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The West's demographic suicide (Read 1579 times)
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #45 - Jan 3rd, 2018 at 6:41pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 4:49pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 3:58pm:
You are probably too old to care because you are probably researching ways to spend your retirement. But I and anyone 15 years old than myself and those younger than me, are getting burdened with the consequences of your generation trying to show the world that you are not racist by importing anyone from anywhere without any thought of how they impact Australia. I think Australia has a much better quarantine program to eliminate undesirable species from entering this country and creating havoc. Why import people who have no desire to contribute to Australia, sit on welfare, commit crimes and antisocial behaviour, and try to encourage the rest of Australia to import more of their kind. That is neither a racist assumption, nor a fear or hatred of other cultures belief.


I have no intentions of retiring for many years.   I grew up in the sixties.  I came to adulthood in the late seventies.   I cannot understand what is so hard today for the youngsters.   All they need is drive and ambition.  If you lack those things, society will still care for you.  Can't afford a house in Sydney?  Move out of Sydney.  Go to a regional centre or another capital city.   Work hard, buy a flat.  Sell the flat.  Buy a house.  Simples really.  Sydney is a crappy place anyway.   See the rest of the country.  Who knows, you might meet real people and enjoy their company.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes

Very true.
Sydney city is lovely and buzzy and beautiful but the sea of suburbia around it is totally overrated. Move out if you can and visit for a week once or twice a year, if you must.

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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #46 - Jan 3rd, 2018 at 7:42pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 5:41pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 5:22pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 5:14pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 3:55pm:
I think there is a double standard you show in your posts that contradict one another.




Australians, of all colours, all "races", all ethnicities,  are still Australians.   We all belong to the one country - Australia.   We all swear allegiance to this country.  We become Australians.   All Australians, good, bad, ugly, are Australians.  The days of the White Australia Policy are over, dead, buried, except it seems in the imaginations of Racists and Xenophobes.    Australia is a multicultural society, a multiracial one, a multireligious one, as well.   Time to live with that fact and stop telling yourselves lies.   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


That's only in the big cities Brian. In the bush the "White Australia Policy" is still alive ... and we love it that way out here. It's peaceful and tranquil, it's friendly and co-operative when we need things done, we understand each other perfectly when we converse and the Aussie sense of humour is also still alive. What we don't want or need is black Africans, Indians, Pakis, Asians and muslims stuffing it all up

If it ain't broke, don't try and fix it


95% of the Australian population lives in cities.   Time to climb out of the 1950s and live in the 21st century.  The "White Australia Policy" was finally overturned by Gough Whitlam.  We are no-longer a White monoculture.  Time to face facts.  Not live in your fantasy world.   Rural Australians are the most welcoming people I have met,  they don't care about the colour of a person's skin or what culture they practise any more than the overwhelming majority of Australians do.    Roll Eyes

Actually Holt and the Libs overturned and set in train the end of the white Australia policy and It was not until the Fraser Liberal government's review of immigration law in 1978 that all selection of prospective migrants based on country of origin was entirely removed from official policy.

Very recently bwian the media have been extolling Holts virtues and they said he brought the policy to an end.  i think you will find I am more correct than you.
As usual.
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #47 - Jan 3rd, 2018 at 8:56pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 5:41pm:
Bias_2012 wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 5:22pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 5:14pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 3:55pm:
I think there is a double standard you show in your posts that contradict one another.




Australians, of all colours, all "races", all ethnicities,  are still Australians.   We all belong to the one country - Australia.   We all swear allegiance to this country.  We become Australians.   All Australians, good, bad, ugly, are Australians.  The days of the White Australia Policy are over, dead, buried, except it seems in the imaginations of Racists and Xenophobes.    Australia is a multicultural society, a multiracial one, a multireligious one, as well.   Time to live with that fact and stop telling yourselves lies.   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


That's only in the big cities Brian. In the bush the "White Australia Policy" is still alive ... and we love it that way out here. It's peaceful and tranquil, it's friendly and co-operative when we need things done, we understand each other perfectly when we converse and the Aussie sense of humour is also still alive. What we don't want or need is black Africans, Indians, Pakis, Asians and muslims stuffing it all up

If it ain't broke, don't try and fix it


95% of the Australian population lives in cities.   Time to climb out of the 1950s and live in the 21st century.  The "White Australia Policy" was finally overturned by Gough Whitlam.  We are no-longer a White monoculture.  Time to face facts.  Not live in your fantasy world.   Rural Australians are the most welcoming people I have met,  they don't care about the colour of a person's skin or what culture they practise any more than the overwhelming majority of Australians do.    Roll Eyes




If it ain't broke, don't try and fix it
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #48 - Jan 3rd, 2018 at 9:48pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 4:36pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 3:58pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 5:14pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 3:55pm:
I think there is a double standard you show in your posts that contradict one another.


