Forum

 
  Back to OzPolitic.com   Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
  Forum Home Album HelpSearch Recent Rules LoginRegister  
 

Pages: 1 2 3 4 
Send Topic Print
Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes (Read 5321 times)
DonDeeHippy
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Cool Stuff

Posts: 2782
Australia
Gender: male
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #30 - Jun 8th, 2018 at 1:44pm
 
DonDeeHippy wrote on Jun 7th, 2018 at 6:27am:
juliar wrote on Jun 5th, 2018 at 1:46pm:
The old troll DDH is making up the bulldust as he/she goes - what a FRAUD!!!

so lithium battery packs can still be put in Australian homes and  none have caught fire. who is the sensationalist fraud here Jules ???
Wink Wink Wink

Still none have caught on fire..... waiting waiting Wink Wink
Back to top
 

I am me
 
IP Logged
 
juliar
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 22966
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #31 - Jun 8th, 2018 at 2:01pm
 
Boring silly old DDH - what a waste of time.


More to the point Vangard what will the home insurance companies do ?

If a home catches on fire for any reason when the fire gets to the Tesla Lithium fire bomb PowerWall it will go off like a fire bomb - you know just like the Tesla fiery death trap cars do.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
DonDeeHippy
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Cool Stuff

Posts: 2782
Australia
Gender: male
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #32 - Jun 10th, 2018 at 8:16am
 
juliar wrote on Jun 8th, 2018 at 2:01pm:
Boring silly old DDH - what a waste of time.


More to the point Vangard what will the home insurance companies do ?

If a home catches on fire for any reason when the fire gets to the Tesla Lithium fire bomb PowerWall it will go off like a fire bomb - you know just like the Tesla fiery death trap cars do.

so lithium battery packs can still be put in Australian homes and  none have caught fire. who is the sensationalist fraud here Jules ??? Wink Wink Wink
Back to top
 

I am me
 
IP Logged
 
juliar
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 22966
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #33 - Jun 11th, 2018 at 7:33pm
 
Boring silly old DDH - what a waste of time. Wonder when the poor soul will get so humiliated that he/she will leave permanently ?

Now the TRUTH about lithium fire bombs in the home is starting to leak out alarming the public.

When will home insurance companies wack up the premiums to cover lithium fire bombs in the home ?




‘Years to understand’ fire risk of solar power systems
GREG BROWN Journalist Canberra The Australian12:00AM July 12, 2017

...
SunSeeker Electrical owner Abdullah Sultan says he knows of hundreds of fires caused by poor installation of solar panels. Picture: James Croucher

Victoria’s Metropolitan Fire Brigade has responded to more than 40 fires caused by home solar power systems in the past five years and warned that it would take years to understand the fire risk posed by lithium ion battery storage.

The MFB said the solar installations were vulnerable to faults across their systems, including isolation switches, inverters and installed wiring, and from deteriorating components.

The alarming figures come as the solar battery storage industry pushes to kill new regulations that would force homeowners to build a separate “fire bunker” housing for battery installations.

Under draft rules released by Standards Australia, lithium ion batteries are classed as “Fire Class 1” and would not be allowed inside or within 1m of a domestic dwelling. The industry will have until August 15 to respond to the draft regulations.


The safety moves are designed to avoid a repeat of Labor’s insulation batts scheme in which the rapid rollout of roof insulation in 2009 led to more than 200 house fires across the nation, and ultimately four deaths.

The MFB warned last night that the risk caused by the rapidly growing uptake of solar panels on homes had not yet been properly understood.

“In the past five years, MFB has responded to more than 40 fires involving solar panels,” a spokeswoman said.

“The causes of these fires vary but are usually sparked by system faults including isolation switches, inverters, installed wiring, and deteriorating components.

“As with any new technology, it will take some time before the risks associated with lithium ion batteries in solar panels can be fully understood.”

