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New Zealand 3 gun challenge (Read 8658 times)
Setanta
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #30 - Feb 27th, 2018 at 7:11pm
 
Aussie wrote on Feb 27th, 2018 at 7:06pm:
While I'd love to engage with you on that inbuilt hypocrisy about what you reckon is 'too far'.....FFS......leave me out of this schit.

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Leave my hypocrisy alone! It's only human! Cry
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Black Orchid
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #31 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 12:33pm
 
Whilst Australia has never really been a hunting nation I think that too many people think their beloved thick and juicy steak comes already prepared as is seen in the Butcher's window.   Killed, trimmed, gutted and sliced without ever thinking where it really came from.

If you can't kill animals yourself (for food as opposed to 'sport') you really should not eat meat at all nor should you criticise those who do.    Ever.
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greggerypeccary
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #32 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 12:55pm
 
Black Orchid wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 12:33pm:
Whilst Australia has never really been a hunting nation I think that too many people think their beloved thick and juicy steak comes already prepared as is seen in the Butcher's window.   Killed, trimmed, gutted and sliced without ever thinking where it really came from.

If you can't kill animals yourself (for food as opposed to 'sport') you really should not eat meat at all nor should you criticise those who do.    Ever.


Bizarre "logic".

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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #33 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 1:30pm
 
No Gweggy the bizarre logic comes from those who happily eat their slab of red, juicy, sliced meat without once thinking that the animal has suffered from distress, trauma, terror and worse for days, or weeks,  before it ends up on your plate.

A clean shot to the head or heart by a hunter, intending to use it for food, is more humane and the hunter more deserving than the yuppies who sit around enjoying their steak and sipping their wine whilst criticising others, without one ounce of regard for the animal they are chowing down on.
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Agnes
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #34 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 2:37pm
 
Black Orchid wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 1:30pm:
No Gweggy the bizarre logic comes from those who happily eat their slab of red, juicy, sliced meat without once thinking that the animal has suffered from distress, trauma, terror and worse for days, or weeks,  before it ends up on your plate.

A clean shot to the head or heart by a hunter, intending to use it for food, is more humane and the hunter more deserving than the yuppies who sit around enjoying their steak and sipping their wine whilst criticising others, without one ounce of regard for the animal they are chowing down on.

A shot to the heart isn't clean- the head yes-intensive farming practices/ slaughter houses/animal transport methods are  places of terror and cruelty for animals! Agree
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #35 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:28pm
 
Setanta wrote on Feb 27th, 2018 at 6:25pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Feb 27th, 2018 at 6:08pm:
I note you're still avoiding the question about the Baron's misuse of the forum.  Why?    Roll Eyes


I have addressed it, you're just not happy with my response, that is besides the point though. MRBs mods can run their boards as they see fit, like it or lump it, they make the rules as long as they do not break site rules, you are not required to be a part of it



There you go Brian you have been told.

The Tribe has spoken i was voted in to moderate this forum, it sounds like you have a bad case of sour grapes.
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Baronvonrort
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #36 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:37pm
 
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 2:37pm:
Black Orchid wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 1:30pm:
No Gweggy the bizarre logic comes from those who happily eat their slab of red, juicy, sliced meat without once thinking that the animal has suffered from distress, trauma, terror and worse for days, or weeks,  before it ends up on your plate.

A clean shot to the head or heart by a hunter, intending to use it for food, is more humane and the hunter more deserving than the yuppies who sit around enjoying their steak and sipping their wine whilst criticising others, without one ounce of regard for the animal they are chowing down on.

A shot to the heart isn't clean- the head yes-intensive farming practices/ slaughter houses/animal transport methods are  places of terror and cruelty for animals! Agree


A heart shot is clean if done right it also takes out both lungs which are either side of the heart.

I think it's Victoria which now has mobile abattoirs so the animals don't have to be transported.

The Australian government says heart and lung shots are the most humane way of shooting

Pages 11 and 12
Quote:
Humane shooting operations


The shooting technique that will be used for this program is endorsed by the Australian Government (Department of Environment and Heritage) as the most humane method for reducing the numbers of pest animals. This technique involves shooting the animals using the ‘double tap’ method, which requires that two shots be fired at the heart and lungs in rapid succession. This results in a quick death, with minimal stress and suffering.

Shot placement


To ensure a quick and humane kill, the best point of aim on all animals is the forward, lower two-thirds of the chest.

