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The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court. (Read 15646 times)
freediver
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #150 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:11pm
 
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 3:18pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 2:13pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 12:42pm:
I used an example of a private enterprise refusing to provide services to minorities that covers your proposition....A shop owner refusing to serve a minority is not respect unless it is respect for everyone's right to be a bigot....You are proposing a General Store in a country town can refuse to serve Aborigines not because they have done anything wrong just because of the colour of their skin....You are proposing we set back the civil rights movement 50 years why, because gay people can get married and you think this is a small way to continue the persecution or is their a more sinister motive???

Huh Huh Huh


Phil you keep completely ignoring the facts of the case. He was more than happy to serve the gay couple. He was not prepared to create a particular customised product for them.


Errr....I was responding to another posters comment???

Huh Huh Huh

If you make custom cakes on request you have no legal basis to refuse anyone....Whom do you propose people should be allowed to discriminate against FD and on what basis???

Huh Huh Huh


Of course you have a right to refuse. A good legal basis is that you do not sell the particular product they are asking for.
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Setanta
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #151 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:23pm
 
Phil, would a factory that could make any latex product you choose be liable if they refused to take your order to make dildos? The owner of the factory may not like making dildos, even while they can, because dykes use them. Is that OK?
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philperth2010
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #152 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 10:58pm
 
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:23pm:
Phil, would a factory that could make any latex product you choose be liable if they refused to take your order to make dildos? The owner of the factory may not like making dildos, even while they can, because dykes use them. Is that OK?


Yes of course....You could force any company to make any product line you dictate!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
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Setanta
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #153 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:00pm
 
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 10:58pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:23pm:
Phil, would a factory that could make any latex product you choose be liable if they refused to take your order to make dildos? The owner of the factory may not like making dildos, even while they can, because dykes use them. Is that OK?


Yes of course....You could force any company to make any product line you dictate!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Don't you see a cake shop as a factory for making cakes?
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philperth2010
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #154 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:02pm
 
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:11pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 3:18pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 2:13pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 12:42pm:
I used an example of a private enterprise refusing to provide services to minorities that covers your proposition....A shop owner refusing to serve a minority is not respect unless it is respect for everyone's right to be a bigot....You are proposing a General Store in a country town can refuse to serve Aborigines not because they have done anything wrong just because of the colour of their skin....You are proposing we set back the civil rights movement 50 years why, because gay people can get married and you think this is a small way to continue the persecution or is their a more sinister motive???

Huh Huh Huh


Phil you keep completely ignoring the facts of the case. He was more than happy to serve the gay couple. He was not prepared to create a particular customised product for them.


Errr....I was responding to another posters comment???

Huh Huh Huh

If you make custom cakes on request you have no legal basis to refuse anyone....Whom do you propose people should be allowed to discriminate against FD and on what basis???

Huh Huh Huh


Of course you have a right to refuse. A good legal basis is that you do not sell the particular product they are asking for.


Yes as I have been saying all along....However the baker in question never even found out what product he was refusing to provide....The ruling on this case should be interesting???

Huh Huh Huh
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
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philperth2010
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #155 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:06pm
 
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:00pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 10:58pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:23pm:
Phil, would a factory that could make any latex product you choose be liable if they refused to take your order to make dildos? The owner of the factory may not like making dildos, even while they can, because dykes use them. Is that OK?


Yes of course....You could force any company to make any product line you dictate!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Don't you see a cake shop as a factory for making cakes?


You are joking right....Does the factory make custom cakes to order???

Huh Huh Huh

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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
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Setanta
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #156 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:11pm
 
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:06pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:00pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 10:58pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:23pm:
Phil, would a factory that could make any latex product you choose be liable if they refused to take your order to make dildos? The owner of the factory may not like making dildos, even while they can, because dykes use them. Is that OK?


Yes of course....You could force any company to make any product line you dictate!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Don't you see a cake shop as a factory for making cakes?


You are joking right....Does the factory make custom cakes to order???

