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Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti (Read 11813 times)
greggerypeccary
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #60 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 8:34am
 
Lord Herbert wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 8:33am:
And frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn if it's racist to say I'm tired of reading about Blacks on the Rampage down there in Melbourne.


Stop reading it, then.

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Auggie
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #61 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 11:10am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9th, 2018 at 4:15pm:
I'd actually say the active supporters of Terrorism world wide would be half that.   In Australia, I would suggest that they constitute about a tenth of that (ie, about 1%).    


So, Brian you said that in your opinion you say that about 5% of Muslims worldwide actively support terrorism. Based on that calculation, that’s 90 million people.

No small number is it? And that’s NOT counting the numbers who believe in subjugating women and oppressing gays.

You think 5% of Christians actively support terrorism?? Doubt it.
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #62 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 11:13am
 
Grendel wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 7:50am:
You are wasting your time with this fool Auggie... in over 2 decades he hasn't changed his mind one little bit... he lies, obfuscates, dissembles and is a disingenuous prat.  Surely you've figured this out by now.





I used to have more respect for Brian but lost it quickly when he brought up a personal matter, completely unrelated to argument.

You and I have our disagreements but it’s fair to say that we’ve kept it civil.
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #63 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 3:12pm
 
Auggie wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 11:10am:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9th, 2018 at 4:15pm:
I'd actually say the active supporters of Terrorism world wide would be half that.   In Australia, I would suggest that they constitute about a tenth of that (ie, about 1%).    


So, Brian you said that in your opinion you say that about 5% of Muslims worldwide actively support terrorism. Based on that calculation, that’s 90 million people.

No small number is it? And that’s NOT counting the numbers who believe in subjugating women and oppressing gays.

You think 5% of Christians actively support terrorism?? Doubt it.



Percentages are always deceptive, Augie.

"5%" sounds a lot when rendered into real numbers but it is statistically an insignificant quantity.  Anything about 10% is.   It could as great as 5% it could as little as 1%.   Like anything that indicates "support" that can range from, "pass the ammunition!" to "Oh, here is a few Shekels for the cause, Brother!"   90 Million sounds big but when spread over the entire Muslim world, it is quite small.    Roll Eyes
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #64 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 3:14pm
 
Auggie wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 11:13am:
Grendel wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 7:50am:
You are wasting your time with this fool Auggie... in over 2 decades he hasn't changed his mind one little bit... he lies, obfuscates, dissembles and is a disingenuous prat.  Surely you've figured this out by now.





I used to have more respect for Brian but lost it quickly when he brought up a personal matter, completely unrelated to argument.

You and I have our disagreements but it’s fair to say that we’ve kept it civil.


Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Augie, you were the one who first mentioned that "personal matter", not me.  You did not flag it with a warning.   I merely used information that you provided.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #65 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 4:05pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 3:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 11:10am:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9th, 2018 at 4:15pm:
I'd actually say the active supporters of Terrorism world wide would be half that.   In Australia, I would suggest that they constitute about a tenth of that (ie, about 1%).    


So, Brian you said that in your opinion you say that about 5% of Muslims worldwide actively support terrorism. Based on that calculation, that’s 90 million people.

No small number is it? And that’s NOT counting the numbers who believe in subjugating women and oppressing gays.

You think 5% of Christians actively support terrorism?? Doubt it.



Percentages are always deceptive, Augie.

"5%" sounds a lot when rendered into real numbers but it is statistically an insignificant quantity.  Anything about 10% is.   It could as great as 5% it could as little as 1%.   Like anything that indicates "support" that can range from, "pass the ammunition!" to "Oh, here is a few Shekels for the cause, Brother!"   90 Million sounds big but when spread over the entire Muslim world, it is quite small.    Roll Eyes


90 million is a large number, even globally. It's enough to give impetus to terrorist groups and to organize radicalist communities.

Again, do you think that 5% of the global Christian population hold pernicious beliefs?
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #66 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 4:32pm
 
Auggie wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 4:05pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 3:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 11:10am:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9th, 2018 at 4:15pm:
I'd actually say the active supporters of Terrorism world wide would be half that.   In Australia, I would suggest that they constitute about a tenth of that (ie, about 1%).    


So, Brian you said that in your opinion you say that about 5% of Muslims worldwide actively support terrorism. Based on that calculation, that’s 90 million people.

No small number is it? And that’s NOT counting the numbers who believe in subjugating women and oppressing gays.

You think 5% of Christians actively support terrorism?? Doubt it.



Percentages are always deceptive, Augie.