Energy Safe Victoria director Neil Fraser said at least eight solar panel models had been taken off the market in the past five years because of fire concerns.

“We are aware of as many as eight recalls nationally over the last five years of DC isolator switches which are located next to the solar panel on the roof,” Mr Fraser said.

“It is important that those ­people who have panels maintain them. They need to be cleaned regularly and inspected, preferably by a licensed electrician.”

Sales of battery storage have risen to 6750 battery installations last year, up from 500 in 2015, ­according to a recent survey.

Solar energy equipment supplier SunWiz forecasts at least a threefold increase this year.

The owner of a Sydney-based solar panel maintenance company said he had seen “hundreds” of fires caused by solar panels in the past five years.

SunSeeker Electrical owner Abdullah Sultan said this was because of “cowboy” installers operating under little regulation.

He said cheap products from China had forced local installers to drop prices and cut corners.

“There are a lot of cowboys out there who want a quick buck and the pricing isn’t regulated so you get people charging dirt cheap and customers don’t know what they are buying.”

The Clean Energy Council’s voluntary code outlines concerns that lithium-based batteries can overheat.

But CEC chief executive Kane Thornton said yesterday the lithium ion batteries were not a fire hazard, although he acknowledged it would take time to fully understand their risk.

“Things can go wrong from time to time but they are a relatively low risk, particularly relative to a bunch of other appliances and things that people have got in their homes: tins of lawnmower petrol, gas bottles, toasters.”

A spokesman for Victorian Energy Minister Lily D’Ambrosio said the industry was heavily regulated and the fire risk from solar panels was not high.

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/state-politics/years-to-unders...
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 12th, 2018 at 8:09am by juliar »  
 
IP Logged
 
DonDeeHippy
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Cool Stuff

Posts: 2782
Australia
Gender: male
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #34 - Jun 14th, 2018 at 6:45am
 
juliar wrote on Jun 11th, 2018 at 7:33pm:
Boring silly old DDH - what a waste of time. Wonder when the poor soul will get so humiliated that he/she will leave permanently ?

Now the TRUTH about lithium fire bombs in the home is starting to leak out alarming the public.

When will home insurance companies wack up the premiums to cover lithium fire bombs in the home ?




‘Years to understand’ fire risk of solar power systems
GREG BROWN Journalist Canberra The Australian12:00AM July 12, 2017

https://s33.postimg.cc/3w9omamsf/solar.png
SunSeeker Electrical owner Abdullah Sultan says he knows of hundreds of fires caused by poor installation of solar panels. Picture: James Croucher

Victoria’s Metropolitan Fire Brigade has responded to more than 40 fires caused by home solar power systems in the past five years and warned that it would take years to understand the fire risk posed by lithium ion battery storage.

The MFB said the solar installations were vulnerable to faults across their systems, including isolation switches, inverters and installed wiring, and from deteriorating components.

The alarming figures come as the solar battery storage industry pushes to kill new regulations that would force homeowners to build a separate “fire bunker” housing for battery installations.

Under draft rules released by Standards Australia, lithium ion batteries are classed as “Fire Class 1” and would not be allowed inside or within 1m of a domestic dwelling. The industry will have until August 15 to respond to the draft regulations.

old news the regulations DIDNT ban then in houses


The safety moves are designed to avoid a repeat of Labor’s insulation batts scheme in which the rapid rollout of roof insulation in 2009 led to more than 200 house fires across the nation, and ultimately four deaths.

The MFB warned last night that the risk caused by the rapidly growing uptake of solar panels on homes had not yet been properly understood.

“In the past five years, MFB has responded to more than 40 fires involving solar panels,” a spokeswoman said.

“The causes of these fires vary but are usually sparked by system faults including isolation switches, inverters, installed wiring, and deteriorating components.

“As with any new technology, it will take some time before the risks associated with lithium ion batteries in solar panels can be fully understood.”

Energy Safe Victoria director Neil Fraser said at least eight solar panel models had been taken off the market in the past five years because of fire concerns.

