Australian Politics Forum - Hizb ut-Tahrir in Australia

Mr Hammer

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Re: Hizb ut-Tahrir in Australia
Reply #105 - Mar 29^th, 2017 at 8:05pm

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 2:13pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 1:58pm:

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 1:46pm:

aquascoot wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 1:31pm:

most of these threads involve mothra and gwegs addiction to a certain emotional state.

when you are mediocre and you dont have a lot going on in your life, you tend to be in a state of permanent "pissed off edness".

to keep feeding this state (because emotional states are addictive and the addict needs his hit), gweg and mothra need to keep the hate flowing.

it would be best if those of the noble right ceased feeding the addicts the drug they seek.

they both need to be weaned off this cycle of "unfocused discontent" and "drawing state from the environment" and then they can look deep inside themselves and try to draw peace and contentment from within.

as long as there is an environment and they keep getting fed the insults which they are sooooo addicted to, there is no hope for them to move up.

The noble rightard needs to stop interacting with them, in a spirit of contribution.

Horse-boy, once again demonstrating he has absolutely no idea what is going on.

Greg and (and others) are speaking up against hate.

By doing so, we are, make some people very angry.

It is the that don't want to let go of their hate ... and they similarly hate having their hatred challenged with cool, even-handed facts.

Let go of your prejudice against the left Horse-boy. It's severely clouding your observational skills.

And you won't come to terms with reality. You believe it's all balloons and fairy floss. We want to speak about the unspeakable. You and your kind want to sweep it all under the carpet and call anybody brave enough to confront "the dirt" a bigot.

How very wrong you are.

You see, as i have explained on here many, many times, you lot aren't rational. You say you want open dialogue but you utterly prohibit it by starting from a position of falsehood and prejudice. An open dialogue simply cannot proceed from the point you are starting from. We need to re-educate you to get you back to ground zero.

You can't solve anything with prejudice.

You need to know what the facts are. Know your enemy, not imagine who you think your enemy is and what they are all about. That's not going to get you anywhere. All Muslims are not the problem. Our greatest allies in the fight against extremism are, in fact, Muslims.

Does it make good sense to isolate, pillorise, misinterpret, alienate or subject them to ill-informed prejudice? Of course it doesn't.

In this thread, falsehoods have been exposed. Falsehoods that serve no other purpose than to generate and foster hatred and fear.

See, i'm against hatred and baseless fear.

In fact, i have considerably more in common with a moderate Muslim than i do a believer in thereligionofpeace.

You say you want to fight extremism but you are extremists. You spread lies and half-truths to try to coerce and intimidate people into believing you and being similarly frighted and hateful.

Just like Jihadis do.

You're opposite sides of the same coin.

How can a reasonable person discuss ideas to counter hatred-fueled violence with you? You're so damn full of hate.

In fact, i have considerably more in common with a moderate Muslim than i do a believer in thereligionofpeace.......

At least they believe in something. What you are is a victim mothballs. History is full of your type. You are a reed blowing in the wind. Whoever blows the wind pulls your strings and you wobble back and forth. The militant strand of Islam blow the moderates back and forth. Wake up and smell the roses. We are the fighters, you are the victims.

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Frank

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Re: Hizb ut-Tahrir in Australia
Reply #106 - Mar 29^th, 2017 at 8:30pm

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 6:25pm:

Alas, you probably believe all of that.

An oft cited claim of anti-Muslim hate sites.

History tells a different story though. The Muslims sought to raid caravans to disrupt the enemies war making capabilities.
Mohammed preached against plundering and stopped them.

How many times has Gandalf tried to explain this to you?

So do you accept Mohammed as your personal, moral and practical guide to how to conduct raids on caravans?

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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.

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mothra

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Re: Hizb ut-Tahrir in Australia
Reply #107 - Mar 29^th, 2017 at 9:13pm

freediver wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 7:55pm:

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 6:25pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 6:06pm:

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 5:51pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 5:32pm:

Quote:

It was ordained when Muslims were a targeted and persecuted minority.

Crap. Muhammad preached peace and tolerance when Muslims were a minority. He preached rape and pillage as soon as they gained enough military strength.

Overly siplistic, as no doubt Karnal and Gandalf have told you many, many times.

At the time this Surah was ordained, the Muslims had left Mecca where they were persecuted, to arrive in Medina. The Meccans sent an army after them. The small settlement of Muslims in Medina were under siege conditions.

