Australian Politics Forum - Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti

greggerypeccary

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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #45 - Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:42pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:30pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:15pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 8:30am:

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 6^th, 2018 at 10:39pm:

Bertie wrote on Jan 6^th, 2018 at 9:40pm:

Why is it the prerogative the people being accepted rather than the people accepting them?
Where else do the guests dictate the rules to the hosts?

They are not "guests". They are migrants. They have been invited to join our society as equals. Multiculturalism ensures that their needs and desires are met within our society. To suggest they are "guests" shows that you do not accept them. Remember, we as a society invited them here.

Maybe we should 'invite' a better class of migrant, one that is less demanding and less of a burden on our society.

That rules out Herbie.

He's Chinese, isn't he? Roll Eyes

Dunno, but he's very demanding as well as being a burden on society.

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Lord Herbert

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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #46 - Jan 8^th, 2018 at 5:23pm

Bias_2012 wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2018 at 11:21pm:

Yes but we think that ethnics should change their behavior and we're not positive about muslims - got it?

Your 85% is in the big cities and 60% of those would be ethnic multiculturalists sure they're going to agree

Correct!

And it's well known that survey companies save time and effort by going to our universities to canvas opinion ... places where more than 80% of the students are visibly ethnic whether they were born here or not.

A survey among Australians of European background would be the only valid poll on opinions.

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Brian Ross Gold Member Online Representative of me Posts: 39582	Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti Reply #47 - Jan 8^th, 2018 at 5:41pm greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:42pm: Dunno, but he's very demanding as well as being a burden on society. Appears to be true...
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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti Reply #48 - Jan 8^th, 2018 at 8:29pm Herb, just ignore him... bwian's claim that 20,400,000 Australians support Multiculturalism is a lie.
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #49 - Jan 8^th, 2018 at 9:08pm

Grendel wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 8:29pm:

Herb, just ignore him... bwian's claim that 20,400,000 Australians support Multiculturalism is a lie.

In truth, I believe he's probably right.

I myself enjoy seeing different races and colours around me, just so long as the numbers don't reach Critical Mass and as a white person of European descent you find yourself a very small minority as in Sydney's Parramatta and many other suburbs.

It was always a question of numbers, not whether they have Asian features or they're black Africans.

Once they started to bulk-up in certain Sydney suburbs, that's when even the most tolerant have started to question the immigration program.

A huge percentage of even Labor voters AND Greens voters want a stop to any further Muslim immigration.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #50 - Jan 8^th, 2018 at 9:27pm

Oh, dearie, dearie, me. Still unable to face facts. 85% of Australians said they appreciate Multiculturalism. Now, how is that report, a "lie"? How is the survey that produced those results, a "lie"? No one has presented any evidence that either I or the Scanlon Report are lying. They just shriek, "Lie!" "Lie!" "Lie!" Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #51 - Jan 8^th, 2018 at 11:10pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

Secondly, you have no understanding of the problems that Asian migrants have had in Europe - the Indians, the Pakistanis, the Bangladeshis, etc.

When I said Asians, I was referring to those of East Asian background such as Chinese, Vietnamese, Japanese and Korean. Pakistanis and Bangladeshis are majority Muslims.

Next??

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

Well, who's fault is that? The Muslim migrants or the French authorities? When they were desperate for factory fodder, they welcomed the Muslim migrants. When factories closed, and competition became more fierce they turned on the most recent migrants. The Germans have long been antagonistic towards their Turkish "guest workers".

It's the fault of the French authorities for having such an immigration policy.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

Well, percentage wise, yes, I'd agree. However, in absolute numbers, in the US they far outweigh the numbers downunder. You also seem to be assuming all American Muslims are migrants to the USA. Very few are. Most American Muslims are domestically "grown" - either converts or born there, as are most Australian Muslims.

No, I'm saying that the percentage of Muslims in American is 0.9%, whether they're homegrown or not. The lesser the number, the easier it is to integrate migrants.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

ers back in the mid-late-19th century. Sydney had a handful of sailors. Adelaide has one of the oldest Mosques in Australia, in the city centre. Muslims are basically accepted by most South Australians. Sydneysiders appear to have problems. I don't think it is the Muslim's fault completely. I'd suggest it was in part, the Sydneysiders'. They don't like people who are different. They don't like the Indochinese, they don't like the Muslims.