"5%" sounds a lot when rendered into real numbers but it is statistically an insignificant quantity.  Anything about 10% is.   It could as great as 5% it could as little as 1%.   Like anything that indicates "support" that can range from, "pass the ammunition!" to "Oh, here is a few Shekels for the cause, Brother!"   90 Million sounds big but when spread over the entire Muslim world, it is quite small.    Roll Eyes


90 million is a large number, even globally. It's enough to give impetus to terrorist groups and to organize radicalist communities.

Again, do you think that 5% of the global Christian population hold pernicious beliefs?


If by "pernicious beliefs" you mean dislike of Gays, misogynistic views about women and so on, I'd have to say, easily.   Easily, Augie.    Then you have to ask, what degree of those "pernicious beliefs" they hold - do they mean throw all Gays off buildings, make women subservient and barefoot and pregnant?   Some do, some don't.   Just look back that the history of these fora, where people like Herbie and Co. are always complaining about feminism and so on.    Roll Eyes
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #67 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 4:40pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 4:32pm:
Auggie wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 4:05pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 3:12pm:
Auggie wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 11:10am:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9th, 2018 at 4:15pm:
I'd actually say the active supporters of Terrorism world wide would be half that.   In Australia, I would suggest that they constitute about a tenth of that (ie, about 1%).    


So, Brian you said that in your opinion you say that about 5% of Muslims worldwide actively support terrorism. Based on that calculation, that’s 90 million people.

No small number is it? And that’s NOT counting the numbers who believe in subjugating women and oppressing gays.

You think 5% of Christians actively support terrorism?? Doubt it.



Percentages are always deceptive, Augie.

"5%" sounds a lot when rendered into real numbers but it is statistically an insignificant quantity.  Anything about 10% is.   It could as great as 5% it could as little as 1%.   Like anything that indicates "support" that can range from, "pass the ammunition!" to "Oh, here is a few Shekels for the cause, Brother!"   90 Million sounds big but when spread over the entire Muslim world, it is quite small.    Roll Eyes


90 million is a large number, even globally. It's enough to give impetus to terrorist groups and to organize radicalist communities.

Again, do you think that 5% of the global Christian population hold pernicious beliefs?


If by "pernicious beliefs" you mean dislike of Gays, misogynistic views about women and so on, I'd have to say, easily.   Easily, Augie.    Then you have to ask, what degree of those "pernicious beliefs" they hold - do they mean throw all Gays off buildings, make women subservient and barefoot and pregnant?   Some do, some don't.   Just look back that the history of these fora, where people like Herbie and Co. are always complaining about feminism and so on.    Roll Eyes


What I mean by pernicious beliefs is the following:

1) criminalization of homosexuality (to the extent that a person should be thrown in jail);
2) women cannot hold positions of power or adjudicate over matters solely concerning men in a court of law;
3) do not support representative democracy;
4) do not support 'separation of church and state'.

Dislike of gays, misogyny are very vague terms that don't really mean anything unless you provide me with a practical example. Do you believe that 5% of Christians hold any ONE of the pernicious beliefs that I HAVE LISTED ABOVE.

Second, I cannot speak for Herbie, but criticism of Feminism is criticism of Third-Wave Feminism, which propagates misandry and man-hating.
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #68 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm
 
Auggie wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 4:40pm:
[quote author=Brian_Ross link=1514968393/66#66 date=1516084355][quote author=augcaesarustus link=1514968393/65#65 date=1516082713]
What I mean by pernicious beliefs is the following:

1) criminalization of homosexuality (to the extent that a person should be thrown in jail);
2) women cannot hold positions of power or adjudicate over matters solely concerning men in a court of law;
3) do not support representative democracy;
4) do not support 'separation of church and state'.

Dislike of gays, misogyny are very vague terms that don't really mean anything unless you provide me with a practical example. Do you believe that 5% of Christians hold any ONE of the pernicious beliefs that I HAVE LISTED ABOVE.


Russian, Uganda, India - all non-Islamic nations have in the last 10 years or so, outlawed Homosexuality, Augie.

There have been definitely a two step forward, one step back approach to Homosexuality around the world.  Downunder, we legalised by a very circuitous route, Same-Sex-Marriage.   Something well within the power of the Parliament to do without recourse to the people.   However, to appease the Conservatives, Prime Minister Trumble was forced to appeal to the people and have the ABS ask them.

I'd say about 5% of Christians, or more, believe that Homosexuality should be outlawed, easily.

Quote:
Second, I cannot speak for Herbie, but criticism of Feminism is criticism of Third-Wave Feminism, which propagates misandry and man-hating.


Well, they don't differentiate - deliberately between the various "waves", Augie.  To them, "Feminism" is a dirty word.   Their views would fit quite well with many conservative Muslims IMO.

