Australian Politics Forum - Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?

PZ547

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Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?
Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 2:35pm

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Last week, a new law in New Zealand, the Customs and Excise Act 2018, gave customs officials the power to confiscate and retain digital devices and request passwords so information can be read and cloned. Refusal to comply can result in tourists being hit with a fine of up to NZ$5000.

And while you can appeal later, the reality is once your unlocked device has been handed over your data, and any data that connects you to other people such as email or instant messages are no longer private. This is a sign of increasingly invasive laws permeating our society

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Quote:

The worry is that other countries like Australia may see this as a precedent and introduce their own laws

LINK

So, naked and carrying a see-through plastic bag containing a toothbrush when planning a trip to NZ?

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 131487 Gender:	Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ? Reply #1 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 3:11pm In New Zealand — and many other countries, including Australia — Customs officers are already legally permitted to search digital devices as they would luggage, and to seize devices for forensic examination if they are believed to contain evidence of criminal activity.
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PZ547

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Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?
Reply #2 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 3:54pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 3:11pm:

In New Zealand — and many other countries, including Australia — Customs officers are already legally permitted to search digital devices as they would luggage, and to seize devices for forensic examination if they are believed to contain evidence of criminal activity

Are you sure?

This LINKseems to say otherwise:

Quote:

The Federal Government has been at pains to push the line that the legislation is limited, necessary and only targeting the legitimate investigation of suspects of serious crimes

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The Government says the current legislation is a good compromise. It will force technology companies to help law enforcement agencies read those messages, through so-called “technical assistance notices” issued by agency bosses and the Federal attorney-general, and only where a warrant to intercept communications has been granted by a court

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The real weakness in the laws is the lack of oversight. Agencies will need a court-issued warrant that says they can intercept the communications of their target

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Every generation we go through a major scandal at a law enforcement agency, and a royal commission exposes deep-rooted corruption.

Our police forces will have these powers, and our security agencies aren’t immune to those risks ...

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But he (Dutton)failed to mention the appalling uses authoritarian governments make of powers similar to those he seeks to extend here

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Here again is the LINK

ABC news on the other hand, makes the following claim, although a Search of Commonwealth Consolidated Acts site does not bear out ABC's claim: LINK

ABC claims: Quote:

Both Australian and New Zealand customs officers are legally allowed to search not only your personal baggage, but also the contents of your smartphone, tablet or laptop. It doesn't matter whether you are a citizen or visitor, or whether you're crossing a border by air, land or sea

LINK

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?
Reply #3 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 3:56pm

PZ547 wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 3:54pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 3:11pm:

In New Zealand — and many other countries, including Australia — Customs officers are already legally permitted to search digital devices as they would luggage, and to seize devices for forensic examination if they are believed to contain evidence of criminal activity

Are you sure?

Yep.

https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/crime/australian-border-force-charges-timorese-...

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PZ547

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Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?
Reply #4 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:11pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 3:56pm:

PZ547 wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 3:54pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 3:11pm:

In New Zealand — and many other countries, including Australia — Customs officers are already legally permitted to search digital devices as they would luggage, and to seize devices for forensic examination if they are believed to contain evidence of criminal activity

Are you sure?

Yep.

https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/crime/australian-border-force-charges-timorese-...

But ---- the article you linked said this Quote:

ABF regional commander for WA, Rod O’Donnell, said officers were skilled at identifying people attempting to carry prohibited material across the border

It did not say that border patrol were able to apprehend the man under new legislation enabling border partrol to demand mobile and computer passwords

And as my second post explained, prior to demanding mobile and computer passwords, customs/border patrol must be granted permission ' [b]issued by agency bosses and the Federal attorney-general, and only where a warrant to intercept communications has been granted by a court[/b] ' --- AND 'Agencies will need a court-issued warrant that says they can intercept the communications of their target

So, it seems, with regard to the article you cited, border patrol/customs had received approval to act via a court-issued warrant (from a court and/or agency bosses and/or Federal attorney general) allowing them to intercept the communnications of their target

or, the guy appeared to them to be suspicious

AND that he cooperated with border patrol/customs request that he provide his mobile/computer passwords

In other words, the guy caved

Only other possibility is that Australian border patrol/customs had information about the guy (via a tip-off) that was sufficient for them to be granted powers by Federal attorney general, agency bosses and/or court

No mention of border patrol/customs being empowered to demand the guy's passwords under threat of $5000 penalty. No mention of requirement of everyone being forced to provide passwords on demand to Border patrol/customs -- at the moment, at least

Glad they caught those guys/mentally ill deviants, obviously

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 131487 Gender:	Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ? Reply #5 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:12pm The passwords stuff is new. That's all.
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PZ547 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 9282 Gender:	Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ? Reply #6 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:15pm greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:12pm: The passwords stuff is new. That's all. Are you claiming legislation HAS been passed allowing Australian border patrol/customs to demand anyone's computer and mobile passwords?
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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 131487 Gender:	Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ? Reply #7 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:18pm PZ547 wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:15pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:12pm: The passwords stuff is new. That's all. Are you claiming legislation HAS been passed allowing border patrol/customs to demand anyone's computer and mobile passwords? In Australia? Not that I know of.
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PZ547

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Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?
Reply #8 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:21pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:18pm:

PZ547 wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:15pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:12pm:

The passwords stuff is new.

