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The hydrogen future is ever nearer (Read 1971 times)
DonDeeHippy
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #60 - Jun 4th, 2018 at 3:03pm
 
lee wrote on Jun 2nd, 2018 at 12:06pm:
DonDeeHippy wrote on Jun 2nd, 2018 at 8:57am:
well in that case u better email Tesla and point out to them that they r wasting money on this and how silly they r.



Better still try google and learn for yourself. Then maybe you could make an informed comment.

Until then you are merely blathering.

And I think seeing as Musk has patents he knows how the system works.

your the one with a bee in his bonnet about Tesla getting patients I really dont give a toss Lee  Wink Wink
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DonDeeHippy
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #61 - Jun 4th, 2018 at 3:08pm
 
juliar wrote on Jun 4th, 2018 at 1:14pm:
Gosh the Greeny Type DDH is upset at being exposed as nothing but a technically ignorant attention seeking fraud.

So ignoring the silly waste of space Greeny type DDH and getting back to practical matters which the dumb DDH will NEVER be able to understand.



This is how transport will grow into the future. EV=all electric heap  HV=hybrid vehicle  PHV=plug in hybrid vehicle  FCV=fuel cell vehicle

https://s33.postimg.cc/p0dbop6in/image.jpg



Bear in mind the coal pollution caused by all electrics will put a stop to their expansion as they are basically parasites feeding on the coal power generating system.

with your superior intellect Jules I assume u realize
it takes 5 times as much electricity to make hydrogen and have it compressed than it does to recharge a battery, so 5 times the coal as per your argument, not to mention transporting the hydrogen then getting it to a filling station etc etc Wink Wink Wink Wink
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lee
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #62 - Jun 4th, 2018 at 3:10pm
 
DonDeeHippy wrote on Jun 4th, 2018 at 3:03pm:
your the one with a bee in his bonnet about Tesla getting patients I really dont give a toss Lee



Yeah. you were just the one spouting bulsh!t about patents; when you didn't have a clue. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
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Sir lastnail
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #63 - Jun 4th, 2018 at 8:20pm
 
juliar wrote on Jun 1st, 2018 at 5:11pm:
Gee the lulus are out with the FULL MOON. It always happens.

Gosh what a trio - LostSnail and DDH and Futility in search of Failure all howling at the moon - you can't get much worse than that.

Their combined knowledge wouldn't fill a tea cup.

Now back to the TOPIC which the normally off topic normally ignored Greeny types think is just an excuse to try to get noticed.



Wow! What a snorter!!!  Makes the fire death trap Tesla look really drab.

https://inhabitat.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2014/11/Toyota-Mirai-Fuel-Cel...
Toyota Mirai Fuel Cell Vehicle



Now have a look at the gleaming hydrogen cars of the future which are here now

https://inhabitat.com/toyota-unveils-mirai-hydrogen-fuel-cell-car-with-300-mile-...


Wonder if Tesla is going to bring out a modern hydrogen car to replace their aging already obsolete all electric heaps ?




When can I buy one socko ? In 20 years time ? Cheesy LOL
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"When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours." - Luke Muehlhauser
 
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DonDeeHippy
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #64 - Jun 4th, 2018 at 8:33pm
 
lee wrote on Jun 4th, 2018 at 3:10pm:
DonDeeHippy wrote on Jun 4th, 2018 at 3:03pm:
your the one with a bee in his bonnet about Tesla getting patients I really dont give a toss Lee



Yeah. you were just the one spouting bulsh!t about patents; when you didn't have a clue. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

ohh the circle starts again
I said Tesla have opened some of their patents for anyone to use. anything after that is your crap Lee...... Wink Wink
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lee
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #65 - Jun 4th, 2018 at 8:44pm
 
DonDeeHippy wrote on Jun 4th, 2018 at 8:33pm:
I said Tesla have opened some of their patents for anyone to use. anything after that is your crap Lee.....



