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Racism, sacred cows and political correctness (Read 110000 times)
freediver
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #435 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:28pm
 
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 5:14pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 4:47pm:
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 3:02pm:
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 1:51pm:
Kind of a strange stretch there, John - if climbing the Opera House was made legal - what possible connection with race could there be?  It's open to everyone.... even the Kaffir can climb it.


according to fd they're racist now that they don't allow it


And sexist. Women are not allowed to climb it. Only Aboriginal men from the correct tribal grouping. That's pretty much the definition of racism and sexism, but wrap it in the woolly fuzz of political correctness and suddenly people cannot see what is right in front of them. And our government is tacitly endorsing one group's racism, sexism and spiritual views and allowing it to be imposed on everyone.



ahhmm, no one is allowed to climb it. .... i was talking about the opera house. ...  Cheesy Cheesy


So we agree - a ban on climbing the opera house is neither racist or sexist, unlike a ban on women and non-Aboriginal men climbing Uluru.
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John Smith
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #436 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:34pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:28pm:
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 5:14pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 4:47pm:
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 3:02pm:
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 1:51pm:
Kind of a strange stretch there, John - if climbing the Opera House was made legal - what possible connection with race could there be?  It's open to everyone.... even the Kaffir can climb it.


according to fd they're racist now that they don't allow it


And sexist. Women are not allowed to climb it. Only Aboriginal men from the correct tribal grouping. That's pretty much the definition of racism and sexism, but wrap it in the woolly fuzz of political correctness and suddenly people cannot see what is right in front of them. And our government is tacitly endorsing one group's racism, sexism and spiritual views and allowing it to be imposed on everyone.



ahhmm, no one is allowed to climb it. .... i was talking about the opera house. ...  Cheesy Cheesy


So we agree - a ban on climbing the opera house is neither racist or sexist, unlike a ban on women and non-Aboriginal men climbing Uluru.


you'll never get me to agree with your bullsh1t fd. you can't just pretend it's sexist and racist and expect others to believe it.
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freediver
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #437 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:48pm
 
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:34pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:28pm:
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 5:14pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 4:47pm:
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 3:02pm:
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 1:51pm:
Kind of a strange stretch there, John - if climbing the Opera House was made legal - what possible connection with race could there be?  It's open to everyone.... even the Kaffir can climb it.


according to fd they're racist now that they don't allow it


And sexist. Women are not allowed to climb it. Only Aboriginal men from the correct tribal grouping. That's pretty much the definition of racism and sexism, but wrap it in the woolly fuzz of political correctness and suddenly people cannot see what is right in front of them. And our government is tacitly endorsing one group's racism, sexism and spiritual views and allowing it to be imposed on everyone.



ahhmm, no one is allowed to climb it. .... i was talking about the opera house. ...  Cheesy Cheesy


So we agree - a ban on climbing the opera house is neither racist or sexist, unlike a ban on women and non-Aboriginal men climbing Uluru.


you'll never get me to agree with your bullsh1t fd. you can't just pretend it's sexist and racist and expect others to believe it.


Am I pretending that all women are banned? Am I pretending that Anungu men are allowed to climb, but not non-Aboriginal men? Am I pretending that no national park would ever be handed over to any other racial group so they can impose their religious views on other people?

It must be tough when you have to reject reality just for the opportunity to disagree with me.
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Mattyfisk
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #438 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 7:12pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:48pm:
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:34pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:28pm:
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 5:14pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 4:47pm:
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 3:02pm:
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 1:51pm:
Kind of a strange stretch there, John - if climbing the Opera House was made legal - what possible connection with race could there be?  It's open to everyone.... even the Kaffir can climb it.


according to fd they're racist now that they don't allow it


And sexist. Women are not allowed to climb it. Only Aboriginal men from the correct tribal grouping. That's pretty much the definition of racism and sexism, but wrap it in the woolly fuzz of political correctness and suddenly people cannot see what is right in front of them. And our government is tacitly endorsing one group's racism, sexism and spiritual views and allowing it to be imposed on everyone.



ahhmm, no one is allowed to climb it. .... i was talking about the opera house. ...  Cheesy Cheesy


So we agree - a ban on climbing the opera house is neither racist or sexist, unlike a ban on women and non-Aboriginal men climbing Uluru.


you'll never get me to agree with your bullsh1t fd. you can't just pretend it's sexist and racist and expect others to believe it.


