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Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck! (Read 1281 times)
AnotherJourneyByTrain
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age?
Reply #15 - Apr 19th, 2017 at 5:28pm
 
Cost Efficiency
CO2 is a by-product in a number of industries, so the price of CO2 is low. However, CO2 systems tend to be more expensive than traditional systems due to higher pressures (in transcritical systems) or increased complexity (in both transcritical and subcritical systems). Complexity of systems seems to be decreasing with the entrance of Booster systems and as the number of CO2 installations has increased, history has shown that the cost approaches the cost of the reference systems using HFCs.

Secondary, large CO2 systems, especially in industrial refrigeration, may be less expensive to build than their glycol counterparts and thus offer lower initial and life-cycle costs.


source:  http://refrigerants.danfoss.com/co2/#/
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......Australia has an illegitimate Government!
 
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #16 - Apr 19th, 2017 at 9:42pm
 
When I take my mutt for a walk and a swim on the local beach I look at the houses built just on the other side of the road from the beach. Right on the sand dunes in other words. I wonder how long it will be before the houses will have to be pulled down so a decent sand dune system can regenerate, keeping the rising sea out of Adelaide. Or will sand have to be pumped up at massive cost to create sand dunes on what is now beach?

Some seaside councils are starting to try and build sand dunes on their beaches. Seacliff (Glenelg&Brighton council) seems to be most advanced and most successful.

Maybe our sucky politicians need to consider zoning along and just behind the beach?
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The greenhouse effect has been demonstrated to be real. Ice is retreating and the world is warming.
 
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lee
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #17 - Apr 19th, 2017 at 9:59pm
 
Why?
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #18 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 7:04am
 
NASA has released a dataset projecting how AGW will affect temperatures and rainfall by regions, down to individual cities:

Quote:
NASA has released data showing how temperature and rainfall patterns worldwide may change through the year 2100 because of growing concentrations of greenhouse gases in Earth’s atmosphere.

The dataset, which is available to the public, shows projected changes worldwide on a regional level in response to different scenarios of increasing carbon dioxide simulated by 21 climate models. The high-resolution data, which can be viewed on a daily timescale at the scale of individual cities and towns, will help scientists and planners conduct climate risk assessments to better understand local and global effects of hazards, such as severe drought, floods, heat waves and losses in agriculture productivity.

“NASA is in the business of taking what we’ve learned about our planet from space and creating new products that help us all safeguard our future,” said Ellen Stofan, NASA chief scientist. “With this new global dataset, people around the world have a valuable new tool to use in planning how to cope with a warming planet.”

The new dataset is the latest product from the NASA Earth Exchange (NEX), a big-data research platform within the NASA Advanced Supercomputing Center at the agency's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field, California. In 2013, NEX released similar climate projection data for the continental United States that is being used to quantify climate risks to the nation’s agriculture, forests, rivers and cities.

"This is a fundamental dataset for climate research and assessment with a wide range of applications,” said Ramakrishna Nemani, NEX project scientist at Ames. “NASA continues to produce valuable community-based data products on the NEX platform to promote scientific collaboration, knowledge sharing, and research and development."

This NASA dataset integrates actual measurements from around the world with data from climate simulations created by the international Fifth Coupled Model Intercomparison Project. These climate simulations used the best physical models of the climate system available to provide forecasts of what the global climate might look like under two different greenhouse gas emissions scenarios: a “business as usual” scenario based on current trends and an “extreme case” with a significant increase in emissions.

The NASA climate projections provide a detailed view of future temperature and precipitation patterns around the world at a 15.5 mile (25 kilometer) resolution, covering the time period from 1950 to 2100. The 11-terabyte dataset provides daily estimates of maximum and minimum temperatures and precipitation over the entire globe.

NEX is a collaboration and analytical platform that combines state-of-the-art supercomputing, Earth system modeling, workflow management and NASA remote-sensing data. Through NEX, users can explore and analyze large Earth science data sets, run and share modeling algorithms and workflows, collaborate on new or existing projects and exchange workflows and results within and among other science communities.

NEX data and analysis tools are available to the public through the OpenNEX project on Amazon Web Services. OpenNEX is a partnership between NASA and Amazon, Inc., to enhance public access to climate data, and support planning to increase climate resilience in the U.S. and internationally. OpenNEX is an extension of the NASA Earth Exchange in a public cloud-computing environment.

NASA uses the vantage point of space to increase our understanding of our home planet, improve lives, and safeguard our future. NASA develops new ways to observe and study Earth's interconnected natural systems with long-term data records. The agency freely shares this unique knowledge and works with institutions around the world to gain new insights into how our planet is changing.

Additional information about the new NASA climate projection dataset is available at:

https://nex.nasa.gov/nex/projects/1356/

The dataset is available for download at:

https://cds.nccs.nasa.gov/nex-gddp/

OpenNEX information and training materials are available at:

http://nex.nasa.gov/opennex

For more information about NASA’s Earth science activities, visit:

http://www.nasa.gov/earth



So, our politicians now have the data available to inform decisions. Will they do anything with that information? We need to hold them accountable.

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The greenhouse effect has been demonstrated to be real. Ice is retreating and the world is warming.
 
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lee
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #19 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 10:43am
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 7:04am:
NASA has released a dataset projecting how AGW will affect temperatures and rainfall by regions, down to individual cities


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 7:04am:
So, our politicians now have the data available to inform decisions. Will they do anything with that information? We need to hold them accountable.


You do know the difference between projections and data; don't you?

