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We will have to hire God (Read 2475 times)
Stig
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #15 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 10:51am
 
Even the current generation of self-driving cars have already proved themselves safer than human drivers.

After a fatal crash involving a Tesla on autopilot in the US, their National Highway Traffic Safety Administration investigated the autopilot system used in the cars, and all the naysayers lined up to demand it be withdrawn.

Then the findings were released - that actually the crash rate of Tesla cars had dropped by 40% in cars where autopilot was installed. Given that the speed-hating nanny-statists responsible for road safety here in Oz are happy to crow about even a few % reduction in the road toll (and lie about how it's due to speed cameras), 40% is huge.

When you talk such massive reductions in fatalities, self-driving cars (and especially self-driving trucks) are a no-brainer.

https://techcrunch.com/2017/01/19/nhtsas-full-final-investigation-into-teslas-au
topilot-shows-40-crash-rate-reduction/
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Gordon
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #16 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 11:13am
 
Stig wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 10:51am:
Even the current generation of self-driving cars have already proved themselves safer than human drivers.

After a fatal crash involving a Tesla on autopilot in the US, their National Highway Traffic Safety Administration investigated the autopilot system used in the cars, and all the naysayers lined up to demand it be withdrawn.

Then the findings were released - that actually the crash rate of Tesla cars had dropped by 40% in cars where autopilot was installed. Given that the speed-hating nanny-statists responsible for road safety here in Oz are happy to crow about even a few % reduction in the road toll (and lie about how it's due to speed cameras), 40% is huge.

When you talk such massive reductions in fatalities, self-driving cars (and especially self-driving trucks) are a no-brainer.

https://techcrunch.com/2017/01/19/nhtsas-full-final-investigation-into-teslas-au
topilot-shows-40-crash-rate-reduction/


All tariffs should be dropped to reduce car prices, and automated braking and lane departure should be mandatory within about 5 years.


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freediver
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #17 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?
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Bobby.
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #18 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:50pm
 
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?



Computers are not alive -
they have no consciousness as we do.

We humans are far more advanced than computers
except in maybe chess.
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Lord Herbert
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #19 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:59pm
 
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons travelling at high speed. It only kills us occasionally.


40,000 on average per year in the US killed on the roads.


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greggerypeccary
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #20 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 2:01pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?



Computers are not alive -
they have no consciousness as we do.

We humans are far more advanced than computers
except in maybe chess.


A lot of forum members here have confessed that they can't keep their cars within the legal speed limits.

Computers probably can.

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Johnnie
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #21 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 5:31pm
 
I hope they can tell the difference between the stop and the hand wave the lollypop guy gives at the road works, the sensors are going to have to be good to navigate the five way Britannia roundabout in Adelaide, i would be closing my eyes and hoping for the best, there might be a few tail end collisions with dogs cats and roos playing chicken, i can see the hoons playing a few tricks with these machines, still i have had enough of driving and will take my chances, sit back have a beer and keep the insurance up to date.
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freediver
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #22 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:52pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?



Computers are not alive -
they have no consciousness as we do.

We humans are far more advanced than computers
except in maybe chess.


Computers are capable of doing the things that you insist require consciousness.
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Setanta
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #23 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:56pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?



Computers are not alive -
they have no consciousness as we do.

We humans are far more advanced than computers
except in maybe chess.


Driving is like playing chess. Being aware of the board, foreseeing moves, looking behind the pawn, watching for checkmates.
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Bobby.
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #24 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:59pm
 
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:52pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?



Computers are not alive -
they have no consciousness as we do.

We humans are far more advanced than computers
except in maybe chess.


Computers are capable of doing the things that you insist require consciousness.



Not really FD.
They are good at chess because there are strict rules
about what piece can move where and they can calculate billions of board positions.
Evaluating a position on the road is so different.
You need to be able to predict what could go wrong in advance.
I don't think computers are close to being there yet.

Can the computer really see that the school bus has just stopped and
the kids are getting off the bus but that some kid might run out from in front of the bus
into the path of your car?
I dunno?
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freediver
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #25 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 8:02pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:59pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:52pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?



Computers are not alive -
they have no consciousness as we do.

We humans are far more advanced than computers
except in maybe chess.


Computers are capable of doing the things that you insist require consciousness.