Feminism is IMO well, feminism - the rights of women being recognised.   Simples really and I am constantly amazed that some Australians still believe women should be subservient.   Doesn't matter what religion they are, either.   Thankfully, that is long dead and buried, despite all the bleating about it here and elsewhere.    Roll Eyes
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #69 - Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:33pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
Russian, Uganda, India - all non-Islamic nations have in the last 10 years or so, outlawed Homosexuality, Augie.


Ok, so did a bit a research. Same-sex consensual sex is not illegal in Russia, so it's not criminalized; but the majority do support discrimination against same-sex couples/people.

If this is the case, and according to my own logic, then most Russians wouldn't be able to integrate into society because they cannot accept homosexuality; therefore my integrationist policy would make it harder for Russian to become citizens, or permanently migrate to Australia. From a theoretically point of view, if the majority of Russians believe this, then we shouldn't be taking them in in such great numbers.

Is it racist to say that about Russians?

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
Downunder, we legalised by a very circuitous route, Same-Sex-Marriage.   Something well within the power of the Parliament to do without recourse to the people.   However, to appease the Conservatives, Prime Minister Trumble was forced to appeal to the people and have the ABS ask them.


Not being for same-sex marriage is not the same as believing in its criminalization. It's not homophobic to be against ssm. I voted in favour of it, but I understand the conservative's arguments fully. But, that's for another thread.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
I'd say about 5% of Christians, or more, believe that Homosexuality should be outlawed, easily.


In that case, then my immigration policy would equally apply to those people. The policy isn't based on race or religion, it's based on those values I specified above. If you don't believe them, doesn't matter than you're whitest white person on the planet, you cannot get citizenship to Australia.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
Well, they don't differentiate - deliberately between the various "waves", Augie.  To them, "Feminism" is a dirty word.   Their views would fit quite well with many conservative Muslims IMO.


Well, that's not my fault, is it?

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
Simples really and I am constantly amazed that some Australians still believe women should be subservient. 


Like that idiot on the commercial for 'Married at First Sight' who said that 'Men are getting beaten by their girlfriends... Why shouldn't we be like other countries?'????

Every time I see that, I feel disgusted. Men like that should be shot.
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #70 - Jan 18th, 2018 at 2:50pm
 
Bwian states unequivocally...
"Simples really and I am constantly amazed that some Australians still believe women should be subservient." 
So bwian what is the Muslim attitude to women.
Must they be covered up....  subservience.
Must they walk behind their men...  subservience...
Etc, etc, etc, bwian...  so you are against Islamic practices then bwian?
But cant say anything except against Western cultures right?
Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Grin Grin Grin Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Grin Grin Grin Roll Eyes
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #71 - Jan 18th, 2018 at 3:55pm
 
Auggie wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:33pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
Russian, Uganda, India - all non-Islamic nations have in the last 10 years or so, outlawed Homosexuality, Augie.


Ok, so did a bit a research. Same-sex consensual sex is not illegal in Russia, so it's not criminalized; but the majority do support discrimination against same-sex couples/people.


The Russians have stopped short of criminalising it.  However, they are doing everything but making it illegal.  Gays are warned about attending the 2018 World Cup...

Quote:
If this is the case, and according to my own logic, then most Russians wouldn't be able to integrate into society because they cannot accept homosexuality; therefore my integrationist policy would make it harder for Russian to become citizens, or permanently migrate to Australia. From a theoretically point of view, if the majority of Russians believe this, then we shouldn't be taking them in in such great numbers.

Is it racist to say that about Russians?


It is Xenophobic.   Russians leaving Russia may well be doing so because they disagree with the present Russian Government's policies.  You would deny them a safe haven.   So much for mercy, hey, Augie?  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes

Quote:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
Downunder, we legalised by a very circuitous route, Same-Sex-Marriage.   Something well within the power of the Parliament to do without recourse to the people.   However, to appease the Conservatives, Prime Minister Trumble was forced to appeal to the people and have the ABS ask them.


Not being for same-sex marriage is not the same as believing in its criminalization. It's not homophobic to be against ssm. I voted in favour of it, but I understand the conservative's arguments fully. But, that's for another thread.


Yet you are attacking the conservative viewpoint, Augie.   You don't wish those holding those views to become citizens.  Tsk, tsk.    Roll Eyes

Quote:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
I'd say about 5% of Christians, or more, believe that Homosexuality should be outlawed, easily.


In that case, then my immigration policy would equally apply to those people. The policy isn't based on race or religion, it's based on those values I specified above. If you don't believe them, doesn't matter than you're whitest white person on the planet, you cannot get citizenship to Australia.