Huh Huh Huh



What? You just said you can't order a manufacturer to make a particular product that they are equipped to make and in the material the manufacturer say he can make in any shape so why must a cake manufacturer be help to a different standard?
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philperth2010
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #157 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:14pm
 
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:11pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:06pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:00pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 10:58pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:23pm:
Phil, would a factory that could make any latex product you choose be liable if they refused to take your order to make dildos? The owner of the factory may not like making dildos, even while they can, because dykes use them. Is that OK?


Yes of course....You could force any company to make any product line you dictate!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Don't you see a cake shop as a factory for making cakes?


You are joking right....Does the factory make custom cakes to order???

Huh Huh Huh



What? You just said you can't order a manufacturer to make a particular product that they are equipped to make and in the material the manufacturer say he can make in any shape so why must a cake manufacturer be help to a different standard?


Bullshit....Read my response again and apologise!!!

You could go to Boeing and force them to build you a submarine especially if you are gay!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
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Setanta
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #158 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:17pm
 
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:14pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:11pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:06pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:00pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 10:58pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:23pm:
Phil, would a factory that could make any latex product you choose be liable if they refused to take your order to make dildos? The owner of the factory may not like making dildos, even while they can, because dykes use them. Is that OK?


Yes of course....You could force any company to make any product line you dictate!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Don't you see a cake shop as a factory for making cakes?


You are joking right....Does the factory make custom cakes to order???

Huh Huh Huh



What? You just said you can't order a manufacturer to make a particular product that they are equipped to make and in the material the manufacturer say he can make in any shape so why must a cake manufacturer be help to a different standard?


Bullshit....Read my response again and apologise!!!

You could go to Boeing and force them to build you a submarine especially if you are gay!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


No need to take that tone with me Brian, I know what I said, I suggest you reread. I never said the factory makes cakes, I said it specialises in making products from latex in any form the customer wants.

edit: You said it was OK for such a manufacturer to turn down that order. I'm asking what is the difference between that and cake, besides the materials.
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philperth2010
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #159 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:23pm
 
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:17pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:14pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:11pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:06pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:00pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 10:58pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:23pm:
Phil, would a factory that could make any latex product you choose be liable if they refused to take your order to make dildos? The owner of the factory may not like making dildos, even while they can, because dykes use them. Is that OK?


Yes of course....You could force any company to make any product line you dictate!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Don't you see a cake shop as a factory for making cakes?


You are joking right....Does the factory make custom cakes to order???

Huh Huh Huh



What? You just said you can't order a manufacturer to make a particular product that they are equipped to make and in the material the manufacturer say he can make in any shape so why must a cake manufacturer be help to a different standard?


Bullshit....Read my response again and apologise!!!

You could go to Boeing and force them to build you a submarine especially if you are gay!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


No need to take that tone with me Brian, I know what I said, I suggest you reread. I never said the factory makes cakes, I said it specialises in making products from latex in any form the customer wants.

edit: You said it was OK for such a manufacturer to turn down that order. I'm asking what is the difference between that and cake, besides the materials.


Who is Brian....Is that some sort of insult???

The cake shop provides custom made (to order) cakes and the factory provides mass produced products....I thought you where joking???

Smiley Smiley Smiley
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
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Setanta
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #160 - Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:27pm
 
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:23pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:17pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:14pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:11pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:06pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 11:00pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 10:58pm:
Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2017 at 9:23pm:
Phil, would a factory that could make any latex product you choose be liable if they refused to take your order to make dildos? The owner of the factory may not like making dildos, even while they can, because dykes use them. Is that OK?


Yes of course....You could force any company to make any product line you dictate!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Don't you see a cake shop as a factory for making cakes?


You are joking right....Does the factory make custom cakes to order???

Huh Huh Huh



What? You just said you can't order a manufacturer to make a particular product that they are equipped to make and in the material the manufacturer say he can make in any shape so why must a cake manufacturer be help to a different standard?


Bullshit....Read my response again and apologise!!!

You could go to Boeing and force them to build you a submarine especially if you are gay!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


No need to take that tone with me Brian, I know what I said, I suggest you reread. I never said the factory makes cakes, I said it specialises in making products from latex in any form the customer wants.

edit: You said it was OK for such a manufacturer to turn down that order. I'm asking what is the difference between that and cake, besides the materials.


Who is Brian....Is that some sort of insult???