DonDeeHippy wrote on Jun 1st, 2018 at 5:04pm:
because a competitor could patent their stuff, then they wouldn't be able to use there own tech.......


Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
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juliar
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #66 - Jun 5th, 2018 at 1:28pm
 
LostSnail and DDh are competing to see who is the worst.

The baffling attention seeking technical ignorance of the Greeny types defies description.

But then that is why they are so naive and gullible as to be sucked in by the Greeny bulldust.

But leaving the Greeny bulldust waffle in the dust and back to reality.

When you see the development in the obvious choice of hydrogen for the future they make the already obsolete Tesla fire death traps look really drab.


...m
Toyota’s hydrogen-powered Mirai went on sale in Japan way back in 2015 and now Japan is looking to import hydrogen from AUSTRALIA.



12 Best Electric Cars and Trucks Powered by Hydrogen Fuel Cells
Feb 19, 2018

VIDEO: 12 Best Electric Cars and Trucks Powered by Hydrogen Fuel Cells

Automotive Territory: Trending News & Car Reviews — via YouTube

Even though today hydrogen fuel cell technology is being vastly out played by all-electric powertrains, many manufacturers are determined to develop both technologies letting science discoveries and rate of progress to determine which one is here to stay.

Hydrogen cars can provide long range, take minutes to refuel and emit only water, this is why they deserve your attention, so welcome to the list of 12 best hydrogen powered automobiles. Enjoy the ride.

https://atwarwiththedinosaurs.com/12-best-electric-cars-and-trucks-powered-by-hy...
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juliar
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #67 - Jun 8th, 2018 at 6:37pm
 
See the Greeny lulus DDh and LostSnail are competing to see who is the most tragic waste of space.

Their combined knowledge wouldn't fill the back of a postage stamp.




Amazon Is Buying Hydrogen Stocks: You Should, Too
June 8th, 2018

Elon Musk is against it.

But Amazon is all for it.

In fact, these tech titans are clashing right now over what technology will carry us out of the fossil fuel age.

For companies like Tesla, lithium-ion battery technology is the future.

You see, these batteries have become an integral part of our daily lives, and everyone is desperately trying to build faster, cheaper, more efficient versions of them.

Yet, there’s a little-known power source that's threatening to ruin it all for Musk.

Amazon is going all in on an up-and-coming alternative power: hydrogen fuel cells.

And it’s sparked a war within the auto industry.

Will tomorrow’s cars be fueled by lithium batteries or hydrogen fuel cells?

It’s the fight of the century.

And Jeff Bezos — one of the world’s richest men — is betting big that hydrogen will win.

We’ve even found the tiny company that Amazon has bought into that's developing hydrogen fuel cell technology, and shares could explode at any moment!

And we reveal its name and ticker symbol in our free report: “Even Amazon Is Investing in Hydrogen.”

In our report, you get key details about the hydrogen and lithium industries and also why Amazon has put its weight behind hydrogen.

https://secure.energyandcapital.com/148953?device=c&gclid=CjwKCAjw0ujYBRBDEiwAn7...


...
After the electric fiery death trap cars are banned clean safe hydrogen will be the future of the future

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DonDeeHippy
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #68 - Jun 8th, 2018 at 10:57pm
 
That is even uglier than a Prius.... still not even 1 of those in aus yet.... Wink Wink
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DonDeeHippy
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #69 - Jun 8th, 2018 at 11:03pm
 
juliar wrote on Jun 8th, 2018 at 6:37pm:
See the Greeny lulus DDh and LostSnail are competing to see who is the most tragic waste of space.

Their combined knowledge wouldn't fill the back of a postage stamp.




Amazon Is Buying Hydrogen Stocks: You Should, Too
June 8th, 2018

Elon Musk is against it.

But Amazon is all for it.

In fact, these tech titans are clashing right now over what technology will carry us out of the fossil fuel age.