Really? Sydney is a cosmopolitan society. I doubt that this is the case. It ultimately comes down to numbers, and to the fact that there is a dangerous ideology out there, which is encouraging people not to integrate into society.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

I disagree. Both demonstrate that Muslims can integrate and do become part of the wider Australian community. I remember my Turkish-Cypriot friend being very welcomed in the local RSL before 11 September. Afterwards? Everybody was suspicious. He hadn't changed - they had.

It does matter. Completely ignoring the historical development of a nation is ignorance. Of course, it's wrong when a Muslim gets a dirty look or is discriminated against. It's also true that many Muslims support terrorism, and hold pernicious beliefs about women and minorities.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

How do I know you're integrated, Augie? Mmm? Don't ask stupid questions.

I'm integrated because I speak English with an Australian accent; am loyal to King and country; was baptised an Anglican, and support core liberal values. I'm fully integrated.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

Does he dance around in an Arab robe, waving a sword, screaming "Allahu Akaba"? Of course bloody not. Apart from the fact he isn't Arab. You have some really weird ideas, I'd suggest, really weird ideas.

Did I say anything about clothing? I said it was about 'values' and 'beliefs'. A person can dress as a Muslim but believe in separation of church of state; just as the opposite can occur.

Separation of church and state is non-negotiable in Australia, and all migrants and citizens should support the secular state.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

Because America accepts them, in their major cities. Outside, they are just as narrow minded as it appears you are, Augie. Even more so. "Towel heads? Kill 'em all!"

No, because there are less of them.

Second, I never said anything about killing Muslims. I have friends who are Muslims. I'm simply recognising the danger of the ideology of Islamism. You're burying your head in the sand about the reality that values and beliefs have on actions.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

I believe a tiny minority in Australia actively support Terrorism, Augie. Figures? Don't have them but it seems to be mainly young, impressionable people who the Police catch. Yet you seem to think that the majority of Muslims support Terrorism. Why? Because the media tells you that? Tsk, tsk.

You're misquoting me. I never said that the majority support terrorism; I said that a large minority do. It's about degree. There's a huge difference between 0.1% about 10%. As I said it didn't take 51% of Germans for the Nazis to come into power; but a significant minority in German at the time did support Nazism, and this was enough for them to have power.

I would say that around 1 in 10 Muslims around the world support terrorism, and that's being conservative.

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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #52 - Jan 9^th, 2018 at 8:54am

Oh, dearie, dearie, me bwian. Still unable to face facts.

20,400,000 Australians do not support Multiculturalism as you claimed.

Even though I note you keep rewording your claim a lot bwian... wassup... lying getting more difficult for you?
The Scanlon founder is pro- large immigration and pro-multiculturalism... his foundation is not a government or academic institute. They surveyed mostly like minded people bwian... 1200.... not 35,000 where 93% wanted and end to multiculturalism.

Their results are not backed up by other polls, taken around the same times and their results and methodology are refuted by Institutes like The Australian Population Research Institute....

Now, how is it that YOU lie? You claimed bwian that 85% of Australians supported Multiculturalism based on a dodgey survey bwian.
YOU lied that "No one has presented any evidence that either I or the Scanlon Report are lying" oh dear bwian... been posted many times, this is just another one.

Quote:

They just shriek, "Lie!" "Lie!" "Lie!" Tsk, tsk.

yes bwian tsk,tsk, tsk... there you go lying again.

93% of 35,000 polled nationally want an end to Multiculturalism.
85% of 30,000+ polled agree with Andrew Fraser and wanted a return to some form of the White Australia Policy.

I'm guessing none of these people were polled by Scanlon. Cheesy

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Brian Ross

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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #53 - Jan 9^th, 2018 at 3:58pm

Auggie wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 11:10pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

Secondly, you have no understanding of the problems that Asian migrants have had in Europe - the Indians, the Pakistanis, the Bangladeshis, etc.

