Australian Politics Forum - Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran

Baronvonrort

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Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran
Jun 10^th, 2018 at 7:03pm

Since muslims claim the Quran is the words of Allah who are these people Allah calls hypocrites?

Hypocrites are a word Allah calls those muslims who don't take Islam seriously the Arabic word for hypocrite is Munafiq

Quote:

Allah speaking-

O Prophet, fight against the disbelievers and the hypocrites and be harsh upon them. And their refuge is Hell, and wretched is the destination.

https://quran.com/9/73

https://quran.com/search?q=hypocrite

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issuevoter

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Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran
Reply #1 - Jun 10^th, 2018 at 9:34pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Jun 10^th, 2018 at 7:03pm:

Since muslims claim the Quran is the words of Allah who are these people Allah calls hypocrites?

Hypocrites are a word Allah calls those muslims who don't take Islam seriously the Arabic word for hypocrite is Munafiq

Quote:

Allah speaking-

O Prophet, fight against the disbelievers and the hypocrites and be harsh upon them. And their refuge is Hell, and wretched is the destination.

https://quran.com/9/73

https://quran.com/search?q=hypocrite

Isn't there a contradiction in this? If a person does not take Islam "seriously," how can they be considered a Muzlim?

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Unforgiven Gold Member Offline I have sinned Posts: 8879 Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #2 - Jun 10^th, 2018 at 10:24pm Freediver and Yadda.
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Baronvonrort

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Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran
Reply #3 - Jun 10^th, 2018 at 10:40pm

issuevoter wrote on Jun 10^th, 2018 at 9:34pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jun 10^th, 2018 at 7:03pm:

Since muslims claim the Quran is the words of Allah who are these people Allah calls hypocrites?

Hypocrites are a word Allah calls those muslims who don't take Islam seriously the Arabic word for hypocrite is Munafiq

Quote:

Allah speaking-

O Prophet, fight against the disbelievers and the hypocrites and be harsh upon them. And their refuge is Hell, and wretched is the destination.

https://quran.com/9/73

https://quran.com/search?q=hypocrite

Isn't there a contradiction in this? If a person does not take Islam "seriously," how can they be considered a Muzlim?

Firstly muslims will claim there are no contradictions in the Quran.
Quote:

Allah speaking-

Then do they not reflect upon the Qur'an? If it had been from [any] other than Allah, they would have found within it much contradiction.

https://quran.com/4/82

The hypocrites would be the muslims who think they can pick and choose which parts of Islam to believe in.It's a package deal if you want those Houris and the everlasting erection to service them

Quote:

hen, you are those [same ones who are] killing one another and evicting a party of your people from their homes, cooperating against them in sin and aggression. And if they come to you as captives, you ransom them, although their eviction was forbidden to you. So do you believe in part of the Scripture and disbelieve in part? Then what is the recompense for those who do that among you except disgrace in worldly life; and on the Day of Resurrection they will be sent back to the severest of punishment. And Allah is not unaware of what you do.

https://quran.com/2/85

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moses Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6353	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #4 - Jun 12^th, 2018 at 2:43pm How many times do I have to explain it? The qur'an is definitely not talking about killing them, you see the two person Arabian root for kill is not mentioned (or some such crap) The qur'an is written in a secret code, it jus duzzant mean what it sayz.
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polite_gandalf

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Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran
Reply #5 - Jun 23^rd, 2018 at 12:53am

Baronvonrort wrote on Jun 10^th, 2018 at 7:03pm:

Hypocrites are a word Allah calls those muslims who don't take Islam seriously the Arabic word for hypocrite is Munafiq

But you don't have a verse to back this up?

This is very unusual for you Baron - you are usually more than willing to provide the scriptural evidence for your claims.

Could it be because the Quran very clearly and explicitly explains that a munafiq is very much a "hypocrite" in exactly the same sense that we understand the word today?

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47481 At my desk.	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #6 - Jun 23^rd, 2018 at 8:14am Sometimes it's very easy to translate Arabic into English.
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #7 - Jun 23^rd, 2018 at 11:39am freediver wrote on Jun 23^rd, 2018 at 8:14am: Sometimes it's very easy to translate Arabic into English. I guess it is when moses and jihad watch can spoon feed you the "right" versions, without having to think. I believe the technical term is "confirmation bias"
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47481 At my desk.	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #8 - Jun 23^rd, 2018 at 11:45am Sometimes it's so confusing that most English versions of the Quran get it wrong and say fight when they meant to say inner peaceful struggle while slaughtering the infidel.
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Mattyfisk Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 92409 Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #9 - Jun 30^th, 2018 at 8:02pm Unforgiven wrote on Jun 10^th, 2018 at 10:24pm: Freediver and Yadda. What sound does a jellyfish make?
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Mattyfisk

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Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran
Reply #10 - Jun 30^th, 2018 at 8:04pm

freediver wrote on Jun 23^rd, 2018 at 11:45am:

Sometimes it's so confusing that most English versions of the Quran get it wrong and say fight when they meant to say inner peaceful struggle while slaughtering the infidel.