That's all.

Are you claiming legislation HAS been passed allowing border patrol/customs to demand anyone's computer and mobile passwords?

In Australia?

Not that I know of.

So what are you saying?

Are you saying Australian border patrol/customs ARE demanding mobile/computer passwords, without authorisation, such authorisation as contained within my above posts which state:

Quote:

customs/border patrol must be granted permission ' issued by agency bosses and the Federal attorney-general, and only where a warrant to intercept communications has been granted by a court ' ---

AND 'Agencies will need a court-issued warrant that says they can intercept the communications of their target

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?
Reply #9 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:27pm

PZ547 wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:21pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:18pm:

PZ547 wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:15pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:12pm:

The passwords stuff is new.

That's all.

Are you claiming legislation HAS been passed allowing border patrol/customs to demand anyone's computer and mobile passwords?

In Australia?

Not that I know of.

So what are you saying?

Are you saying Australian border patrol/customs ARE demanding mobile/computer passwords, without authorisation, such authorisation as contained within my above posts which state:

Quote:

customs/border patrol must be granted permission ' issued by agency bosses and the Federal attorney-general, and only where a warrant to intercept communications has been granted by a court ' ---

AND 'Agencies will need a court-issued warrant that says they can intercept the communications of their target

Demanding?

Probably not.

I assume they just ask the owner of the device to unlock it, and most of them voluntarily oblige.

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PZ547

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Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?
Reply #10 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:36pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:27pm:

PZ547 wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:21pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:18pm:

PZ547 wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:15pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:12pm:

The passwords stuff is new.

That's all.

Are you claiming legislation HAS been passed allowing border patrol/customs to demand anyone's computer and mobile passwords?

In Australia?

Not that I know of.

So what are you saying?

Are you saying Australian border patrol/customs ARE demanding mobile/computer passwords, without authorisation, such authorisation as contained within my above posts which state:

Quote:

customs/border patrol must be granted permission ' issued by agency bosses and the Federal attorney-general, and only where a warrant to intercept communications has been granted by a court ' ---

AND 'Agencies will need a court-issued warrant that says they can intercept the communications of their target

Demanding?

Probably not.

I assume they just ask the owner of the device to unlock it, and most of them voluntarily oblige

So your post (No.2 in this thread)

Quote:

n New Zealand — and many other countries, including Australia — Customs officers are already legally permitted to search digital devices as they would luggage, and to seize devices for forensic examination if they are believed to contain evidence of criminal activity

is incorrect

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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 95276 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ? Reply #11 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:38pm One day we will all learn to love Big Brother.
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PZ547

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Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?
Reply #12 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:42pm

Bobby. wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:38pm:

One day we will all learn to love Big Brother.

Or we could just walk around naked, carrying nothing, then all we'll have to contend with will be anal probes

At least every man and his dog getting around naked will collapse the porn industry. I've been advocating once a week Naked Day for years for that very reason

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Bobby.

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Re: Enter New Zealand Stark Naked ?
Reply #13 - Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:57pm

PZ547 wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:42pm:

Bobby. wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2018 at 4:38pm:

One day we will all learn to love Big Brother.

Or we could just walk around naked, carrying nothing, then all we'll have to contend with will be anal probes

At least every man and his dog getting around naked will collapse the porn industry. I've been advocating once a week Naked Day for years for that very reason

Big Brother wants your mind not your arse.

David Bowie 1984.

Someday they won't let you
So now you must agree
The times they are a-telling
And the changing isn't free
You've read it in the tea leaves, and the tracks are on TV
Beware the savage jaw of 1984
They'll split your pretty cranium, and fill it full of air
And tell that you're eighty, but brother, you won't care
You'll be shooting up on anything, tomorrow's never there
Beware the savage jaw of 1984

David Bowie Big Brother.

Don't talk of dust and roses
Or should we powder our noses?
Don't live for last year's capers
Give me steel, give me steel, give me pulsars unreal
He'll build a glass asylum
With just a hint of mayhem
He'll build a better whirlpool
We'll be living from sin
Then we can really begin

Someone to claim us, someone to follow
Someone to shame us, some brave Apollo
Someone to fool us, someone like you
We want you Big Brother, Big Brother

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