The cake shop provides custom made (to order) cakes and the factory provides mass produced products....I thought you where joking???

Smiley Smiley Smiley


Oops, no, it was a slip, sorry. Not intentional. I hope you accept my apology for that and answer the question better than that. The factory can make anything out of Latex. If you pay enough they will do one offs like any capitalist.



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buzzanddidj
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #161 - Dec 11th, 2017 at 12:16am
 
Mortdooley wrote on Dec 6th, 2017 at 2:19am:
So many of you have gone so far down the road to Bizarro world that you can't see that a business owner once had Rights too. The fair thing is that the Baker in this case loses a sale. Forcing him to perform services he won't do otherwise is a form of Slavery. "We reserve the Right to refuse service to anyone" was once recognized as the owners freedom of choice. Now a pair of rump rangers and the courts of Colorado will probably  force an honest business man to lose his livelihood.




It still IS the "owners freedom of choice" - and will continue to BE so
Just as the civil celebrant - as a private enterprise service provider - holds the same right

Registry office - government employed - celebrants, must ALWAYS apply the law of the land - without fear or favour - or find another job

The "houses of god" have ALWAYS held a legal right to say who they will and who they won't marry

All of this "slippery slope" fabrication was a creation of the "NO" argument leading up to the recent ABS opinion poll
And all based on tales from a f*cked up American legal system
NOTHING here related to Australian law

For myself - I won't be seeking any blessing from religious organisations who've been flinging hatred at me, all my life
Nor will I be looking to give hundreds of any homophobic bigot for a wedding cake


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« Last Edit: Dec 11th, 2017 at 12:22am by buzzanddidj »  

'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'


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Setanta
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #162 - Dec 11th, 2017 at 12:46am
 
buzzanddidj wrote on Dec 11th, 2017 at 12:16am:
Mortdooley wrote on Dec 6th, 2017 at 2:19am:
So many of you have gone so far down the road to Bizarro world that you can't see that a business owner once had Rights too. The fair thing is that the Baker in this case loses a sale. Forcing him to perform services he won't do otherwise is a form of Slavery. "We reserve the Right to refuse service to anyone" was once recognized as the owners freedom of choice. Now a pair of rump rangers and the courts of Colorado will probably  force an honest business man to lose his livelihood.




It still IS the "owners freedom of choice" - and will continue to BE so
Just as the civil celebrant - as a private enterprise service provider - holds the same right

Registry office - government employed - celebrants, must ALWAYS apply the law of the land - without fear or favour - or find another job

The "houses of god" have ALWAYS held a legal right to say who they will and who they won't marry

All of this "slippery slope" fabrication was a creation of the "NO" argument leading up to the recent ABS opinion poll
And all based on tales from a f*cked up American legal system
NOTHING here related to Australian law

For myself - I won't be seeking any blessing from religious organisations who've been flinging hatred at me, all my life
Nor will I be looking to give hundreds of any homophobic bigot for a wedding cake


I'm not a poof but was married by a civil celebrant in a public place. I don't understand the butt hurt, just do business elsewhere and take your friends with you. I'm not religious or dogmatic. I can't see what the poofs hope to gain beyond forcing someone to do something against their will. Buy a smacking cake somewhere that want's to make it. It's not 1955 Alabama, they could have a cake flown around the world, there is no shortage of people that would make it for them for a price. It seems much more about how far you can bend someone to your will or the will of the pitchfork holders.


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« Last Edit: Dec 11th, 2017 at 12:51am by Setanta »  
 
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #163 - Dec 11th, 2017 at 1:54am
 
This is the failure of the Civil Rights Act, the individual has no Rights when a member of a recognized group feels discriminated against.
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buzzanddidj
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Re: The gay wedding cake has hit the US supreme court.
Reply #164 - Dec 11th, 2017 at 7:28am
 
Mortdooley wrote on Dec 11th, 2017 at 1:54am:
This is the failure of the Civil Rights Act, the individual has no Rights when a member of a recognized group feels discriminated against.





Can anyone out sort through this hysterical rant and gibberish ...

- then let us ALL know who these victims of discrimination are,
as a fallout from Marriage Equality Legislation in Australia ?






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'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'


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