In field operations, brain and spinal shots cannot be reliably used to dispose of animals. Both the brain and spinal cord are small targets, making it difficult to effectively and humanely target these areas during shooting operations. For instance, a slightly miscued attempt at the brain often results in a broken jaw. Similarly, a neck shot that is too low, may sever the windpipe or the oesophagus, resulting in pain and suffering by the animal. For this reason, chest shots should only be used. Wounded animals and sucklings should be killed immediately, before targeting other animals.
The lungs are positioned on each side of the heart and almost completely envelope it. Thus, a shot to the top of the heart will also be an effective lung shot.

http://www.territorystories.nt.gov.au/jspui/bitstream/10070/212930/1/Feral_Anima...



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Agnes
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #37 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:48pm
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:37pm:
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 2:37pm:
Black Orchid wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 1:30pm:
No Gweggy the bizarre logic comes from those who happily eat their slab of red, juicy, sliced meat without once thinking that the animal has suffered from distress, trauma, terror and worse for days, or weeks,  before it ends up on your plate.

A clean shot to the head or heart by a hunter, intending to use it for food, is more humane and the hunter more deserving than the yuppies who sit around enjoying their steak and sipping their wine whilst criticising others, without one ounce of regard for the animal they are chowing down on.

A shot to the heart isn't clean- the head yes-intensive farming practices/ slaughter houses/animal transport methods are  places of terror and cruelty for animals! Agree

Quote:
A heart shot is clean if done right it also takes out both lungs which are either side of the heart.

 
If
done right
and that is a very dubious/uncertain method - a head shot is much more reliable as you can actually see the head- between they eyes if you are that good- is better-

Quote:
I think it's Victoria which now has mobile abattoirs so the animals don't have to be transported.
well thats good but but tell that to the thousands of sheep trucked through here every year at the height of summer bound for Adelaide abbottoirs

Quote:
The Australian government says heart and lung shots are the most humane way of shooting

[color=#ff0000]lol I disagree and as an ex shooter I can say that is BS- pen pushers sitting in a guvvie job  Grin- what the hell would they know?animals move you know they dont sit still so you can get a premium shot what a load of crap- "shot placement "  Grin Grin Grin Grin
[/color]






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« Last Edit: Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:59pm by Agnes »  

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Baronvonrort
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #38 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:06pm
 
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:48pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:37pm:
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 2:37pm:
Black Orchid wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 1:30pm:
No Gweggy the bizarre logic comes from those who happily eat their slab of red, juicy, sliced meat without once thinking that the animal has suffered from distress, trauma, terror and worse for days, or weeks,  before it ends up on your plate.

A clean shot to the head or heart by a hunter, intending to use it for food, is more humane and the hunter more deserving than the yuppies who sit around enjoying their steak and sipping their wine whilst criticising others, without one ounce of regard for the animal they are chowing down on.

A shot to the heart isn't clean- the head yes-intensive farming practices/ slaughter houses/animal transport methods are  places of terror and cruelty for animals! Agree

Quote:
A heart shot is clean if done right it also takes out both lungs which are either side of the heart.

 
If
done right
and that is a very dubious/uncertain method - a head shot is much more reliable as you can actually see the head- between they eyes if you are that good- is better-

Quote:
I think it's Victoria which now has mobile abattoirs so the animals don't have to be transported.
well thats good but but tell that to the thousands of sheep trucked through here every year at the height of summer bound for Adelaide abbottoirs

Quote:
The Australian government says heart and lung shots are the most humane way of shooting

[color=#ff0000]lol I disagree and as an ex shooter I can say that is BS- pen pushers sitting in a guvvie job  Grin- what the hell would they know?animals move you know they dont sit still so you can get a premium shot what a load of crap- "shot placement "  Grin Grin Grin Grin
[/color]








The lungs are on either side of the heart so a side on shot will take out both lungs that is what i meant by if done right, from front on it's not likely to take both lungs.

When a human has low blood pressure they faint, a heart shot means the animal will have no blood pressure which means they drop and don't get back up.

For some animals the brain is a lot smaller than the heart, with a cross wind the projectile can get carried sideways the further the distance for the shot the further is gets carried.

My father was a professional shooter he mostly went for heart, with side on shots the heart is preferable if the animal is facing you then head shot would be the go.

A link with target areas- https://www.pestsmart.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/180212_SOP_FOX003_web.pd...

As for mobile abattoirs they're fairly new I think they will become more common.
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Agnes
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #39 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:22pm
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:06pm:
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:48pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:37pm:
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 2:37pm:
Black Orchid wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 1:30pm:
No Gweggy the bizarre logic comes from those who happily eat their slab of red, juicy, sliced meat without once thinking that the animal has suffered from distress, trauma, terror and worse for days, or weeks,  before it ends up on your plate.