The only option for the Muslims was to either accept domination or fight for their beliefs.

The Meccans sent an army after them because Muhammad was using Medina as a base from which to rob Meccan caravans.

The "accept domination" schtick is BS. The Meccans wanted to stop Muhammad robbing caravans. After one battle that they won, the went back to Mecca rather than pressing their advantage because they thought Muhammad was dead and that would be the end of it. It was not the culture at the time for one religion to dominate another. Muhammad introduced that. It was literally a multicultural and multireligious society.

Had they not been beholden to a giant douchebag, they would have seen the clear option of not robbing Meccan caravans.

Alas, you probably believe all of that.

An oft cited claim of anti-Muslim hate sites.

History tells a different story though. The Muslims sought to raid caravans to disrupt the enemies war making capabilities.
Mohammed preached against plundering and stopped them.

How many times has Gandalf tried to explain this to you?

So, they spent ten years robbing Meccan caravans in an attempt to stop the Meccans from retaliating over the constant caravan raiding?

Or was it a grand scheme by the Muslims so they could later attack Mecca?

Muhammad did not preach against plundering. He lead the plundering.

Again, you prove to be wrong on every single count Mothra.

Where on earth did you pull 10 years from? The Muslims went to Medina in 622. The first raid on Medina was in 623, and there were other skirmishes.

The Battle of Badr itself was in was in early 624.

10 years? Not even close.

The raids were to interrupt the war-making capabilities and to interrupt Quraish trade routes that were passing too close to Medina.

But listen FD, if they were plundering, would it not be justified? As the Meccans had seized all of their property an wealth and sold off everything they seized for financial benefit?

But anyway, i digress. There are several Hadiths that refer specifically to plundering:

The thief is not a believer while he is stealing. The plunderer is not a believer while he is plundering and the people are watching him.
Source: Ṣaḥīḥ al-Bukhārī2343

Whoever plunders the wealth of others is not one of us.
Source: Sunan al-Tirmidhī 1123

Whoever is notorious for plunder is not one of us.
Source: Sunan Abī Dāwūd 4391

Verily, plunder is unlawful.
Source: Sunan Ibn Mājah 3938

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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.

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mothra

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Re: Hizb ut-Tahrir in Australia
Reply #108 - Mar 29^th, 2017 at 9:16pm

Mr Hammer wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 8:05pm:

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 2:13pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 1:58pm:

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 1:46pm:

aquascoot wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 1:31pm:

most of these threads involve mothra and gwegs addiction to a certain emotional state.

when you are mediocre and you dont have a lot going on in your life, you tend to be in a state of permanent "pissed off edness".

to keep feeding this state (because emotional states are addictive and the addict needs his hit), gweg and mothra need to keep the hate flowing.

it would be best if those of the noble right ceased feeding the addicts the drug they seek.

they both need to be weaned off this cycle of "unfocused discontent" and "drawing state from the environment" and then they can look deep inside themselves and try to draw peace and contentment from within.

as long as there is an environment and they keep getting fed the insults which they are sooooo addicted to, there is no hope for them to move up.

The noble rightard needs to stop interacting with them, in a spirit of contribution.

Horse-boy, once again demonstrating he has absolutely no idea what is going on.

Greg and (and others) are speaking up against hate.

By doing so, we are, make some people very angry.

It is the that don't want to let go of their hate ... and they similarly hate having their hatred challenged with cool, even-handed facts.

Let go of your prejudice against the left Horse-boy. It's severely clouding your observational skills.

And you won't come to terms with reality. You believe it's all balloons and fairy floss. We want to speak about the unspeakable. You and your kind want to sweep it all under the carpet and call anybody brave enough to confront "the dirt" a bigot.

How very wrong you are.

You see, as i have explained on here many, many times, you lot aren't rational. You say you want open dialogue but you utterly prohibit it by starting from a position of falsehood and prejudice. An open dialogue simply cannot proceed from the point you are starting from. We need to re-educate you to get you back to ground zero.

You can't solve anything with prejudice.

You need to know what the facts are. Know your enemy, not imagine who you think your enemy is and what they are all about. That's not going to get you anywhere. All Muslims are not the problem. Our greatest allies in the fight against extremism are, in fact, Muslims.