Oh, I know.

freediver wrote on Jun 24^th, 2018 at 3:21pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 24^th, 2018 at 2:14pm:

Do you understand that this verse is pricisely about avoiding conflict - ie by emigrating rather than staying and fighting?

OK, I'll concede that one.

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran
Reply #11 - Jun 30^th, 2018 at 9:53pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 23^rd, 2018 at 12:53am:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jun 10^th, 2018 at 7:03pm:

Hypocrites are a word Allah calls those muslims who don't take Islam seriously the Arabic word for hypocrite is Munafiq

But you don't have a verse to back this up?

This is very unusual for you Baron - you are usually more than willing to provide the scriptural evidence for your claims.

Muslims say the Quran is the word of Allah therefore it's your Allah calling people hypocrites (Munafiqs).

Verse in the Quran mention disbelievers and hypcrites therefore they're 2 separate groups of people.

Quote:

Allah speaking-

O Prophet, fight against the disbelievers and the hypocrites and be harsh upon them. And their refuge is Hell, and wretched is the destination.
https://quran.com/9/73

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #12 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:17pm Is that the best you can come up with Baron? Would you care to have another go? Where is the supporting verse for this claim of yours... Quote: Hypocrites are a word Allah calls those muslims who don't take Islam seriously ??
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47481 At my desk.	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #13 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:20pm Did Muhammad the illiterate provide a dictionary to go along with his book?
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Imrah Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 663 Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #14 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:21pm Not all Mohammedans understand the rest of humanity with the same level of respect. It depends on how literally they read their holy text, unfortunately for us mutilated infidels.
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #15 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:49pm freediver wrote on Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:20pm: Did Muhammad the illiterate provide a dictionary to go along with his book? He went one better - he (as in the Quran recital) explained clearly exactly what a hypocrite is. And guess what - it wasn't "those muslims who don't take Islam seriously"
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polite_gandalf

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Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran
Reply #16 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:52pm

Imrah wrote on Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:21pm:

It depends on how literally they read their holy text, unfortunately for us mutilated infidels.

Indeed. For example too many muslims don't take these two verses literally: "there is no compulsion in religion" and "whoever wills - let him believe; and whoever wills - let him disbelieve" - and somehow think that instead people must be forced to believe, or else face death.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Imrah

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Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran
Reply #17 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:55pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:49pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:20pm:

Did Muhammad the illiterate provide a dictionary to go along with his book?

He went one better - he (as in the Quran recital) explained clearly exactly what a hypocrite is. And guess what - it wasn't "those muslims who don't take Islam seriously"

I think that must have been some bug in the transliteration. What he meant was, "those humans who don't take Islam seriously" but maybe he had a point in 600AD or whenever. Now the Tigris and the Euphrates are all but dried up and the oil is the great elixer of Allah, and it is about time these raggamuffins got with the frucking programme and understand the other five billion souls stuck here on Earth with the exact same bloody right to be here as they do.

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freediver

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Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran
Reply #18 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:57pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:49pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 1^st, 2018 at 5:20pm:

Did Muhammad the illiterate provide a dictionary to go along with his book?

He went one better - he (as in the Quran recital) explained clearly exactly what a hypocrite is. And guess what - it wasn't "those muslims who don't take Islam seriously"

Are you going to provide this definition, or do we have to go looking?

How did he define Jihad?

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #19 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 6:32pm I was putting my faith in you managing the challenging task of typing "Quran + hypocrite" into google. My bad, here you go FD, open up, here comes the aeroplane! https://quran.com/63 - see verses 1-7 for example.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47481 At my desk.	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #20 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 6:34pm Quote: When the hypocrites come to you, [O Muhammad], they say, "We testify that you are the Messenger of Allah ." And Allah knows that you are His Messenger, and Allah testifies that the hypocrites are liars. So hypocrit = liar? Is there a definition for jihad in there somewhere?
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #21 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 7:45pm freediver wrote on Jul 1^st, 2018 at 6:34pm: So hypocrit = liar? all the verses I referred to you put together makes it pretty clear what a hypocrite is FD. And I think we can both agree it isn't "those humans who don't take Islam seriously".
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47481 At my desk.	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #22 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 8:25pm Apostates?
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #23 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 8:32pm apostates what? I hope you'r still not asking me to explain what is so clearly explained in verses 63:1-7
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47481 At my desk.	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #24 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 8:33pm He says it is because they believed then disbelieved. That makes them apostates, right? Is there a definition for jihad in there somewhere?
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #25 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 8:35pm get back to me when you've actually read it FD.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47481 At my desk.	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #26 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 8:36pm Quote: That is because they believed, and then they disbelieved; so their hearts were sealed over, and they do not understand.
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #27 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 9:05pm Congratulations FD, thats one verse. Would you like to quote the other 6? It might help - #justsayin
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47481 At my desk.	Re: Who are the people Allah calls Hypocrites in Quran Reply #28 - Jul 1^st, 2018 at 9:53pm Would you? You are the one who thinks it tells us something, not me. Is there a definition for jihad in there somewhere?
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