Australian Politics Forum - Love in the Koran

Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Love in the Koran Reply #105 - Mar 7^th, 2017 at 9:58am uh oh another one in total denial...
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Mattyfisk

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #106 - Mar 7^th, 2017 at 10:39am

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 7^th, 2017 at 6:34am:

freediver wrote on Mar 6^th, 2017 at 10:03pm:

We have had many threads dedicated to it.

Have you forgotten?

Yes I have FD - I have indeed "forgotton" all those threads about PEW surveys on muslim attitudes to a) domestic violence and b) child marriage. Why? Because there are none.

Now now, G, you know as well as I do that when FD talks about Muslim attitudes towards domestic violence and child marriage, he is referring to Malaysian attitudes on the death penalty for apostasy.

FD can draw you a Venn diagram if you want.

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freediver

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #107 - Mar 7^th, 2017 at 6:49pm

Gandalf we have only talked about one Pew survey. We have always used the singular when discussing it. You are feigning confusion. You are now trying to dig your way out by telling another lie about multiple surveys. This would be a whole lot simpler if you did not make stuff up with every single post.

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 5^th, 2017 at 10:24am:

freediver wrote on Mar 4^th, 2017 at 8:39pm:

Gandalf, do you reject these verses of the Koran?

Shall I quote all the new testament verses stipulating the inferior status of women? No one can seriously argue that the Quranic attitude towards women is any worse than the Biblical attitude.

freediver wrote on Mar 6^th, 2017 at 8:15pm:

Quote:

Just like Christians have demonstrably found ways to reject New Testament commands that women are inferior and should be kept out of sight

OK go on then, show us where it says this.

Gandalf you have been begging us to ask you for the evidence so you can demonstrate that Christianity is in some way as bad as Islam. Now is your opportunity.

Also Gandalf, is there only one direct reference to love in the Koran that you consider relevant here?

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« Last Edit: Mar 7^th, 2017 at 7:11pm by freediver »

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polite_gandalf

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #108 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 9:57am

freediver wrote on Mar 7^th, 2017 at 6:49pm:

Gandalf we have only talked about one Pew survey. We have always used the singular when discussing it. You are feigning confusion. You are now trying to dig your way out by telling another lie about multiple surveys. This would be a whole lot simpler if you did not make stuff up with every single post.

What has this bizarre tangent got to do with your inability to produce the survey on child marriage and domestic violence? I have referenced several PEW surveys over the years FD. None of them to my knowledge mentioned anything about muslim attitudes about domestic violence or child marriage. Can you show me them?

freediver wrote on Mar 7^th, 2017 at 6:49pm:

Gandalf you have been begging us to ask you for the evidence so you can demonstrate that Christianity is in some way as bad as Islam. Now is your opportunity.

define "as bad" FD. My references re the new testament were only about the inferior status of women:

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1487240389/37#37

My point being, keeping women subordinate - as commanded by the NT is not really a "thing" amongst christians nowadays.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Mattyfisk Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 92409 Gender:	Re: Love in the Koran Reply #109 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 10:04am FD, can you provide the Pew survey you're referring to? We'll have a little look-see.
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freediver

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #110 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:01pm

Quote:

What has this bizarre tangent got to do with your inability to produce the survey on child marriage and domestic violence?

You denied the existence of the Pew survey, then somehow decided we are talking about multiple surveys dedicated entirely to the topic. The bizarre tangent is a reflection of your bizarre arguments.

If you want more closet-to-home evidence of Muslims supporting domestic violence, I give you your own support of wife beating as a valid way of asking women what they are thinking, your insistence that Islamic wife beating is better because it lacks the 'drunk bogan' connotations, etc. Abu also spoke out on the wonders of wife beating. He thinks it is a good way to shake a woman out of a nasty mood. We are yet to have a Muslim here who rejects wife beating unequivocally, because Muhammed's statements in the Koran and Muhammed's own actions compel them to defend and support the practice.

Quote:

define "as bad" FD

You are the one who introduced the comparison Gandalf. Are you now asking me to explain it?

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 5^th, 2017 at 10:24am:

freediver wrote on Mar 4^th, 2017 at 8:39pm:

Gandalf, do you reject these verses of the Koran?

Shall I quote all the new testament verses stipulating the inferior status of women? No one can seriously argue that the Quranic attitude towards women is any worse than the Biblical attitude. And yet Christians are by and large respectful of women today. Theoretically it should be easier for muslims to justify respect for women - Islamically. So scripture alone cannot be used as proof of what muslims do in practice. Which is why this fallacious leap in logic was not your first choice of argument - your first choice was a non-existent survey of actual muslim attitudes. Which would have been perfect has it been real - its just a shame you pulled it out of your arse.

No wonder you are now reluctant to paste the quotes.

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Mattyfisk

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #111 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:14pm

Mattyfisk wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 10:04am:

FD, can you provide the Pew survey you're referring to?

We'll have a little look-see.

Sorry, FD, I see you've already provided the evidence. This should do:

Quote:

If you want more closet-to-home evidence of Muslims supporting domestic violence, I give you your own support of wife beating as a valid way of asking women what they are thinking, your insistence that Islamic wife beating is better because it lacks the 'drunk bogan' connotations, etc. Abu also spoke out on the wonders of wife beating. He thinks it is a good way to shake a woman out of a nasty mood. We are yet to have a Muslim here who rejects wife beating unequivocally, because Muhammed's statements in the Koran and Muhammed's own actions compel them to defend and support the practice.

Hang on, you did say more information, didn't you? In addition to the Pew survey?

Better post the right survey, FD - just to be on the safe side.

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« Last Edit: Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:19pm by Mattyfisk »

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polite_gandalf

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #112 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:19pm

freediver wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:01pm:

You denied the existence of the Pew survey, then somehow decided we are talking about multiple surveys dedicated entirely to the topic. The bizarre tangent is a reflection of your bizarre arguments.

ok FD. Whatever contortions you feel is necessary to avoid admitting the survey doesn't exist.

Maybe you really are as clueless as you are making out to be. Who knows. Whatever it is, this is just weird.

freediver wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:01pm:

We are yet to have a Muslim here who rejects wife beating unequivocally

Except me of course. But I know its much more fun to make up crap about what I said - Gandalf loves wife beating, Gandalf thinks gays should be executed for doing it mardi gras style...

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Mattyfisk

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #113 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:21pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:19pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:01pm:

You denied the existence of the Pew survey, then somehow decided we are talking about multiple surveys dedicated entirely to the topic. The bizarre tangent is a reflection of your bizarre arguments.

ok FD. Whatever contortions you feel is necessary to avoid admitting the survey doesn't exist.

Now now, G, FD has the survey. He's looking for it as we speak.

You wait and see, it'll show your Muselman to be a real rotter. I mean, look at the evidence FD's got already:

Quote:

If you want more closet-to-home evidence of Muslims supporting domestic violence, I give you your own support of wife beating as a valid way of asking women what they are thinking, your insistence that Islamic wife beating is better because it lacks the 'drunk bogan' connotations, etc. Abu also spoke out on the wonders of wife beating. He thinks it is a good way to shake a woman out of a nasty mood. We are yet to have a Muslim here who rejects wife beating unequivocally, because Muhammed's statements in the Koran and Muhammed's own actions compel them to defend and support the practice.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47481 At my desk.	Re: Love in the Koran Reply #114 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:25pm Oh look: http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-overview/ Around 84% of South Asian Muslims (the largest group of them) support shariah law. 93% of southeast asian Muslims believe a woman should obey her husband.
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polite_gandalf

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #115 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:27pm

freediver wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:25pm:

Oh look:

http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-overview/

Around 84% of South Asian Muslims (the largest group of them) support shariah law.

93% of southeast asian Muslims believe a woman should obey her husband.

Yes thats what I thought FD.

No pew survey showing muslim attitudes on domestic violence or child marriage.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Mattyfisk

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #116 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:27pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:19pm:

Except me of course. But I know its much more fun to make up crap about what I said - Gandalf loves wife beating, Gandalf thinks gays should be executed for doing it mardi gras style...

But you have to, don't you? Muhammed's statements in the Koran and Muhammed's own actions compel you to defend and support the practice.

I don't know why we're bothering to find this Pew survey, the proof's all there. Still, if it makes you happy -

FD?

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Mattyfisk

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #117 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:28pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:27pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:25pm:

Oh look:

http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-overview/

Around 84% of South Asian Muslims (the largest group of them) support shariah law.

93% of southeast asian Muslims believe a woman should obey her husband.

Yes thats what I thought FD.

No pew survey showing muslim attitudes on domestic violence or child marriage.

He's getting to it, don't you worry.

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freediver

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #118 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:29pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:27pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:25pm:

Oh look:

http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-overview/

Around 84% of South Asian Muslims (the largest group of them) support shariah law.

93% of southeast asian Muslims believe a woman should obey her husband.

Yes thats what I thought FD.

No pew survey showing muslim attitudes on domestic violence or child marriage.

Are you trying to disagree with me Gandalf? Do you now agree with my original point, prior to your bizarre tangent, that there is far better evidence of what Muslims believe? For example:

Muhammed beating his favourite child bride.

Muhammed instructing Muslims to beat their wives in the Koran.

Your support for wife beating, obviously influenced by Muhammed and the Koran.

Abu's support for wife beating.

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Mattyfisk

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Re: Love in the Koran
Reply #119 - Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:35pm

freediver wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:29pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:27pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 8^th, 2017 at 6:25pm:

Oh look:

http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-overview/

Around 84% of South Asian Muslims (the largest group of them) support shariah law.

93% of southeast asian Muslims believe a woman should obey her husband.

Yes thats what I thought FD.

No pew survey showing muslim attitudes on domestic violence or child marriage.

Are you trying to disagree with me Gandalf? Do you now agree with my original point, prior to your bizarre tangent, that there is far better evidence of what Muslims believe? For example:

Muhammed beating his favourite child bride.

Muhammed instructing Muslims to beat their wives in the Koran.

Your support for wife beating, obviously influenced by Muhammed and the Koran.

Abu's support for wife beating.

Well, maybe. Still, there's only one way we can be sure.

Have you found the Pew survey yet?

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