“We are aware of as many as eight recalls nationally over the last five years of DC isolator switches which are located next to the solar panel on the roof,” Mr Fraser said.

“It is important that those ­people who have panels maintain them. They need to be cleaned regularly and inspected, preferably by a licensed electrician.”

Sales of battery storage have risen to 6750 battery installations last year, up from 500 in 2015, ­according to a recent survey.

Solar energy equipment supplier SunWiz forecasts at least a threefold increase this year.

The owner of a Sydney-based solar panel maintenance company said he had seen “hundreds” of fires caused by solar panels in the past five years.

SunSeeker Electrical owner Abdullah Sultan said this was because of “cowboy” installers operating under little regulation.

He said cheap products from China had forced local installers to drop prices and cut corners.

“There are a lot of cowboys out there who want a quick buck and the pricing isn’t regulated so you get people charging dirt cheap and customers don’t know what they are buying.”

The Clean Energy Council’s voluntary code outlines concerns that lithium-based batteries can overheat.
But CEC chief executive Kane Thornton said yesterday the lithium ion batteries were not a fire hazard, although he acknowledged it would take time to fully understand their risk.

“Things can go wrong from time to time but they are a relatively low risk, particularly relative to a bunch of other appliances and things that people have got in their homes: tins of lawnmower petrol, gas bottles, toasters.”

A spokesman for Victorian Energy Minister Lily D’Ambrosio said the industry was heavily regulated and the fire risk from solar panels was not high.

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/state-politics/years-to-unders...

If the people buy electric mowers not even the risk of fuel cans in the garage... win win  Wink
Ok a story about fears of dodgy solar panel installations and the experts saying Battery power packs are not dangerous..   good post Jules keep up the good work  Wink Wink Wink
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 14th, 2018 at 6:50am by DonDeeHippy »  

I am me
 
IP Logged
 
juliar
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 22966
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #35 - Jun 15th, 2018 at 1:36pm
 
Dumb DDH has copied MY GOOD post and then added 1 line of indescribably dribbling nonsense. What an attention seeking troll.
Why does the drongo do this ? Must be masochistic and likes to humiliate him/herself.

Now a very welcome change from the dribbling nonsense of the DDH troll and a look at batteries including the fiery death trap Lithium ones.



How Safe Are Solar Battery Storage Systems?

The solar battery revolution will soon start really getting into gear in Australia. According to a survey carried out in 2017, safety is among the major concerns of Australians considering purchasing energy storage - and this includes environmental safety issues when a battery system reaches the end of its service life.

For those of you wishing to dive into the technical nitty-gritty of these issues, this report (PDF) by the Clean Energy Council contains everything you'd ever need to know about home battery storage system safety.

For everyone else, here's an overview:

Solar battery storage, regardless of whether it's lithium ion, lead acid, flow or aqueous hybrid ion, is perfectly safe if it is installed by an accredited electrician and properly maintained.

However, the inherent safety behind battery storage does vary between competing technologies. Even within each technology, quality in this regard will vary between manufacturers and how the system is installed.

Lead acid batteries are generally safe, and easily recyclable. By "generally safe", it needs to be kept in mind that lead acid batteries emit an explosive combination of hydrogen and oxygen gases towards the final stage of charging, so adequate ventilation is very important.

While it sounds a little offputting, it's just a case of avoiding a potentially dangerous situation by observing appropriate care and maintenance when working with lead-acid batteries. The danger level is really not much different to that associated with petrol powered cars and gas used in the home.

Lithium ion batteries pose a fire hazard if not installed properly, or if you use inferior quality batteries. This is due to the chemistry behind lithium-ion batteries making them more prone to 'thermal runaway'  if they are damaged or if they overheat.

Thermal runaway is a phenomenon whereby where an increase in temperature fuels a further boost in temperature, which can very rapidly lead to a battery venting with flame or even exploding.