Am I pretending that all women are banned? Am I pretending that Anungu men are allowed to climb, but not non-Aboriginal men? Am I pretending that no national park would ever be handed over to any other racial group so they can impose their religious views on other people?

It must be tough when you have to reject reality just for the opportunity to disagree with me.


Hardly as tough as not being able to answer a question though, FD. Even you admit that. What do you call such spineless cowards?
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John Smith
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #439 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:39pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:48pm:
Am I pretending that Anungu men are allowed to climb, but not non-Aboriginal men?



Yes , you are.

no one is stopping you from joining the tribe and take up their beliefs ... then you to can climb Uluru
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John Smith
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #440 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:40pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:48pm:
It must be tough when you have to reject reality just for the opportunity to disagree with me.


disagreeing with you isn't difficult.

you make it to easy.
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freediver
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #441 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:47pm
 
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:39pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 6:48pm:
Am I pretending that Anungu men are allowed to climb, but not non-Aboriginal men?



Yes , you are.

no one is stopping you from joining the tribe and take up their beliefs ... then you to can climb Uluru


How many non-Aboriginal Anunga men are there?

What, other than racism, makes their tribe and their spiritual beliefs a requirement to climb the rock? If we demanded they become Christian and adopt white culture before they can enter Sydney, there would be howls of racism. Yet for some reason this sort of idiocy gets a free pass from Aborigines. Is this the sort of idiocy you personally adopt as a 'non-racist' standard, or will you dream up some stupid excuse for why it is different when Aborigines do it? Would you tolerate white racists using the law to keep out non-whites, so long as a few 'honorary whites' were let in, on condition they act white and say racist things? Why are you so desperate to turn a blind eye to racism when it is wrapped in the woolly fuzz of political correctness?

Are you aware that the traditional ownership has been enshrined in law as an inalienable right that you can only have if you are born to Aboriginal parents of the correct tribal grouping? Does that seem racist to you?

Do you support the government sponsorship of belief systems by demanding people adopt a belief system before they can visit our most iconic natural monument?
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« Last Edit: Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:55pm by freediver »  

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John Smith
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #442 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 9:15pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:47pm:
How many non-Aboriginal Anunga men are there?



I don't know ... is this where you take a guess?
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John Smith
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #443 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 9:16pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:47pm:
Are you aware that the traditional ownership has been enshrined in law as an inalienable right that you can only have if you are born to Aboriginal parents of the correct tribal grouping? Does that seem racist to you?


you mean you want traditional ownership to go to someone other than a traditional owner ..... hows that work exactly? Cheesy Cheesy
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mothra
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #444 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 9:34pm
 
FD's still pretending it''s about sexism and racism, is he?

Is it stubbornness or stupidity?
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #445 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 9:46pm
 
JC Denton wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 5:19pm:




it did come back though???...with no strings attached... Smiley
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #446 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 10:01pm
 
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 9:16pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:47pm:
Are you aware that the traditional ownership has been enshrined in law as an inalienable right that you can only have if you are born to Aboriginal parents of the correct tribal grouping? Does that seem racist to you?


you mean you want traditional ownership to go to someone other than a traditional owner ..... hows that work exactly? Cheesy Cheesy



They have traditional ownership - just no Captain cook ownership, and thus they are in no position to dictate terms to anyone.  They are free to continue their 'spiritual' observances, as much as the rest of us are free to continue ours, including climbing the rock for that once-in-a-lifetime spiritual experience.

Can't get that through your thick heads, though, can I .. all you Kaffir Luvvahs...
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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freediver
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #447 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 11:00pm
 
John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 9:16pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:47pm:
Are you aware that the traditional ownership has been enshrined in law as an inalienable right that you can only have if you are born to Aboriginal parents of the correct tribal grouping? Does that seem racist to you?


you mean you want traditional ownership to go to someone other than a traditional owner ..... hows that work exactly? Cheesy Cheesy


Is it racist or not John?

John Smith wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 9:15pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 8:47pm:
How many non-Aboriginal Anunga men are there?



I don't know ... is this where you take a guess?


My guess would be none. You are making excuses for racism.

What, other than racism, makes their tribe and their spiritual beliefs a requirement to climb the rock? If we demanded they become Christian and adopt white culture before they can enter Sydney, there would be howls of racism. Yet for some reason this sort of idiocy gets a free pass from Aborigines. Is this the sort of idiocy you personally adopt as a 'non-racist' standard, or will you dream up some stupid excuse for why it is different when Aborigines do it? Would you tolerate white racists using the law to keep out non-whites, so long as a few 'honorary whites' were let in, on condition they act white and say racist things? Why are you so desperate to turn a blind eye to racism when it is wrapped in the woolly fuzz of political correctness?