When I said Asians, I was referring to those of East Asian background such as Chinese, Vietnamese, Japanese and Korean. Pakistanis and Bangladeshis are majority Muslims.

As are Malaysians, Indonesians, Augie. Scratch an Australian and their definition of what constitutes an "Asian" leaves two thirds of the continent out. Scratch a Britisher and they include about another third. Asia stretches from Turkey to the Bering Strait. You cannot claim one thing and leave out the rest of it because it doesn't suit you, Augie. Roll Eyes

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Brian Ross

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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #54 - Jan 9^th, 2018 at 4:15pm

Auggie wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 11:10pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

Well, who's fault is that? The Muslim migrants or the French authorities? When they were desperate for factory fodder, they welcomed the Muslim migrants. When factories closed, and competition became more fierce they turned on the most recent migrants. The Germans have long been antagonistic towards their Turkish "guest workers".

It's the fault of the French authorities for having such an immigration policy.

Perhaps it is but they had one and they now have Muslims in their country. You can deport them all back to where they came from except of course for the French citizens, which is about four fifths of their number. Or are you one of those people who thinks citizenship is optional?

Quote:

No, I'm saying that the percentage of Muslims in American is 0.9%, whether they're homegrown or not. The lesser the number, the easier it is to integrate migrants.

Funny, I always understood "migrants" came from another country. "Homegrown" means they were born American citizens. So much for citizenship it seems.

Quote:

Really? Sydney is a cosmopolitan society. I doubt that this is the case. It ultimately comes down to numbers, and to the fact that there is a dangerous ideology out there, which is encouraging people not to integrate into society.

Sydney is reluctantly a cosmopolitan society, Augie. As I've pointed out, they didn't like the Indochinese when they first arrived. They don't like the Muslims. They didn't like the Italians/Greeks/Serbs/Croats/Bosnians either. Starting to see a pattern yet? They didn't like the Catholics, the Eastern Orthodox, the Copts... Seeing the patter yet? Anything at all?

Quote:

It does matter. Completely ignoring the historical development of a nation is ignorance. Of course, it's wrong when a Muslim gets a dirty look or is discriminated against. It's also true that many Muslims support terrorism, and hold pernicious beliefs about women and minorities.

Quote:

I'm integrated because I speak English with an Australian accent; am loyal to King and country; was baptised an Anglican, and support core liberal values. I'm fully integrated.

"King and country"? Well, we haven't had a King for what sixty odd years. So you don't appear that integrated. To me, you sound integrated but to Herbie, you're still a "Johnny-Foreigner". To him and his cohorts, you're a migrant. Tsk, tsk. Why should we accept your word, hey?

BTW, how do you measure "integration"? Is there a scale? Roll Eyes

Quote:

Did I say anything about clothing? I said it was about 'values' and 'beliefs'. A person can dress as a Muslim but believe in separation of church of state; just as the opposite can occur.

Separation of church and state is non-negotiable in Australia, and all migrants and citizens should support the secular state.

You better take that up with Tone Rabbit. He seems to disagree with you. Tsk, tsk. Does that make him "unAustralian"?

I agree, in part, with your comment but as our system is set up to separate Church and State - indeed most Australians don't even believe in God and wouldn't know what the Church was on about... Roll Eyes

Quote:

No, because there are less of them.

To the bigoted, numbers are meaningless. We presenting have less than 4% who are Muslim. Yet, according to some who post here we are about to be taken over by Muslims. Roll Eyes

Quote:

Second, I never said anything about killing Muslims. I have friends who are Muslims. I'm simply recognising the danger of the ideology of Islamism. You're burying your head in the sand about the reality that values and beliefs have on actions.

No, I am pointing out what the opponents of Multiculturalism say about it and Immigrants, Augie. As they appear to be ignoring you, it seems to fall to me to be a Devil's Advocate...

Quote:

You're misquoting me. I never said that the majority support terrorism; I said that a large minority do. It's about degree. There's a huge difference between 0.1% about 10%. As I said it didn't take 51% of Germans for the Nazis to come into power; but a significant minority in German at the time did support Nazism, and this was enough for them to have power.

I would say that around 1 in 10 Muslims around the world support terrorism, and that's being conservative.