An interesting claim.  Care to produce proof where I have contradicted myself, WS?


Let's do this the old fashion way --- Thank you for accepting that you show a double standard in your post that contradict one another.


I accept your claim?  Where?  Please, if you really want to do this the traditional way, you need to prove I contradict myself.  tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


A little slow, are you Brian? You have accepted that I claimed you contradict yourself in posts by asking me to further validate my claim against you with proof. In the everyday world, accepting that your opponent has a point by asking him to "prove it" does validate your opponent's claim against you. You have accepted that someone has a valid point against you because you think that asking for proof puts the burden on someone that you have just validated with asking for evidence.

The burden of proof is upon the person making the assertion. But if you validate their assertion asking them to provide evidence, then it is the same as saying "That's interesting. Please continue with your critique of me". Going on about asking people to prove their cases against you and then finishing with a "tsk tsk" ad hominem, makes you sound like you have nothing to respond to an effective debate. It also makes you seem, informally, like some desperate troll. Looking to pick a fight whilst using deflection seems to be your main strategy.

Could I implore you to try a different approach to your monotonous auto-responder responses by simply denying that someone has said something true? "There is no evidence that I have contradicted myself" may be an acceptable response. A strong response might be "That is not true". THEN the onus goes back on the opponent to prove his case. I can't be bothered going through your posts to find something in one forum topic that contradicts a post in another forum topic. If I did, then I would have wasted some valuable reading time.
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #49 - Jan 3rd, 2018 at 10:34pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 4:45pm:
Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Really?  And I was always taught that the reason why people in the Third World have large families was because there was no social security system to care for them in their old age and instead they relied upon the brood to do it for them.   I know of no country, with an adequate social security system where large families are encouraged.  Indeed, I don't know of any society where large families are encouraged, period.  They occur because there is no social security system and because of a lack of contraception methods which are cheap and easily affordable.   Until you can produce evidence, otherwise, I think I'll just ignore your claims.


Um.... Brian? You do understand the concept of conception, don't you? In basic terms, it is when a man sticks his erect phallus into the vagina of a woman to stimulate both male and female in that copulation. At some point after, usually between 5 minutes and 50 minutes after the initial copulation, the male normally starts having misogynistic thoughts quickly ruminate through his head about how he wants to dominate his female partner he is having sex with, and then he grunts as a result of spasms from his ejaculations whilst erupting semen out his phallus and into the vagina and uterus of his female. Sometimes the male collapses onto his female in triumph of what he considered a good sexual encounter. Other times, the female gets off of him after she thinks he is done. A few times, the male walks off to find a tap with running water to wash the mace that had previously been sprayed into his face by his 'mate'. And then there are those that just say "Okay, I'm done. Get dressed and get out. Here's $20. Do you want me to call you a taxi?".

But in any event, there is rarely much planning that the baby-making department unless the couple are really planning on having the child. I would surmise that most conceptions universally are unplanned, and are the result of the man wanting to satiate his primal instincts.

In the third world, they have a largely male-dominated society that determines a large amount of how society runs. If a guy wants to have sex with his girlfriend or wife, he is not going to take "No" for an answer. Then you get those unwanted pregnancies amongst those that were wanted. It is very common for African societies where women have 5 to 10 children per family. Though, you would find today's average to be around 5 to 6, it is still a large number of children to have. And as such being an African society, these people do not plan for old age. Heck, even recently, old age is 50 years of age where you die of some preventable disease. But I digress. When someone does reach a time when they are too old to hunt or gather food, then they are basically on their death beds. Because there is no such thing as retirement in third world countries, you keep doing what you can until you can't. Even those infertile old ladies who did not have children -- they keep busy until people notice that they have not been around. Eventually, they will discover the smell.

Social security? Even that concept is about 70 to 80 years old in Australia. But do keep that in mind when you are retired. Because as fewer and fewer Australians are available to keep paying the taxes from their income and buying products with goods and services taxes... it won't be fast food workers, centrelink recipients, and taxi drivers feeding your old age.