Do you support the government sponsorship of belief systems by demanding people adopt a belief system before they can visit our most iconic natural monument?
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freediver
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #448 - Nov 12th, 2017 at 11:10pm
 
Banning climbing Ayers Rock/Uluru does nothing for Aboriginal reconciliation

http://www.cairnspost.com.au/news/opinion/banning-climbing-ayers-rockuluru-does-nothing-for-aboriginal-reconciliation/news-story/b7bd9badcc750c471f9045f50fce11ee

PLANS to close Ayers Rock to climbers from 2019 add more weight to the notion that the most divisive force in Australia is not white people, but Aboriginal activists.

Already in response, other Aboriginal advocacies are calling for more natural landmarks to be closed to non-Aborigines, such as Mt Warning in northern NSW.

Closing The Rock to climbers will likely set off a domino effect of similar exclusion orders around the country.

Locally, entry to Mossman Gorge is controlled by the Kuku Yalanji people. They say entry needed to be managed to prevent damage by visitors.

The same can’t be said for the hardy chunk of sandstone in Central Australia. Instead, it’s being closed for “cultural reasons”.

In the Daintree, the State Government is looking at increasing the role of Aboriginal culture in managing the area. This includes limiting entry to “sacred sites”.

Those proposing closures say indigenous law should trump the law of the land.

For instance, chairman of the Uluru-Kata Tjuta National Park board of management at Ayers Rock, Sammy Wilson, said of the native people: “Anangu have a governing system but the whitefella government has been acting in a way that breaches our laws.”

This is absurd and divisive.

If white people proposed a different set of laws for themselves, it would make international headlines and draw worldwide condemnation.

But laws that exclude whites are praised and defended.

Another example from the Daintree is that indigenous people can take dogs into the World Heritage area, light fires and shoot guns.

Good luck doing that if you’re not from the right tribal group.

In the Hinchinbrook, a big chunk of Missionary Bay is off-limits to anyone who’s not a traditional owner without a permit in order to protect “cultural resources”, without actually saying what those are.

Preserving “culture” is continually pushed by activists determined to punish modern non-Aboriginal Australians for the sins of their fathers.

In reality, Aboriginal culture while undoubtedly worthy of pride, respect and learning, has been misused by some to promote self-segregation, with “no whites” computer rooms, sporting teams, jobs and land – all while criticising non-indigenous for failing to embrace “reconciliation”.

But it’s hard to reconcile when the other party keeps telling you how terrible you are and says you can’t go to certain places.

If you don’t support partioning off Australia along racial lines decided by Aborigines, you’re culturally insensitive, ignorant, bigoted, and racist.

But whenever a defence of European, Caucasian or Christian culture is offered, there are reminders that we must all be eternally ashamed.

Natural features such as mountains, rocks, swimming holes, beaches and rivers belong to no one and should be accessed and enjoyed by all.

As explained recently by someone upset by this: “To ban anybody who is not indigenous from freely accessing this chunk of ancient dried sandstone is a form of racism. If the Human Rights Commission was of any use whatsoever it would be smacking this disgusting, selfish, nasty decision down.”

If Aborigines say climbing Ayers Rock – or Uluru as they call it – is disrespectful to their culture, we can acknowledge that.

So no hitting golf balls off The Rock, no partying, no defecating and no leaving of rubbish.

Aboriginal rangers could patrol the area and prosecute those who don’t treat the climb respectfully.

Same goes for the Hinchinbrook, Mossman Gorge and the Daintree.

Anyone should be allowed to go for free but not to desecrate.

Mt Olympus, Mt Everest, Mt Kiliminjaro, Mt Fuji, the Rock of Gibraltar – all these natural features are sacred to the indigenous peoples of those lands.

But you can still climb on them, and in fact, it is encouraged – respectfully of course.

So we must ask, if Aboriginal activists truly want “reconciliation” in a united Australia, what would work better: demanding laws that only benefit Aborigines and exclude whites? Or encouraging their people to be more tolerant, more open to change and more inclusive?
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John Smith
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Re: Racism, sacred cows and political correctness
Reply #449 - Nov 13th, 2017 at 10:12am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 11:00pm:
Is it racist or not John?


no

freediver wrote on Nov 12th, 2017 at 11:00pm:
My guess would be none.


so you're making up stuff ? not your first time
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