It is based on political views.  Views which I note a third of the Australian population more than likely support.  Are they to be deported because of their views?  Tsk, tsk.    Roll Eyes

Quote:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
Well, they don't differentiate - deliberately between the various "waves", Augie.  To them, "Feminism" is a dirty word.   Their views would fit quite well with many conservative Muslims IMO.


Well, that's not my fault, is it?


No, it isn't but you would still prevent them from becoming citizens.  Strikes me as equally narrow-minded.    Roll Eyes

Quote:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 16th, 2018 at 5:15pm:
Simples really and I am constantly amazed that some Australians still believe women should be subservient. 


Like that idiot on the commercial for 'Married at First Sight' who said that 'Men are getting beaten by their girlfriends... Why shouldn't we be like other countries?'????

Every time I see that, I feel disgusted. Men like that should be shot.


So, they must fear for their lives now?  Tsk, tsk.    Roll Eyes
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #72 - Jan 18th, 2018 at 4:06pm
 
bwian says... "It is Xenophobic.   Russians leaving Russia may well be doing so because they disagree with the present Russian Government's policies.  You would deny them a safe haven.   So much for mercy, hey, Augie?  Tsk, tsk"

Tsk tsk bwian...  is the Russian Government our responsibility?  Is the russian way of life our responsibility?  We have elections bwian to resolve such issues.  We have Referenda and Plebiscites etc...  we are a democratic state.

We are not a Noah's Ark for people from failed states or social policy disagreements.
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #73 - Jan 18th, 2018 at 6:09pm
 
Quote:
According to the Constitution of Russia, the country is a federation and semi-presidential republic, wherein the President is the head of state[125] and the Prime Minister is the head of government. The Russian Federation is fundamentally structured as a multi-party representative democracy, with the federal government composed of three branches:

    Legislative: The bicameral Federal Assembly of Russia, made up of the 450-member State Duma and the 166-member Federation Council, adopts federal law, declares war, approves treaties, has the power of the purse and the power of impeachment of the President.
    Executive: The President is the Supreme Commander-in-Chief of the Armed Forces, can veto legislative bills before they become law, and appoints the Government of Russia (Cabinet) and other officers, who administer and enforce federal laws and policies.
    Judiciary: The Constitutional Court, Supreme Court and lower federal courts, whose judges are appointed by the Federation Council on the recommendation of the President, interpret laws and can overturn laws they deem unconstitutional.


Sounds kinda familiar doesn't it... Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #74 - Jan 19th, 2018 at 10:32am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 18th, 2018 at 3:55pm:
Russians leaving Russia may well be doing so because they disagree with the present Russian Government's policies.  You would deny them a safe haven.   So much for mercy, hey, Augie?  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


If they disagree with the current Russian government's policies, then they're likely to support our values, aren't they?? Which means they would most likely be allowed to permanently migrate to Australia.

Being against homosexuality is not the criteria; it's whether you believe homosexual acts should be criminalized that is the bar here. Many Russians, as do Australians believe that homosexuality is not nature, etc. but nearly all Australians would believe that they shouldn't be thrown in jail for their acts.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 18th, 2018 at 3:55pm:
Yet you are attacking the conservative viewpoint, Augie.   You don't wish those holding those views to become citizens.  Tsk, tsk.    Roll Eyes


No, you're conflating fundamentalism with conservative. Yes, fundamentalist Christians, Jews and Hindus wouldn't share these values, but then I also want to screen those people too. Conservatives are different to fundamentalist views.

The whole process is about screening those who wish to become citizens of Australians. If you are wanting to exert your civic duty to vote, then you should hold the values of that country. That doesn't mean you're not welcome to Australia to study visit, or live on a temporary basis.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 18th, 2018 at 3:55pm:
It is based on political views.  Views which I note a third of the Australian population more than likely support.  Are they to be deported because of their views?  Tsk, tsk.    Roll Eyes


No one is to be deported for holding different views. And no, I disagree, I don't agree that one-third of the Australian population support theocracy.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 18th, 2018 at 3:55pm:
No, it isn't but you would still prevent them from becoming citizens.  Strikes me as equally narrow-minded.    Roll Eyes


No, it wouldn't. It would flag only those who believe women to be second-class citizens.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 18th, 2018 at 3:55pm:
So, they must fear for their lives now?  Tsk, tsk.    Roll Eyes


Oooh, so first I"m a rapist, and now I'm a murderer???

Get a grip, Brian. You're reputation as a sound progressive is slowly losing its traction as you make ad hominem arguments.

Tsk, tsk.
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