Not really FD.
They are good at chess because there are strict rules
about what piece can move where and they can calculate billions of board positions.
Evaluating a position on the road is so different.
You need to be able to predict what could go wrong in advance.
I don't think computers are close to being there yet.

Can the computer really see that the school bus has just stopped and
the kids are getting off the bus but that some kid might run out from in front of the bus
into the path of your car?
I dunno?


You are about 20 years behind Bobby. Computers are driving cars on our roads, doing the exact things that you claim require consciousness. I still have no idea why anyone would think it requires consciousness to avoid colliding with something.
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Gordon
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #26 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 8:04pm
 
Setanta wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:56pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?



Computers are not alive -
they have no consciousness as we do.

We humans are far more advanced than computers
except in maybe chess.


Driving is like playing chess. Being aware of the board, foreseeing moves, looking behind the pawn, watching for checkmates.


Just today I was turning right from a kind of busy road into a side street. The car behind me beeped because I didn't take advantage of the break in traffic to turn (yes Sydney is like that).  It was a small gap but very doable with a bit of haste.

The car behind me didn't notice the kid on skateboard on the footpath partly obscured by a nature strip hedge.
He zoomed out across the street I wanted to turn into.

I'd would have had to chose between hitting the kid or getting tboned. Wonder if AI could pick that one up.
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Setanta
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #27 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 8:10pm
 
Gordon wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 8:04pm:
Setanta wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:56pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?



Computers are not alive -
they have no consciousness as we do.

We humans are far more advanced than computers
except in maybe chess.


Driving is like playing chess. Being aware of the board, foreseeing moves, looking behind the pawn, watching for checkmates.


Just today I was turning right from a kind of busy road into a side street. The car behind me beeped because I didn't take advantage of the break in traffic to turn (yes Sydney is like that).  It was a small gap but very doable with a bit of haste.

The car behind me didn't notice the kid on skateboard on the footpath partly obscured by a nature strip hedge.
He zoomed out across the street I wanted to turn into.

I'd would have had to chose between hitting the kid or getting tboned. Wonder if AI could pick that one up.


A lot of people don't, that's for sure. Some kid got himself t-boned not far from here skateboarding on a road through a round about just down the hill from LBH at Lismore Square. He was on the road, nothing hidden.

edit: Thinking about it, it may have been an herself. Anyway a teenager near the end of the Chrissy hols.

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Bobby.
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #28 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 8:12pm
 
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 8:02pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:59pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 7:52pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 1:50pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:37pm:
Bobby. wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:03pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 9:55pm:
Do you only drive carefully when there is a school bus around bobby?

Don't forget, every day we get in our cars and share the road with complete and utter morons traveling at high speed.
It only kills us occasionally.



No - I just gave you one small example of where consciousness is required.


Are you saying the driverless cars we already have are actually alive?

Or that they crash every time something unexpected happens but no-one has noticed?



Computers are not alive -
they have no consciousness as we do.

We humans are far more advanced than computers
except in maybe chess.


Computers are capable of doing the things that you insist require consciousness.



Not really FD.
They are good at chess because there are strict rules
about what piece can move where and they can calculate billions of board positions.
Evaluating a position on the road is so different.
You need to be able to predict what could go wrong in advance.
I don't think computers are close to being there yet.

Can the computer really see that the school bus has just stopped and
the kids are getting off the bus but that some kid might run out from in front of the bus
into the path of your car?
I dunno?


You are about 20 years behind Bobby. Computers are driving cars on our roads, doing the exact things that you claim require consciousness. I still have no idea why anyone would think it requires consciousness to avoid colliding with something.


I thought I gave a strong example.

How would the computer know that:
(1) it was a school bus?
(2) that kids were getting off the bus on the left hand side?
(3) that kids were being shielded from view by the front of the bus?
(4) that kids are impulsive and might just run from the front of the bus across the road without looking?

That's just one hypothetical but very real example.

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Setanta
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Re: We will have to hire God
Reply #29 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 8:15pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 8:12pm:
I thought I gave a strong example.

How would the computer know that:
(1) it was a school bus?
(2) that kids were getting off the bus on the left hand side?
(3) that kids were being shielded from view by the front of the bus?
(4) that kids are impulsive and might just run from the front of the bus across the road without looking?

That's just one hypothetical but very real example.



How about busses have electronics too or at least something the car can read? A bus is stopped, it signals that to nearby vehicles, vehicles passing it automatically slow, unlike people.
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