Because 'lithium ion' is an umbrella term that describes a wide variety of lithium chemistries (such as lithium iron phosphate, lithium cobalt oxide, lithium manganese oxide and lithium nickel manganese cobalt oxide), it's important to note that some types of lithium ion batteries are much safer than others. Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4) is considered the safest in terms of thermal runaway risk and is the most durable lithium battery chemistry.

Aside from the type of lithium-ion chemistry, safety will also depend on the systems built into the battery. For example, Tesla's Powerwall battery also boasts a special safety feature that seals off any thermally unstable cells if they pose a thermal runaway risk, which is why they're rated for both outdoor and indoor installations.

Lithium ion batteries are very difficult to dispose of/recycle, making them hazardous from an environmental perspective.

Flow batteries are much more environmentally friendly, and have a very low fire risk due to the chemistry of the solutions they contain, such as zinc-bromide electrolyte, which is essentially a fire retardant. They're also very easy to recycle.

Salt water batteries are non-toxic, non-flammable, and non-explosive. Their chemistry is inherently safe and not capable of thermal runaway. The batteries are also entirely touch-safe, and environmentally friendly to recycle.

One other important safety issue regardless of chemistry or battery type relates to the primary purpose of the product - to store energy, and a lot of it; i.e there is a potential electrocution hazard.

In short? Don't skimp on battery system quality or installation costs. Get the job done right, and your home battery storage system will operate safely and have a long service life.

National standards are currently being developed by Standards Australia  to ensure safe home energy storage products are used in Australia and that they are installed correctly. Additionally, the Clean Energy Council has introduced installation guidelines for home battery systems. The CEC's Battery Installation Guidelines for Accredited Installers (PDF) became mandatory as of the beginning of November 2017.

https://www.solarquotes.com.au/battery-storage/safety/
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
juliar
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 22966
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #36 - Jun 15th, 2018 at 1:57pm
 
Will your lithium solar storage battery burn your house down ?  See what they do to Tesla cars!!!



Fire sparks concerns over lack of standards on battery storage
By Giles Parkinson on 18 March 2016

Images of an “exploded” lithium-ion battery storage device in a household garage in Victoria have been doing the rounds of social media, highlighting the risks and the lack of formal standards in a technology that is expected to be at the heart of a booming billion dollar industry in Australia.

...
growatt 1

It is estimated that 50,000 battery storage systems could be installed in Australia over the next 12 months, and more than a million within a decade. Some suggest more than two million homes could have battery storage in a relatively short time.

It is hailed as the continuation of an energy revolution that will shift the onus on power supply from large centralised generators to the home and business. The CSIRO and leading utilities such as Engie predict half of all generation will come from local distributed sources, and battery storage will play a key role.

Australia is seen to be at the cutting edge of this revolution. Even the Coalition government appears to be on board. But the stark fact is that there are no official standards setting the rules and guidelines for new battery storage chemistries such as lithium ion in Australia, and there may not be for another three to five years.


This is raising concerns among installers and industry leaders about the potential fall-out if real damage is done, particularly if consumers aim for the “cheap” end of the market, as many did with rooftop solar.

...
growatt 2

The images above first appeared on the social media website Whirlpool, where there are a range of theories as to what may have happened. The fire appears to have been contained and there are no reports of any injuries.

This incident occurred with a system produced by Growatt, a manufacturer considered to be at the “premium” end of the Chinese market. It has sent out a team from China to investigate the incident. RenewEconomy sought to contact the team but was not successful.

These photos were taken from an installation in Victoria. It is not known what caused the “explosion”, although it is assumed to be a case of “thermal runaway.” It is not known whether it is an installation fault or a problem with the system, or some third party factors.

The hope is that this a one-off. The fear is that the lack of standards means it may not be. The nature of battery storage systems and the energy and the chemicals that they embody potentially make them the most dangerous electronic item to be put in a home, as AGL’s head of new energy Marc England pointed out last year.

John Grimes, the CEO of the Energy Storage Council, says there are Australian standards in place for lead acid battery storage technologies (although these are 20 years old and need to be updated) but there are no standards for new chemistries such as lithium-ion.

The ESC is about to release a package of “best practice” guidelines for battery storage products, installations and maintenance that it hopes will act as an interim standard for battery storage developers and installers, and as a guide to consumers.

It is also about to produce a “white list” of  products to ensure that hybrid systems are inherently safe. This is being done with the help of international standards consultants DNV, via their energy storage testing laboratory in the US.

“The fact that there is no standard means there is the opportunity for shysters and carpet baggers to go out and put something in the market place,” Grimes said. “That is something that frightens us – we want and need good outcomes for consumers and the public right from day one.

“We don’t want to scare the public and say that there is a huge risk. Wree do want to make su that people make an informed decision. The number of systems out there is small – but it will grow exponentially.

“We need to ensure the safety of installers, customers and their families, and first responders in the event of an emergency, including fire.”

The Clean Energy Council says it, too, is working on developing battery product standards and introducing training for installers.

“We are excited by the possibilities presented by battery storage technology are exciting, but the protection of consumers needs to remain the industry’s highest priority,” a spokesman said in an emailed statement.

“We have talked to a range of policymakers about this issue to highlight the need for regulation that will keep low-quality products out of the country and make sure that those installing battery technology are highly skilled professionals.”

Mark Hickey, an installer with NSW-based Light Touch Solar & Electrical, agrees that the lack of standards and controls over the actions of a few is a major concern.

While there were approval processes for solar panels – just recently updated to make them an ongoing and “random” search rather than a once off – and for inverters, there were none for battery storage. And there were no restrictions on the people who could install battery storage devices.


This alarming report continues overleaf
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
juliar
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 22966
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #37 - Jun 15th, 2018 at 1:57pm
 
This alarming report continues...

While there were approval processes for solar panels – just recently updated to make them an ongoing and “random” search rather than a once off – and for inverters, there were none for battery storage. And there were no restrictions on the people who could install battery storage devices.

“Some people are out to make a quick buck and it’s more common than I’d like to think,” Hickey says. “Some of these smaller players will damage the industry for the rest of us who are trying to do good work.”

Hickey says this could prompt an overreaction from the government and incumbent utilities, with unjustified and costly restrictions put on the industry. “I’m very excited about battery storage, but I do have concerns about a few minority installers and the damage they can do the industry.”

Indeed, the overwhelming message from the solar and battery storage industry is that – like most industries – you get what you pay for. The fear is that Australian households – having gravitated, particularly in the early years, to the “cheap” end of the solar market – may do the same with battery storage.

Jeff Wehl, from Ecoelectric, an installer of rooftop solar and hybrid battery storage systems in Queensland, is one of those who says he fears many Australian consumers will fall into the same trap as they did with rooftop solar, buying cheaper and lower quality products in a bid to save money.

He said expectations of cheap batteries had been inflated by the promises of Tesla in delivering devices at around $A4,000 (after exchange rates). But this did not include inverters, other technology and installation. That led to expectations of low costs and a search for cheaper products.

Wehl recounts one recent product demonstration for installers by another battery storage brand that finished badly when the device “made a loud bang” as the capacitor blew.

“There were about 10 contractors in the room and we all had the same thought – we are not buying this for at least another 12 months. It seems that everyone is racing their products to the market, but some are not ready.”

Glen Morris, the chief technical expert on the ESC, is working with Standards Australia on developing a new standard – AS/NZS5139 – for new battery storage chemistries.

But he says it is a long process, particularly given that many of the people working on developing new standards work on a “voluntary capacity.”

He is in favour of a system adopted in Germany, known as KIT, which gives a weighting system on battery storage products. Any product below a given weighting cannot be installed.

“Anyone can sell a battery storage system in Australia,” Morris says. At the moment, the onus falls on the manufacturer providing safety guidance on they technology. He recommends consumers ask for a safety data sheet (SDS), but he says that few manufacturers provide them.

“I wouldn’t be putting chemistries inside a building until I knew it was inherently safe,” he says.

https://reneweconomy.com.au/fire-sparks-concerns-over-lack-of-standards-on-batte...
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
TheFunPolice
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 9009
waggawagga
Gender: male
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #38 - Jun 15th, 2018 at 3:26pm
 
juliar wrote on May 27th, 2018 at 9:49pm:
Gosh the Greeny type DDH is trying to sound intelligent. Didn't work.

Gosh, is Juliar getting all tryhard upper middle class to try and wipe away the stain of copper internet?
Back to top
 

......Australia has an illegitimate Government!
 
IP Logged
 
DonDeeHippy
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Cool Stuff

Posts: 2782
Australia
Gender: male
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #39 - Jun 16th, 2018 at 6:50am
 
juliar wrote on Jun 15th, 2018 at 1:57pm:
This alarming report continues...

While there were approval processes for solar panels – just recently updated to make them an ongoing and “random” search rather than a once off – and for inverters, there were none for battery storage. And there were no restrictions on the people who could install battery storage devices.

“Some people are out to make a quick buck and it’s more common than I’d like to think,” Hickey says. “Some of these smaller players will damage the industry for the rest of us who are trying to do good work.”

Hickey says this could prompt an overreaction from the government and incumbent utilities, with unjustified and costly restrictions put on the industry. “I’m very excited about battery storage, but I do have concerns about a few minority installers and the damage they can do the industry.”

Indeed, the overwhelming message from the solar and battery storage industry is that – like most industries – you get what you pay for. The fear is that Australian households – having gravitated, particularly in the early years, to the “cheap” end of the solar market – may do the same with battery storage.

Jeff Wehl, from Ecoelectric, an installer of rooftop solar and hybrid battery storage systems in Queensland, is one of those who says he fears many Australian consumers will fall into the same trap as they did with rooftop solar, buying cheaper and lower quality products in a bid to save money.

He said expectations of cheap batteries had been inflated by the promises of Tesla in delivering devices at around $A4,000 (after exchange rates). But this did not include inverters, other technology and installation. That led to expectations of low costs and a search for cheaper products.

Wehl recounts one recent product demonstration for installers by another battery storage brand that finished badly when the device “made a loud bang” as the capacitor blew.

“There were about 10 contractors in the room and we all had the same thought – we are not buying this for at least another 12 months. It seems that everyone is racing their products to the market, but some are not ready.”

Glen Morris, the chief technical expert on the ESC, is working with Standards Australia on developing a new standard – AS/NZS5139 – for new battery storage chemistries.

But he says it is a long process, particularly given that many of the people working on developing new standards work on a “voluntary capacity.”

He is in favour of a system adopted in Germany, known as KIT, which gives a weighting system on battery storage products. Any product below a given weighting cannot be installed.

“Anyone can sell a battery storage system in Australia,” Morris says. At the moment, the onus falls on the manufacturer providing safety guidance on they technology. He recommends consumers ask for a safety data sheet (SDS), but he says that few manufacturers provide them.

“I wouldn’t be putting chemistries inside a building until I knew it was inherently safe,” he says.

https://reneweconomy.com.au/fire-sparks-concerns-over-lack-of-standards-on-batte...

did the exploding capacitor spark a lithium thermal runaway ....... what happened as a result jules...... Wink Wink Wink
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 16th, 2018 at 6:57am by DonDeeHippy »  

I am me
 
IP Logged
 
DonDeeHippy
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Cool Stuff

Posts: 2782
Australia
Gender: male
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #40 - Jun 16th, 2018 at 6:53am
 
juliar wrote on Jun 15th, 2018 at 1:36pm:
Dumb DDH has copied MY GOOD post and then added 1 line of indescribably dribbling nonsense. What an attention seeking troll.
Why does the drongo do this ? Must be masochistic and likes to humiliate him/herself.

Now a very welcome change from the dribbling nonsense of the DDH troll and a look at batteries including the fiery death trap Lithium ones.



How Safe Are Solar Battery Storage Systems?

The solar battery revolution will soon start really getting into gear in Australia. According to a survey carried out in 2017, safety is among the major concerns of Australians considering purchasing energy storage - and this includes environmental safety issues when a battery system reaches the end of its service life.

For those of you wishing to dive into the technical nitty-gritty of these issues, this report (PDF) by the Clean Energy Council contains everything you'd ever need to know about home battery storage system safety.

For everyone else, here's an overview:

Solar battery storage, regardless of whether it's lithium ion, lead acid, flow or aqueous hybrid ion, is perfectly safe if it is installed by an accredited electrician and properly maintained.

However, the inherent safety behind battery storage does vary between competing technologies. Even within each technology, quality in this regard will vary between manufacturers and how the system is installed.

Lead acid batteries are generally safe, and easily recyclable. By "generally safe", it needs to be kept in mind that lead acid batteries emit an explosive combination of hydrogen and oxygen gases towards the final stage of charging, so adequate ventilation is very important.

While it sounds a little offputting, it's just a case of avoiding a potentially dangerous situation by observing appropriate care and maintenance when working with lead-acid batteries. The danger level is really not much different to that associated with petrol powered cars and gas used in the home.

Lithium ion batteries pose a fire hazard if not installed properly, or if you use inferior quality batteries. This is due to the chemistry behind lithium-ion batteries making them more prone to 'thermal runaway'  if they are damaged or if they overheat.

Thermal runaway is a phenomenon whereby where an increase in temperature fuels a further boost in temperature, which can very rapidly lead to a battery venting with flame or even exploding.

Because 'lithium ion' is an umbrella term that describes a wide variety of lithium chemistries (such as lithium iron phosphate, lithium cobalt oxide, lithium manganese oxide and lithium nickel manganese cobalt oxide), it's important to note that some types of lithium ion batteries are much safer than others. Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4) is considered the safest in terms of thermal runaway risk and is the most durable lithium battery chemistry.

Aside from the type of lithium-ion chemistry, safety will also depend on the systems built into the battery. For example, Tesla's Powerwall battery also boasts a special safety feature that seals off any thermally unstable cells if they pose a thermal runaway risk, which is why they're rated for both outdoor and indoor installations.

Lithium ion batteries are very difficult to dispose of/recycle, making them hazardous from an environmental perspective.

Flow batteries are much more environmentally friendly, and have a very low fire risk due to the chemistry of the solutions they contain, such as zinc-bromide electrolyte, which is essentially a fire retardant. They're also very easy to recycle.

Salt water batteries are non-toxic, non-flammable, and non-explosive. Their chemistry is inherently safe and not capable of thermal runaway. The batteries are also entirely touch-safe, and environmentally friendly to recycle.

One other important safety issue regardless of chemistry or battery type relates to the primary purpose of the product - to store energy, and a lot of it; i.e there is a potential electrocution hazard.

In short? Don't skimp on battery system quality or installation costs. Get the job done right, and your home battery storage system will operate safely and have a long service life.

National standards are currently being developed by Standards Australia  to ensure safe home energy storage products are used in Australia and that they are installed correctly. Additionally, the Clean Energy Council has introduced installation guidelines for home battery systems. The CEC's Battery Installation Guidelines for Accredited Installers (PDF) became mandatory as of the beginning of November 2017.

https://www.solarquotes.com.au/battery-storage/safety/

Back to top
 

I am me
 
IP Logged
 
DonDeeHippy
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Cool Stuff

Posts: 2782
Australia
Gender: male
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #41 - Jun 16th, 2018 at 7:00am
 
juliar wrote on Jun 15th, 2018 at 1:57pm:
Will your lithium solar storage battery burn your house down ?  See what they do to Tesla cars!!!



Fire sparks concerns over lack of standards on battery storage
By Giles Parkinson on 18 March 2016

Images of an “exploded” lithium-ion battery storage device in a household garage in Victoria have been doing the rounds of social media, highlighting the risks and the lack of formal standards in a technology that is expected to be at the heart of a booming billion dollar industry in Australia.

https://reneweconomy.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/growatt-1.jpg
growatt 1

It is estimated that 50,000 battery storage systems could be installed in Australia over the next 12 months, and more than a million within a decade. Some suggest more than two million homes could have battery storage in a relatively short time.

It is hailed as the continuation of an energy revolution that will shift the onus on power supply from large centralised generators to the home and business. The CSIRO and leading utilities such as Engie predict half of all generation will come from local distributed sources, and battery storage will play a key role.

Australia is seen to be at the cutting edge of this revolution. Even the Coalition government appears to be on board. But the stark fact is that there are no official standards setting the rules and guidelines for new battery storage chemistries such as lithium ion in Australia, and there may not be for another three to five years.


This is raising concerns among installers and industry leaders about the potential fall-out if real damage is done, particularly if consumers aim for the “cheap” end of the market, as many did with rooftop solar.

https://reneweconomy.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/growatt-2.jpg
growatt 2

The images above first appeared on the social media website Whirlpool, where there are a range of theories as to what may have happened. The fire appears to have been contained and there are no reports of any injuries.

This incident occurred with a system produced by Growatt, a manufacturer considered to be at the “premium” end of the Chinese market. It has sent out a team from China to investigate the incident. RenewEconomy sought to contact the team but was not successful.

These photos were taken from an installation in Victoria. It is not known what caused the “explosion”, although it is assumed to be a case of “thermal runaway.” It is not known whether it is an installation fault or a problem with the system, or some third party factors.

The hope is that this a one-off. The fear is that the lack of standards means it may not be. The nature of battery storage systems and the energy and the chemicals that they embody potentially make them the most dangerous electronic item to be put in a home, as AGL’s head of new energy Marc England pointed out last year.

John Grimes, the CEO of the Energy Storage Council, says there are Australian standards in place for lead acid battery storage technologies (although these are 20 years old and need to be updated) but there are no standards for new chemistries such as lithium-ion.

The ESC is about to release a package of “best practice” guidelines for battery storage products, installations and maintenance that it hopes will act as an interim standard for battery storage developers and installers, and as a guide to consumers.




This alarming report continues overleaf

so a cheepo chinese battery pack failed, that doesn't look like one of those burn everything down to molten metal sort of thermal lithium fires...
doesn't look like a bomb Wink Wink
so what did cause the fire jules its been a few years.... it could of been a capacitor, and it obviously didn't burn down the house...... Wink Wink
Back to top
 

I am me
 
IP Logged
 
juliar
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 22966
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #42 - Jun 19th, 2018 at 12:56pm
 
More meaningless attention seeking drool from the dumb boring troll.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Sir lastnail
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 29705
Gender: male
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #43 - Jun 19th, 2018 at 7:26pm
 
Hey socko. Back in the late 90's GM's EV1 powered by NiMH batteries never had trouble with fires. What happened to it ? Guess who sat on the battery patents for years and wouldn't license it to anyone ?

Back to top
 

In August 2021, Newcastle Coroner Karen Dilks recorded that Lisa Shaw had died “due to complications of an AstraZeneca COVID vaccination”.
 
IP Logged
 
juliar
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 22966
Re: Tesla lithium fire bombs to be banned in homes
Reply #44 - Jun 19th, 2018 at 9:07pm
 
Even more meaningless attention seeking drool from the other dumb boring troll.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 3 4 
Send Topic Print