Quote:
As for what happens when they arrive in Western societies, they get the aspirational bug - they want the cars, the tvs, the houses, the big fancy schools for their kids and so on and so on.   Just like the society that surrounds them.  Their birthrates rapidly fall to that of the surrounding society.   How inconsiderate of them, hey?   Roll Eyes


They get bored by big tv screens, cars, and what is in big houses, because they can't afford to buy them. Then they go for the thefts, like the Apex gangs. Genuine migrants work whatever job they had lined up for them. Others work whatever job they have available -- and work to survive before they work to keep up with the Jones'. But we seem to be missing the refugees, and the few migrants that have no appreciation for what they have. Those entitlement refugees. I bet many of them would rather 90% of Australia be Middle Eastern, African, Indian, Pakistani, or whatever their cultural background be.
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #50 - Jan 3rd, 2018 at 10:47pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 4:49pm:
I have no intentions of retiring for many years.   I grew up in the sixties.  I came to adulthood in the late seventies.   I cannot understand what is so hard today for the youngsters.   All they need is drive and ambition.  If you lack those things, society will still care for you.  Can't afford a house in Sydney?  Move out of Sydney.  Go to a regional centre or another capital city.   Work hard, buy a flat.  Sell the flat.  Buy a house.  Simples really.  Sydney is a crappy place anyway.   See the rest of the country.  Who knows, you might meet real people and enjoy their company.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


I have no intention of moving out of my quiet, regional town of Rockhampton. I am quite happy with the gentle nature of the environment, and even the redneck to sophisticated people whom I live, play and work. My house I live in is either going to be given to me in an inheritance or bought for the price of a cheap song, seeing that the house's value is not much more than Tay Allyn's "Mass Text" song.

The reason us Generation Xers are complaining about our state of affairs is because we are having to deal with our adulthoods competing with casual workers. I am a casual worker. I think that any fulltime job available to me would be snapped up in no time. Baby Boomers grew up in a time of free university education, plentiful employment, and a relatively safe environment. If modern young adults had that kind of deal, we too would be less pessimistic about our futures. Ergo, the reason why I am motivated to be a realist in this forum topic.
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #51 - Jan 4th, 2018 at 5:00pm
 
“‘
Diversity’ is where once functioning societies go to die
,” observes Mark Steyn, who presents evidence for this in a brilliantly creative and possibly soon to be outlawed form.

Please enjoy, if that’s the right word.
https://www.steynonline.com/8364/welcome-to-the-new-year-same-as-the-old


An eight o'clock curfew
Seven sexual assailants
Six stabbers arrested
Five homes raided
Four women gang-raped
Three pubs attacked
Two police officers lynched
and a canceled New Year in Sydney




"Diversity" is where once functioning societies go to die. But who ya gonna believe - the official happy-talk or your acid-scarred eyes??


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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #52 - Jan 4th, 2018 at 5:17pm
 
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 9:48pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 4:36pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 3:58pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 5:14pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 3:55pm:
I think there is a double standard you show in your posts that contradict one another.


An interesting claim.  Care to produce proof where I have contradicted myself, WS?


Let's do this the old fashion way --- Thank you for accepting that you show a double standard in your post that contradict one another.


I accept your claim?  Where?  Please, if you really want to do this the traditional way, you need to prove I contradict myself.  tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


A little slow, are you Brian? You have accepted that I claimed you contradict yourself in posts by asking me to further validate my claim against you with proof. In the everyday world, accepting that your opponent has a point by asking him to "prove it" does validate your opponent's claim against you. You have accepted that someone has a valid point against you because you think that asking for proof puts the burden on someone that you have just validated with asking for evidence.


Actually, what I am doing is rejecting your claim, you need to prove it.  You have thus far failed dismally to do so.  Keep trying, though, it is amusing to watch as your flounder.   Roll Eyes

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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #53 - Jan 4th, 2018 at 5:27pm
 
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 10:34pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 4:45pm:
Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Really?  And I was always taught that the reason why people in the Third World have large families was because there was no social security system to care for them in their old age and instead they relied upon the brood to do it for them.   I know of no country, with an adequate social security system where large families are encouraged.  Indeed, I don't know of any society where large families are encouraged, period.  They occur because there is no social security system and because of a lack of contraception methods which are cheap and easily affordable.   Until you can produce evidence, otherwise, I think I'll just ignore your claims.


Um.... Brian? You do understand the concept of conception, don't you?


Yes, thanks.  I have had three children with my wife.  I think I understand the process.   Roll Eyes

Quote:
But in any event, there is rarely much planning that the baby-making department unless the couple are really planning on having the child. I would surmise that most conceptions universally are unplanned, and are the result of the man wanting to satiate his primal instincts.