For companies like Tesla, lithium-ion battery technology is the future.

You see, these batteries have become an integral part of our daily lives, and everyone is desperately trying to build faster, cheaper, more efficient versions of them.

Yet, there’s a little-known power source that's threatening to ruin it all for Musk.

Amazon is going all in on an up-and-coming alternative power: hydrogen fuel cells.

And it’s sparked a war within the auto industry.

Will tomorrow’s cars be fueled by lithium batteries or hydrogen fuel cells?

It’s the fight of the century.

And Jeff Bezos — one of the world’s richest men — is betting big that hydrogen will win.

We’ve even found the tiny company that Amazon has bought into that's developing hydrogen fuel cell technology, and shares could explode at any moment!

And we reveal its name and ticker symbol in our free report: “Even Amazon Is Investing in Hydrogen.”

In our report, you get key details about the hydrogen and lithium industries and also why Amazon has put its weight behind hydrogen.

https://secure.energyandcapital.com/148953?device=c&gclid=CjwKCAjw0ujYBRBDEiwAn7...


http://www.glbrain.com/images/tools/66/57/0605745b371be8b3d22b73638c065766_xxbig...
After the electric fiery death trap cars are banned clean safe hydrogen will be the future of the future


You do realize this is a scam Jules...... go on give them your email and bank details too... I think Microsoft r doing a lottery too. I have some shares in shyhooks for ya as well Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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lee
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #70 - Jun 9th, 2018 at 12:06pm
 
DonDeeHippy wrote on Jun 8th, 2018 at 11:03pm:
You do realize this is a scam Jules.



you do have a link to prove this?
Oh, The claim was made by a Tesla co-founder. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
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juliar
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #71 - Jun 11th, 2018 at 8:05pm
 
Dumber than dumb uneducated technically ignorant DDH is attention seeking again. No surprise he/she is normally ignored.

And fancy wasting space copying my good post and then adding some silly childish waffling dribble!!!

But ignoring the deadly boring DDH and back on topic.

The sheer inconvenience of long refueling time and range anxiety will always put the kibosh on the general acceptance of electric heaps.

Not to mention the ever present risk of suddenly bursting into flames.




Japan is betting future cars will use hydrogen fuel cells

https://www.ft.com/content/98080634-a1d6-11e7-8d56-98a09be71849
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juliar
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #72 - Jun 11th, 2018 at 8:44pm
 
The Rise of Hydrogen Fuel Cell Vehicles is now inevitable as people realize the all electrics are fiery deathtraps.

Zero Emission Fuel Cells
Article by Randy MacEwen, President & CEO Jan. 23, 2018

KPMG recently published its 19th consecutive Global Automotive Executive Survey 2018. 

The survey concluded, “There will not be a single solitary drivetrain technology: Executives project a similar split by 2040 for
Battery Electric Vehicles (BEVs) (26%),
Fuel Cell Electric Vehicles (FCEVs) (25%),
ICEs (Internal Combustion Engines (ICE) (25%) and hybrids (24%).


The report also noted, “FCEVs have replaced BEVs as this year’s #1 key trend until 2025.”  Yes, you read that correctly – hydrogen fuel cell vehicles top the list as the key trend.

Notwithstanding inflammatory commentary by some well-known electric car proponents, Ballard is very excited about the long-term opportunity for fuel cell electric passenger cars.  Here’s why.

...
hydrogen fuel cell vehicles

7 Reasons Why the World is Ready for Fuel Cell Passenger Cars

1. The Market is Massive
Most people know from personal experience that the global automotive industry is huge. Consider the following two ways to evaluate the size of the market.

First, let’s consider the market as a function of the aggregate sales price of new cars sold each year. There are 80 million cars sold each year globally. At an average selling price of US$19k, this translates to a US$1.5 trillion annual market. This is equivalent to approximately 2% of global GDP.

