated beyond their abilities.

As for tarring, of course you are. All Americans are irresponsible as demonstrated by this victimized little girl! Your whole point is based on saying look at how violent the Americans are, they need more gun control! Not in my neighborhood bubba, we don't beat our women or kill a stranger because he disrespected us by stepping on our Nike shoes. A people who as a race never discovered the wheel or built anything that lasted 100 years or a structure over two stories tall.

We can't have gun control laws for one group and not another so we will continue to be responsible citizens and they will continue to victimize mostly each other.

This is all a distraction from the purpose of the original post, your citizens deserve to have your laws liberalized. The majority of projectile expelling devices need fewer regulation, not more.  Whether spring powered, air powered or using gun powder the likelihood of them being used illegally is so remote there is no reason for regulation!

You need to get over this authoritarian attitude. Your citizens need less government, not more!



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Racism is as I have suggested, based upon prejudice and lies, not scientific fact.   Black Africans used the wheel, I think you're talking about native Americans.  Another group I'm sure you'd claim weren't real Americans as well.

Why am I reminded of the old joke, a woman is on her mobile phone at the airport speaking in a language other than English and a White Supremacist rips into her, damning her for not speaking English, "stop speakin' that foreign lingo!".  "Excuse me," replies the woman, "I am speaking Navaho, my ancestors were here thousands of years before your ancestors arrived."   

The point is, some people who might claim they are superior because of their supposed "race" are actually inferiors - just like you, Mort.

Your guns contribute to the violence present in American society.  You have guns because you fear your fellow Americans.   Doesn't matter what the colour of their skin, where they live or what they do, you're afraid of them all.   So, if you like living in fear, go for it but more civilised people don't and we won't.   Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #51 - Nov 28th, 2018 at 12:21am
 
You must suffer from ADHD because you just can't stay on point! I have never held myself out to be better than anyone but I also don't recognize anyone as being better than me! Unlike you who let me know those descended from convicts are inferior to you!

I see your knowledge of American Indians is as Hollywood inspired as many of your BS opinions. There once was a people in North America only remembered as the ancient ones.  The American Indians wiped them out and took their land. They all had a long history of invading the territory claimed by other tribes. You will get a more accurate history by reading the novels of Louis L'amore  then the politically correct fiction passed off as history!

My guns are secured and have not contributed to violence in my society. I can't say none ever took a life because many were Police and Military trade-ins. I don't own because of fear, I own because of a sense of history and being armed doesn't equal fear! Some even take loose powder and round balls!

I carry to protect what I value. Crime is reduced when the muggers and rapists don't know who is armed or who may come to the aid of their victims! That isn't fear and an encounter with an attacker isn't an opportunity for a sparing match. 

Now, try to pay attention. It would not harm your society to delete laws that serve no purpose. A Crossman .22 caliber pellet gun is not a threat to the public and nothing is accomplished by record keeping and restrictions. I am sure there are many other examples.
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Re: Australia's NRA-inspired gun lobby
Reply #52 - Nov 28th, 2018 at 9:01am
 
Guns attract guns. The fewer there are, the better.
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Reply #53 - Nov 28th, 2018 at 6:36pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 28th, 2018 at 12:21am:
You must suffer from ADHD because you just can't stay on point! I have never held myself out to be better than anyone but I also don't recognize anyone as being better than me! Unlike you who let me know those descended from convicts are inferior to you!


"Inferior"?  No, just different, Mort.  Just different.  They are descended from the first white settlers on this continent.  I have relatives who trace their ancestry further back than that  some 75,000 years actually.   They were considered "inferior" by many White colonists for the reason they had black skin.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes

Quote:
I see your knowledge of American Indians is as Hollywood inspired as many of your BS opinions. There once was a people in North America only remembered as the ancient ones.  The American Indians wiped them out and took their land. They all had a long history of invading the territory claimed by other tribes. You will get a more accurate history by reading the novels of Louis L'amore  then the politically correct fiction passed off as history!


Westerns are so much a romanticised view of history.  The wild west only lasted a generation, if that, in most parts of the US.  Yet, according to Hollywood, it lasted for hundreds of years.  Just as today, many Americans appear to believe they still live in that period and place and need guns to protect themselves.  Funny how weird people are sometimes, hey?