To a certain extent, I agree with you but in Western societies, it is accepted that women have a choice to refuse the advances of any man, legally, if necessary.  It is otherwise considered rape.   Even amongst Muslims in Australia, women have the right to say, "no!"  If they so desire.   If the man does not accept that choice, he can be charged with rape.

Quote:
In the third world...


We are not discussing the Third World.  We are discussing Australian society.  So your attempts at how Third World societies operate can be ignored.  Tsk, tsk. 

Quote:
Social security? Even that concept is about 70 to 80 years old in Australia. But do keep that in mind when you are retired. Because as fewer and fewer Australians are available to keep paying the taxes from their income and buying products with goods and services taxes... it won't be fast food workers, centrelink recipients, and taxi drivers feeding your old age.


The concept is actually over a hundred years old in Australia.  We were the first to introduce Widows' pensions, aged pensions, unemployment benefits and so on.   We led the world for the first half of the 20th century in that regard.  So, please don't try and lecture me about social security in Australia.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes

Quote:
Quote:
As for what happens when they arrive in Western societies, they get the aspirational bug - they want the cars, the tvs, the houses, the big fancy schools for their kids and so on and so on.   Just like the society that surrounds them.  Their birthrates rapidly fall to that of the surrounding society.   How inconsiderate of them, hey?   Roll Eyes


They get bored by big tv screens, cars, and what is in big houses, because they can't afford to buy them. Then they go for the thefts, like the Apex gangs. Genuine migrants work whatever job they had lined up for them. Others work whatever job they have available -- and work to survive before they work to keep up with the Jones'. But we seem to be missing the refugees, and the few migrants that have no appreciation for what they have. Those entitlement refugees. I bet many of them would rather 90% of Australia be Middle Eastern, African, Indian, Pakistani, or whatever their cultural background be.


Oh, dear, oh, dearie, me.  What happens is that when they arrive, they become all aspirational.  They seek employment, they find it and they work bloody hard to get all the things they want.  Their children, OTOH, often fail to adapt, to find work and fall into crime, drugs and so on.  The Apex Gang is just the latest development.  In 1950s, we had the Sharpies and the Wedgies and then the various Italian/Greek/Serbian/Croat/Bosnian gangs, then the Indochinese gangs.   The point is, they all grow up, they move on.  Some remained locked into a life of crime and drugs, the majority don't.   They become aspirational, they find work, they work bloody hard, they save and buy the things they desire.   It is quite simple, really.   Tsk, tsk.    Roll Eyes
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #54 - Jan 4th, 2018 at 5:29pm
 
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 10:47pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 4:49pm:
I have no intentions of retiring for many years.   I grew up in the sixties.  I came to adulthood in the late seventies.   I cannot understand what is so hard today for the youngsters.   All they need is drive and ambition.  If you lack those things, society will still care for you.  Can't afford a house in Sydney?  Move out of Sydney.  Go to a regional centre or another capital city.   Work hard, buy a flat.  Sell the flat.  Buy a house.  Simples really.  Sydney is a crappy place anyway.   See the rest of the country.  Who knows, you might meet real people and enjoy their company.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


I have no intention of moving out of my quiet, regional town of Rockhampton. I am quite happy with the gentle nature of the environment, and even the redneck to sophisticated people whom I live, play and work. My house I live in is either going to be given to me in an inheritance or bought for the price of a cheap song, seeing that the house's value is not much more than Tay Allyn's "Mass Text" song.

The reason us Generation Xers are complaining about our state of affairs is because we are having to deal with our adulthoods competing with casual workers. I am a casual worker. I think that any fulltime job available to me would be snapped up in no time. Baby Boomers grew up in a time of free university education, plentiful employment, and a relatively safe environment. If modern young adults had that kind of deal, we too would be less pessimistic about our futures. Ergo, the reason why I am motivated to be a realist in this forum topic.



Take it up with the Government which has encouraged the spread of casualisation of the workforce.   I have not been in favour of the ending of free education, the casualisation of the workforce, any of it.  However, it appears the majority of voters don't care about it.    Roll Eyes
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #55 - Jan 4th, 2018 at 8:16pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 4th, 2018 at 5:27pm:
We are not discussing the Third World.  We are discussing Australian society.  So your attempts at how Third World societies operate can be ignored.  Tsk, tsk. 