Second, let’s consider the total addressable market as a function of the number of miles driven each year. There are 10 trillion miles traveled annually by the global population of cars.  At an average cost of US$1/mile, this implies a market size of US$10 trillion. This is equivalent to approximately 13% of global GDP.

Here are a few additional facts to punctuate the size of the automotive market.  Transportation is the second largest expense for US households, and 70% of total US petroleum usage is for transportation.

Consistent with the results in the KPMG survey, we also believe there will be a number of drivetrain solutions to meet differing market requirements and use cases for passenger vehicles. We also believe FCEVs will play an important role in a certain number of these use cases.

2. Attractive FCEV Targets are Being Set
A key industry development in 2017 was the formation of the Hydrogen Council, launched at the World Economic Forum in Davos. The Hydrogen Council is a global initiative of leading energy, transport and industry companies with a united vision of hydrogen as a key part of the future energy transition.  The Hydrogen Council has the following target for FCEVs in 2030:

350,000 commercial trucks
50,000 buses
Thousands of trains and ships
1 in 12 cars sold in California, Germany, Japan and South Korea
and the following target for FCEVs in 2050:

15 to 20 million commercial trucks
5 million buses
25% of passenger ships
20% of trains
400 million passenger cars
3. The Need for Deep Decarbonization
The heightened interest in electrification, including in FCEVs, is being driven in part by the global movement towards addressing climate change and air pollution through decarbonization. This direction was highlighted in 2017 with several countries proposing or passing laws that would ban ICE-based vehicles.

Britain and France each outlined a plan to ban ICEs in vehicles by 2040.
India is targeting all vehicles on the road to be powered by clean energy by 2030.
In Norway, over 20% of new vehicles sold today are electric and the government wants 100% of sales to be zero-emission by 2025. The Netherlands is also following suit. Germany is reviewing a similar objective.
There is indication that the California Air Resources Board is also considering a move toward zero-emission vehicles.
China is reviewing a timeline for banning ICEs.
In 2017, we also saw unprecedented developments at the city level when 12 of the C40 cities – including London, Paris, Los Angeles, Copenhagen, Barcelona, Vancouver, Mexico City, Milan, and Seattle – signed the “C40 Fossil-Fuel-Free Streets Declaration” – establishing a target of procuring only zero-emission transit buses by the year 2025. Over the next few years, we expect more countries and cities to set up plans to ban ICE-based vehicles.

One important consideration that has received relatively low attention is the true “wells to wheels” GHG analysis for alternative powertrain technologies. BEVs are characterized as zero tailpipe emissions. This is true. However, it’s also important to consider the GHG and other emissions associated with:

the electricity required to recharge batteries

Read rest of the inevitable rise of FCEV and the inevitable decline of BEV here

http://blog.ballard.com/hydrogen-fuel-cell-vehicles
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« Last Edit: Jun 11th, 2018 at 8:57pm by juliar »  
 
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DonDeeHippy
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #73 - Jun 12th, 2018 at 4:50am
 
lee wrote on Jun 9th, 2018 at 12:06pm:
DonDeeHippy wrote on Jun 8th, 2018 at 11:03pm:
You do realize this is a scam Jules.



you do have a link to prove this?
Oh, The claim was made by a Tesla co-founder. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

what that amazon has bought a hydrogen company and do u want to buy shares for this unnamed company........ Cheesy Cheesy
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juliar
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Re: The hydrogen future is ever nearer
Reply #74 - Jun 12th, 2018 at 7:43am
 
Silly dumb normally ignored DDH is trying to sound intelligent to try to get attention. Didn't work.

What will kill electric cars - they are death traps.


Are Electric Vehicles a Fire Hazard? Lithium-ion batteries have risks, but they can be managed to prevent fires in EVs.
by Kevin Bullis  November 26, 2013

In the past two months, three Tesla Motors Model S electric cars have caught fire after their lithium-ion battery packs were damaged. Last week the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration said it would investigate whether Tesla’s Model S needs to be modified to prevent further fires.