A clean shot to the head or heart by a hunter, intending to use it for food, is more humane and the hunter more deserving than the yuppies who sit around enjoying their steak and sipping their wine whilst criticising others, without one ounce of regard for the animal they are chowing down on.

A shot to the heart isn't clean- the head yes-intensive farming practices/ slaughter houses/animal transport methods are  places of terror and cruelty for animals! Agree

Quote:
A heart shot is clean if done right it also takes out both lungs which are either side of the heart.

 
If
done right
and that is a very dubious/uncertain method - a head shot is much more reliable as you can actually see the head- between they eyes if you are that good- is better-

Quote:
I think it's Victoria which now has mobile abattoirs so the animals don't have to be transported.
well thats good but but tell that to the thousands of sheep trucked through here every year at the height of summer bound for Adelaide abbottoirs

Quote:
The Australian government says heart and lung shots are the most humane way of shooting

[color=#ff0000]lol I disagree and as an ex shooter I can say that is BS- pen pushers sitting in a guvvie job  Grin- what the hell would they know?animals move you know they dont sit still so you can get a premium shot what a load of crap- "shot placement "  Grin Grin Grin Grin
[/color]








The lungs are on either side of the heart so a side on shot will take out both lungs that is what i meant by if done right, from front on it's not likely to take both lungs.

When a human has low blood pressure they faint, a heart shot means the animal will have no blood pressure which means they drop and don't get back up.

For some animals the brain is a lot smaller than the heart, with a cross wind the projectile can get carried sideways the further the distance for the shot the further is gets carried.

My father was a professional shooter he mostly went for heart, with side on shots the heart is preferable if the animal is facing you then head shot would be the go.

A link with target areas- https://www.pestsmart.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/180212_SOP_FOX003_web.pd...

As for mobile abattoirs they're fairly new I think they will become more common.

I was a prof shooter Baron and worked with another professional shooter- the heart is too small of a target to be used as a reliable kill method in the dark with a spotlight- the target is way too small  the size if a child fist and not visible to the naked eye- your father most likely executed a lot of gut shots I would say- shooting through the head is the most humane way and its instant-
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Baronvonrort
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #40 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:34pm
 
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:22pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:06pm:
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:48pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:37pm:
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 2:37pm:
Black Orchid wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 1:30pm:
No Gweggy the bizarre logic comes from those who happily eat their slab of red, juicy, sliced meat without once thinking that the animal has suffered from distress, trauma, terror and worse for days, or weeks,  before it ends up on your plate.

A clean shot to the head or heart by a hunter, intending to use it for food, is more humane and the hunter more deserving than the yuppies who sit around enjoying their steak and sipping their wine whilst criticising others, without one ounce of regard for the animal they are chowing down on.

A shot to the heart isn't clean- the head yes-intensive farming practices/ slaughter houses/animal transport methods are  places of terror and cruelty for animals! Agree

Quote:
A heart shot is clean if done right it also takes out both lungs which are either side of the heart.

 
If
done right
and that is a very dubious/uncertain method - a head shot is much more reliable as you can actually see the head- between they eyes if you are that good- is better-

Quote:
I think it's Victoria which now has mobile abattoirs so the animals don't have to be transported.
well thats good but but tell that to the thousands of sheep trucked through here every year at the height of summer bound for Adelaide abbottoirs

Quote:
The Australian government says heart and lung shots are the most humane way of shooting

[color=#ff0000]lol I disagree and as an ex shooter I can say that is BS- pen pushers sitting in a guvvie job  Grin- what the hell would they know?animals move you know they dont sit still so you can get a premium shot what a load of crap- "shot placement "  Grin Grin Grin Grin
[/color]








The lungs are on either side of the heart so a side on shot will take out both lungs that is what i meant by if done right, from front on it's not likely to take both lungs.

When a human has low blood pressure they faint, a heart shot means the animal will have no blood pressure which means they drop and don't get back up.

For some animals the brain is a lot smaller than the heart, with a cross wind the projectile can get carried sideways the further the distance for the shot the further is gets carried.

My father was a professional shooter he mostly went for heart, with side on shots the heart is preferable if the animal is facing you then head shot would be the go.

A link with target areas- https://www.pestsmart.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/180212_SOP_FOX003_web.pd...

As for mobile abattoirs they're fairly new I think they will become more common.

I was a prof shooter Baron and worked with another professional shooter- the heart is too small of a target to be used as a reliable kill method in the dark with a spotlight- the target is way too small  the size if a child fist and not visible to the naked eye- your father most likely executed a lot of gut shots I would say- shooting through the head is the most humane way and its instant- 


The heart and lungs are a bigger target compared to the brain with most animals.