Quote:
My guns are secured and have not contributed to violence in my society. I can't say none ever took a life because many were Police and Military trade-ins. I don't own because of fear, I own because of a sense of history and being armed doesn't equal fear! Some even take loose powder and round balls!


You own them ultimately because you fear your fellow Americans, Mort.  You cannot deny you have them for "protection".  Who are you protecting yourself against, except your fellow Americans.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes

Quote:
I carry to protect what I value. Crime is reduced when the muggers and rapists don't know who is armed or who may come to the aid of their victims! That isn't fear and an encounter with an attacker isn't an opportunity for a sparing match. 


Much easier to call the police and let them deal with the miscreants than take the law into your own hands.  Stop dreaming your Wild West dreams - you supposedly live in a modern, liberal, democratic and law-abiding society.   Time for you to prove that.  Surrender your guns, immediately!

Quote:
Now, try to pay attention. It would not harm your society to delete laws that serve no purpose. A Crossman .22 caliber pellet gun is not a threat to the public and nothing is accomplished by record keeping and restrictions. I am sure there are many other examples.


A pellet gun is a gun.  A gun which can kill people and hurt them.  Time to surrender your guns, Mort.  Time to join the 21st century!  You don't live in the 19th century.   Roll Eyes
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Reply #54 - Nov 29th, 2018 at 1:36am
 
Having a gun for defense is no different than having a spare tire in a vehicle, a first aid kit or extra food and water in case of need! Discounting my historical artifacts and range toys I have a few polymer framed defensive arms. The compacts even have laser sights. I don't fear because I am not forced to live in an area were crimes are common. It is unlikely anyone will attack me where I live but I will still answer my door after dark with a gun held behind my back until I identify the visitor. That is being careful, not fearful! I never advocate for everyone to be armed, some just don't understand it is a responsibility to be taken seriously and not a magic talisman.  

Calling the police is great for getting reports written about a crime but as we all know "when seconds count the police are only minutes away". You are your own first responders! Rest assured if you break into my neighbors home I will call the police and record as much information about you as I safely can. If you break into mine chances are you will be stopped and that may include getting shot.

Most people are not the biggest and baddest MF around and a well placed bullet is a real game changer. When grandma or grandpa is the victim of a home invasion she/he may not be the one carried out. The old and the weak deserve a chance to defend themselves as well as the rest of us.

Once again, lighten up your gun laws and concern yourselves with only the ones commonly used in crimes. Regulating Daisy BB guns is laughably absurd.
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Reply #55 - Nov 29th, 2018 at 3:52pm
 
Mortdooley wrote on Nov 29th, 2018 at 1:36am:
Having a gun for defense is no different than having a spare tire in a vehicle, a first aid kit or extra food and water in case of need! Discounting my historical artifacts and range toys I have a few polymer framed defensive arms. The compacts even have laser sights. I don't fear because I am not forced to live in an area were crimes are common. It is unlikely anyone will attack me where I live but I will still answer my door after dark with a gun held behind my back until I identify the visitor. That is being careful, not fearful! I never advocate for everyone to be armed, some just don't understand it is a responsibility to be taken seriously and not a magic talisman.  

Calling the police is great for getting reports written about a crime but as we all know "when seconds count the police are only minutes away". You are your own first responders! Rest assured if you break into my neighbors home I will call the police and record as much information about you as I safely can. If you break into mine chances are you will be stopped and that may include getting shot.

Most people are not the biggest and baddest MF around and a well placed bullet is a real game changer. When grandma or grandpa is the victim of a home invasion she/he may not be the one carried out. The old and the weak deserve a chance to defend themselves as well as the rest of us.

Once again, lighten up your gun laws and concern yourselves with only the ones commonly used in crimes. Regulating Daisy BB guns is laughably absurd.



Thanks, Mort for condemning yourself from your own keyboard.  You claim you don't fear yet you admit to answering the door with a gun behind your back.  Why do that, unless you fear who might be at at the door?   Your guns are why other Americans have guns.   They fear you, just as much as you fear them.   Nothing you have said reassures me that you are not ultimately at the root cause of why Americans believe they need guns.    Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

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Reply #56 - Nov 29th, 2018 at 4:42pm
 
The Americans have the 2A to protect them from gun grabbers.

There is nothing the leftist bedwetting hoplophobes in Australia can do to take away the constitutional rights of Americans
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