...
Burn out: The front end of a Tesla Model S was consumed in flames after its battery was damaged.

In two cases, the cars ran over large metal objects at highway speed; the third car hit a concrete wall. No one was hurt: a warning system allowed the drivers to pull the car over and get out before smoke started coming from the battery pack, and the design of the battery pack slowed the spread of the fire, which never made it into the passenger compartments. Tesla has said it will cover fires in its warranty, so the cost won’t be felt by owners. And Tesla founder Elon Musk argues that the fires are still very rare.

Even so, the incidents have drawn attention to the safety of the batteries used in electric vehicles (see “Early Data Suggests Collision-Caused Fires Are More Frequent in the Tesla Model S than Conventional Cars”). They are also just the latest examples of lithium-ion battery fires in electric vehicles—we’ve seen fires with the Chevy Volt and Fisker Karma plug-in vehicles. Boeing’s 787 Dreamliner was grounded because of problems with its new lithium-ion batteries.

There are inherent risks when you store enough energy to propel a two-ton car at 75 miles an hour for hundreds of miles. After all, thousands of gasoline-powered cars catch fire in collisions each year. In principle, those risks can be managed through structural design and cooling. But could the lithium-ion battery cells themselves be made safer?

Electric-vehicle battery packs are made of hundreds to thousands of battery cells, each of which contains a flammable liquid electrolyte. Managing the risks of lithium-ion battery fires comes down to two things: keeping the electrolyte from catching fire, and keeping a fire from spreading if it does happen.

However, lithium-ion battery cells themselves can sometimes generate enough heat to ignite the electrolyte in a process known as thermal runaway. Short-circuits between the two electrodes in a battery cell, for example, can heat up the electrodes. If these electrodes get too hot, the heat can trigger chemical reactions that quickly generate more heat until the electrolytes burst into flame. This seems to be what happened in the Tesla fires, when damage to the battery packs caused short-circuits leading to thermal runaway.

Short circuits can be the result of manufacturing defects, but battery makers have become very good at preventing those. When batteries are used as intended, there’s only one fire for every 100 million lithium-ion battery cells out there, says Jeff Dahn, professor of physics and chemistry at Dalhousie University. Tesla also guards against thermal runaway events with an extensive liquid cooling system designed to cool the cells so fast that if one cell catches fire, its neighbors won’t.

If, however, multiple cells are damaged, the cooling system might not be enough. “If the Tesla pack is abused severely by a large metal object thrust through the pack, it will probably have a fire in most instances,” Dahn says.

Tesla further protects the battery pack with a quarter-inch-thick plate of hardened aluminum. In many cases, this seems to work. The Model S earned the highest safety ratings from NHTSA after crash tests. But the protection didn’t prove to be enough in the case of the fires.

Tesla also built a firewall between the pack and the passenger compartment. “That firewall is designed so that even if the pack does go into thermal runaway, it does not penetrate the passenger compartment,” Musk says.

Since the accidents, Tesla sent out a software update that changes the settings on the Model S suspension so that the battery pack is higher off the ground at highways speeds, making it less likely to hit the sort of chunks of metal that caused two of the fires.

Beyond making battery packs safer, it’s also possible to make the cells themselves safer by switching to electrode materials that store less energy but can withstand higher temperatures before thermal runaway starts. Some other automakers have done this, but the resulting battery packs cost more. It’s not clear that Tesla has selected electrode materials to improve the safety of individual cells.

Musk says it would be possible to increase the thickness of the aluminum plating that protects the battery pack. But that would add considerable weight that would hurt the car’s performance and lower its range on a charge. He says that he doesn’t think this will be necessary, since the current safety measures have protected drivers, and he expects that there won’t be many fires.

https://www.technologyreview.com/s/521976/are-electric-vehicles-a-fire-hazard/
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