We are letting in a lot of Third World people and tell them to maintain their cultures and values.  And so, as everyone notices, there are more and more Third World values and habits in Australia.  Third World immigrants do not transform themselves when they go through customs, they do not leave the third world at the border. They bring it in, they cultivate it, they are encouraged to do so.

So I'm afraid we are discussing the Third World if/when we are discussing immigration on a large scale from the Third World, it cannot be avoided, the discussion.








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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #56 - Jan 4th, 2018 at 8:46pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 4th, 2018 at 5:17pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 9:48pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 4:36pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 3rd, 2018 at 3:58pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 5:14pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 1st, 2018 at 3:55pm:
I think there is a double standard you show in your posts that contradict one another.


An interesting claim.  Care to produce proof where I have contradicted myself, WS?


Let's do this the old fashion way --- Thank you for accepting that you show a double standard in your post that contradict one another.


I accept your claim?  Where?  Please, if you really want to do this the traditional way, you need to prove I contradict myself.  tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


A little slow, are you Brian? You have accepted that I claimed you contradict yourself in posts by asking me to further validate my claim against you with proof. In the everyday world, accepting that your opponent has a point by asking him to "prove it" does validate your opponent's claim against you. You have accepted that someone has a valid point against you because you think that asking for proof puts the burden on someone that you have just validated with asking for evidence.


Actually, what I am doing is rejecting your claim, you need to prove it.  You have thus far failed dismally to do so.  Keep trying, though, it is amusing to watch as your flounder.   Roll Eyes


You fell on your sword accepting my position by asking me to reinforce my point with proof. Ask any reputable lawyer, and he will put you in your place by making you agree with me about the rules of burden of proof.
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #57 - Jan 4th, 2018 at 9:28pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 4th, 2018 at 5:27pm:
Yes, thanks.  I have had three children with my wife.  I think I understand the process.   Roll Eyes


I have had several with 4 different women. All 4 women apiece want another child with me. So, I am also guilty of fecklessly fathering children without much thought of consequences. But, apart from one son now disowned, none of my children have grown up to become antisocial nuisances. I can't say the same about people from overseas who come here from antisocial cultures and think that they have the right to impose their criminal culture on Australia and get away with it.

Quote:
To a certain extent, I agree with you but in Western societies, it is accepted that women have a choice to refuse the advances of any man, legally, if necessary.  It is otherwise considered rape.   Even amongst Muslims in Australia, women have the right to say, "no!"  If they so desire.   If the man does not accept that choice, he can be charged with rape.


This is where you seem to show naivete. There are certain people in all cultures that show a blatant disregard for women's rights. The right to be refused sex, but unable to accept that. But you will find that women in western cultures are more likely to succeed in refusing sex, compared to most non-western cultured people. Even in Australia, if you hold misogynistic beliefs, some women refusing sex with you will end up bashed, raped and in some extreme cases, murdered. That is the unfortunate reality, rape charges be damned.

Quote:
In the third world...


[quote="Brian"]We are not discussing the Third World.  We are discussing Australian society.  So your attempts at how Third World societies operate can be ignored.  Tsk, tsk. [/quote]

It matters when women in the third world are considered baby factories, and are part of the reason why third world surplus populations are headed to Australia, for example. We are discussing the "West's" demographic suicide. High birthrates caused by women who have pregnancies from men wanting to get their jollies and reinforce their dominance, it will lead to overcrowded unwanted people running away from their problems, and trying to make their excess families our problems.

Quote:
The concept is actually over a hundred years old in Australia.  We were the first to introduce Widows' pensions, aged pensions, unemployment benefits and so on.   We led the world for the first half of the 20th century in that regard.  So, please don't try and lecture me about social security in Australia.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


Not a worry. But you can imagine that the third world does not generally have that kind of safety net for unemployed and retired. You retire when you die. And if you dare retire, you die. Even 50 years ago, people were dying on average mostly before they turned 80. Living to 100 years was a very rare occurrence. People could have retired by 60 and died by 70. That trend seems to be making a comeback as more and more people die from obesity and diabetic related illnesses/conditions.