Head or heart shot I have no problem with either anything else is unacceptable.

Spotlights went out ages ago most use thermal scopes which are much better.
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Agnes
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #41 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:44pm
 
many shooters here still use spotlights Baron- thermal scopes lol- you are a city slicker aren't you Baron?
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« Last Edit: Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:50pm by Agnes »  

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Brian Ross
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #42 - Feb 28th, 2018 at 5:49pm
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:28pm:
Setanta wrote on Feb 27th, 2018 at 6:25pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Feb 27th, 2018 at 6:08pm:
I note you're still avoiding the question about the Baron's misuse of the forum.  Why?    Roll Eyes


I have addressed it, you're just not happy with my response, that is besides the point though. MRBs mods can run their boards as they see fit, like it or lump it, they make the rules as long as they do not break site rules, you are not required to be a part of it



There you go Brian you have been told.

The Tribe has spoken i was voted in to moderate this forum, it sounds like you have a bad case of sour grapes.


Oh, no, no "sour grapes" on my part, Baron.  I simply intend to make you work for your victory.  You are the moderator, I am quite willing to accept that.   However, you should listen to what your users are saying...   Roll Eyes
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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour.  Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #43 - Mar 2nd, 2018 at 12:36am
 
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:22pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 4:06pm:
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:48pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 3:37pm:
Agnes wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 2:37pm:
Black Orchid wrote on Feb 28th, 2018 at 1:30pm:
No Gweggy the bizarre logic comes from those who happily eat their slab of red, juicy, sliced meat without once thinking that the animal has suffered from distress, trauma, terror and worse for days, or weeks,  before it ends up on your plate.

A clean shot to the head or heart by a hunter, intending to use it for food, is more humane and the hunter more deserving than the yuppies who sit around enjoying their steak and sipping their wine whilst criticising others, without one ounce of regard for the animal they are chowing down on.

A shot to the heart isn't clean- the head yes-intensive farming practices/ slaughter houses/animal transport methods are  places of terror and cruelty for animals! Agree

Quote:
A heart shot is clean if done right it also takes out both lungs which are either side of the heart.

 
If
done right
and that is a very dubious/uncertain method - a head shot is much more reliable as you can actually see the head- between they eyes if you are that good- is better-

Quote:
I think it's Victoria which now has mobile abattoirs so the animals don't have to be transported.
well thats good but but tell that to the thousands of sheep trucked through here every year at the height of summer bound for Adelaide abbottoirs

Quote:
The Australian government says heart and lung shots are the most humane way of shooting

[color=#ff0000]lol I disagree and as an ex shooter I can say that is BS- pen pushers sitting in a guvvie job  Grin- what the hell would they know?animals move you know they dont sit still so you can get a premium shot what a load of crap- "shot placement "  Grin Grin Grin Grin
[/color]








The lungs are on either side of the heart so a side on shot will take out both lungs that is what i meant by if done right, from front on it's not likely to take both lungs.

When a human has low blood pressure they faint, a heart shot means the animal will have no blood pressure which means they drop and don't get back up.

For some animals the brain is a lot smaller than the heart, with a cross wind the projectile can get carried sideways the further the distance for the shot the further is gets carried.

My father was a professional shooter he mostly went for heart, with side on shots the heart is preferable if the animal is facing you then head shot would be the go.

A link with target areas- https://www.pestsmart.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/180212_SOP_FOX003_web.pd...

As for mobile abattoirs they're fairly new I think they will become more common.

I was a prof shooter Baron and worked with another professional shooter- the heart is too small of a target to be used as a reliable kill method in the dark with a spotlight- the target is way too small  the size if a child fist and not visible to the naked eye- your father most likely executed a lot of gut shots I would say- shooting through the head is the most humane way and its instant- 


Don't forget Agnes, bullets don't just go straight through. When hunting you don't use FMJ military ammo. The bullets are frangible, meaning they mushroom and break on impact. The damage inside is not a single hole but more a shotgun effect after penetration. Use the right round. For instance using the right projectile for fox shooting in .17 Hornet or Hornady HMR will not leave an exit wound. The bullet breaks up inside the animal and mashes the heart/lungs. Even if you didn't hit the heart, that is not a gut shot, it's a chest shot, it rips their lungs out Jim(Warren Zevon ref).


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Re: New Zealand 3 gun challenge
Reply #44 - Mar 2nd, 2018 at 2:57pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Feb 26th, 2018 at 11:33pm:
You forget, I spent 10 years toting guns


Have you ever heard the term "Glory Thief" bwian, only you seem to fit that description rather well?

Some countries even prosecute "Glory Thieves" bwinan.......
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