I would suggest that I am not "misquoting" you as reacting to what you have said, Augie. A "large minority" in my book must constitute up to about 49%. To you, it appears to be a statistically insignificant figure of about 10%. I'd actually say the active supporters of Terrorism world wide would be half that. In Australia, I would suggest that they constitute about a tenth of that (ie, about 1%). Roll Eyes

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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti Reply #55 - Jan 9^th, 2018 at 4:32pm there you go.... bwian lives in fantasy land...
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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #56 - Jan 9^th, 2018 at 4:53pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9^th, 2018 at 3:58pm:

Auggie wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 11:10pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 8^th, 2018 at 3:29pm:

Secondly, you have no understanding of the problems that Asian migrants have had in Europe - the Indians, the Pakistanis, the Bangladeshis, etc.

When I said Asians, I was referring to those of East Asian background such as Chinese, Vietnamese, Japanese and Korean. Pakistanis and Bangladeshis are majority Muslims.

As are Malaysians, Indonesians, Augie. Scratch an Australian and their definition of what constitutes an "Asian" leaves two thirds of the continent out. Scratch a Britisher and they include about another third. Asia stretches from Turkey to the Bering Strait. You cannot claim one thing and leave out the rest of it because it doesn't suit you, Augie. Roll Eyes

Next time I'll be sure to put East in front of Asian.

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Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti
Reply #57 - Jan 9^th, 2018 at 5:00pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9^th, 2018 at 4:15pm:

Perhaps it is but they had one and they now have Muslims in their country. You can deport them all back to where they came from except of course for the French citizens, which is about four fifths of their number. Or are you one of those people who thinks citizenship is optional?

No, citizens shouldn't be deported. Happy?

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9^th, 2018 at 4:15pm:

Funny, I always understood "migrants" came from another country. "Homegrown" means they were born American citizens. So much for citizenship it seems.

Well, most Muslims would be migrants or children of migrants, given that America is predominately Christian. Makes sense, lots of?

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9^th, 2018 at 4:15pm:

ell, we haven't had a King for what sixty odd years. So you don't appear that integrated. To me, you sound integrated but to Herbie, you're still a "Johnny-Foreigner". To him and his cohorts, you're a migrant. Tsk, tsk. Why should we accept your word, hey?

And we will have a King in the next decade or so, so I will be integrated, if that helps??

Well, if Herbie thinks I'm a foreigner then that's his problem, not mine. And you shouldn't be listening to people who say things like that. They can't see the grey areas, you see.

Well, you can accept my word, or not. Up to you. Just because I'm the son of migrants, do you expect me to be in favour of multiculturalism and non-integration??? So, am I a race-traitor now, an Uncle Tom??

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9^th, 2018 at 4:15pm:

BTW, how do you measure "integration"? Is there a scale?

Sure, you must believe in liberal values; they are:

1) separation of church of state;
2) freedom of speech;
3) equality for women;
4) equality for minorities;
5) freedom to practise your religion without fear of violence.

Next, you should be 'Australian-first, then whatever after.

You should be able to communicate with the broader community; but you don't have to English as well as I can. And I speak English better than most 'white' Australians.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9^th, 2018 at 4:15pm:

You better take that up with Tone Rabbit. He seems to disagree with you. Tsk, tsk. Does that make him "unAustralian"?

Tone Abbot is not against separation of church and state. If you think he is, how so??

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 9^th, 2018 at 4:15pm:

n part, with your comment but as our system is set up to separate Church and State - indeed most Australians don't even believe in God and wouldn't know what the Church was on about...

What part don't you agree with?

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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti Reply #58 - Jan 16^th, 2018 at 7:50am You are wasting your time with this fool Auggie... in over 2 decades he hasn't changed his mind one little bit... he lies, obfuscates, dissembles and is a disingenuous prat. Surely you've figured this out by now.
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Lord Herbert Gold Member Offline Posts: 34441 Gender:	Re: Survey: most Aussies want to ban multiculticulti Reply #59 - Jan 16^th, 2018 at 8:33am And frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn if it's racist to say I'm tired of reading about *Blacks on the Rampage* down there in Melbourne.
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