Does it make good sense to isolate, pillorise, misinterpret, alienate or subject them to ill-informed prejudice? Of course it doesn't.

In this thread, falsehoods have been exposed. Falsehoods that serve no other purpose than to generate and foster hatred and fear.

See, i'm against hatred and baseless fear.

In fact, i have considerably more in common with a moderate Muslim than i do a believer in thereligionofpeace.

You say you want to fight extremism but you are extremists. You spread lies and half-truths to try to coerce and intimidate people into believing you and being similarly frighted and hateful.

Just like Jihadis do.

You're opposite sides of the same coin.

How can a reasonable person discuss ideas to counter hatred-fueled violence with you? You're so damn full of hate.

In fact, i have considerably more in common with a moderate Muslim than i do a believer in thereligionofpeace.......

At least they believe in something. What you are is a victim mothballs. History is full of your type. You are a reed blowing in the wind. Whoever blows the wind pulls your strings and you wobble back and forth. The militant strand of Islam blow the moderates back and forth. Wake up and smell the roses. We are the fighters, you are the victims.

LOL! You're not a fighter, You're a sad little Islamophobe and purveyor of intolerance, lies and hatred who just utterly missed every single point made to him.

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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Hizb ut-Tahrir in Australia
Reply #109 - Mar 29^th, 2017 at 9:34pm

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 9:13pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 7:55pm:

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 6:25pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 6:06pm:

mothra wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 5:51pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 5:32pm:

Quote:

It was ordained when Muslims were a targeted and persecuted minority.

Crap. Muhammad preached peace and tolerance when Muslims were a minority. He preached rape and pillage as soon as they gained enough military strength.

Overly siplistic, as no doubt Karnal and Gandalf have told you many, many times.

At the time this Surah was ordained, the Muslims had left Mecca where they were persecuted, to arrive in Medina. The Meccans sent an army after them. The small settlement of Muslims in Medina were under siege conditions.

The only option for the Muslims was to either accept domination or fight for their beliefs.

The Meccans sent an army after them because Muhammad was using Medina as a base from which to rob Meccan caravans.

The "accept domination" schtick is BS. The Meccans wanted to stop Muhammad robbing caravans. After one battle that they won, the went back to Mecca rather than pressing their advantage because they thought Muhammad was dead and that would be the end of it. It was not the culture at the time for one religion to dominate another. Muhammad introduced that. It was literally a multicultural and multireligious society.

Had they not been beholden to a giant douchebag, they would have seen the clear option of not robbing Meccan caravans.

Alas, you probably believe all of that.

An oft cited claim of anti-Muslim hate sites.

History tells a different story though. The Muslims sought to raid caravans to disrupt the enemies war making capabilities.
Mohammed preached against plundering and stopped them.

How many times has Gandalf tried to explain this to you?

So, they spent ten years robbing Meccan caravans in an attempt to stop the Meccans from retaliating over the constant caravan raiding?

Or was it a grand scheme by the Muslims so they could later attack Mecca?

Muhammad did not preach against plundering. He lead the plundering.

Again, you prove to be wrong on every single count Mothra.

Where on earth did you pull 10 years from? The Muslims went to Medina in 622. The first raid on Medina was in 623, and there were other skirmishes.

The Battle of Badr itself was in was in early 624.

10 years? Not even close.

The raids were to interrupt the war-making capabilities and to interrupt Quraish trade routes that were passing too close to Medina.

But listen FD, if they were plundering, would it not be justified? As the Meccans had seized all of their property an wealth and sold off everything they seized for financial benefit?

But anyway, i digress. There are several Hadiths that refer specifically to plundering:

The thief is not a believer while he is stealing. The plunderer is not a believer while he is plundering and the people are watching him.
Source: Ṣaḥīḥ al-Bukhārī2343

Whoever plunders the wealth of others is not one of us.
Source: Sunan al-Tirmidhī 1123

Whoever is notorious for plunder is not one of us.
Source: Sunan Abī Dāwūd 4391

Verily, plunder is unlawful.
Source: Sunan Ibn Mājah 3938

If a muslim steals from another muslim they chop his hand off.

Why does allah need 20% of all war booty mothballs?

What sort of god demands 20% of all war booty?

quran.com/8/41

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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mothra

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Re: Hizb ut-Tahrir in Australia
Reply #110 - Mar 29^th, 2017 at 10:07pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 29^th, 2017 at 9:34pm: