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What would be enough (Read 1513 times)
Valkie
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What would be enough
Apr 11th, 2018 at 6:15pm
 
Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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freediver
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #1 - Apr 11th, 2018 at 6:40pm
 
A lot of the activists seem to want to create a racial divide with some kind of eternal rent or inalienable rights being bequeathed only to those born of the correct parents.
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Valkie
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #2 - Apr 11th, 2018 at 6:47pm
 
Ok
So the first demand
A rent on Australia by other than Aboriginals

How much?
Who gets it?
Who controls it?
How is it handed out?

What will it cost each white Australian
IE, how much extra tax a week?
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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miketrees
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #3 - Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:37pm
 

The rent thing has been paid many times over.

We need a stricter definition of who is Aboriginal for starters, done by DNA not some mumbo jumbo I think I am aboriginal therefore I am.

Or just ignore aboriginality all together and treat everyone equally.

There are large numbers of aboriginal people from WA and NT living in outcamps or country towns,,, we have to be real about this not many of them can work or want to work in the way the rest of the world expects.

They will be on welfare forever and that will pass down the generations.

Everyone should just come to terms with that and stop throwing good money after bad like we are now.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #4 - Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm
 
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.
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« Last Edit: Apr 11th, 2018 at 10:00pm by Ye Grappler »  

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Valkie
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #5 - Apr 12th, 2018 at 5:21am
 
You see
This is a perfect example of what the problem is.

All I asked for, from the horses mouth so to speak, is
What do our Aboriginals NEED
What do or Aboriginals WANT
And
What do our Aboriginals EXPECT

They have carte blanche to discuss openly these things here
I do not wish to judge them, simply gain an understanding of their needs, wants and expectations.

But once again they cannot be bothered

Like a child who wants more and more, without actually knowing what it wants, they just keep demanding.

Let me help a bit
Letas run through the demands of the past.
1) equal rights to whites.
2) their land back
3) rent for their land
4) compensation for their land
5) compensation for stolen children
6) allowed to control their own lives
7) free housing

These are things they have demanded and to some extent gained

But in the long term, WHAT;
DO THEY NEED
DO THEY WANT
DO THEY EXPECT

Continually demanding without a plan is both infantile and pointless.

Surely someone here has some idea of these things

Then we can see how or even if these things are achievable


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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Bobby
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #6 - Apr 12th, 2018 at 6:29am
 
Abos already get too much money from my taxes.
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Valkie
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #7 - Apr 12th, 2018 at 7:11pm
 
It would appear that they don't know what they want

They just want it, and they want it now.

How about I help a bit here

They want RENT for their land
Ok
How much rent?
Who gets it?
How is it to be distributed?

They want their land back
Ok
We all know that's never gonna happen
But we can give them vacant land
Now
What will they do with it
From past experience, they will sell it, fair enough
But once sold, it's sold, no more demanding the land back again and again.

They want special previlidges
Ok
What previlidges?
And who gets them?
Full blood only?
Half blood?
Anyone who calls themselves abbo?
Please clarify
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Brian Ross
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #8 - Apr 12th, 2018 at 7:28pm
 
...

Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Poor, poor, white fellas.  Not a black fella amongst 'em but they reckon they can tell black fellas how to live their lives.   Obviously they have learnt nothing from the past history of that being done.   Bugger me, looks like all the problems of dictating to people have passed 'em by.  Paternalism didn't work.  Genocide didn't work, except in Tasmania.   No full blood black fellas there now, hey?  Now they just want to make all the Black fellas act like white fellas.

You lot appear to forget, white fellas stole this land from the black fellas.  White fellas destroyed their families, stole their children, tried to turn 'em to white fellas.  Did that work?  Nope.

Perhaps instead of dictating to others, you should ask them what they want and need?   Why should they become white fellas?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #9 - Apr 12th, 2018 at 7:32pm
 
Bwyannnnnnnn
What part of this post do I state that?

I am asking what they NEED, WANT AND EXPECT.

All I get from you is a pointless racist rambling load of hogwash.

Now if you have nothing sensible to add
Take your pathetic take, take and shove it up your analkarnal.
Fool
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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miketrees
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #10 - Apr 12th, 2018 at 8:09pm
 


They need to stop being Aboriginals and start being Australians
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #11 - Apr 12th, 2018 at 8:45pm
 
miketrees wrote on Apr 12th, 2018 at 8:09pm:
They need to stop being Aboriginals and start being Australians



Purr-fect... simply purr-fect!

Now if I went around saying 'No Kaffirs Allowed!' at Gilgai, where my great-great-grandparents are buried near Inverell ... 'ow do you think THAT would go .. ey?  EY?  I ask you?  'Ow Would That Go Across With Your Niqqer 'activists'?

They'd be up in arms about 'Whitey' taking control over a spot in 'their' land....

What the Hell is wrong with governments giving in to every demand from every silly self-interested group - while actively putting the rest down as serfs who'll take what they're given and love it or be punished??

Where has my country gone?
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« Last Edit: Apr 12th, 2018 at 8:50pm by Ye Grappler »  

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #12 - Apr 12th, 2018 at 11:31pm
 
...

Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Poor, poor, Graps.  Your country hasn't gone anywhere, except forward.  Nowadays, people get listened to and if their complaints are valid, they get corrected.  The bad ol' days o' Racism are long gone.  Paternalism is dead and buried.  Stolen Generations apologised for.   Black fellas gettin' what they are due it seems.  They now got Native Title, they got right of veto over development on their lands.   Yet they still got White fellas moanin' and complainin' about paying compensation to the Black fellas.  Appears the White fellas forgotten their Constitution that applies to ALL AUSTRALIANS, Black, White, whatever colour.  Government gotta treat everybody the same - no more stealin' land, no more stealin' children.   Roll Eyes
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #13 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 3:07am
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 12th, 2018 at 5:21am:
You see
This is a perfect example of what the problem is.

All I asked for, from the horses mouth so to speak, is
What do our Aboriginals NEED
What do or Aboriginals WANT
And
What do our Aboriginals EXPECT

They have carte blanche to discuss openly these things here
I do not wish to judge them, simply gain an understanding of their needs, wants and expectations.

But once again they cannot be bothered

Like a child who wants more and more, without actually knowing what it wants, they just keep demanding.

Let me help a bit
Letas run through the demands of the past.
1) equal rights to whites.
2) their land back
3) rent for their land
4) compensation for their land
5) compensation for stolen children
6) allowed to control their own lives
7) free housing

These are things they have demanded and to some extent gained

But in the long term, WHAT;
DO THEY NEED
DO THEY WANT
DO THEY EXPECT

Continually demanding without a plan is both infantile and pointless.

Surely someone here has some idea of these things

Then we can see how or even if these things are achievable




Someone needs to hand them a dictionary to look up the word reconciliation and because it is costing us fkken billions for zero return. They should look at the accounting term and not the relationship term, because there is not end to the demands at this point so there is no reconciliation under this use of the term.


reconciliation
noun [ C or U ] UK ​  /ˌrekənˌsɪliˈeɪʃən/ US ​

ACCOUNTING the process of comparing different financial accounts, amounts, etc. in order to check that they add up to the same total or to explain any differences between them:

We haven't done a reconciliation yet.

Like you said How Much?

And if we agree it is fkken done, no more fkken handouts, apologies, nothing, you get the same sh1t as everyone else.


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Valkie
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #14 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 6:03am
 
I'm still not hearing from those who profess to be Aboriginal or who support Aboriginals.

Is it too hard a question to ask what would you NEED, WANT AND EXPECT from Australia to be satisfied?

It seems that there is always cries of
Give us our land back
Pay us rent
Give us this and that, you owe us.

But when it comes down to the nitty gritty, you all crawl away saying mumble mumble

Now
Pay the rent!
How much do you want?
Who will get it?
Who will administer it?
What criteria gives you access?

Easy enough questions you would think

It's time to put up or shut up
No more whyning about being downtrodden if you can't answer a simple question.

Come on, give us something here.
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Valkie
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #15 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 6:09am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 12th, 2018 at 11:31pm:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/128170/2467911-yawn_20smiley.jpg

Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Poor, poor, Graps.  Your country hasn't gone anywhere, except forward.  Nowadays, people get listened to and if their complaints are valid, they get corrected.  The bad ol' days o' Racism are long gone.  Paternalism is dead and buried.  Stolen Generations apologised for.   Black fellas gettin' what they are due it seems.  They now got Native Title, they got right of veto over development on their lands.   Yet they still got White fellas moanin' and complainin' about paying compensation to the Black fellas.  Appears the White fellas forgotten their Constitution that applies to ALL AUSTRALIANS, Black, White, whatever colour.  Government gotta treat everybody the same - no more stealin' land, no more stealin' children.   Roll Eyes


Ok bwyannnnnnnn
What do you see as the Aboriginals rights
What should THEY NEED, EXPECT AND WANT?
I'm trying to get some sort of handle on this.
A quantifiable understanding of what they want with regard to land rights
A quantifiable understanding of what compensation they believe is adequate for their stolen generation or percieved slights against them

Exactly what is this going to take to make them happy?

Or is this too hard and they simply WANT........EVERYTHING?
Without stating what they want?
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Bobby
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #16 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 4:06pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 12th, 2018 at 7:28pm:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/128170/2467911-yawn_20smiley.jpg

Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Poor, poor, white fellas.  Not a black fella amongst 'em but they reckon they can tell black fellas how to live their lives.   Obviously they have learnt nothing from the past history of that being done.   Bugger me, looks like all the problems of dictating to people have passed 'em by.  Paternalism didn't work.  Genocide didn't work, except in Tasmania.   No full blood black fellas there now, hey?  Now they just want to make all the Black fellas act like white fellas.

You lot appear to forget, white fellas stole this land from the black fellas.  White fellas destroyed their families, stole their children, tried to turn 'em to white fellas.  Did that work?  Nope.

Perhaps instead of dictating to others, you should ask them what they want and need?   Why should they become white fellas?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes



They only spemd our tax money on grog and cigarettes.

Abo kids have STDs. -  Abo communities are full of child molesters.

You can't help these people.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #17 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 5:03pm
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 6:15pm:
Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.

How would I know: I have no Aboriginal blood in me! I assume they want a fair go!
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #18 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 5:04pm
 
Bobby wrote on Apr 13th, 2018 at 4:06pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 12th, 2018 at 7:28pm:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/128170/2467911-yawn_20smiley.jpg

Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Poor, poor, white fellas.  Not a black fella amongst 'em but they reckon they can tell black fellas how to live their lives.   Obviously they have learnt nothing from the past history of that being done.   Bugger me, looks like all the problems of dictating to people have passed 'em by.  Paternalism didn't work.  Genocide didn't work, except in Tasmania.   No full blood black fellas there now, hey?  Now they just want to make all the Black fellas act like white fellas.

You lot appear to forget, white fellas stole this land from the black fellas.  White fellas destroyed their families, stole their children, tried to turn 'em to white fellas.  Did that work?  Nope.

Perhaps instead of dictating to others, you should ask them what they want and need?   Why should they become white fellas?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes



They only spemd our tax money on grog and cigarettes.

Abo kids have STDs. -  Abo communities are full of child molesters.

You can't help these people.

Learned helplessness!
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......Australia has an illegitimate Government!
 
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Valkie
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #19 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 5:57pm
 
A number of people on this forum have eluded to or stated outright that they are abbos.

But typical of Australian abbos, they are unable to get off their collective asses and actually come up with anything.

Or is it that by never ever actually giving anyone an idea of what they actually want, need or expect, they can just keep demanding more and more adinfinitum.

I must admit an agenda in this thread.
Having several abbo mates, I know what they say when asked
I have also discussed in depth the askings and probable resulting issues.
It's fun to watch them realize that there are repercussions to any demands.

For example
I posted this question to a collective of abbo mates, some bludgers and some actual working stiffs. Some were full blood and some of questionable decent.
It was interesting that the white abbos we're far more demanding and far less tolerant than the full bloods.

Anyhoo
I asked "What would you expect if you were given the ability to dictate some form of payment or rent for Australia?"

The answer was.
"We should be given free housing, free cars and a good income for life"

Ok I said, how much of an income?

This brought all sorts of discussion, the white abbos we're far more greedy than the full bloods, so we will go with the white abbos response
$150,000.00 a year .....each.

Ok I said
Who gets it, all abos or is it divvied out depending on percentage of aboriginality?

This almost caused a fight.
But they eventually agreed that everyone would get the same.

Fair enough
Then I put to them that I would advise my kids to marry an abbo just to ensure a never ending income.
And I would guess that many many other Australians and immigrants would do the same.
This would put a tremendous burden on the few people who were paying taxes.

They thought about this for a while and said
" Well we would stop that and only abbos could marry abbos"

I said "THATS RACIST"

This went on for a while ( I had 10 days with them and no TV you see)

In the end they all agreed to disagree and nothing was decided

PS
It was a great week and a bit
And the Barra was always fresh.
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #20 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 9:44pm
 
AnotherJourneyByTrain wrote on Apr 13th, 2018 at 5:03pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 6:15pm:
Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.

How would I know: I have no Aboriginal blood in me! I assume they want a fair go!


Do you think that Australian society gives them one?  I don't.  Particularly when you have stupid comments like Bobby's just above your's.    Roll Eyes
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #21 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 9:59pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 13th, 2018 at 9:44pm:
Do you think that Australian society gives them one?  I don't.  Particularly when you have stupid comments like Bobby's just above your's.    Roll Eyes


Depends on how they carry themselves - when I worked on rail tunnel building, one of the gangers was an Aboriginal, and he was a really nice guy and a great worker, worth every cent.

Unfortunately most live in remote towns where there is little work - look at Moree and such and that's more civilised than Boggabilla - so it's a bit hard to work out if anyone there is 'getting a fair go'.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #22 - Apr 15th, 2018 at 1:28pm
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 13th, 2018 at 9:59pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 13th, 2018 at 9:44pm:
Do you think that Australian society gives them one?  I don't.  Particularly when you have stupid comments like Bobby's just above your's.    Roll Eyes


Depends on how they carry themselves - when I worked on rail tunnel building, one of the gangers was an Aboriginal, and he was a really nice guy and a great worker, worth every cent.

Unfortunately most live in remote towns where there is little work - look at Moree and such and that's more civilised than Boggabilla - so it's a bit hard to work out if anyone there is 'getting a fair go'.



You appear to be defining a "fair go" as meaning they get a bludger's life, Graps.  No where did I say that.  "A fair go" in most people's parlance means not being judged on the colour of their skin and being given equal opportunity with other people, before being judged by their performance.   In the case of Indigenous Australians you have comments such as Bobby's and others who judge them first and foremost on the colour of their skin.  I have known a few Indigenous Australians over the years.  Some were layabouts, most were hard workers who strived to make sure they had earnt a wage to put food on the table.  Yet, according to the Racists in our society they are all layabout drunkards.  Tsk, tsk.   Until they get given the same "fair go" that other Australians are accorded as their right, they will continue to be judged on the colour of their skin.  Hardly seems fair to me.  Unfortunately it seems all too Australian though.   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #23 - Apr 15th, 2018 at 2:43pm
 
I'm glad you said 'appear' - you are often wrong because you have a terrible tendency to 'read in' to anyone else's statement and cast it in the worst possible light.

I treat Kaffirs the same way as everyone else - in an open and friendly manner without judgement - my door is always open ....

The time of 'the fair go' and the 'fair treatment' by 'the good guys' is long gone... it went out the door when this nation began to kow-tow to special interest groups and thus opened the door to inequalities everywhere, and near-anarchy, with 'merit', for example, being how much you are prepared to demand....

Started with the 'feminists' and the nation has been in the sewer ever since.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #24 - Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:37pm
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 15th, 2018 at 2:43pm:
I'm glad you said 'appear' - you are often wrong because you have a terrible tendency to 'read in' to anyone else's statement and cast it in the worst possible light.

I treat Kaffirs the same way as everyone else - in an open and friendly manner without judgement - my door is always open ....

The time of 'the fair go' and the 'fair treatment' by 'the good guys' is long gone... it went out the door when this nation began to kow-tow to special interest groups and thus opened the door to inequalities everywhere, and near-anarchy, with 'merit', for example, being how much you are prepared to demand....

Started with the 'feminists' and the nation has been in the sewer ever since.



That is your opinion, Graps.  Unfortunately it is wrong.  Appears you seem to think that giving people a "fair go" includes ignoring their plight, rather than addressing it.  Tsk, tsk.   Never took you for a whiner and a whinger.  Appears I was wrong.  The "Politics of Jealousy" appears to be what you're claiming.    Roll Eyes
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #25 - Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:50pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:37pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 15th, 2018 at 2:43pm:
I'm glad you said 'appear' - you are often wrong because you have a terrible tendency to 'read in' to anyone else's statement and cast it in the worst possible light.

I treat Kaffirs the same way as everyone else - in an open and friendly manner without judgement - my door is always open ....

The time of 'the fair go' and the 'fair treatment' by 'the good guys' is long gone... it went out the door when this nation began to kow-tow to special interest groups and thus opened the door to inequalities everywhere, and near-anarchy, with 'merit', for example, being how much you are prepared to demand....

Started with the 'feminists' and the nation has been in the sewer ever since.



That is your opinion, Graps.  Unfortunately it is wrong.  Appears you seem to think that giving people a "fair go" includes ignoring their plight, rather than addressing it.  Tsk, tsk.   Never took you for a whiner and a whinger.  Appears I was wrong.  The "Politics of Jealousy" appears to be what you're claiming.    Roll Eyes


And yet you abhor the Intervention.... was that 'ignoring their plight'?

What would you ask be done for 'their plight'?  Cut off booze supplies?  Give them more sustenance money than every other unemployed person?  Imprison any who beat up their missus or might even think of doing so?  Give them free housing or subsidised housing?

All these have been tried - all you end with up is whining about how they want 'to do things their way' (so if they want to booze their pay let them), whining about the high rate of Aboriginal incarceration, and wrecked and serial movement from one cheap place to live to another with no material improvement in their condition.

How many billions would you like to give them each year to 'help with their plight'?  Can they not do something for themselves?

As for that comment - it came to me from an old Digger mate, who ended up on TPI - you see - many such could read the straws in the wind way back in the 1990's - when this country really started to hit the skids.... funny how you can link that decline directly to social intervention, including 'industrial relations' by governments bent on control of the populace so as to enforce their place in the 'global economy'. These guys KNEW that the future lead to many of them being poor in their reclining and thus their retiring years, so they went for it then, as insurance.  One such, an old mate, said I was stupid to continue to prop up the company we both worked for when its management were running it into the ground... he was right and I took a hit.

You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time - but you can't fool all of the people all of the time.  And Diggers are a hard lot to fool.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #26 - Apr 16th, 2018 at 9:33pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:37pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 15th, 2018 at 2:43pm:
I'm glad you said 'appear' - you are often wrong because you have a terrible tendency to 'read in' to anyone else's statement and cast it in the worst possible light.

I treat Kaffirs the same way as everyone else - in an open and friendly manner without judgement - my door is always open ....

The time of 'the fair go' and the 'fair treatment' by 'the good guys' is long gone... it went out the door when this nation began to kow-tow to special interest groups and thus opened the door to inequalities everywhere, and near-anarchy, with 'merit', for example, being how much you are prepared to demand....

Started with the 'feminists' and the nation has been in the sewer ever since.



That is your opinion, Graps.  Unfortunately it is wrong.  Appears you seem to think that giving people a "fair go" includes ignoring their plight, rather than addressing it.  Tsk, tsk.   Never took you for a whiner and a whinger.  Appears I was wrong.  The "Politics of Jealousy" appears to be what you're claiming.    Roll Eyes


Brian tends to ignore whatever you say (autopilot, I think he calls it) and blend every person who has ever disagreed with him into one. Thus, he always wins his arguments and leaves everyone wondering what he is on about. He is not reading into your post, he is reading something else.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #27 - Apr 16th, 2018 at 11:05pm
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:50pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:37pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 15th, 2018 at 2:43pm:
I'm glad you said 'appear' - you are often wrong because you have a terrible tendency to 'read in' to anyone else's statement and cast it in the worst possible light.

I treat Kaffirs the same way as everyone else - in an open and friendly manner without judgement - my door is always open ....

The time of 'the fair go' and the 'fair treatment' by 'the good guys' is long gone... it went out the door when this nation began to kow-tow to special interest groups and thus opened the door to inequalities everywhere, and near-anarchy, with 'merit', for example, being how much you are prepared to demand....

Started with the 'feminists' and the nation has been in the sewer ever since.



That is your opinion, Graps.  Unfortunately it is wrong.  Appears you seem to think that giving people a "fair go" includes ignoring their plight, rather than addressing it.  Tsk, tsk.   Never took you for a whiner and a whinger.  Appears I was wrong.  The "Politics of Jealousy" appears to be what you're claiming.    Roll Eyes


And yet you abhor the Intervention.... was that 'ignoring their plight'?


It wasn't answering their needs.  Of the IIRC 66 findings from the Royal Commission that prompted the Intervention, not one, no, not one, was addressed by the Intervention.  Howard produced this wonderful Intervention and he failed dismally to address what the Royal Commission found.   Tsk, tsk.  Howards second lowest point during his Prime Ministership.   Roll Eyes

Quote:
What would you ask be done for 'their plight'?  Cut off booze supplies?  Give them more sustenance money than every other unemployed person?  Imprison any who beat up their missus or might even think of doing so?  Give them free housing or subsidised housing?


How about addressing the IIRC 66 findings of the Royal Commission, Graps rather than simply throwing the Army at the settlements to build houses?  Hey?  Too hard a concept to grasp?  Really?   Roll Eyes

Now, stop your whinging and whining old man.  Start acting your age.  Start actually addressing the issues rather than just slamming people who have been slammed all their lives by dickheads like you.  It's enough to make a person weep to read the bullshit that you and your fellow whingers and whiners have been posting.  The same tired old bullshit, the same tired old lies and the tired old crap.    Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #28 - Apr 16th, 2018 at 11:25pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 11:05pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:50pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:37pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 15th, 2018 at 2:43pm:
I'm glad you said 'appear' - you are often wrong because you have a terrible tendency to 'read in' to anyone else's statement and cast it in the worst possible light.

I treat Kaffirs the same way as everyone else - in an open and friendly manner without judgement - my door is always open ....

The time of 'the fair go' and the 'fair treatment' by 'the good guys' is long gone... it went out the door when this nation began to kow-tow to special interest groups and thus opened the door to inequalities everywhere, and near-anarchy, with 'merit', for example, being how much you are prepared to demand....

Started with the 'feminists' and the nation has been in the sewer ever since.



That is your opinion, Graps.  Unfortunately it is wrong.  Appears you seem to think that giving people a "fair go" includes ignoring their plight, rather than addressing it.  Tsk, tsk.   Never took you for a whiner and a whinger.  Appears I was wrong.  The "Politics of Jealousy" appears to be what you're claiming.    Roll Eyes


And yet you abhor the Intervention.... was that 'ignoring their plight'?


It wasn't answering their needs.  Of the IIRC 66 findings from the Royal Commission that prompted the Intervention, not one, no, not one, was addressed by the Intervention.  Howard produced this wonderful Intervention and he failed dismally to address what the Royal Commission found.   Tsk, tsk.  Howards second lowest point during his Prime Ministership.   Roll Eyes

Quote:
What would you ask be done for 'their plight'?  Cut off booze supplies?  Give them more sustenance money than every other unemployed person?  Imprison any who beat up their missus or might even think of doing so?  Give them free housing or subsidised housing?


How about addressing the IIRC 66 findings of the Royal Commission, Graps rather than simply throwing the Army at the settlements to build houses?  Hey?  Too hard a concept to grasp?  Really?   Roll Eyes

Now, stop your whinging and whining old man.  Start acting your age.  Start actually addressing the issues rather than just slamming people who have been slammed all their lives by dickheads like you.  It's enough to make a person weep to read the bullshit that you and your fellow whingers and whiners have been posting.  The same tired old bullshit, the same tired old lies and the tired old crap.    Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


When do I slam Niqqers, Whiner?  You better get off that sh1t you're on, man.

But the intervention addressed certain aspects of their plight - medical attention for obvious conditions, food supplies... a little bit of law and order - oh - sorry - that was Captain Cook and thus not acceptable, so bash the missus and kids doing it your way on the piss....

You have yet to answer the question - kid - about what would be appropriate to answer their NEEDS - as opposed to their wants.

Now settle down - there's a good kid - and do try to keep the personal vitriol to a minimum.... it doesn't help your or any Niqqer's case for anything except a handout from unemployment benefit and a boot in the arse out the door to find their own way IN their own way as they think they want and 'need' to do.

What ARE these 'needs'?  Are those 'needs' of others equally unemployed etc met other than by a simple handout of Social Security?

What exactly is it that you, and they, imagine you want or need for these whining Niqqers?

You want to move them all into towns?  Never hear the end of the whining about Stolen From their Farken Land...leave 'em to their own devices?  Never hear the end of the whining about how they've been abandoned to a life of drug and alcohol abuse, violence, hunger and neglect by Whitey.

You need to grow up a bit before you start talking to others that way, son.... let's just put all the bastards in re-education camps and let them learn and earn their way out... that'll solve it... and you can go there with them until you learn a little respect for others.... see how you go then.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #29 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 5:51pm
 
I wish I had been given the fair go my aboriginal brothers get.

Free education right through uni would have been great

Special treatment at centalink

First in line for free housing

Paid to go to school

Yep, sounds like we treat them so badly.
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I HAVE A DREAM
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A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #30 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 5:52pm
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 5:51pm:
I wish I had been given the fair go my aboriginal brothers get.

Free education right through uni would have been great

Special treatment at centalink

First in line for free housing

Paid to go to school

Yep, sounds like we treat them so badly.


Grin
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #31 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:28pm
 
What was that aboriginal program they ran on SBS which showed a totally different side to their community that was filled with successful people in all walks of life? It was a weekly window on a part of urban aboriginal society which otherwise never gets exposure in the mainstream media. These were interesting and sophisticated indigenous Australians with lots to say and not a hint of whinge or Aboriginal Nationalism.

Aboriginal Australia is a broad parish that includes the whingers, the bludgers, and the criminals ~ right through to those who quietly beaver away alongside the rest of us in mainstream society.

caricaturing them all with the same brush as losers and feckless parasites upon the taxpayer does many of them a grievous injustice.

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Re: What would be enough
Reply #32 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #33 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:35pm
 
You didn't light that fire, did you Unforgiven?? Huh
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #34 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:37pm
 
Mr Hammer wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:35pm:
You didn't light that fire, did you Unforgiven?? Huh


I lit a fire under some conservatives who went incendiary.

It could have been Grappler falling out of his tree hitting a rock with his head causing sparks.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #35 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:48pm
 
All those idiots who claim that we have done enough (i.e. Valkie). You need to remember one key thing: when racism is institutional, as it was in Australia for a long time, it's very hard to change those institutions for the future. Throwing money doesn't fix an institution if the institution is already rotten.

Those who claim that they've been raised in a tough environment, blah blah blah, there were no institutional disadvantages against you. Because of the status of non-indigenous, you were socialised much more easily into existing institutions, which is already an advantage over indigenous people.

When you learn to consider structures and institutions, you then learn that institutions govern behaviour very effectively. It's very difficult to succeed when the institution is against you.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #36 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:52pm
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 5:51pm:
I wish I had been given the fair go my aboriginal brothers get.

Free education right through uni would have been great

Special treatment at centalink

First in line for free housing

Paid to go to school

Yep, sounds like we treat them so badly.


That you say this indicates your naivity. It's always more complicated that just 'throwing money at the problem'.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #37 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:54pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:52pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 5:51pm:
I wish I had been given the fair go my aboriginal brothers get.

Free education right through uni would have been great

Special treatment at centalink

First in line for free housing

Paid to go to school

Yep, sounds like we treat them so badly.


That you say this indicates your naivity. It's always more complicated that just 'throwing money at the problem'.


Yeah , year,

Whatever..............
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #38 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:54pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:52pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 5:51pm:
I wish I had been given the fair go my aboriginal brothers get.

Free education right through uni would have been great

Special treatment at centalink

First in line for free housing

Paid to go to school

Yep, sounds like we treat them so badly.


That you say this indicates your naivity. It's always more complicated that just 'throwing money at the problem'.


Yeah , year,

Whatever..............
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #39 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:57pm
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:54pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:52pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 5:51pm:
I wish I had been given the fair go my aboriginal brothers get.

Free education right through uni would have been great

Special treatment at centalink

First in line for free housing

Paid to go to school

Yep, sounds like we treat them so badly.


That you say this indicates your naivity. It's always more complicated that just 'throwing money at the problem'.


Yeah , year,

Whatever..............


Ok, here are three questions for you, which I hope you can answer.

1) why do many aboriginals who live in the city not speak English properly?

2) why are many Aboriginal women fat?

3) why do they often carry on on the bus or on the street, shouting to each other?
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #40 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:13pm
 
Ok, here are three questions for you, which I hope you can answer.

1) why do many aboriginals who live in the city not speak English properly?

Probably because they don't go to school and know they will get a free ride.
In a suburb near me, aboriginals live in hovels, broken doors, smashed windows, scrub that was once grass.
Once they have destroyed the place sufficiently, they get another house to destroy.
WHY? Because it all comes so easy that they have no ownership or respect for other people's property or themselves

2) why are many Aboriginal women fat?
Only as they get older, the young ones platy and run with all the other children.
As they get older they lose respect for themselves and just eat crap, because they are too lazy to buy food and cook it themselves

3) why do they often carry on on the bus or on the street, shouting to each other? [/quote]
Not sure about that one
I avoid busses and trains like the plague, mainly because they are full of people carrying communicable desease.
On the street however, they shout, yell fight, insult people so they will be noticed
And why do they want to be noticed?
So they can scream racism and claim they are abused because they are abbos
Not because they are crude,  loudmouthed louts

Answer your questions?
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #41 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:15pm
 
Now, how about you answer my questions

Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #42 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:20pm
 
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.


Go eat your arse.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #43 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:21pm
 
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:37pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:35pm:
You didn't light that fire, did you Unforgiven?? Huh


I lit a fire under some conservatives who went incendiary.

It could have been Grappler falling out of his tree hitting a rock with his head causing sparks.


Bite your arse.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams
 
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greggerypeccary
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #44 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:23pm
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:15pm:
Now, how about you answer my questions

Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.


They probably need, want, and expect, people like you to leave this country.

One can hardly blame them.

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Valkie
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #45 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:24pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:15pm:
Now, how about you answer my questions

Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.


They probably need, want, and expect, people like you to leave this country.

One can hardly blame them.




OFF TOPIC

ABUSIVE COWARDLY TROLL
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Ye Grappler
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #46 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:25pm
 
Lord Herbert wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:28pm:
What was that aboriginal program they ran on SBS which showed a totally different side to their community that was filled with successful people in all walks of life? It was a weekly window on a part of urban aboriginal society which otherwise never gets exposure in the mainstream media. These were interesting and sophisticated indigenous Australians with lots to say and not a hint of whinge or Aboriginal Nationalism.

Aboriginal Australia is a broad parish that includes the whingers, the bludgers, and the criminals ~ right through to those who quietly beaver away alongside the rest of us in mainstream society.

caricaturing them all with the same brush as losers and feckless parasites upon the taxpayer does many of them a grievous injustice.




Yes - leave that feckless loser parasite label for the likes of Unforgiven... fits like a glove... and they put gloves on him when he fits so he won't scrabble in the dirt and harm his hands.  Sort of a Sergeant Garp thing to stop him masturbating.  Be better if they bandaged his hands so he can't reach a keyboard and waste electrons.

Some coons are good people.... (not him of course- he's a waste of goanna lard) ... and only a true bigot would deny his imbecility by suggesting that only Whites can be bigoted.
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« Last Edit: Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:41pm by Ye Grappler »  

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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greggerypeccary
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #47 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:31pm
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:24pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:15pm:
Now, how about you answer my questions

Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.


They probably need, want, and expect, people like you to leave this country.

One can hardly blame them.




OFF TOPIC

ABUSIVE COWARDLY TROLL



Drunken rant.

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Valkie
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #48 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:33pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:31pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:24pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:15pm:
Now, how about you answer my questions

Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.


They probably need, want, and expect, people like you to leave this country.

One can hardly blame them.




OFF TOPIC

ABUSIVE COWARDLY TROLL



Drunken rant.



OFF TOPIC

ABUSE

TROLL

PS....I don't drink fool
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #49 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:34pm
 
Time to go

The troll fool is becoming boring
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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greggerypeccary
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #50 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:35pm
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:33pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:31pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:24pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:15pm:
Now, how about you answer my questions

Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.


They probably need, want, and expect, people like you to leave this country.

One can hardly blame them.




OFF TOPIC

ABUSIVE COWARDLY TROLL



Drunken rant.



OFF TOPIC

ABUSE

TROLL

PS....I don't drink fool


You should.

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Re: What would be enough
Reply #51 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:42pm
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:20pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.


Go eat your arse.


Oh, Grap triggered.

Rule Number 1: NO PERSON IN AUSTRALIA HAS HAD IT WORSE THAN THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE. FULL STOP.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #52 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 9:42pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:15pm:
Now, how about you answer my questions

Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.


They probably need, want, and expect, people like you to leave this country.

One can hardly blame them.



They might have to go to WAR to get those things.... now what do they really need,want and expect?  Other than the right to abuse Whitey for feeding them..... (sighs) cut off all aid and let them work it out for themselves... they'll soon trim down their population one way or another without White Man's Interventionism/Oppression... such as hospitals, medicine, balanced diet, healthy food (not mostly meat) ... and law and order.. don't forget law and order....

Watched a thing today that took place during the StolenWealth Games - bunch of Aboriginals set up camp, the cops came to check them out - the Aboriginals shook fingers in their faces, demanded that they leave, some sheila screeched at them like a cockatoo (one of them Coon voices that grate so much - too much smoksan'beer, Bro), said they were not subject to 'their' laws, and they owned the joint and the cops should get out.



Reckon I'll give that a go if I ever get pulled over for a traffic fine....... seems to work wonders....
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Ye Grappler
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #53 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 9:43pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:42pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:20pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.


Go eat your arse.


Oh, Grap triggered.

Rule Number 1: NO PERSON IN AUSTRALIA HAS HAD IT WORSE THAN THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE. FULL STOP.


Wrong.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams
 
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Lord Herbert
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #54 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 10:19pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:42pm:
Rule Number 1: NO PERSON IN AUSTRALIA HAS HAD IT WORSE THAN THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE. FULL STOP.


Their worst years lasted for 45,000 years before today's First World society arrived to bring them every advantage that millions of migrants have been seeking here from all over the world.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #55 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 11:18pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:15pm:
Now, how about you answer my questions

Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.


They probably need, want, and expect, people like you to leave this country.

One can hardly blame them.



Valkie hasn't yet finished eating their lunch.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #56 - Apr 17th, 2018 at 11:25pm
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:25pm:
Lord Herbert wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:28pm:
What was that aboriginal program they ran on SBS which showed a totally different side to their community that was filled with successful people in all walks of life? It was a weekly window on a part of urban aboriginal society which otherwise never gets exposure in the mainstream media. These were interesting and sophisticated indigenous Australians with lots to say and not a hint of whinge or Aboriginal Nationalism.

Aboriginal Australia is a broad parish that includes the whingers, the bludgers, and the criminals ~ right through to those who quietly beaver away alongside the rest of us in mainstream society.

caricaturing them all with the same brush as losers and feckless parasites upon the taxpayer does many of them a grievous injustice.




Yes - leave that feckless loser parasite label for the likes of Unforgiven... fits like a glove... and they put gloves on him when he fits so he won't scrabble in the dirt and harm his hands.  Sort of a Sergeant Garp thing to stop him masturbating.  Be better if they bandaged his hands so he can't reach a keyboard and waste electrons.

Some coons are good people.... (not him of course- he's a waste of goanna lard) ... and only a true bigot would deny his imbecility by suggesting that only Whites can be bigoted.


Oh dear! I have punctured Grappler's ego and hurt it's feelings. Now Grappler's insidious bigotry publishing might suffer lower productivity and his boss Yadda might have to let Grappler go.
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Gnads
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #57 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:06am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 12th, 2018 at 7:28pm:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/128170/2467911-yawn_20smiley.jpg

Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Poor, poor, white fellas.  Not a black fella amongst 'em but they reckon they can tell black fellas how to live their lives.   Obviously they have learnt nothing from the past history of that being done.   Bugger me, looks like all the problems of dictating to people have passed 'em by.  Paternalism didn't work.  Genocide didn't work, except in Tasmania.   No full blood black fellas there now, hey?  Now they just want to make all the Black fellas act like white fellas.

You lot appear to forget, white fellas stole this land from the black fellas.  White fellas destroyed their families, stole their children, tried to turn 'em to white fellas.  Did that work?  Nope.

Perhaps instead of dictating to others, you should ask them what they want and need?   Why should they become white fellas?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


You're a fool.

Who's dictating? Ask them what they want & need?

Nothing is ever enough.

Nothing was stolen, nor families destroyed.

As for turning them into white fellas ..... for some that's exactly what they are for all intents & purposes

because people like you believe that being Aboriginal is just a state of mind.  Roll Eyes

Dearie Dearie me tsk tsk tsk.
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Politicians are like nappies; they need to be changed often and for the same reason.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #58 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:13am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:37pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 15th, 2018 at 2:43pm:
I'm glad you said 'appear' - you are often wrong because you have a terrible tendency to 'read in' to anyone else's statement and cast it in the worst possible light.

I treat Kaffirs the same way as everyone else - in an open and friendly manner without judgement - my door is always open ....

The time of 'the fair go' and the 'fair treatment' by 'the good guys' is long gone... it went out the door when this nation began to kow-tow to special interest groups and thus opened the door to inequalities everywhere, and near-anarchy, with 'merit', for example, being how much you are prepared to demand....

Started with the 'feminists' and the nation has been in the sewer ever since.



That is your opinion, Graps.  Unfortunately it is wrong.  Appears you seem to think that giving people a "fair go" includes ignoring their plight, rather than addressing it.  Tsk, tsk.   Never took you for a whiner and a whinger.  Appears I was wrong.  The "Politics of Jealousy" appears to be what you're claiming.    Roll Eyes


Grin That's you're opinion & you're often wrong

IMHO Grappler is right .. you're merely a guilt ridden apologist with an over inflated opinion ...... & ego.
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Politicians are like nappies; they need to be changed often and for the same reason.
The most difficult choice a politician must ever make is whether to be a hypocrite or a liar.
 
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #59 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:18am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 11:05pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:50pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 16th, 2018 at 6:37pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 15th, 2018 at 2:43pm:
I'm glad you said 'appear' - you are often wrong because you have a terrible tendency to 'read in' to anyone else's statement and cast it in the worst possible light.

I treat Kaffirs the same way as everyone else - in an open and friendly manner without judgement - my door is always open ....

The time of 'the fair go' and the 'fair treatment' by 'the good guys' is long gone... it went out the door when this nation began to kow-tow to special interest groups and thus opened the door to inequalities everywhere, and near-anarchy, with 'merit', for example, being how much you are prepared to demand....

Started with the 'feminists' and the nation has been in the sewer ever since.



That is your opinion, Graps.  Unfortunately it is wrong.  Appears you seem to think that giving people a "fair go" includes ignoring their plight, rather than addressing it.  Tsk, tsk.   Never took you for a whiner and a whinger.  Appears I was wrong.  The "Politics of Jealousy" appears to be what you're claiming.    Roll Eyes


And yet you abhor the Intervention.... was that 'ignoring their plight'?


It wasn't answering their needs.  Of the IIRC 66 findings from the Royal Commission that prompted the Intervention, not one, no, not one, was addressed by the Intervention.  Howard produced this wonderful Intervention and he failed dismally to address what the Royal Commission found.   Tsk, tsk.  Howards second lowest point during his Prime Ministership.   Roll Eyes

Quote:
What would you ask be done for 'their plight'?  Cut off booze supplies?  Give them more sustenance money than every other unemployed person?  Imprison any who beat up their missus or might even think of doing so?  Give them free housing or subsidised housing?


How about addressing the IIRC 66 findings of the Royal Commission, Graps rather than simply throwing the Army at the settlements to build houses?  Hey?  Too hard a concept to grasp?  Really?   Roll Eyes

Now, stop your whinging and whining old man.  Start acting your age.  Start actually addressing the issues rather than just slamming people who have been slammed all their lives by dickheads like you.  It's enough to make a person weep to read the bullshit that you and your fellow whingers and whiners have been posting.  The same tired old bullshit, the same tired old lies and the tired old crap.    Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


That's you to a tee ..... you're the dickhead with the same ol same ol guilt ridden crap.
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Politicians are like nappies; they need to be changed often and for the same reason.
The most difficult choice a politician must ever make is whether to be a hypocrite or a liar.
 
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Captain Caveman
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #60 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:23am
 
So if we have to give everything to the abos..what does the white Australian get?

Those who think the land was STOLEN are a bloody disgrace......NO ONE OWNS THE LAND! PERIOD!!
Gov have fooled you lot i to believing you do. You own nothing. You spend your life paying a bank for something you never own.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #61 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:25am
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Valkie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:15pm:
Now, how about you answer my questions

Ok
Let's have a sensible discussion about exactly what the Aboriginals Need, Want and Expect.

Let's assume theoretically, that the Australian government have decided to agree to any and all demands of the Aboriginals in an attempt to satisfy their demands.

What do the Aboriginals NEED

What do the Aboriginals WANT

What do the Aboriginals EXPECT.

This is a brainstorming session, so it's no holds barred

Just state what as clearly as possible.


They probably need, want, and expect, people like you to leave this country.

One can hardly blame them.



You should head up the first boat load out Capn Peccarhead.  Roll Eyes
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Politicians are like nappies; they need to be changed often and for the same reason.
The most difficult choice a politician must ever make is whether to be a hypocrite or a liar.
 
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #62 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:28am
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:42pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:20pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.


Go eat your arse.


Oh, Grap triggered.

Rule Number 1: NO PERSON IN AUSTRALIA HAS HAD IT WORSE THAN THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE. FULL STOP.


The perpetual victim & guilt industry enabler.  Roll Eyes

They really didn't have an idyllic life pre-colonisation either.
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The most difficult choice a politician must ever make is whether to be a hypocrite or a liar.
 
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #63 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:43am
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 9:43pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:42pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:20pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.


Go eat your arse.


Oh, Grap triggered.

Rule Number 1: NO PERSON IN AUSTRALIA HAS HAD IT WORSE THAN THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE. FULL STOP.


Wrong.


We all like to think that ‘we’ve had it the toughest’ it makes us feel better about ourselves. I can tell you with absolute certainty Grap that the indigenous peoples experiences institutional racism and oppression. When it becomes institutionalised, it’s hard to undo.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #64 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:45am
 
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:28am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:42pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:20pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.


Go eat your arse.


Oh, Grap triggered.

Rule Number 1: NO PERSON IN AUSTRALIA HAS HAD IT WORSE THAN THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE. FULL STOP.


The perpetual victim & guilt industry enabler.  Roll Eyes

They really didn't have an idyllic life pre-colonisation either.


How naive you are to believe that they are better off now than before. Before, there was no institutional oppression against them or their way of life. They lived their lives with completely autonomy and independence.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #65 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:45am:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:28am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:42pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:20pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.


Go eat your arse.


Oh, Grap triggered.

Rule Number 1: NO PERSON IN AUSTRALIA HAS HAD IT WORSE THAN THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE. FULL STOP.


The perpetual victim & guilt industry enabler.  Roll Eyes

They really didn't have an idyllic life pre-colonisation either.


How naive you are to believe that they are better off now than before. Before, there was no institutional oppression against them or their way of life. They lived their lives with completely autonomy and independence.


With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #66 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:27am
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:45am:


How naive you are to believe that they are better off now than before. Before, there was no institutional oppression against them or their way of life. They lived their lives with completely autonomy and independence.
Their method of population control was to kill new born babies. 8 year old girls married to 60 year old men. Life was so much better for them. What did the Romans ever do for us?
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #67 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #68 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:34am
 
Rhino wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:27am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:45am:


How naive you are to believe that they are better off now than before. Before, there was no institutional oppression against them or their way of life. They lived their lives with completely autonomy and independence.
Their method of population control was to kill new born babies. 8 year old girls married to 60 year old men. Life was so much better for them. What did the Romans ever do for us?


Do you have evidence to support your claims that 8 year girls married 60 year old men? Or are you viewing the lifestyle of the Indigenous peoples through your prejudiced lens of Islam?
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #69 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:50am
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:45am:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:28am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:42pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:20pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.


Go eat your arse.


Oh, Grap triggered.

Rule Number 1: NO PERSON IN AUSTRALIA HAS HAD IT WORSE THAN THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE. FULL STOP.


The perpetual victim & guilt industry enabler.  Roll Eyes

They really didn't have an idyllic life pre-colonisation either.


How naive you are to believe that they are better off now than before. Before, there was no institutional oppression against them or their way of life. They lived their lives with completely autonomy and independence.


Well a good many would be leading much much better lives than their pre-colonisation ancestors and the ratio will only improve with time.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #70 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:51am
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:34am:
Rhino wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:27am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:45am:


How naive you are to believe that they are better off now than before. Before, there was no institutional oppression against them or their way of life. They lived their lives with completely autonomy and independence.
Their method of population control was to kill new born babies. 8 year old girls married to 60 year old men. Life was so much better for them. What did the Romans ever do for us?


Do you have evidence to support your claims that 8 year girls married 60 year old men? Or are you viewing the lifestyle of the Indigenous peoples through your prejudiced lens of Islam?

Unlike most here I have lived amongst Islamic cultures, Im also on record as stating that i dont see the Islam religion as the main issue but the culture which uses it as a justification for their abhorrent cultural practises. If you did at least a little basic research about Aboriginal culture you will find I am exactly right. Anything else you want to be wrong about today? I really do not understand why some of you people make statements without obtaining at least a little knowledge on the subjects at hand first.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #71 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:52am
 
The noble savage
Quote:
A NEW report has called for the outlawing of traditional Aboriginal customs in remote communities that sanction violence against women and children and the promised marriage of girls as young as four.

The report, by Sydney academic Helen Hughes, calls for the age that girls can marry in remote communities to be raised to 18, the age that both the bride and groom must be to marry in the rest of Australia.

Professor Hughes' call follows a controversial decision by the Northern Territory's Chief Justice, Brian Martin, last month to sentence a 55-year-old Aboriginal elder to only four weeks' jail for hitting his 14-year-old "promised wife" with a boomerang and having forced anal sex with her.

The girl's family had promised her to the man under traditional law when she was only four.

https://www.theage.com.au/news/national/aboriginal-child-bride-laws-attacked/2005/09/21/1126982123475.html
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #72 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:54am
 
Rhino wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:51am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:34am:
Rhino wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:27am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:45am:


How naive you are to believe that they are better off now than before. Before, there was no institutional oppression against them or their way of life. They lived their lives with completely autonomy and independence.
Their method of population control was to kill new born babies. 8 year old girls married to 60 year old men. Life was so much better for them. What did the Romans ever do for us?


Do you have evidence to support your claims that 8 year girls married 60 year old men? Or are you viewing the lifestyle of the Indigenous peoples through your prejudiced lens of Islam?

Unlike most here I have lived amongst Islamic cultures, Im also on record as stating that i dont see the Islam religion as the main issue but the culture which uses it as a justification for their abhorrent cultural practises. If you did at least a little basic research about Aboriginal culture you will find I am exactly right. Anything else you want to be wrong about today? I really do not understand why some of you people make statements without obtaining at least a little knowledge on the subjects at hand first.


The religion is a reflection of the underlying culture, and now they prop each other up.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #73 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #74 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:17pm
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


I'd also like to ask people what would they see as an alternative?

The natural progression for something like this is for initially things to go bad for one culture then steadily improve throughout their transition period.

Eventually in time, the two cultures will be indistinguishable.




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Re: What would be enough
Reply #75 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:06pm
 
Rhino wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:51am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:34am:
Rhino wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:27am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:45am:


How naive you are to believe that they are better off now than before. Before, there was no institutional oppression against them or their way of life. They lived their lives with completely autonomy and independence.
Their method of population control was to kill new born babies. 8 year old girls married to 60 year old men. Life was so much better for them. What did the Romans ever do for us?


Do you have evidence to support your claims that 8 year girls married 60 year old men? Or are you viewing the lifestyle of the Indigenous peoples through your prejudiced lens of Islam?

Unlike most here I have lived amongst Islamic cultures, Im also on record as stating that i dont see the Islam religion as the main issue but the culture which uses it as a justification for their abhorrent cultural practises. If you did at least a little basic research about Aboriginal culture you will find I am exactly right. Anything else you want to be wrong about today? I really do not understand why some of you people make statements without obtaining at least a little knowledge on the subjects at hand first.


Allow to apologise for any negative assumptions made about you.

Even if that were the case, that doesn’t mean that we should expect indigenous peoples to adapt to our culture and way of life. It doesn’t mean that we should attribute  their failures to laziness or racial inferiority. It’s a hell of a lot more complex that than.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #76 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:13pm
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


The fact that they are from a pre-industrial culture makes even harder to adapt. You’re coming from a culture of no written language to a written one. Brains are wired differently. That’s one example. Not to mention an different social structure and organisation. Transformation of a society to a modern one requires certain conditions. The indigenous peoples didn’t meet those conditions.

Regarding the improvement of indigenous peoples, sure some have benefitted but overall I’d say that there are still challenges.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #77 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:15pm
 
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:17pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


I'd also like to ask people what would they see as an alternative?

The natural progression for something like this is for initially things to go bad for one culture then steadily improve throughout their transition period.

Eventually in time, the two cultures will be indistinguishable.






The first thing to do is to recognise that they’ve had it tough by our hand and we owe them our resources and effort to ameliorate their condition to the best of our ability.

As to how long it will take? Who knows? It could take 10 years or 10,000 years.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #78 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:17pm
 
It's easy. Take the resources that have been stolen by British Aboriginals in Australia and give it to Australian Aboriginals.

Throw in Freediver as a sweetener.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #79 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:19pm
 
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:17pm:
It's easy. Take the resources that have been stolen by British Aboriginals in Australia and give it to Australian Aboriginals.

Throw in Freediver as a sweetener.


So we have to give them some sticks?
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #80 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:21pm
 
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:19pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:17pm:
It's easy. Take the resources that have been stolen by British Aboriginals in Australia and give it to Australian Aboriginals.

Throw in Freediver as a sweetener.


So we have to give them some sticks?


Give till it hurts.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #81 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 10:45am:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:28am:
Auggie wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:42pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 7:20pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 17th, 2018 at 6:33pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 11th, 2018 at 9:54pm:
The sad thing is that no matter what you give the silly bastards - they will still be no better off.

Giving them the keys to Ayers Rock and Mt Warning will do not one thing to change their real situation, and will only make them less acceptable to others in the nation.  I'd go so far as to say it will undo the rather haphazard upward movement in their acceptability to the majority created with 'the apology'.. Instead of accepting that and moving on - they - like every other small and selfish group - used it as a platform from which to launch more and more insanity upon the majority.

When 3% of the population can wag to dog of the rest - there is something wrong.

What they want is anything they can get for nothing.

What they need is to get into the 21st Century and realise they are now a small proportion of the Australian population and they need to get in line with the rest and earn their way.

What politicians and governments need to do is start saying NO, and forget about the screeching press and the ranting 'racist' nonsense.  It's Racist to isolate Ayers Rock and Mt Warning for the exclusive use of a few of a certain kind - it is not racist to want to enjoy those things like everyone else.  I doubt that any single one of us here ever abused a Black or deprived or robbed a Black of anything*... yet they expect us all to take responsibility for the actions of others and of governments and agencies past which we had nothing to do with, and they expect us to accept exclusion from interesting areas just to suit them.

Falc em!

* unlike the bullshit photos master light tried to push on me last night as if I had anything to do with Kaffirs in chains.... I never laid a hand on them Niqqers... and I'm not responsible for it happening.  Adios, light - you've lost me as well, along with your Niqqer mates and pals.


Spoken like a surreptitious, insidious bigot.

How would British Aboriginal Grappler born with a foot in his mouth know?

Stick to publishing your fantasies about being a war hero.


Go eat your arse.


Oh, Grap triggered.

Rule Number 1: NO PERSON IN AUSTRALIA HAS HAD IT WORSE THAN THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE. FULL STOP.


The perpetual victim & guilt industry enabler.  Roll Eyes

They really didn't have an idyllic life pre-colonisation either.


How naive you are to believe that they are better off now than before. Before, there was no institutional oppression against them or their way of life. They lived their lives with completely autonomy and independence.


They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #82 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:26pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:15pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:17pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


I'd also like to ask people what would they see as an alternative?

The natural progression for something like this is for initially things to go bad for one culture then steadily improve throughout their transition period.

Eventually in time, the two cultures will be indistinguishable.






The first thing to do is to recognise that they’ve had it tough by our hand and we owe them our resources and effort to ameliorate their condition to the best of our ability.

As to how long it will take? Who knows? It could take 10 years or 10,000 years.


I'd prefer to take the majority off drip feed and give the best and brightest a rolled gold first class education. I hate throwing good money after bad.

Govt funding for the top 100 private schools would be conditional on giving bright Aboriginal kids scholarships. Getting some more Aboriginal doctors, lawyers and business people out there would help bring them out of the funk they're in.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #83 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:31pm
 
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.


Wowee! That's the same behavior as British Aboriginals on Saturdays at trains stations and stadiums.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #84 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm
 
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #85 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:34pm
 
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:26pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:15pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:17pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


I'd also like to ask people what would they see as an alternative?

The natural progression for something like this is for initially things to go bad for one culture then steadily improve throughout their transition period.

Eventually in time, the two cultures will be indistinguishable.






The first thing to do is to recognise that they’ve had it tough by our hand and we owe them our resources and effort to ameliorate their condition to the best of our ability.

As to how long it will take? Who knows? It could take 10 years or 10,000 years.


I'd prefer to take the majority off drip feed and give the best and brightest a rolled gold first class education. I hate throwing good money after bad.

Govt funding for the top 100 private schools would be conditional on giving bright Aboriginal kids scholarships. Getting some more Aboriginal doctors, lawyers and business people out there would help bring them out of the funk they're in.


I don't disagree with these measures.

But, do you feel guilt for the actions of our predecessors? Because I do.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #86 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:38pm
 
Grin Grin Grin

Black Australians get 'free money'
like
Black Americans get 'free sex'.


...and they do so, entirely thanks to the 'Media'.


It's Politically Correct for USA 'White' women to have sex with a Black male before they 'earn' the right to have children, let alone 'white' ones.




Ohh the things you all do to pay/provide for stealing an entire 'continent' from Black people. Grin
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #87 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:44pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:34pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:26pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:15pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:17pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


I'd also like to ask people what would they see as an alternative?

The natural progression for something like this is for initially things to go bad for one culture then steadily improve throughout their transition period.

Eventually in time, the two cultures will be indistinguishable.






The first thing to do is to recognise that they’ve had it tough by our hand and we owe them our resources and effort to ameliorate their condition to the best of our ability.

As to how long it will take? Who knows? It could take 10 years or 10,000 years.


I'd prefer to take the majority off drip feed and give the best and brightest a rolled gold first class education. I hate throwing good money after bad.

Govt funding for the top 100 private schools would be conditional on giving bright Aboriginal kids scholarships. Getting some more Aboriginal doctors, lawyers and business people out there would help bring them out of the funk they're in.


I don't disagree with these measures.

But, do you feel guilt for the actions of our predecessors? Because I do.


No. Tribes of apes have been marauding across the planet for a million years. Aboriginals managed to stay tucked away in a quiet corner of the world for a very long time and it was going to end eventually.

Australia was discovered by the best civilisation of the day and the one that evolved into the freest and best democracy.

They should be thankful they weren't discovered by Arab slavers or any number of civilizations who may have perpetrated a true genocide and wiped them out to the last person.

I acknowledge their hardships past and present, but guilt should only be felt by people who have done something wrong.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #88 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:45pm
 
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:17pm:
It's easy. Take the resources that have been stolen by British Aboriginals in Australia and give it to Australian Aboriginals.

Throw in Freediver as a sweetener.


They didn't mine resources.

They dug a bit of ochre.

Any mining on Aboriginal land pays royalties.

How else would Galarrwuy Yunupingu have been driving around in a 40ft flybridge cruiser(which he sank)?


Quote:
Mr Yunupingu and other clan leaders spent three years negotiating the $700 million, 42-year deal with the mining giant, which operates a bauxite mine and alumina refinery on Yolngu land, 650km east of Darwin.


https://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/now-dreams-realised-healing-ca...

And that's only one group.

Who else gets paid those sorts of royalties? Roll Eyes
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #89 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #90 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm
 
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #91 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:51pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:34pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:26pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:15pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:17pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


I'd also like to ask people what would they see as an alternative?

The natural progression for something like this is for initially things to go bad for one culture then steadily improve throughout their transition period.

Eventually in time, the two cultures will be indistinguishable.






The first thing to do is to recognise that they’ve had it tough by our hand and we owe them our resources and effort to ameliorate their condition to the best of our ability.

As to how long it will take? Who knows? It could take 10 years or 10,000 years.


I'd prefer to take the majority off drip feed and give the best and brightest a rolled gold first class education. I hate throwing good money after bad.

Govt funding for the top 100 private schools would be conditional on giving bright Aboriginal kids scholarships. Getting some more Aboriginal doctors, lawyers and business people out there would help bring them out of the funk they're in.


I don't disagree with these measures.

But, do you feel guilt for the actions of our predecessors? Because I do.


Why? & what good does that do?

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Re: What would be enough
Reply #92 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:54pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.


What a load of clap trap.

As I said you're just an enabler of the guilt & victim industry.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #93 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:54pm
 
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:51pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:34pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:26pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:15pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:17pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


I'd also like to ask people what would they see as an alternative?

The natural progression for something like this is for initially things to go bad for one culture then steadily improve throughout their transition period.

Eventually in time, the two cultures will be indistinguishable.






The first thing to do is to recognise that they’ve had it tough by our hand and we owe them our resources and effort to ameliorate their condition to the best of our ability.

As to how long it will take? Who knows? It could take 10 years or 10,000 years.


I'd prefer to take the majority off drip feed and give the best and brightest a rolled gold first class education. I hate throwing good money after bad.

Govt funding for the top 100 private schools would be conditional on giving bright Aboriginal kids scholarships. Getting some more Aboriginal doctors, lawyers and business people out there would help bring them out of the funk they're in.


I don't disagree with these measures.

But, do you feel guilt for the actions of our predecessors? Because I do.


Why? & what good does that do?



Because it shows that we as a society must have compassion and continue to further the amelioration of the plight of the indigenous peoples.

What we did to the indigenous peoples was shameful, both British and Australians. You can try to dress it up as a civilising mission, but the institutionalisation of racism and oppression was unacceptable.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #94 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:01pm
 
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:54pm:
What a load of clap trap.


Really? So did we just 'grew' here, did we? Everything we have just appeared out of no where one day and that's it.

Actually I was mistaken, it took us much longer. Homo Sapiens became the dominant species around 10,000 BC, and the first empires weren't in existence until around 2500 to 1500 BC, so it took almost 10,000 years from hunter gatherer to complex civilisation. And that's with all the geographical conditions necessary to have an agricultural surplus, and to develop urban cities.

You really need to learn your history, mate.

Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:54pm:
As I said you're just an enabler of the guilt & victim industry.


I would rather be an enabler of guild and victimisation than an enabler of hatred and bigotry.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #95 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:01pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:54pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:51pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:34pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:26pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:15pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:17pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


I'd also like to ask people what would they see as an alternative?

The natural progression for something like this is for initially things to go bad for one culture then steadily improve throughout their transition period.

Eventually in time, the two cultures will be indistinguishable.






The first thing to do is to recognise that they’ve had it tough by our hand and we owe them our resources and effort to ameliorate their condition to the best of our ability.

As to how long it will take? Who knows? It could take 10 years or 10,000 years.


I'd prefer to take the majority off drip feed and give the best and brightest a rolled gold first class education. I hate throwing good money after bad.

Govt funding for the top 100 private schools would be conditional on giving bright Aboriginal kids scholarships. Getting some more Aboriginal doctors, lawyers and business people out there would help bring them out of the funk they're in.


I don't disagree with these measures.

But, do you feel guilt for the actions of our predecessors? Because I do.


Why? & what good does that do?



Because it shows that we as a society must have compassion and continue to further the amelioration of the plight of the indigenous peoples.

What we did to the indigenous peoples was shameful, both British and Australians. You can try to dress it up as a civilising mission, but the institutionalisation of racism and oppression was unacceptable.



Oh perrrlease ...... & $33billion dollars a year, free education & health care, affirmative action, land rights etc aren't doing that?

The OP is "what would be enough?".

Obviously you wouldn't have a feckin clue.  Roll Eyes
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Gordon
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #96 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:03pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.


Actually this is interesting and I've mentioned something about this before.

Aboriginals suffered at the hands of the British and Australians, sure.

However, they've had a civilisation handed to them on a silver platter that took 2500 of slaughter to attain. It's almost like they were given access to a wormhole and have been propelled 10000 years from stone and to space age in a few hundred years.

They paid a very small cost to reach modernity compared to everyone else.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #97 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:03pm
 
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:01pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:54pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:51pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:34pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:26pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:15pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:17pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:32am:
Ye Grappler wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 11:15am:
With a disease riddled, unhealthy, violent lifestyle, often cold and hungry, and with a lifespan of around twenty-three, same as the pyramid builders.  That's why it is still part of their 'culture' to breed early and often..... they don't expect to make it to see their children grown in their DNA.

You're dreaming.   Now tell me how the tribes that had an annual migration from the high country to the ocean, where it was warmer in Winter, had a continuous occupation of the land?  they were itinerants with no fixed abode.. no claim to Mt Warning .. sorry.. most of the Aboriginals who live in that area had ancestors who came from other areas  - mass DNA testing should show who was who.


Yeah but you're forgetting one thing. If everyone lives the same as you do and you don't know any different lifestyle, then you're more likely to be satisfied. And then, as soon as someone comes along and imposes a completely alien system that you're not prepared for, do you think you're likely to succeed?

If I suddenly took over Sydney with goons, and imposed a Chinese-style society over Sydney residents: i.e. everyone has to speak Chinese; Han Chinese people get priority in jobs and housing, which involved kicking people out of their homes; and take children from their families and put them in Communist Party re-education centres; and I completely recognised society along those lines, do you think that you would succeed?? You would probably be thrown in poverty and out on your arse in a moment. That's what happened to the Indigenous peoples.


You'd have a point if we were talking about roughly equal societies in competition... in the case of Aboriginals we are not, since their society and 'culture' was considerably lower on the scale than that which transplanted them.

Other than that - taking your example of Chinee over-taking Oz - we are talking more an emotion or subjective state rather than a physical one, since the overall well-being (without oppressios etc) would be roughly equal and possibly in some ways better.

In the case of the Aboriginals - over the course of 200+ years - it has gotten considerably better... walkabout with spear has now become LandCruiserabout with firearm... while clad in warm clothes and with sleeping bags etc and some canned food etc...


I'd also like to ask people what would they see as an alternative?

The natural progression for something like this is for initially things to go bad for one culture then steadily improve throughout their transition period.

Eventually in time, the two cultures will be indistinguishable.






The first thing to do is to recognise that they’ve had it tough by our hand and we owe them our resources and effort to ameliorate their condition to the best of our ability.

As to how long it will take? Who knows? It could take 10 years or 10,000 years.


I'd prefer to take the majority off drip feed and give the best and brightest a rolled gold first class education. I hate throwing good money after bad.

Govt funding for the top 100 private schools would be conditional on giving bright Aboriginal kids scholarships. Getting some more Aboriginal doctors, lawyers and business people out there would help bring them out of the funk they're in.


I don't disagree with these measures.

But, do you feel guilt for the actions of our predecessors? Because I do.


Why? & what good does that do?



Because it shows that we as a society must have compassion and continue to further the amelioration of the plight of the indigenous peoples.

What we did to the indigenous peoples was shameful, both British and Australians. You can try to dress it up as a civilising mission, but the institutionalisation of racism and oppression was unacceptable.



Oh perrrlease ...... & $33billion dollars a year, free education & health care, affirmative action, land rights etc aren't doing that?

The OP is "what would be enough?".

Obviously you wouldn't have a feckin clue.  Roll Eyes


Correct, because throwing money at a problem doesn't always solve it. These issues are more complex than you make them out to be.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #98 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:04pm
 
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:03pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.


Actually this is interesting and I've mentioned something about this before.

Aboriginals suffered at the hands of the British and Australians, sure.

However, they've had a civilisation handed to them on a silver platter that took 2500 of slaughter to attain. It's almost like they were given access to a wormhole and have been propelled 5000 (probably more) from stone and to space age in  a few hundred years.

They paid a very small cost to reach modernity compared to everyone else.


Doesn't matter, Gordie. It only works if the society to which it is given has the necessary conditions already in place.

The prerequisite of industralisation is feudalism. The indigenous peoples didn't meet that condition, so the access doesn't matter.

EDIT: you can't go from hunter-gatherer to industralisation straightaway, you have to go through stages first, otherwise it doesn't work.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #99 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:06pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:54pm:
What we did to the indigenous peoples was shameful, both British and Australians. You can try to dress it up as a civilising mission, but the institutionalisation of racism and oppression was unacceptable.


It's known as genocide, a continuing policy designed to eliminate Australian Aboriginals.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #100 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:07pm
 
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:06pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:54pm:
What we did to the indigenous peoples was shameful, both British and Australians. You can try to dress it up as a civilising mission, but the institutionalisation of racism and oppression was unacceptable.


It's known as genocide, a continuing policy designed to eliminate Australian Aboriginals.


Yes, I'm willing to accept that some policies were genocidal in nature.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #101 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:17pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:07pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:06pm:
[quote author=augcaesarustus link=1523434551/93#93 date=1524023696]What we did to the indigenous peoples was shameful, both British and Australians. You can try to dress it up as a civilising mission, but the institutionalisation of racism and oppression was unacceptable.


It's known as genocide, a continuing policy designed to eliminate Australian Aboriginals.


Yes, I'm willing to accept that some policies were genocidal in nature. [/quote

So true

The Australian aboriginals certainly decimated and destroyed the original inhabitants through genocide.

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Re: What would be enough
Reply #102 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:19pm
 
I've always thought Ayre's Rock would make a good landing site for Christ's Second Coming.

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Re: What would be enough
Reply #103 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:23pm
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:17pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:07pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:06pm:
[quote author=augcaesarustus link=1523434551/93#93 date=1524023696]What we did to the indigenous peoples was shameful, both British and Australians. You can try to dress it up as a civilising mission, but the institutionalisation of racism and oppression was unacceptable.


It's known as genocide, a continuing policy designed to eliminate Australian Aboriginals.


Yes, I'm willing to accept that some policies were genocidal in nature. [/quote

So true

The Australian aboriginals certainly decimated and destroyed the original inhabitants through genocide.

KARMA IS A MEAN BITCH


Funny you feel so strongly about it. Were your ancestors those who preceded the indigenous peoples? You seem to feel a dare-I-say 'residual' anger about it...

Valkie, you're a bloody racist. You're a disgrace to this country. I can only hope that over time this country becomes inhabited less and less by people like you.

You're a dying breed, and thank God for that. History is against you.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #104 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:25pm
 
Lord Herbert wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:19pm:
I've always thought Ayre's Rock would make a good landing site for Christ's Second Coming.



Who knows? We might find some golden plates buried in the Outback, written in an obscure dialect of Ancient Egyptian??
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #105 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:25pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:04pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:03pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.


Actually this is interesting and I've mentioned something about this before.

Aboriginals suffered at the hands of the British and Australians, sure.

However, they've had a civilisation handed to them on a silver platter that took 2500 of slaughter to attain. It's almost like they were given access to a wormhole and have been propelled 5000 (probably more) from stone and to space age in  a few hundred years.

They paid a very small cost to reach modernity compared to everyone else.


Doesn't matter, Gordie. It only works if the society to which it is given has the necessary conditions already in place.

The prerequisite of industralisation is feudalism. The indigenous peoples didn't meet that condition, so the access doesn't matter.

EDIT: you can't go from hunter-gatherer to industralisation straightaway, you have to go through stages first, otherwise it doesn't work.


That's why I said we should ramp up integration with education. Leaving them thinking there is any chance of retaining the old way will only prolong their suffering as fringe dwellers.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #106 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:27pm
 
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:25pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:04pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:03pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.


Actually this is interesting and I've mentioned something about this before.

Aboriginals suffered at the hands of the British and Australians, sure.

However, they've had a civilisation handed to them on a silver platter that took 2500 of slaughter to attain. It's almost like they were given access to a wormhole and have been propelled 5000 (probably more) from stone and to space age in  a few hundred years.

They paid a very small cost to reach modernity compared to everyone else.


Doesn't matter, Gordie. It only works if the society to which it is given has the necessary conditions already in place.

The prerequisite of industralisation is feudalism. The indigenous peoples didn't meet that condition, so the access doesn't matter.

EDIT: you can't go from hunter-gatherer to industralisation straightaway, you have to go through stages first, otherwise it doesn't work.


That's why I said we should ramp up integration with education. Leaving them thinking there is any chance of retaining the old way will only prolong their suffering as fringe dwellers.


Fair enough, so long as you recognise that the indigenous peoples don't meet the conditions necessary to progress to an industrialised society within a short period of time. 200 odd years isn't enough time. It took more than 5000 years to get from hunter-gatherer to complex civilization, and a further 5000 years to get from civilization to enlightenment.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #107 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:35pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:27pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:25pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:04pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:03pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.


Actually this is interesting and I've mentioned something about this before.

Aboriginals suffered at the hands of the British and Australians, sure.

However, they've had a civilisation handed to them on a silver platter that took 2500 of slaughter to attain. It's almost like they were given access to a wormhole and have been propelled 5000 (probably more) from stone and to space age in  a few hundred years.

They paid a very small cost to reach modernity compared to everyone else.


Doesn't matter, Gordie. It only works if the society to which it is given has the necessary conditions already in place.

The prerequisite of industralisation is feudalism. The indigenous peoples didn't meet that condition, so the access doesn't matter.

EDIT: you can't go from hunter-gatherer to industralisation straightaway, you have to go through stages first, otherwise it doesn't work.


That's why I said we should ramp up integration with education. Leaving them thinking there is any chance of retaining the old way will only prolong their suffering as fringe dwellers.


Fair enough, so long as you recognise that the indigenous peoples don't meet the conditions necessary to progress to an industrialised society within a short period of time. 200 odd years isn't enough time. It took more than 5000 years to get from hunter-gatherer to complex civilization, and a further 5000 years to get from civilization to enlightenment.


I think you're off course here a bit.

You don't need to know how to make a car to be able to drive one. They don't need to reinvent the wheel. They don't need to reenact our history to function in the society we've created.

Hmm ok I kind of see what you're saying. They can't have the hunter gatherer mindset AND modernity at the same time, but individually they can choose modernity.


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Re: What would be enough
Reply #108 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:38pm
 
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:35pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:27pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:25pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:04pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:03pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.


Actually this is interesting and I've mentioned something about this before.

Aboriginals suffered at the hands of the British and Australians, sure.

However, they've had a civilisation handed to them on a silver platter that took 2500 of slaughter to attain. It's almost like they were given access to a wormhole and have been propelled 5000 (probably more) from stone and to space age in  a few hundred years.

They paid a very small cost to reach modernity compared to everyone else.


Doesn't matter, Gordie. It only works if the society to which it is given has the necessary conditions already in place.

The prerequisite of industralisation is feudalism. The indigenous peoples didn't meet that condition, so the access doesn't matter.

EDIT: you can't go from hunter-gatherer to industralisation straightaway, you have to go through stages first, otherwise it doesn't work.


That's why I said we should ramp up integration with education. Leaving them thinking there is any chance of retaining the old way will only prolong their suffering as fringe dwellers.


Fair enough, so long as you recognise that the indigenous peoples don't meet the conditions necessary to progress to an industrialised society within a short period of time. 200 odd years isn't enough time. It took more than 5000 years to get from hunter-gatherer to complex civilization, and a further 5000 years to get from civilization to enlightenment.


I think you're off course here a bit.

You don't need to know how to make a car to be able to drive one. They don't need to reinvent the wheel. They don't need to reenact our history to function in the society we've created.

Hmm ok I kind of see what you're saying. They can't have the hunter gatherer mindset AND modernity at the same time, but individually they can choose modernity.




Sure, they can choose individually to do so. It's also true that individuals are often constraints by the institutions in which they raised or live in.
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HooYAY its FriYAY
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #109 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:40pm
 
Nothing.

It’s not about enough.

It’s about maintaining the rage, never taking responsibility, always having someone or something to blame.

A classic I reckon are the lazy fat alco turds living in the shadow of the missive open cut at Kalgoorlie. “where’s our money, where’s our money”

Get off your lazy fat black arses and get a job ffs....  Roll Eyes

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Re: What would be enough
Reply #110 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:43pm
 
Black Man says: "You take Australia from us Black peoples, we take your 'MEDIA'."

Yep - only white guys on Media are gay ones and poor ones. Grin Grin Grin


Aboriginals take 222 years to become 'civilised'.
British took 800 years via Rome to become 'civilised'.
Grin
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #111 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:51pm
 
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:04pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:03pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.


Actually this is interesting and I've mentioned something about this before.

Aboriginals suffered at the hands of the British and Australians, sure.

However, they've had a civilisation handed to them on a silver platter that took 2500 of slaughter to attain. It's almost like they were given access to a wormhole and have been propelled 5000 (probably more) from stone and to space age in  a few hundred years.

They paid a very small cost to reach modernity compared to everyone else.


Doesn't matter, Gordie. It only works if the society to which it is given has the necessary conditions already in place.

The prerequisite of industralisation is feudalism. The indigenous peoples didn't meet that condition, so the access doesn't matter.

EDIT: you can't go from hunter-gatherer to industralisation straightaway, you have to go through stages first, otherwise it doesn't work.

Why is feudalism the prerequisite?
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......Australia has an illegitimate Government!
 
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AnotherJourneyByTrain
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #112 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:54pm
 
HooYAY its FriYAY wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:40pm:
Nothing.

It’s not about enough.

It’s about maintaining the rage, never taking responsibility, always having someone or something to blame.

A classic I reckon are the lazy fat alco turds living in the shadow of the missive open cut at Kalgoorlie. “where’s our money, where’s our money”

Get off your lazy fat black arses and get a job ffs....  Roll Eyes


IN MY OPINION THEY HAVE A RIGHT TO BE ANGRY!
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HooYAY its FriYAY
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #113 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 3:03pm
 
AnotherJourneyByTrain wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:54pm:
HooYAY its FriYAY wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:40pm:
Nothing.

It’s not about enough.

It’s about maintaining the rage, never taking responsibility, always having someone or something to blame.

A classic I reckon are the lazy fat alco turds living in the shadow of the missive open cut at Kalgoorlie. “where’s our money, where’s our money”

Get off your lazy fat black arses and get a job ffs....  Roll Eyes


IN MY OPINION THEY HAVE A RIGHT TO BE ANGRY!


Fair enough.

But angry, lazy, blaming, irresponsible, drug addled, abusive, dirty, dependant...... Roll Eyes

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Auggie
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #114 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 3:04pm
 
AnotherJourneyByTrain wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:51pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:04pm:
Gordon wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 2:03pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:48pm:
Auggie wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:33pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:22pm:
They oppressed each other ..... the different tribal groups & clan groups.

They still do it today.

You're so full of guilt & BS.


Ok, Mr. Smartypants.

Explain how warring with each other in tribes make it easy for them to transition into an industrialized society??


They've had 232 years to give it a crack.  Roll Eyes


And how long did it take us?

More than 2500 years meeting all the conditions necessary to become an industralised society, not to mention two world wars, and the death of millions of people in process.

They're not even 5 percent of the way there.


Actually this is interesting and I've mentioned something about this before.

Aboriginals suffered at the hands of the British and Australians, sure.

However, they've had a civilisation handed to them on a silver platter that took 2500 of slaughter to attain. It's almost like they were given access to a wormhole and have been propelled 5000 (probably more) from stone and to space age in  a few hundred years.

They paid a very small cost to reach modernity compared to everyone else.


Doesn't matter, Gordie. It only works if the society to which it is given has the necessary conditions already in place.

The prerequisite of industralisation is feudalism. The indigenous peoples didn't meet that condition, so the access doesn't matter.

EDIT: you can't go from hunter-gatherer to industralisation straightaway, you have to go through stages first, otherwise it doesn't work.

Why is feudalism the prerequisite?


Feudalism is a pre-requisite because of the advancements in agriculture which it creates. Also, it enshrined the idea of private property in the form of inclosures, etc.

I should mention also that Feudalism eventually died away in Europe and was replaced by Absolute Rule, thereby returning to centralisation and empires.
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Re: What would be enough
Reply #115 - Yesterday at 1:01am
 
Put the Kangaroo Kaffirs to Feudalism first and then move forward with them....

I say this is all bullshit.  I've known many Kangaroo Kaffirs and many of them are intelligent, but often find themselves in areas where there is NO WORK - for anyone!  This business of assimilating into a tertiary production culture is laughable when you look at the majority of country towns....

What the reality is - is that many Kangaroo Kaffirs feel a sense of entitlement and feel oppressed because they can't get a job, either, and so they turn to alcohol, drugs and criminal behaviour - part of which is 'revenge' on Whitey.... I've met some who actually feel that if they steal from Whitey, they are only getting back what they had stolen.....

When this nation can provide secure jobs and genuine opportunity to get ahead on merit and have those opportunities evenly spread across the nation, rather than being more available in big cities than in the bush - then we might see some changes....

I've lived in the city and in the bush - and let me tell you - finding a job in the bush is one hell of a lot harder, even though in the cities the floor has collapsed under many avenues of work.  I turn 69 this year, and am still on the lookout for a job part-time.

Now try arguing the REASONS for this and not attack those who ask for reasonable answers to important questions about Aboriginals.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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