Quote:
Oh, dear, oh, dearie, me.  What happens is that when they arrive, they become all aspirational.  They seek employment, they find it and they work bloody hard to get all the things they want.  Their children, OTOH, often fail to adapt, to find work and fall into crime, drugs and so on.  The Apex Gang is just the latest development.  In 1950s, we had the Sharpies and the Wedgies and then the various Italian/Greek/Serbian/Croat/Bosnian gangs, then the Indochinese gangs.   The point is, they all grow up, they move on.  Some remained locked into a life of crime and drugs, the majority don't.   They become aspirational, they find work, they work bloody hard, they save and buy the things they desire.   It is quite simple, really.   Tsk, tsk.    Roll Eyes


People will do enough to survive. For me, I was lucky enough to get a house that my relative own and pay little rent and little in terms of expenses. The only thing expected is that I keep the house in order and clean. I work in a casual job that could be giving me work hours anywhere between 10 and 30 hours. It has been over 2 years since I last worked over 30 hours for a week. I am required to search out 20 jobs a month, attend job network interviews every month, do TAFE, and that is it. Apart from 10 hours a week on this forum, I basically have 90 hours to spare for the week (50 of those being for sleep). I consider myself a lazy person, until I am given something to do.

But even the Centrelink people and my job network member do not consider me a burden because I work and earn my welfare supplemental income through mutual obligations. It is the people that sit around and do nothing with their lives and get paid twice as much welfare as I do that are the problem. If every loafing welfare recipient did as much work that I did, Australia would save billions in welfare costs. It is not about being aspirational. It is about survival. Nothing more. People will only become aspirational if they have a goal. Otherwise, they will sit on their behinds and do the minimum amount to alleviate their boredom or whatever they need to survive.
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Frank
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #58 - Jan 12th, 2018 at 7:58am
 
Katharine Betts and Bob Birrell,  26 October 2017
Australia’s population grew by a massive 384,000 in the year to March 2017, some 217,000, or 60 per cent, of which was due to net overseas migration.

Immigration is the dynamic factor in this population surge, reflecting a record high permanent migration program and generous settings for temporary-entry visas.

The consequences are becoming obvious and are being reflected in increased public concern about quality of life and questions concerning ethnic diversity.

The Australian Population Research Institute (TAPRI) commissioned a national survey of Australian voters in August 2017 to assess the extent of this concern and its causes.

The survey found that 74 per cent of voters thought that Australia does not need more people, with big majorities believing that that population growth was putting ‘a lot of pressure’ on hospitals, roads, affordable housing and jobs.

Most voters were also worried about the consequences of growing ethnic diversity. Forty-eight per cent supported a partial ban on Muslim immigration to Australia, with only 25 per cent in opposition to such a ban.

Despite these demographic pressures and discontents, Australia’s political and economic elites are disdainful of them and have ignored them. They see high immigration as part of their commitment to the globalisation of Australia’s economy and society and thus it is not to be questioned.

Elites elsewhere in the developed world hold similar values, but have had to retreat because of public opposition. Across Europe 15 to 20 per cent of voters currently support anti-immigration political parties.

Our review of elite opinion in Australia shows that here they think they can ignore public concerns. This is because their main source of information about public opinion on the issue, the Scanlon Foundation, has consistently reported that most Australians support their immigration and cultural diversity policies.

How could Australia be so different from other Western countries? It has long been argued, including by the Scanlon Foundation, that Australians were insulated from the economic shocks of the Global Financial Crisis in 2008-2009. This means that we have a lower share of angry ‘left behinds’ than in Europe and the US, that is, people suffering from economic stress who can be mobilised around an anti-immigration banner.

This is why Labor’s shadow Deputy Treasurer, Andrew Leigh, can assert that Australian attitudes to migrants are warm and ‘becoming warmer over time’ and that ‘there is solid support for the principle of non-discrimination’. It is also why, according to prominent writer David Marr, ‘more than almost any people on earth, we are happy for migrants to come in big numbers’.

The TAPRI survey refutes these findings. It shows that 74 per cent of voters believe that Australia does not need more people and that, at the time of the survey, 54 per cent wanted a reduction in the migrant intake. This includes 57 per cent of Liberal voters and 46 per cent of Labor voters. This result is far higher than the 34 per cent of respondents wanting a lower migrant intake reported in the last Scanlon survey (in July-August 2016).

Australian voters’ concern about immigration levels and ethnic diversity does not derive from economic adversity. Rather it stems from the increasingly obvious impact of population growth on their quality of life and the rapid change in Australia’s ethnic and religious make-up.

Such is the extent of these concerns that they could readily be mobilised in an electoral context by One Nation or any other party with a similar agenda, should such a party be able to mount a national campaign. If this occurs, the Liberal Party is likely to be the main loser.

The full text of the report is here.
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Grendel
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Re: The West's demographic suicide
Reply #59 - Jan 12th, 2018 at 4:50pm
 
Elites Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
Who needs them.
Right bwian oh Dr of Divinity... Cheesy
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