When there are so many unknowns in climate science, it is merely projections. It could only come true if ALL the underlying assumptions come true. Wink
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AnotherJourneyByTrain
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #20 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:24pm
 
lee wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 10:43am:
Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 7:04am:
NASA has released a dataset projecting how AGW will affect temperatures and rainfall by regions, down to individual cities


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 7:04am:
So, our politicians now have the data available to inform decisions. Will they do anything with that information? We need to hold them accountable.


You do know the difference between projections and data; don't you?

When there are so many unknowns in climate science, it is merely projections. It could only come true if ALL the underlying assumptions come true. Wink

What is data for?

END OF!!!!!!!!!!!  Shocked
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lee
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #21 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:44pm
 
AnotherJourneyByTrain wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:24pm:
What is data for?



If you use it to predict the future you should acknowledge the uncertainties.


Note the difference in the certainties. Wink

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 7:04am:
how AGW will affect temperatures and rainfall by


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 7:04am:
worldwide may change

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AnotherJourneyByTrain
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #22 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:45pm
 
lee wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:44pm:
AnotherJourneyByTrain wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:24pm:
What is data for?



If you use it to predict the future you should acknowledge the uncertainties.



Note the difference in the certainties. Wink

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 7:04am:
how AGW will affect temperatures and rainfall by


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 7:04am:
worldwide may change


That's a fair call- and that is why in a court of law they do!
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......Australia has an illegitimate Government!
 
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lee
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #23 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:46pm
 
AnotherJourneyByTrain wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:45pm:
That's a fair call- and that is why in a court of law they do!



But not in the climate court. Wink
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juliar
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #24 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:48pm
 
The old MM is trying to stir again with some lying Globally Warmed Greenie Propaganda.
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AnotherJourneyByTrain
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #25 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:49pm
 
lee wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:46pm:
AnotherJourneyByTrain wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 1:45pm:
That's a fair call- and that is why in a court of law they do!



But not in the climate court. Wink

I would expect uncertainty ranges as all good scientific method provides. If uncertainty ranges aren't provided then it simply isn't methodical!
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Sir Bobby
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #26 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 2:17pm
 
I thought this mini ice age topic was well covered already?
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Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #27 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 2:47pm
 
This thread belongs in Politics Sucks, being about AGW and the
POLITICAL
decisions and actions needed to prepare for it, reduce emissions, adapt and mitigate.

I have shown the Ice Age is not happening, some idiots posted a heap of weird videos that prove nothing.
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The greenhouse effect has been demonstrated to be real. Ice is retreating and the world is warming.
 
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lee
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #28 - Apr 20th, 2017 at 2:52pm
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 20th, 2017 at 2:47pm:
I have shown the Ice Age is not happening



No you haven't. You just assume an ice age will happen literally overnight.

Also you haven't shown, despite your protestations, that CAGW or AGW due to CO2 are happening. If it is not Catastrophic there is no imperative action needed.
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Re: Are we about to enter an Ice Age? Politicans suck!
Reply #29 - Apr 21st, 2017 at 10:08am
 
Another aspect of AGW that needs a political response.

As the globe warms there is more evaporation from warmer seas (the oceans absorb and store a lot of the extra heat from AGW) and this means increased precipitation, e.g. as the moist air mass hits land or mountain slopes etc etc. This increased precipitation brings a menace closer and closer: mosquitoes and the diseases they bring:

Quote:
The outbreak began so slowly that no one in Dallas perceived it at first. In June 2012, a trickle of people began showing up in emergency rooms broiling with fever, complaining that their necks were stiff and that bright lights hurt their eyes. The numbers were initially small; but by the middle of July, there were more than 50 victims each week, slumping in doctors’ offices or carried into hospitals comatose or paralyzed from inflammation in their brains. In early August, after nine people died, Dallas County declared a state of emergency: It was caught in an epidemic of what turned out to be West Nile virus, the worst ever experienced by a city in the United States. By the end of the year, 1,162 people had tested positive for the mosquito-borne virus; 216 had become sick enough to be hospitalized; and 19 were dead. . . .

Victims were clustered in affluent ZIP codes where many owners had walked away from overmortgaged mansions. Haley and his team knew that there would be abandoned swimming pools and potted plants there — perfect places for mosquitoes to breed unbothered. But the financial crisis was four years old in 2012. The homes had been neglected for years without triggering an epidemic; no matter how many mosquitoes bred in the summer, the deep cold that blankets central Texas a dozen days every winter would knock the bugs down again.

Except, Haley remembered, it had not been very cold that year. There was only one night of hard frost; everyone had talked about it, grateful they did not have to dash out to wrap plants and turn off hose taps while thermometers plunged. The investigators downloaded federal weather data for each year since West Nile first arrived in Texas and plotted the metrics against the case counts. The epidemic year was an outlier on every measure, with the warmest winter, the warmest spring and the heaviest early rainfall in 10 years. It had been a freak weather event, and mosquitoes benefited from it. The insects survived the winter, so there were more of them to start with. They woke sooner, spilled out earlier from their winter hiding places and bit people in greater numbers than in any other year, transmitting so much virus that it made many people gravely ill.


https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/20/magazine/why-the-menace-of-mosquitoes-will-on...

The other menace occurs where drying occurs, like the southern half of Australia and parts of the US and other areas;

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/08/us/wildfires-midwest-prairie-texas.html

Wild fires/bush fires. We all see the destruction they bring time and time again. We just going to suffer them or are we going to tackle issues like zoning, housing design etc etc to protect townships from the ravages of bushfires? Fuel reduction burns are now much more difficult with, as the BuMet has reported, the increasing length of the bushfire season.

Be an export opportunity if we develop materials and designs to resist bushfires: wild fires are a growing menace all over the world. The west of the US in particular is suffering bigger and bigger wildfires.
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The greenhouse effect has been demonstrated to be real. Ice is retreating and the world is warming.
 
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